If Conservatives had accomplishments, they wouldn't be so jealous of Liberals

[Harry Dresden]

Conservatives have their placetoo. Sometimes liberals get a little too crazy. It's not a bad thing to hear another perspective.

like here in California.....programs started with good intent but since no one was watching over them they became bloated and out of control and were being scammed by lowlife assholes....then if someone says something about how out of control they are and we need to reign them in...they get called a racist or a uncaring asshole or in Deans case he will say how Republicans just hate the program and want to end it.....

Examples?

the State Union Contracts .....which has way over a Hundred Million in unfunded liabilities coming up that Brown is going to have to contend with ..... and many State Welfare programs up and down the State which were started with good intentions but now because of neglect...have become bloated and out of control....and even if someone as liberal as you Dean says "hey these things need to be cut or reigned in, something needs to be done".... guess who will be called a racist uncaring asshole?....

 

[rdean]

Notice right wingers don't even try to present any accomplishments? In fact, they try desperately to justify why there shouldn't be any accomplishments. With out government accomplishments, we wouldn't have the Interstate highway system. We wouldn't have NASA. We wouldn't have our military. There would be no vaccines against polio, the flu and other disease. There wouldn't be anyone helping disaster victims.

Listen to Republicans and we would be the shithole of the world. Even worse than Red States.

 

[Harry Dresden]

programs started with good intent but since no one was watching over them they became bloated and out of control and were being scammed by lowlife assholes

The road to hell is always paved in good intentions. As it turns out, similarly, all government programs become bloated, wasteful and scammed by low-lives. Right from the start they'r always a lie and a sham.

but if someone was actually doing their jobs those programs may not have been that out of control....

 

[TakeAStepBack]

programs started with good intent but since no one was watching over them they became bloated and out of control and were being scammed by lowlife assholes

The road to hell is always paved in good intentions. As it turns out, similarly, all government programs become bloated, wasteful and scammed by low-lives. Right from the start they'r always a lie and a sham.

but if someone was actually doing their jobs those programs may not have been that out of control....

The problem with that idea is you're assuming that anyone has the ability to be frugal, resourceful and conservative with someone elses money. It's a farce.

 

[Toro]

Liberals gave us the Welfare State, Public Housing, Public education and voting rights for the non-living

And that thing you're typing on.

No, that was capitalism.

 

[Toro]

There should be a "Liberal Appreciation Day" celebrated in this country considering what they have brought to America.

 

[BULLDOG]

Conservatives have their placetoo. Sometimes liberals get a little too crazy. It's not a bad thing to hear another perspective.

Republicans don't have another perspective. Back when they were an honorable party, they had another perspective. Now they have nothing but bile and obstructions. Where is a single republican perspective on anything other than opposition to Obama? It does not exist.

Well, in rhetoric they have another perspective. But how would you know? Yuu modern day libs have been saying that line over the loud speaker every time a republican opens his mouth about anything.

Because it's true. Are you saying the right has been prevented from saying what they want to say? Hell......They have the entire fox network to broadcast anything they want heard 24 hours a day. There has been no censorship of all the crazy remarks they make. What makes you think any perspective they might have has been silenced?

I would suspect you're not the type to seek out conservative/republican news based on that hate slogan in your signature, Poindexter.

I have great respect for the memory of the republican party which no longer exists in an honorable form because it has been bastardized by the teaparty. Given that, there is no need to seek out what republicans stand for and advocate. Unlike fox drones who only accept information from one source, I listen to a variety of sources, and if the right has something they want heard, there is little doubt that it will be heard. Are you actually trying to claim the right has a great trove of reasonable, workable ideas, but they are somehow being sequestered from the public, and only after in depth searching will any of those great ideas be found? That's just stupid.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Conservatives have their placetoo. Sometimes liberals get a little too crazy. It's not a bad thing to hear another perspective.

Republicans don't have another perspective. Back when they were an honorable party, they had another perspective. Now they have nothing but bile and obstructions. Where is a single republican perspective on anything other than opposition to Obama? It does not exist.

Well, in rhetoric they have another perspective. But how would you know? Yuu modern day libs have been saying that line over the loud speaker every time a republican opens his mouth about anything.

