IDF...Here We Come.

[Lipush]

New olim: IDF, here we come!

Some 130 young Jewish men, women from North America to join Israeli army immediately after making aliyah next week. One of them, Ben Yablon, who comes from family of pilots, has always dreamed of serving in IAF. 'My two greatest loves are Israel and flying,' he says

Ben Yablon, 19, of Portland, has been surrounded by aircraft since childhood. His father is a pilot, two of his uncles are pilots, and even his grandmother was a pilot who took a NASA training course and volunteered in an air defense unit. He himself has been practicing since the age of 16 and received an American pilot license a year ago.



Now he is spreading his wings towards the destination he has always dreamed of: The Israel Air Force.

Welcome Home

Nearly 1,000 kids making aliyah in 2013 / Anav Silverman, Tazpit

Nefesh B’Nefesh flight from North America brings 106 children with their parents to Israel
Full story

Yablon is one of 130 young Jewish men and women from North America who will immigrate to Israel next week on a special flight of the Nefesh B'Nefesh organization – which will take them straight to their service in the Israel Defense Forces.

"I decided I wanted to serve in the best air force in the world with the best pilots," Yablon says. "My dream is to be a combat pilot in the Israel Air Force and defend the State of Israel. My two greatest loves are Israel and flying. It's very important to me to fight for what I believe in.

"I have always loved Israel. I feel connected to it. Israel for me is much more than old buildings, beaches and shawarma. It's the idea that Jews have their own homeland and have a home to go back to. I feel sad that Jews could not always immigrate to Israel, but today it's possible and I don't want to miss the opportunity."

Yablon was raised in a Zionist home which supported his decision to immigrate to Israel, despite slight hesitations. His father, an electronics engineer, is the chair of American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) in Oregon.

The final decision to immigrate to Israel was made after Ben Yablon and Miriam Clayman fell in love during a visit to Israel last year as part of a Bar-Ilan University program. While her partner dreams of the Israel Air Force, Clayman wants to serve in the Intelligence Corps.

"It's the best way to serve my country," she says. "I want to defend Israel. My parents are very supportive of me, and they may very well follow in my footsteps in the end."

The majority of young olim have asked to serve in combat units. Among the boys there is high demand this year for voluntary units like Duvdevan, Sayeret Matkal, Golani, the Paratroopers Brigade and the pilots' course. Among the girls, the favored service is in the Oketz Unit, medical assistants' course, as non-commissioned officers and as shooting instructors.

"The fact that these young people are leaving their convenient life abroad in order to immigrate to Israel and join the IDF says a lot about our power as a people and about the mutual responsibility, which is the foundation of our lives," says Minister Landver. "All that is left for us is to be proud of them and ensure that they get all the help we can give them."

New olim: IDF, here we come! - Israel Jewish Scene, Ynetnews

there is no question about dual loyalties here. these olim have rejected the USA and have demeaned our military with such statements as "I decided I wanted to serve in the best air force in the world with the best pilots".

while america has been engaged in war for over ten years, these young people raised in jewish homes and eager to serve in combat units, have turned their backs on the country of their birth to join a foreign countries military. it lends new meaning to "israel is and will always be america's greatest ally."

i think america should revoke their citisenship as i am sure close to none of them have the moral integrity to renounce their own citisenship to this country by any other mean than their actions.

i served in the U.S.Army and my son is currently serving in the U.S. Navy and i consider this a slap in the face to all american servvcemen. that is fine to many o you, i suppose.

i have no problem with them serving in the IDF as that is their choice...but when americans applaud their service in a foreign military while our country is at war is disgusting, particularly when so few jewish americans are wearing the uniform of the USA.

revoke their citisenship!!!

and god bless he jews and everyone serving in the military of the United States of America.

Wonderful news. God bless them.

 

[Lipush]

"I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

Who said that?

that is the oath of allegiance every IDF recruit takes. it is a matter of public record and is not subject to copyright.

That's not the oath, but whatever.

 

[Lipush]

"I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

Perhaps then you should have provided a link for it then, as posting quotes without proper linkeage is a violation of rules.

Is it a known fact that they actually took this oath?

No.

That's not the one I took. The oath in to the IDF values, not to any civilian state laws. we put the Bible on the rifle and simply say "I swear" and salute the commander. That's all.

I don't remember ever saying this oath in my service.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

"I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

Perhaps then you should have provided a link for it then, as posting quotes without proper linkeage is a violation of rules.

Is it a known fact that they actually took this oath?

No.

That's not the one I took. The oath in to the IDF values, not to any civilian state laws. we put the Bible on the rifle and simply say "I swear" and salute the commander. That's all.

I don't remember ever saying this oath in my service.

What did you swear to, Lipush?

 

[sealadaigh]

"I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

Perhaps then you should have provided a link for it then, as posting quotes without proper linkeage is a violation of rules.

Is it a known fact that they actually took this oath?

That's not the one I took. The oath in to the IDF values, not to any civilian state laws. we put the Bible on the rifle and simply say "I swear" and salute the commander. That's all.

I don't remember ever saying this oath in my service.

ou

here, for you and roudy...

