I don't really understand the Dems' "need," for lack of a better word, for a national $15 min wage.

[Shelzin]

If one doesn't like a wage of 7.25 then don't do not apply. Leave those jobs unfilled. Of course then some morons will accuse people of being lazy which is totally untrue. A salary of 75 grand isn't even middle class anymore.

That's completely dependent on where you are in the US. You make 75 grand in Iowa, you are absolutely middle class. Of course, our cost of living is much lower than most places. OBVIOUSLY lower than where you are from.

 

[Shelzin]

It doesn't matter at all that you don't think we should be constantly pumping billions into the markets.

We are.

That's true. The point is I agree with you on that point. That's all. I'm not the type to tell you I disagree with you on one part of what you are saying, so therefor everything you say is wrong. I'm just trying to show good faith with you. This is what I agree with, this is what I disagree with.

If you don't' like that, too bad. I'm going to do it anyway.

Good habits are just as hard to break as bad ones.

 

[pknopp]

It doesn't matter at all that you don't think we should be constantly pumping billions into the markets.

We are.

That's true. The point is I agree with you on that point. That's all. I'm not the type to tell you I disagree with you on one part of what you are saying, so therefor everything you say is wrong. I'm just trying to show good faith with you. This is what I agree with, this is what I disagree with.

If you don't' like that, too bad. I'm going to do it anyway.

Good habits are just as hard to break as bad ones.

If we would stop the pumping I would stop supporting a $15 minimum wage. Think it will happen?

 

[Leo123]

I’m all for the natural evolution of businesses to go to automation but, not when forced by government edict to raise wages.

 

[Shelzin]

If we would stop the pumping I would stop supporting a $15 minimum wage. Think it will happen?

No. But that doesn't change the fact that you supporting a $15 minimum wage won't do what you think it will.

I mean you can absolutely make the argument if you like, but it really doesn't mean anything to the topic we are discussing.

It's like saying your left big toe has gangrene, so you want to shoot your healthy right big toe. What's the point in doing that? How about we just fix the gangrene?

 

[pknopp]

If we would stop the pumping I would stop supporting a $15 minimum wage. Think it will happen?

No. But that doesn't change the fact that you supporting a $15 minimum wage won't do what you think it will.

I mean you can absolutely make the argument if you like, but it really doesn't mean anything to the topic we are discussing.

It's like saying your left big toe has gangrene, so you want to shoot your healthy right big toe. What's the point in doing that? How about we just fix the gangrene?

Because we won't.

 

[Markle]

"medium wage" means some make more and a lot make less. This is news to you?

Are you pretending to be this ignorant or do you come by it naturally?

As you know, the word you are looking for is MEDIAN, not MEDIUM. There is no economic term, "medium wage". There is a MEDIAN wage. You have the definition wrong too. Median wage means there are as many earning more as there are earning less.

Median income
The median income is the income amount that divides a population into two equal groups, half having an income above that amount, and half having an income below that amount. It may differ from the mean income. The income that occurs most frequently is the income mode. Each of these is a way of understanding income distribution.

The mean income is the AVERAGE income. Do we have to explain that to you also?

 

[Markle]

Byrd Rule, politics threaten $15 per hour minimum wage

Democrats face a series of steep political and procedural challenges as they plot a path to raise the minimum wage to $15 per hour using a budgetary process known as reconciliation that would sides…

thehill.com

I don't doubt or disagree with NYC or other urban areas, esp progressive ones, logically wanting the raise. Or the need of workers. But in rural states, min wage jobs sometimes just supplement rural life of raising and growing one's own food. It will kill jobs, because the people who buy retail goods are the same ones working the jobs. Employers will consolidate gas stations, small grocery's and maybe even Wal-Marts. It just seems typical leftwing elitism to think places like Ala and Miss and WV can't figure out their own state economies.

I can't see how fifteen an hour will help when it needs to be a min. wage of twenty five an hour.

Zero!

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Byrd Rule, politics threaten $15 per hour minimum wage

Democrats face a series of steep political and procedural challenges as they plot a path to raise the minimum wage to $15 per hour using a budgetary process known as reconciliation that would sides…

thehill.com

I don't doubt or disagree with NYC or other urban areas, esp progressive ones, logically wanting the raise. Or the need of workers. But in rural states, min wage jobs sometimes just supplement rural life of raising and growing one's own food. It will kill jobs, because the people who buy retail goods are the same ones working the jobs. Employers will consolidate gas stations, small grocery's and maybe even Wal-Marts. It just seems typical leftwing elitism to think places like Ala and Miss and WV can't figure out their own state economies.