Because it's true. Are you saying the right has been prevented from saying what they want to say? Hell......They have the entire fox network to broadcast anything they want heard 24 hours a day. There has been no censorship of all the crazy remarks they make. What makes you think any perspective they might have has been silenced?

I would suspect you're not the type to seek out conservative/republican news based on that hate slogan in your signature, Poindexter.

I have great respect for the memory of the republican party which no longer exists in an honorable form because it has been bastardized by the teaparty. Given that, there is no need to seek out what republicans stand for and advocate. Unlike fox drones who only accept information from one source, I listen to a variety of sources, and if the right has something they want heard, there is little doubt that it will be heard. Are you actually trying to claim the right has a great trove of reasonable, workable ideas, but they are somehow being sequestered from the public, and only after in depth searching will any of those great ideas be found? That's just stupid.

Thanks for the admission. So, like I said, you wouldn't know what republicans are thinking. You're completely paralyzed by hatred and intolerance.

All your other whining and diatribe aside, Nancy.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Notice right wingers don't even try to present any accomplishments? In fact, they try desperately to justify why there shouldn't be any accomplishments. With out government accomplishments, we wouldn't have the Interstate highway system. We wouldn't have NASA. We wouldn't have our military. There would be no vaccines against polio, the flu and other disease. There wouldn't be anyone helping disaster victims.

Listen to Republicans and we would be the shithole of the world. Even worse than Red States.

parts of S.California are just about 3rd world.......go down to El Centro and tell me if your in the US or Mexico plenty of other smaller towns like Bell are going the same way.....you going to blame that on Republicans?.....well wait you would blame a hang nail on them so maybe i should not ask you that....

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

There should be a "Liberal Appreciation Day" celebrated in this country considering what they have brought to America.

The very definition of "Conservative" is "fear of change". I have no doubt that without liberals, we would be theocratic English colonies with slaves.

And look at our history of Literature, Theater, Dance, Music and the other arts. The history of Art in America is almost the History of Gays. So much from such a small group of people. Look at how much America owes Alan Turing and he wasn't even American.

Our greatest institutions of higher learning, research and technology are mostly in Blue States for a reason.

Weekends, 40 hour work week, child labor laws, vacations, health care, equal pay for equal work, and all the other benefits workers get were never supported by conservatives. These have always been seen as "liberal".

And when you look at the enormous diversity within Liberals as a group, they will be a strong force far into the future. Blacks, Hispanics, Whites, gays, atheists, religious, rich, poor, scientists, teachers, straights and so on.

We really should have a "Liberal Appreciation Day". To thank Liberals for what they brought to this country in spite of so much opposition.

ROFLMNAO!

Let's count up the Liberal Accomplishments:

117 TRILLION DOLLARS IN TOTAL US DEBT...

Normalized Sexual Abnormality: Men Marrying Men, and the ver popular Girl on Girl...

Catastrophic Collapse of the Financial Markets

7 Years of Economic Stagnation

7 Years of unprecedented obscenely high unemployment.

Crippled the US Manufacturing Industries; Textile, steel, electronic and coming soon: Automobile.

Crippled the US Education System

Crippled the Black Culture

Took Detroit from a jewel of modernity and enterprise and turned it into an heath hazard, and a general embarrassment to the species.

Murderer 50 MILLION Children who WERE STILL IN THE WOMB! (And that's just since the mid 1970s)

No-Fault Divorce, AIDS, EBOLA, The Syph, The Clap.

And the greatest of all Liberal Achievements?

They MURDERED 150 MILLION INNOCENT PEOPLE inside a single generation, IN PEACE TIME, in the middle of the 20th Century alone... And all because those people just would not endorse communism. (For the Edification of the Intellectually Less Fortunate (Liberals) that's just under HALF of the US population today... So look around at work tomorrow... and imagine HALF of everyone there DEAD, because of people EXACTLY LIKE, your friendly neighborhood Liberals.

 

[Harry Dresden]

programs started with good intent but since no one was watching over them they became bloated and out of control and were being scammed by lowlife assholes

The road to hell is always paved in good intentions. As it turns out, similarly, all government programs become bloated, wasteful and scammed by low-lives. Right from the start they'r always a lie and a sham.

but if someone was actually doing their jobs those programs may not have been that out of control....

