If The Economy Is So Great Why Can't Most People Miss One Paycheck?

[Ray From Cleveland]

I don't know about that; certainly not with rent. I refuse to do business with Section 8 people. But they drove their beat up old car, had to replace the bald tires once a month or so, a few times her father came over to do some repairs on the vehicle, and yes, they were a couple days late with rent every month, but otherwise pretty good tenants.

I think we have a major problem between drugs and employment in this country. My father made a pretty good living being a bricklayer. In fact he's 87 years old and still getting his pension. But his union couldn't replace the retired bricklayers. Granted, it is very hard work, but it also pays very good money. Sure, people would come in for the job, but when they found out drug testing was involved, they walked right back out the door.

My opinion is we have two major problems that are stopping people from bettering themselves. One is drugs, and the other is social programs. We pay people not to work.

Do you think welfare recipients should take a drug test?

I do. Why not? If we working people have to take drug tests, why shouldn't the people that live off the money working people make?

We are in agreement then.

IMO we either all take drug tests or we all don't. I hate when my name gets pulled up for a drug test. It's a pain in the ass because my employer by law is not allowed to tell us ahead of time when we got called. And it always seems I just went to the bathroom before I found out I had to go.

Most police officers are not required for those tests, neither are teachers, neither are our politicians. I wonder how many people would keep those jobs if drug testing was a requirement.

I actually don't even remember the last job I had that didn't require drug testing, because I give so little thought and attention to being drug tested. It is at best a momentary blip on my radar. I can't even imagine having to plan my life around such a thing. Sounds tiresome. My current employer doesn't do it once you're hired, but that's because we all work closely together in small offices, and being high would be really obvious.

Well drug tests are more than about if you're intoxicated at the moment. Pot stays in your system for close to a month. So you could have been smoking pot last weekend, and February 5th, get busted because you had to take a drug test. Opioid products are out of your system in less than 48 hours.

Most employers have drug testing to reduce their premiums on Workman's Compensation insurance. It's not a violation of your constitutional rights because in most cases, your employer is not the government. However it's federal law that truck drivers submit to drug screenings to keep your medical card. I guess nobody challenged that in court yet. In our case, the government is violating your Fourth Amendment rights. I also believe that's why people who get paid by the government don't have to do it.

 

[danielpalos]

]
Our problem isn't that we can't work through a problem, Lice. It's that we dispute your definition of "problem", and we utterly reject your "solution" of convincing perfectly capable adults that they're helpless children who need a "societal" nanny.

So you can't perceive a problem. That says a lot about your intellect, the limits of which I have seen before.

Blah blah "You don't agree with me, so you're STUPID!"

I don't perceive the problem YOU think exists. And believe me, I'm not going to be ashamed about it because YOU don't approve.

Who cares what you think. You are just here to sexually serve some fundie guy. Go back to your bedroom. You are just a fundie chick.

lol. i don't take right wing women seriously.

Gee, Daniel...I wonder who's more intelligent...you...or say, Condi Rice? Do you take her seriously?

depends on the argument.

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

 

[Polishprince]

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

That won't work. Employers can reduce their taxable income and their taxes when their expenses go up.

The employees don't pay more taxes because of the Earned Income Tax Credit.


So even if we assume that raising the minimum wage is neutral as far as jobs, it doesn't increase net taxes at all.

 

[Oldstyle]

Shutdown cost U.S. economy $11 billion, budget office says

3 billion will never be recovered. I don’t know how many more times the country can stand Republican attacks. All the attacks under bush, under Reagan and now the attacks under Trump.

America has been devastated by Republicans.

So Pelosi refused to give in on the wall prompting a shut down which cost the US economy 11 billion and put Federal workers through weeks of stress...and after all that we STILL don't have a secure border...we don't have comprehensive immigration reform and we still have tens of thousands of illegals headed our way in caravans! So what did Pelosi gain by what she put the country through?