The IDF General Staff order from 1948 says that every soldier who receives his or her personal weapon will make the following pledge: "I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

There are those who, while smashing myths and taking other actions to undermine the strength of IDF, are seeking to harm the IDF's oath of allegiance so as to blur the demands made of the soldiers. One such person is the ultra-leftist Knesset member, Avshalom "Abu" Vilan.

Protecting the homeland - Israel Opinion, Ynetnews

 

[Lipush]

Perhaps then you should have provided a link for it then, as posting quotes without proper linkeage is a violation of rules.

Is it a known fact that they actually took this oath?

No.

That's not the one I took. The oath in to the IDF values, not to any civilian state laws. we put the Bible on the rifle and simply say "I swear" and salute the commander. That's all.

I don't remember ever saying this oath in my service.

What did you swear to, Lipush?

To be loyal to the IDF and keep its values.

 

[Roudy]

LOL...i saw what you edited, but that is neither here not there.

The "Tolerance Code" of the Israel Defense Forces

it would seem that if some soldiers were not required to take the oath, it would be mentioned here. my only conclusion is rthat the obvious need not be stated. however, you are absolutely right, i have no link to that unstated obvious.

now, you also made the allegation that recruits from foreign countries were not required to take the oath and you say you checked, no less. please provide the proof of your allegation with a link.

Edited? I did not use that site with regards to anything in this thread. However, your link still says nothing about the requirements for a foreign national applying to enlist in the Israeli military to take any specific oath.

roudy, i said i had no link. i also said it was probably a case of not stating the obvious.

now, you made the statement that recruits from foreign countries did not have to take the oath and you further stated you had proof. i want your link.

Actually there are several sites including an IDF site itself that say the oath is part of the procedures only if the person is also requesting citizenship as well. Look it up. Again, I am not the one that claimed the oath was taken, I simply asked what evidence is there that it was. So far I haven't seen any.

As far the US govt, even if a person's residence (not citizenship) in a country requires that he / she serve in its military, and take an oath, their citizenship will be intact. There are many cases regarding this matter in the past and some have even made it to higher courts.

Bottom line is the one way a person's citizenship gets revoked nowadays is if they willingly do it in front of a US govt agent such as an embassy or official, or, if they serve in enemy forces or terrorist forces, in that case it's treason and loosing your US citizenship should be the least of your worries.

Currently the US accepts dual / multiple citizenship from virtually any country. It is those countries such as Russia, India, China, Brazil, that do not accept their citizens to also become citizens of other countries.

Again, the information is readily available on govt websites.

 

[Lipush]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

 

[sealadaigh]

Edited? I did not use that site with regards to anything in this thread. However, your link still says nothing about the requirements for a foreign national applying to enlist in the Israeli military to take any specific oath.

roudy, i said i had no link. i also said it was probably a case of not stating the obvious.

now, you made the statement that recruits from foreign countries did not have to take the oath and you further stated you had proof. i want your link.

Actually there are several sites including an IDF site itself that say the oath is part of the procedures only if the person is also requesting citizenship as well. Look it up. Again, I am not the one that claimed the oath was taken, I simply asked what evidence is there that it was. So far I haven't seen any.

As far the US govt, even if a person's residence (not citizenship) in a country requires that he / she serve in its military, and take an oath, their citizenship will be intact. There are many cases regarding this matter in the past and some have even made it to higher courts.

Bottom line is the one way a person's citizenship gets revoked nowadays is if they willingly do it in front of a US govt agent such as an embassy or official, or, if they serve in enemy forces or terrorist forces, in that case it's treason and loosing your US citizenship should be the least of your worries.

Currently the US accepts dual / multiple citizenship from virtually any country. It is those countries such as Russia, India, China, Brazil, that do not accept their citizens to also become citizens of other countries.

Again, the information is readily available on govt websites.

link...

 

[Roudy]

roudy, i said i had no link. i also said it was probably a case of not stating the obvious.

now, you made the statement that recruits from foreign countries did not have to take the oath and you further stated you had proof. i want your link.

Actually there are several sites including an IDF site itself that say the oath is part of the procedures only if the person is also requesting citizenship as well. Look it up. Again, I am not the one that claimed the oath was taken, I simply asked what evidence is there that it was. So far I haven't seen any.

As far the US govt, even if a person's residence (not citizenship) in a country requires that he / she serve in its military, and take an oath, their citizenship will be intact. There are many cases regarding this matter in the past and some have even made it to higher courts.

Bottom line is the one way a person's citizenship gets revoked nowadays is if they willingly do it in front of a US govt agent such as an embassy or official, or, if they serve in enemy forces or terrorist forces, in that case it's treason and loosing your US citizenship should be the least of your worries.

Currently the US accepts dual / multiple citizenship from virtually any country. It is those countries such as Russia, India, China, Brazil, that do not accept their citizens to also become citizens of other countries.

Again, the information is readily available on govt websites.

link...

Easily available. Do a search.

 

[sealadaigh]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

then provide the oath you swore to, or in other words, you took.

 

[sealadaigh]

Actually there are several sites including an IDF site itself that say the oath is part of the procedures only if the person is also requesting citizenship as well. Look it up. Again, I am not the one that claimed the oath was taken, I simply asked what evidence is there that it was. So far I haven't seen any.