The problem with that idea is you're assuming that anyone has the ability to be frugal, resourceful and conservative with someone elses money. It's a farce.

maybe that depends on the attitude of those running the place.....

 

[Little-Acorn]

How typical of the usual liberal fanatics, to think that government must show "accomplishments".

Government is only there to protect people's rights. Basically, to protect people from being messed with unjustly by other people.

When government does its job right, nobody notices, because there is nothing much to see. You can live your life without unjust interference from others, is all. Government will seem like a very small part of your life, because it mostly stays out of your way (as long as you don't violate your neighbors' rights) and you live your life normally.

If another country attacks, then government must get much bigger, taking a large part of the GDP, to fight them off and defeat them. Then its "accomplishments" become noticeable. When the enemy is defeated, then govt must shrink back down, relinquish its power, and fade into the background (mostly) again. At least, a good government will.

Liberals see government differently, of course. Government must become a major part of everyone's lives (whether they like it or not), doling out money for health care, nice workplaces, retirement funds, and even regulating what light bulbs you can buy and how much water your toilet uses. And a host of other things.

To liberals, government must show more and more "accomplishments" all the time. To conservatives, that's what it must NOT do, except in dire emergencies it is empowered to deal with.

So it's not surprising that the hate-filled liberals on this board, try to condemn conservatives for not "showing enough accomplishments".
Liberals think that's a condemnation. But in fact, it's a compliment. The less government is seen, the better it is. Except in grave emergencies, of course (wars etc.) that it is supposed to deal with. But in general, a government that shows few "accomplishments" (or none in peacetime) is likely doing its job right.

 

[BULLDOG]

Republicans don't have another perspective. Back when they were an honorable party, they had another perspective. Now they have nothing but bile and obstructions. Where is a single republican perspective on anything other than opposition to Obama? It does not exist.

Well, in rhetoric they have another perspective. But how would you know? Yuu modern day libs have been saying that line over the loud speaker every time a republican opens his mouth about anything.

Because it's true. Are you saying the right has been prevented from saying what they want to say? Hell......They have the entire fox network to broadcast anything they want heard 24 hours a day. There has been no censorship of all the crazy remarks they make. What makes you think any perspective they might have has been silenced?

I would suspect you're not the type to seek out conservative/republican news based on that hate slogan in your signature, Poindexter.

I have great respect for the memory of the republican party which no longer exists in an honorable form because it has been bastardized by the teaparty. Given that, there is no need to seek out what republicans stand for and advocate. Unlike fox drones who only accept information from one source, I listen to a variety of sources, and if the right has something they want heard, there is little doubt that it will be heard. Are you actually trying to claim the right has a great trove of reasonable, workable ideas, but they are somehow being sequestered from the public, and only after in depth searching will any of those great ideas be found? That's just stupid.

Thanks for the admission. So, like I said, you wouldn't know what republicans are thinking. Your completely paralyzed by hatred and intolerance.

All your other whining and diatribe aside, Nancy.

OK.....Where is this repository of great right wing ideas? I've watched fox.....It ain't there. Why don't your politicians just publish a list? If it has been published, how about a link? Is someone forcing them to keep it a deep dark secret? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

We're really shy on observable examples...

 

[LeftofLeft]

There should be a "Liberal Appreciation Day" celebrated in this country considering what they have brought to America.

The very definition of "Conservative" is "fear of change". I have no doubt that without liberals, we would be theocratic English colonies with slaves.

And look at our history of Literature, Theater, Dance, Music and the other arts. The history of Art in America is almost the History of Gays. So much from such a small group of people. Look at how much America owes Alan Turing and he wasn't even American.

Our greatest institutions of higher learning, research and technology are mostly in Blue States for a reason.

Weekends, 40 hour work week, child labor laws, vacations, health care, equal pay for equal work, and all the other benefits workers get were never supported by conservatives. These have always been seen as "liberal".

And when you look at the enormous diversity within Liberals as a group, they will be a strong force far into the future. Blacks, Hispanics, Whites, gays, atheists, religious, rich, poor, scientists, teachers, straights and so on.

We really should have a "Liberal Appreciation Day". To thank Liberals for what they brought to this country in spite of so much opposition.