The Democrats want to raise the minimum wage to the point where employers will choose to automate their businesses, reduce staff, or eliminate low-wage workers altogether. We're already seeing this in the fast food and hospitality industries.

The Democrats' goal is, of course, to drive low-wage workers to unemployment and then onto welfare, where they can be more easily controlled. If the government is paying for your food rather than your employer, wouldn't you be more "willing" to go along with things like mandatory vaccines, only "approved" content on your social media, not questioning what your kids are being taught in school, etc.?

The government paying for our food,

Trump's Road to Socialism | Tho Bishop

So corporate farms can get billions but working stiffs shouldn't be able to make enough to survive on?

if you are a "working stiff" and the best you can do is a minimum wage job, you made some serious mistakes in your life.

Yeah, like not demanding the government stop the businesses from shipping the jobs overseas.

Do you know WHY businesses ship jobs overseas?

Greedy bastards.

You get half credit which is honestly better than I was expecting. Here's the plot twist though, YOU'RE THE GREEDY BASTARD responsible.

 

[Dirk the Daring]

82 million workers over 16 make minimum wage. That's over HALF the work force.

We ain't talking about kids making sneaker money. We're talking about people trying to survive...on poverty wages

Ha, 'poverty wages.' Here's a question Lesh, why do you think the government should make it ILLEGAL to hire someone who doesn't bring $15 an hour's worth of productivity to a business?

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Byrd Rule, politics threaten $15 per hour minimum wage

Democrats face a series of steep political and procedural challenges as they plot a path to raise the minimum wage to $15 per hour using a budgetary process known as reconciliation that would sides…

thehill.com

I don't doubt or disagree with NYC or other urban areas, esp progressive ones, logically wanting the raise. Or the need of workers. But in rural states, min wage jobs sometimes just supplement rural life of raising and growing one's own food. It will kill jobs, because the people who buy retail goods are the same ones working the jobs. Employers will consolidate gas stations, small grocery's and maybe even Wal-Marts. It just seems typical leftwing elitism to think places like Ala and Miss and WV can't figure out their own state economies.

Fifty years ago, minimum wage buying power was considerably stronger. One hour of work would buy five gallons of gasoline. Today, one hour of work at federal minimum wage about a gallon-and-a-half.

Fifty years ago, minimum wage, one hour of work would buy five loaves of bread and get back change. Today, one hour of work at federal minimum wage, a little over two loaves.

Fifty years ago, minimum wage, working forty hour a week, one income could support a family of three (That would be a married couple with one child).

Fifty years ago, minimum wage, a teenager, working part-time, living with his/her parents, attending college classes could buy a muscle car. Today, the same situation, the teenager buys a used bicycle.

The list goes on, but, the RWNJs are convinced, in the good old days minimum wage workers had life much too good. They want minimum wage workers to rely on social programs to survive, so they can b!tch about how lazy the working poor have become.

.

Geez, you're SO CLOSE! What has changed to the dollar in those same 50 years? Does it have the same purchasing power now that it did then? And why not?

 

[Shelzin]

Because we won't.

So lets make things worse, because we won't. Really?

 

[sartre play]

Company's move from country to country looking for those who will work for less money. That is how you build more profit, Most stuff is now made or grown in other country's. The American wage problem, IS an increase the only or best solution? why haven't we increased it a little every few years so business had time to adjust? or would it have mattered? where did this idea that those who start working for mim wage & get pay increases based on time with the company & doing good work that those jobs are s- - t & people doing them are stupid or some other negative you choice to label them. fact is not every one cares about getting rich, many people just want to do a days work go home & leave the job behind. And you used to be able to house & feed on those wages, what happened? I have way more questions than answers.

 

[pknopp]

Byrd Rule, politics threaten $15 per hour minimum wage

Democrats face a series of steep political and procedural challenges as they plot a path to raise the minimum wage to $15 per hour using a budgetary process known as reconciliation that would sides…

thehill.com

I don't doubt or disagree with NYC or other urban areas, esp progressive ones, logically wanting the raise. Or the need of workers. But in rural states, min wage jobs sometimes just supplement rural life of raising and growing one's own food. It will kill jobs, because the people who buy retail goods are the same ones working the jobs. Employers will consolidate gas stations, small grocery's and maybe even Wal-Marts. It just seems typical leftwing elitism to think places like Ala and Miss and WV can't figure out their own state economies.

The Democrats want to raise the minimum wage to the point where employers will choose to automate their businesses, reduce staff, or eliminate low-wage workers altogether. We're already seeing this in the fast food and hospitality industries.