As far the US govt, even if a person's residence (not citizenship) in a country requires that he / she serve in its military, and take an oath, their citizenship will be intact. There are many cases regarding this matter in the past and some have even made it to higher courts.

Bottom line is the one way a person's citizenship gets revoked nowadays is if they willingly do it in front of a US govt agent such as an embassy or official, or, if they serve in enemy forces or terrorist forces, in that case it's treason and loosing your US citizenship should be the least of your worries.

Currently the US accepts dual / multiple citizenship from virtually any country. It is those countries such as Russia, India, China, Brazil, that do not accept their citizens to also become citizens of other countries.

Again, the information is readily available on govt websites.

link...

Easily available. Do a search.

you said, when i made an "allegation" (your word) that i was obligated to proide proof...and i admitted i had no proof. i have now provided it.

now it is you who has made a statement of fact and you expecct me to provide proof for your claim.

yeah, that certainly works for me.

 

[Roudy]

Loyalty oath - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A loyalty oath is an oath of loyalty to an organization, institution, or state of which an individual is a member.
In this context, a loyalty oath is distinct from pledge or oath of allegiance.It is an affirmation by which a person signs a legally binding document or warrant.

On 10 October 2010 the Israeli cabinet approved a loyalty oath bill requiring all future non-
Jews applying for an Israeli citizenship to swear loyalty to Israel as a Jewish and democratic state.[20] However, on October 18, current prime minister Netanyahu ordered Justice minister Ya'akov Ne'eman to extend Cabinet-level debate on the bill in order to add amendments which make the loyalty oath universal to both Jewish and non-Jewish immigrants who seek citizenship.[21] This inclusion of Jewish immigrants was supported by the Anti-Defamation League.[22]

 

[Roudy]

link...

Easily available. Do a search.

you said, when i made an "allegation" (your word) that i was obligated to proide proof...and i admitted i had no proof. i have now provided it.

now it is you who has made a statement of fact and you expecct me to provide proof for your claim.

yeah, that certainly works for me.

That was not proof, it only applied to those wishing to become Israeli citizens.

 

[Lipush]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

then provide the oath you swore to, or in other words, you took.

Read again. My oath included the Bible putting on the rifle, and saying the words "I swear". It was explained previously that the oath's meaning is protecting Israel and stay loyal to the IDF. but that oath was part of me being a soldier. I simply said "I swear". that's all.

 

[Roudy]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

then provide the oath you swore to, or in other words, you took.

Read again. My oath included the Bible putting on the rifle, and saying the words "I swear". It was explained previously that the oath's meaning is protecting Israel and stay loyal to the IDF. but that oath was part of me being a soldier. I simply said "I swear". that's all.

That is a loyalty oath to the IDF and that goes with anybody who serves in any organization. Doesn't even have to be the IDF or military. The oath of allegiance will be administered as part of the citizenship requirements. Why is this hard to understand. Anybody who signs any employment contract signs a contract to abide by the rules and policies of the organization. Why wouldn't a military force of all things, require recruits to be loyal and follow orders?

 

[Roudy]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

then provide the oath you swore to, or in other words, you took.

If you're born in Israel you're not required to take the oath of allegiance. When you're recruited into the military you take the loyalty oath, as one would here in the US.

 

[sealadaigh]

ONCE AGAIN!!!​

here, for lipush and roudy...

The IDF General Staff order from 1948 says that every soldier who receives his or her personal weapon will make the following pledge: "I swear and commit to pledge allegiance to the State of Israel, its laws, and authorities, to accept upon myself unconditionally the authority of the Israel Defense Force, obey all the orders and instructions given by authorized commanders, devote all my energies, and even sacrifice my life for the protection of the homeland and liberty of Israel."

Protecting the homeland - Israel Opinion, Ynetnews

 

[Roudy]

mer·ce·nar·y (mûrs-nr)
adj.
1. Motivated solely by a desire for monetary or material gain.
2. Hired for service in a foreign army.
n. pl. mer·ce·nar·ies
1. One who serves or works merely for monetary gain; a hireling.
2. A professional soldier hired for service in a foreign army.

"O Canada, we stand on guard for thee"...for free tuition.


mercenary - definition of mercenary by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

An American serving as a mercenary can still retain his or her citizenship, even though an oath would be required. It is considered similar to employment.

 

[sealadaigh]

in the "Hashba'ah" ceremony, the commander stood in front of the soldiers, and read the IDF values which included these words. He called us one by one (We were about 70 girls) and we took the Bible book in our left hand, put it on the rifle, and said loudly, "I swear". The commander saluted back.

By saying the words "I swear", we took upon ourselves to be loyal to the IDF. being loyal to the IDF means to sacrifice ourselves if needed, for Israel, and protect the military values. We swear to the people and army, not government or institutions.

And there is a difference.

then provide the oath you swore to, or in other words, you took.

If you're born in Israel you're not required to take the oath of allegiance. When you're recruited into the military you take the loyalty oath, as one would here in the US.

when the IDF oath given to recruits says "allegiance", i will take them at their word.