Conservatives are jealous over the Liberals' domination of Big Media and Big Academia.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Well, in rhetoric they have another perspective. But how would you know? Yuu modern day libs have been saying that line over the loud speaker every time a republican opens his mouth about anything.

Because it's true. Are you saying the right has been prevented from saying what they want to say? Hell......They have the entire fox network to broadcast anything they want heard 24 hours a day. There has been no censorship of all the crazy remarks they make. What makes you think any perspective they might have has been silenced?

I would suspect you're not the type to seek out conservative/republican news based on that hate slogan in your signature, Poindexter.

I have great respect for the memory of the republican party which no longer exists in an honorable form because it has been bastardized by the teaparty. Given that, there is no need to seek out what republicans stand for and advocate. Unlike fox drones who only accept information from one source, I listen to a variety of sources, and if the right has something they want heard, there is little doubt that it will be heard. Are you actually trying to claim the right has a great trove of reasonable, workable ideas, but they are somehow being sequestered from the public, and only after in depth searching will any of those great ideas be found? That's just stupid.

Thanks for the admission. So, like I said, you wouldn't know what republicans are thinking. Your completely paralyzed by hatred and intolerance.

All your other whining and diatribe aside, Nancy.

OK.....Where is this repository of great right wing ideas? I've watched fox.....It ain't there. Why don't your politicians just publish a list? If it has been published, how about a link? Is someone forcing them to keep it a deep dark secret? Inquiring minds want to know.

Oh, so they need to make it easy for you since you're frothing so with hate for them. I'm not a republican or even conservative. I'm just pointing out your hatred and intolerance are what the republican opponents are relying on full court. And it's working.....well, not really....

 

[Little-Acorn]

Notice right wingers don't even try to present any accomplishments? In fact, they try desperately to justify why there shouldn't be any accomplishments. With out government accomplishments, we wouldn't have the Interstate highway system. We wouldn't have NASA. We wouldn't have our military. There would be no vaccines against polio, the flu and other disease. There wouldn't be anyone helping disaster victims.

You can always tell the more mindless liberal fanatics. They are the ones totally stuck on "If central government doesn't do it, no one will do it", with no evidence to back up their bizarre beliefs.

 

[daws101]

Conservatives use government programs
Wednesday, November 16, 2011
Hidden Federal Government Benefits [/paste:font]
Hidden Government Benefits
By SUZANNE METTLER
September 19, 2011
Ithaca, N.Y.

DON’T take at face value the claims that Americans dislike government. Sure, a recent ABC News/Washington Post poll found that 56 percent of Americans said they wanted smaller government and fewer services.

Tea Party activists, the most vocal citizens of our time, powerfully amplify those demands. Yet the reality is that the vast majority of Americans have at some point relied on government programs — and valued them — even though they often fail to recognize that government is the source of the assistance.

A 2008 poll of 1,400 Americans by the Cornell Survey Research Institute found that when people were asked whether they had “ever used a government social program,” 57 percent said they had not. Respondents were then asked whether they had availed themselves of any of 21 different federal policies, including Social Security, unemployment insurance, the home-mortgage-interest deduction and student loans. It turned out that 94 percent of those who had denied using programs had benefited from at least one; the average respondent had used four.

Americans often fail to recognize government’s role in society, even if they have experienced it in their own lives. That is because so much of what government does today is largely invisible.

Individuals’ political views partly account for their perceptions.

In the Cornell poll, a respondent who self-identified as “extremely liberal” was 20 percentage points more likely to acknowledge using a government program than someone who used the same number of programs but was “extremely conservative.” Also, those who believed that the nation spent too much on welfare were less likely to admit that they had used a “government social program,” perhaps because that term had pejorative connotations.

Besides political ideology, the design of policies also influences awareness.
The most visible policies are those that require people to interact frequently or intensively with public officials to qualify for benefits, like food stamps, disability payments and subsidized housing.

Another set of programs, including Medicare, Pell Grants and Social Security retirement benefits, are also fairly visible, though each contains characteristics that can camouflage government’s role.

The man at the town hall meeting in the summer of 2009 who angrily told his congressman, “Keep your government hands off my Medicare,” might have been in less of a state of denial than many believed: last year, one in four Medicare beneficiaries got their benefits through a private insurance company.