The Democrats' goal is, of course, to drive low-wage workers to unemployment and then onto welfare, where they can be more easily controlled. If the government is paying for your food rather than your employer, wouldn't you be more "willing" to go along with things like mandatory vaccines, only "approved" content on your social media, not questioning what your kids are being taught in school, etc.?

The government paying for our food,

Trump's Road to Socialism | Tho Bishop

So corporate farms can get billions but working stiffs shouldn't be able to make enough to survive on?

if you are a "working stiff" and the best you can do is a minimum wage job, you made some serious mistakes in your life.

Yeah, like not demanding the government stop the businesses from shipping the jobs overseas.

Do you know WHY businesses ship jobs overseas?

Greedy bastards.

You get half credit which is honestly better than I was expecting. Here's the plot twist though, YOU'RE THE GREEDY BASTARD responsible.

It's not about me.

 

[pknopp]

Because we won't.

So lets make things worse, because we won't. Really?

You say it's worse, I say it isn't,

 

[EvilCat Breath]

The minimum wage is just a weapon among many. The weapon is to destroy what it can, a part, a portion, of the working middle class.

 

[Shelzin]

You say it's worse, I say it isn't,

I explained what would happen and why... You say that wouldn't be worse. We disagree. Again... if you give me an "oh shit moment" I didn't think of that. I'll thank you.

 

[pknopp]

You say it's worse, I say it isn't,

I explained what would happen and why... You say that wouldn't be worse. We disagree. Again... if you give me an "oh shit moment" I didn't think of that. I'll thank you.

Minimum wages have been raised ever since there has been one. You are arguing that the working poor should fall further and further behind.

If companies still want to offshore and we want to do nothing about that, I'll be voting for those who promise a guaranteed income.



(Bloomberg) -- The U.S. central bank should not prematurely withdraw pandemic support for the U.S. economy just because some people are getting rich in the stock market, said San Francisco Federal Reserve Bank President Mary Daly.

“We’re building this bridge, which is barely having many communities hang on, and the stock market is running pretty good and many people who already have money are getting more money,” she said Friday during a virtual discussion hosted by the Stanford Graduate School of Business.

Fed’s Daly Pushes Back Against Pulling Policy Aid to Curb Stocks

But the working poor shouldn't get anything. Screw that.

 

[Shelzin]

You say it's worse, I say it isn't,

I explained what would happen and why... You say that wouldn't be worse. We disagree. Again... if you give me an "oh shit moment" I didn't think of that. I'll thank you.

Minimum wages have been raised ever since there has been one. You are arguing that the working poor should fall further and further behind.

I'm arguing that the "fix" that you promote doesn't actually fix anything. You want them to have more money, you make a stronger dollar. MORE doesn't help. Look at the yen and peso. Learn from the past.

If companies still want to offshore and we want to do nothing about that, I'll be voting for those who promise a guaranteed income.

A weaker dollar WOULD help with the offshore goods coming in. I'll give you that. Of course... I personally don't want to live like I'm Chinese... But then... The Chinese will just weaken their own currency to make sure that they are still cheaper labor than we are. They have been doing that for... Well... As long as I've been following it.

But the working poor shouldn't get anything. Screw that.

I'm not suggesting that the working poor shouldn't get anything. Just that your fix is ... Not well thought out and proven not to work.

There is one ABSOLUTE that will always be true in a capitalist society. If you don't make the man paying you MORE money than he's paying you... Then you won't have a job with him very long. You break it down to it's base... That's what it is. If you increase the minimum wage you just increased the basic things that everybody uses by the same percentage.

Increasing minimum wage TO THIS DEGREE doesn't give the working poor anything. It just makes it to where there are more poor. Increasing the problem. So... I have to assume that you are not genuine on why you want the increase.

Edit: I tell what... If you promoted that every state had to increase by 50% it's minimum wage over a period of time... THAT would actually make some sense. Because then you aren't destroying every micro state economy that doesn't already have a $15 minimum wage.

Fair?

 

[pknopp]

You say it's worse, I say it isn't,

I explained what would happen and why... You say that wouldn't be worse. We disagree. Again... if you give me an "oh shit moment" I didn't think of that. I'll thank you.

Minimum wages have been raised ever since there has been one. You are arguing that the working poor should fall further and further behind.

I'm arguing that the "fix" that you promote doesn't actually fix anything. You want them to have more money, you make a stronger dollar. MORE doesn't help. Look at the yen and peso. Learn from the past.

I have NO desire to argue in circles. The way to do that is shut off the billions getting pored into the markets. It's not going to happen. I posted a link where the Fed argues they aren't about to stop.