 

[XponentialChaos]

There's about a million folks and the people who depend on them as well..that are getting screwed by Trump

So why is it always Trump and not the Democrats? Trump is trying to do things to stop a problem, and the Democrats are trying to do things to stop Trump. Trump is trying to keep a campaign promise, and with the Democrats, it's pure politics.

You known the answer to that.
So Trump is just trying to keep a campaign promise. Well that should be really comforting to 800,000 people who will be going a month without pay so Trump can keep a campaign promise.

I see.......so what you're saying is that Trump should break his campaign promise to tens of millions of people to make 800,000 people happy that would never vote for him? Does that sound like good political advice?

No, I'm not saying he shouldn't fight for his wall. He just shouldn't hold 800,000 people hostage because he's can't cut a deal. He should allow government to start for 30 or 60 days while he tries to work a deal with Pelosi. Whose to say that Pelosi would not comprise with him on his wall and he builds just 100 miles of it this year.

Piglosi: give us what we want now and then we’ll discuss what you want later and tell you to go pound a salt bag. So you get nothing and we get back pay and work for our voters. We are hailed heroes and you will be proven a sap.

Tell me, if you were Trump, would you accept that deal? Because if you would, you’d be the biggest sucker in the country.

...are you saying that Trump is the biggest sucker in the country?

 

[Oldstyle]

So you can't perceive a problem. That says a lot about your intellect, the limits of which I have seen before.

Blah blah "You don't agree with me, so you're STUPID!"

I don't perceive the problem YOU think exists. And believe me, I'm not going to be ashamed about it because YOU don't approve.

Who cares what you think. You are just here to sexually serve some fundie guy. Go back to your bedroom. You are just a fundie chick.

lol. i don't take right wing women seriously.

Gee, Daniel...I wonder who's more intelligent...you...or say, Condi Rice? Do you take her seriously?

depends on the argument.

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

So your "solution" to increasing tax revenue is to artificially raise wages across the board which will by necessity also increase the cost of goods and services across the board which means the average American will be no better off than they were before but many young people and those without many job skills will probably be unable to find an entry level job.

Do yourself a favor, Daniel...there is a very fine economic text book by Thomas Sowell that explains EXACTLY why a minimum wage is counter productive! Read it so you have a clue what it is that you're talking about!

 

[Rambunctious]

Why are all of these very rich people telling us little people who are finally back to work and coming out of an 8 year recession that the guy that has made that possible is no good for us?.....

They must think we are stupid...with or without our MAGA hats on.....

 

[XponentialChaos]

A

meanwhile...the American Legion Temporary Financial Assistance Fund is running dry trying to help the Coasties that are being fucked over during this shutdown.

Our turn to rescue the Coast Guard, and we need your help.

We are doing a flea market with all the proceeds going to the fund. Other post are doing similar things.

These people put their lives on the line on a more regular basis than just about anyone and we cannot even give them a paycheck.

Sometimes we just suck as a country.

dirty shame that one man can make life miserable for so many and while she doesn't get as much blame imo pelosi's hands aren't clean either

I'm actually starting to admire Pelosi a little more. I liked PayGo when W was potus. And I don't see her options with Trump. I think it's clear the dems are signaling they'll consider an offer from Trump that doesn't include the Wall across Texas. Trump never won a popular mandate for it, and the dems just handed the gop their asses. If Trump can force his will through blackmailing by hurting over a million workers and negatively affecting our safety ... we both know damn well the SOB will do it over and over. There's only one way to stand up to a bully.

The Democrats are just as responsible for those 800,000 as Trump because they refuse to give in either. Trump is showing no weakness as it's the Democrats trying to get the government open with no deal. Trump is standing strong and will continue to do so.

Whoops.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Why are all of these very rich people telling us little people who are finally back to work and coming out of an 8 year recession that the guy that has made that possible is no good for us?.....

They must think we are stupid...with or without our MAGA hats on.....