In the case of Social Security, checks are sent directly by the government, making it clear why 56 percent of beneficiaries in the Cornell poll acknowledged the use of a social program. But the denial by the remaining 44 percent is also understandable, given that individuals contributed directly from their paychecks to help finance the program. President Franklin D. Roosevelt insisted on this arrangement, knowing the benefits would be understood as an earned right. That way, he said, “no damn politician can ever scrap my social security program.”

The final group of policies, what I call the “submerged state,” is largely invisible because its benefits are channeled through the tax code and subsidies to private organizations. These include the home-mortgage-interest deduction and the exemption from taxes on employer-provided health and retirement benefits. Using “submerged” benefits is nearly as common as using more visible policies.

Even personal encounters with the submerged state fail to make most people recognize that they have benefited from government. The greater the number of visible policies an individual had used, the more likely he or she was to agree that “government programs have helped me in times of need,” but greater use of policies of the submerged state had no comparable impact.

Likewise, the greater the number of visible policies used, the higher the rate of agreement that “government has provided me opportunities to improve my standard of living”; by contrast, those who had used more submerged policies were more likely to disagree. The hidden policies left beneficiaries with the false impression that their economic security was owed merely to their own efforts.

The submerged state obscures the role of government and exaggerates that of the market. It leaves citizens unaware of the source of programs and unable to form meaningful opinions about them.

Until political leaders reveal government benefits for what they are by talking openly about them, we cannot have an honest discussion about spending, taxes or deficits. The stipulation in the new health care reform law that W-2 forms must indicate the value of untaxed employer-provided health care benefits is a step in the right direction. The government should also provide “receipts” that inform people of the size of each benefit they get through the tax code.

The threat to democracy today is not the size of government but rather the hidden form that so much of its growth has taken. If those who assume government has never helped them could see how it has, it might help defuse our polarized political climate and reinvigorate informed citizenship.

Suzanne Mettler, a professor of government at Cornell, is the author of “The Submerged State: How Invisible Government Policies Undermine American Democracy.”
A version of this op-ed appeared in print on September 20, 2011, on page A31 of the New York edition with the headline: Our .

Conservatives use government programs

Shorter Suzanne Mettler-

If you use the programs government forces you into paying for and using it must mean you like them.

sorry shithead nobody forces you to use any of the programs
for instance the aca
you are under no obligation to use it.
if you are doing well enough to pay for your own insurance
or if your as self-sufficient as many conservatives pretend they are you can go without medical care and further over crowd the emergency rooms of the usa.
but
if you did that you'd be using a government program you hate.
what a conundrum!
or you could die holding up an irrational philosophy.

 

[rdean]

Notice right wingers don't even try to present any accomplishments? In fact, they try desperately to justify why there shouldn't be any accomplishments. With out government accomplishments, we wouldn't have the Interstate highway system. We wouldn't have NASA. We wouldn't have our military. There would be no vaccines against polio, the flu and other disease. There wouldn't be anyone helping disaster victims.

Listen to Republicans and we would be the shithole of the world. Even worse than Red States.

parts of S.California are just about 3rd world.......go down to El Centro and tell me if your in the US or Mexico plenty of other smaller towns like Bell are going the same way.....you going to blame that on Republicans?.....well wait you would blame a hang nail on them so maybe i should not ask you that....

Parts of California as opposed to most of some Red States?

 

[daws101]

Conservatives have their placetoo. Sometimes liberals get a little too crazy. It's not a bad thing to hear another perspective.

Republicans don't have another perspective. Back when they were an honorable party, they had another perspective. Now they have nothing but bile and obstructions. Where is a single republican perspective on anything other than opposition to Obama? It does not exist.

Well, in rhetoric they have another perspective. But how would you know? Yuu modern day libs have been saying that line over the loud speaker every time a republican opens his mouth about anything.

Because it's true. Are you saying the right has been prevented from saying what they want to say? Hell......They have the entire fox network to broadcast anything they want heard 24 hours a day. There has been no censorship of all the crazy remarks they make. What makes you think any perspective they might have has been silenced?

I would suspect you're not the type to seek out conservative/republican news based on that hate slogan in your signature, Poindexter.

if the news is bias in either direction it's not news but opining..