You think we were in a recession for 8 years...we do not have to think you are stupid, you just confirmed it.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[edward37]

A

meanwhile...the American Legion Temporary Financial Assistance Fund is running dry trying to help the Coasties that are being fucked over during this shutdown.

Our turn to rescue the Coast Guard, and we need your help.

We are doing a flea market with all the proceeds going to the fund. Other post are doing similar things.

These people put their lives on the line on a more regular basis than just about anyone and we cannot even give them a paycheck.

Sometimes we just suck as a country.

dirty shame that one man can make life miserable for so many and while she doesn't get as much blame imo pelosi's hands aren't clean either

I'm actually starting to admire Pelosi a little more. I liked PayGo when W was potus. And I don't see her options with Trump. I think it's clear the dems are signaling they'll consider an offer from Trump that doesn't include the Wall across Texas. Trump never won a popular mandate for it, and the dems just handed the gop their asses. If Trump can force his will through blackmailing by hurting over a million workers and negatively affecting our safety ... we both know damn well the SOB will do it over and over. There's only one way to stand up to a bully.

The Democrats are just as responsible for those 800,000 as Trump because they refuse to give in either. Trump is showing no weakness as it's the Democrats trying to get the government open with no deal. Trump is standing strong and will continue to do so.

Whoops.

dems won't give in to trump republican mafia tactics of blackmail Keep it up and you lose the senate and presidency in 2020

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So why is it always Trump and not the Democrats? Trump is trying to do things to stop a problem, and the Democrats are trying to do things to stop Trump. Trump is trying to keep a campaign promise, and with the Democrats, it's pure politics.

You known the answer to that.
So Trump is just trying to keep a campaign promise. Well that should be really comforting to 800,000 people who will be going a month without pay so Trump can keep a campaign promise.

I see.......so what you're saying is that Trump should break his campaign promise to tens of millions of people to make 800,000 people happy that would never vote for him? Does that sound like good political advice?

No, I'm not saying he shouldn't fight for his wall. He just shouldn't hold 800,000 people hostage because he's can't cut a deal. He should allow government to start for 30 or 60 days while he tries to work a deal with Pelosi. Whose to say that Pelosi would not comprise with him on his wall and he builds just 100 miles of it this year.

Piglosi: give us what we want now and then we’ll discuss what you want later and tell you to go pound a salt bag. So you get nothing and we get back pay and work for our voters. We are hailed heroes and you will be proven a sap.

Tell me, if you were Trump, would you accept that deal? Because if you would, you’d be the biggest sucker in the country.

...are you saying that Trump is the biggest sucker in the country?

Yes he is......for now. I await to see his future actions. Trump Fd up. He should have continued this shutdown until the Democrats at least wanted to negotiate. It may be he did it to get his State of the Union speech in. Let's see what he has to say then.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Do you think welfare recipients should take a drug test?

I do. Why not? If we working people have to take drug tests, why shouldn't the people that live off the money working people make?

We are in agreement then.

IMO we either all take drug tests or we all don't. I hate when my name gets pulled up for a drug test. It's a pain in the ass because my employer by law is not allowed to tell us ahead of time when we got called. And it always seems I just went to the bathroom before I found out I had to go.

Most police officers are not required for those tests, neither are teachers, neither are our politicians. I wonder how many people would keep those jobs if drug testing was a requirement.

I actually don't even remember the last job I had that didn't require drug testing, because I give so little thought and attention to being drug tested. It is at best a momentary blip on my radar. I can't even imagine having to plan my life around such a thing. Sounds tiresome. My current employer doesn't do it once you're hired, but that's because we all work closely together in small offices, and being high would be really obvious.

Well drug tests are more than about if you're intoxicated at the moment. Pot stays in your system for close to a month. So you could have been smoking pot last weekend, and February 5th, get busted because you had to take a drug test. Opioid products are out of your system in less than 48 hours.

Most employers have drug testing to reduce their premiums on Workman's Compensation insurance. It's not a violation of your constitutional rights because in most cases, your employer is not the government. However it's federal law that truck drivers submit to drug screenings to keep your medical card. I guess nobody challenged that in court yet. In our case, the government is violating your Fourth Amendment rights. I also believe that's why people who get paid by the government don't have to do it.

I understand why, and in a large company I think it's necessary. Again, you work in a small office with a handful of people who are basically in each other's pockets, you're going to know who has a problem and who doesn't in a very short time, even if they don't come to work high.

As for the people who telecommute, I don't think we care what they do, so long as their work doesn't suffer.

 

[Cecilie1200]

You known the answer to that.
So Trump is just trying to keep a campaign promise. Well that should be really comforting to 800,000 people who will be going a month without pay so Trump can keep a campaign promise.

I see.......so what you're saying is that Trump should break his campaign promise to tens of millions of people to make 800,000 people happy that would never vote for him? Does that sound like good political advice?

No, I'm not saying he shouldn't fight for his wall. He just shouldn't hold 800,000 people hostage because he's can't cut a deal. He should allow government to start for 30 or 60 days while he tries to work a deal with Pelosi. Whose to say that Pelosi would not comprise with him on his wall and he builds just 100 miles of it this year.

Piglosi: give us what we want now and then we’ll discuss what you want later and tell you to go pound a salt bag. So you get nothing and we get back pay and work for our voters. We are hailed heroes and you will be proven a sap.

Tell me, if you were Trump, would you accept that deal? Because if you would, you’d be the biggest sucker in the country.

...are you saying that Trump is the biggest sucker in the country?

Yes he is......for now. I await to see his future actions. Trump Fd up. He should have continued this shutdown until the Democrats at least wanted to negotiate. It may be he did it to get his State of the Union speech in. Let's see what he has to say then.

I think he's trying to maneuver to get the Democrats actually blamed for the shutdown if and when it resumes. I doubt he'll be able to accomplish that with the media in their corner.

 

[Andylusion]

It's better in some places than others. New York and California are the worst for finding affordable rent and other things.

In Dem districts, like Pelosi's San Fran, the cost of rent is $3,000 for a crappy apartment. Really blows the budget.

As a landlord, I can explain at least part of this. Millennials and Gen X's are not interested in owning homes. Unlike when we were young, and owning a home was everything, today, following generations simply don't want the responsibility of home ownership.

And from reading various things about these younger generations, they don't want to own anything. Many lease their car. Others rent everything from their furniture to television sets. They simply don't want the problems of ownership. When a problem happens, they simply want to make one phone call and have somebody else deal with it.

It began at the housing crash where millions of people lost their asses. From there, many destroyed their credit because of bankruptcy. They couldn't get a home loan even if they inherited $40,000. So I don't know if they gave up or it changed their priorities. But either way, supply and demand kicked in, and it was strongly in favor of landlords.

The last time I advertised an apartment was February three years ago. From past experience, I didn't expect much of a reply since most people move in spring. I was amazed when I went to my email the next day and found over a dozen replies---some stating they will take the apartment sight unseen. I chose a wonderful couple who were expecting a baby in a few months and they told me of their horrors of trying to find a decent apartment; they were looking for months.

Bottom line is many landlords are taking full advantage of this situation since it's happening coast to coast. They own a commodity everybody wants. When that happens, prices skyrocket.

I would also add, that there is a cultural shift away from the stable married family. Owning a home makes sense if you are married, intend to stay married, and want to have a stable family.

Owning a home is a terrible idea in any other context. If you divorce, the house becomes a massive burden. If you are not married, then your 'partner' can simply bring in a replacement for you, while you are still living there.

If one decides to simply not pay the mortgage, you end up being ruined over it.

 

[Andylusion]

A

meanwhile...the American Legion Temporary Financial Assistance Fund is running dry trying to help the Coasties that are being fucked over during this shutdown.

Our turn to rescue the Coast Guard, and we need your help.

We are doing a flea market with all the proceeds going to the fund. Other post are doing similar things.

These people put their lives on the line on a more regular basis than just about anyone and we cannot even give them a paycheck.

Sometimes we just suck as a country.

dirty shame that one man can make life miserable for so many and while she doesn't get as much blame imo pelosi's hands aren't clean either

I'm actually starting to admire Pelosi a little more. I liked PayGo when W was potus. And I don't see her options with Trump. I think it's clear the dems are signaling they'll consider an offer from Trump that doesn't include the Wall across Texas. Trump never won a popular mandate for it, and the dems just handed the gop their asses. If Trump can force his will through blackmailing by hurting over a million workers and negatively affecting our safety ... we both know damn well the SOB will do it over and over. There's only one way to stand up to a bully.

The Democrats are just as responsible for those 800,000 as Trump because they refuse to give in either. Trump is showing no weakness as it's the Democrats trying to get the government open with no deal. Trump is standing strong and will continue to do so.

Whoops.

dems won't give in to trump republican mafia tactics of blackmail Keep it up and you lose the senate and presidency in 2020

Dems were saying stuff like that before 2009, and before 2016. Funny how the Republicans gained both houses, and the presidency, after being told "If you keep it up, you'll lose!".

 

[LeftofLeft]

The economy is only doing well if you are in the top 10%. For everybody else, not so much.

You could be in the Top 10 percent and still living paycheck to paycheck and/or leveraged to the hilt in debt and not be able to miss a paycheck. The economy has nothing to do with that.

 

[danielpalos]

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

That won't work. Employers can reduce their taxable income and their taxes when their expenses go up.

The employees don't pay more taxes because of the Earned Income Tax Credit.


So even if we assume that raising the minimum wage is neutral as far as jobs, it doesn't increase net taxes at all.

the laws of demand and supply don't cease to exist for right wing fantasy. higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

 

[danielpalos]

Blah blah "You don't agree with me, so you're STUPID!"

I don't perceive the problem YOU think exists. And believe me, I'm not going to be ashamed about it because YOU don't approve.

Who cares what you think. You are just here to sexually serve some fundie guy. Go back to your bedroom. You are just a fundie chick.

lol. i don't take right wing women seriously.

Gee, Daniel...I wonder who's more intelligent...you...or say, Condi Rice? Do you take her seriously?

depends on the argument.

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

So your "solution" to increasing tax revenue is to artificially raise wages across the board which will by necessity also increase the cost of goods and services across the board which means the average American will be no better off than they were before but many young people and those without many job skills will probably be unable to find an entry level job.

Do yourself a favor, Daniel...there is a very fine economic text book by Thomas Sowell that explains EXACTLY why a minimum wage is counter productive! Read it so you have a clue what it is that you're talking about!

inflation happens. it won't be a one to one ratio. don't worry. and, higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand. only the right wing, never gets it.

 

[Polishprince]

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

That won't work. Employers can reduce their taxable income and their taxes when their expenses go up.

The employees don't pay more taxes because of the Earned Income Tax Credit.


So even if we assume that raising the minimum wage is neutral as far as jobs, it doesn't increase net taxes at all.

the laws of demand and supply don't cease to exist for right wing fantasy. higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

Not at the lowest level does it. Are you unfamiliar with EITC? We aren't talking about raising the min wage to $30 an hour are we?

 

[danielpalos]

we should raise the minimum wage to raise tax revenue.

That won't work. Employers can reduce their taxable income and their taxes when their expenses go up.

The employees don't pay more taxes because of the Earned Income Tax Credit.


So even if we assume that raising the minimum wage is neutral as far as jobs, it doesn't increase net taxes at all.

the laws of demand and supply don't cease to exist for right wing fantasy. higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

Not at the lowest level does it. Are you unfamiliar with EITC? We aren't talking about raising the min wage to $30 an hour are we?

not everyone applies for the credit and yes, higher paid labor will pay more in income tax and create more in demand.