Zone1 If Trump isn't pro-life anymore I have no reason to vote for him...

[Flopper]

In the last two elections, I held my nose and voted for Trump because he was the pro-life candidate. And, true to his word, he appointed pro-life Supreme Court justices and got Roe v. Wade overturned.

But now Trump is making noises like he's not pro-life anymore. Melania published her book recently and made a bold pro-abort statement.

Accordingly, I will not vote for Trump in November. I will vote for all down ballot candidates and state initiatives, but neither major candidate for President.

What Trump does depends on who he's speaking to and on what day it is. If you know anything about the life of Donald Trump, you should know he tells people what they want to hear.

In one of his books he cautions readers to always tell the buyer what they want to hear and let the lawyers workout the details. When getting business loans in New York, his bankers wanted to know he was worth more than he actually was, so that is what he told them. At his trial he said, I got the loans and built beautiful buildings in New York and the banks made money and I made money. What's wrong with that? When financing his payoffs of his prostitute and his porn star, he lied by falsifying business records to hide it. In court he said I did nothing wrong.

It should be abundantly clear that Honesty and Donald Trump are not on the best of terms.

 

[initforme]

It's hard for us pro lifers to think about all the innocent babies killed for convenience in the no restrictions of any kind states and those passing draconian laws that make it difficult or impossible for the necessary procedures to be done is just as bad. Melania is absolutely right that timing matters in many of these cases.

Roe v Wade was a compromise of sorts. Leave it up the the doctor and woman in the first trimester, the state has increased interest in the second trimester and the state has a great deal of interest in the third trimester. The intention was that a doctor would need additional authority for an elective abortion in the second trimester and likely a court order for an elective abortion in the third trimester. Of course the pro abortion crowd extrapolated that to no restrictions of any kind plus they wanted insurance companies and/or the taxpayers to pay for all elective abortions.

The huge majority of American citizens do want some restrictions on abortions while very very few want abortion to be banned for any and all reasons.

Have you ever thought of promoting young couples not having kids? Taking steps to ensure no kids are conceived if they are not wanted and APPLAUDING that?

 

[buttercup]

An opinion somebody held 20, 30, 40 or more years ago or even this morning can absolutely change. I held many opinions 20, 30, 40 or more years ago that I no longer have.

Anybody who says they have not changed their views about anything at all over the years is either lying or lives in such a restricted environment they have never ever had to think about anything. Experience, trial and error, education we acquire in living our lives can change a lot of things.

As always, I know I'm in the minority around here, but in my view ^ this^ is one of the biggest problems in this country. People put so much trust in political "leaders." In many cases almost to the point of hero worship.

We can agree to disagree of course, but I just don't buy that he has gone through deep radical changes, going from a New York liberal to a conservative christian. But then, my view since the start has been that Trump is "controlled opposition", just playing a role. I've said this so many times, but I'll say it again. I firmly believe that no one is allowed to the highest office in the land without being "in the club", if you know what I mean. But the public never learns. Trump is a good actor, I'll give him that.

 

[dblack]

Overturning RvW did nothing to address the curtailing of abortions.

But it made the meddling busybodies happy.

 

[initforme]

It's in the hands of each states voters. Explain what more you want.

 

[initforme]

Overturning RvW did nothing to address the curtailing of abortions.

Yes, it fid. It gave the pro life side what they wanted. In the hands of the voters. As it was wished for.

 

[Flopper]

It's hard for us pro lifers to think about all the innocent babies killed for convenience in the no restrictions of any kind states and those passing draconian laws that make it difficult or impossible for the necessary procedures to be done is just as bad. Melania is absolutely right that timing matters in many of these cases.

Roe v Wade was a compromise of sorts. Leave it up the the doctor and woman in the first trimester, the state has increased interest in the second trimester and the state has a great deal of interest in the third trimester. The intention was that a doctor would need additional authority for an elective abortion in the second trimester and likely a court order for an elective abortion in the third trimester. Of course the pro abortion crowd extrapolated that to no restrictions of any kind plus they wanted insurance companies and/or the taxpayers to pay for all elective abortions.

The huge majority of American citizens do want some restrictions on abortions while very very few want abortion to be banned for any and all reasons.

Currently, 63% say abortion should be legal in all or most cases. Most cases meaning up to 25 weeks.

Public Opinion on Abortion

While public support for legal abortion has fluctuated some in two decades of polling, it has remained relatively stable over the past five years.

www.pewresearch.org

However, the devil in the details. The vast majority of American believe abortion should be available to women whose life or health is in serious jeopardy as determined by their doctor, not the government.

 

[initforme]

Less govt means staying out of what happens between dr and woman.

 

[pknopp]

It's in the hands of each states voters. Explain what more you want.

Fewer abortions?

 

[pknopp]

Yes, it fid. It gave the pro life side what they wanted. In the hands of the voters. As it was wished for.

Your post doesn't actually address what I said. It didn't nothing to curtail abortions.

You said "yes it did". It did not.

 

[dblack]

Less govt means staying out of what happens between dr and woman.

Republicans aren't that big on limited government these days. They have a culture war to win!

 

[initforme]

Fewer abortions?

Ifvthats what the voters decide then so be it. Ever thought of encouraging alot less conceptions?

 

[initforme]

Your post doesn't actually address what I said. It didn't nothing to curtail abortions.

You said "yes it did". It did not.

It's in the hands of the voters in each state. Even president Trump was for getting rid of roe. It's gone. Problem is taken care of.

 

[pknopp]

Ifvthats what the voters decide then so be it. Ever thought of encouraging alot less conceptions?

I'll work on that..................

 

[pknopp]

It's in the hands of the voters in each state. Even president Trump was for getting rid of roe. It's gone. Problem is taken care of.

I support the actual pro-life position.

 

[initforme]

I support the actual pro-life position.

So you are happy roe is overturned. It's done.

 

[Foxfyre]

Have you ever thought of promoting young couples not having kids? Taking steps to ensure no kids are conceived if they are not wanted and APPLAUDING that?

You don't know me very well and that might generate a good discussion. This thread isn't about that though

Less govt means staying out of what happens between dr and woman.

And yet the Democrats and a few others pitched a royal hissy fit when Trump and the Supreme Court said the federal government should not be involved at all.

 

[Blackrook]

It's in the hands of each states voters. Explain what more you want.

That worked for slavery, until it didn't.

 

[Foxfyre]

Currently, 63% say abortion should be legal in all or most cases. Most cases meaning up to 25 weeks.

Public Opinion on Abortion

While public support for legal abortion has fluctuated some in two decades of polling, it has remained relatively stable over the past five years.

www.pewresearch.org

However, the devil in the details. The vast majority of American believe abortion should be available to women whose life or health is in serious jeopardy as determined by their doctor, not the government.

But the vast majority of Americans do want some restrictions on abortions, just not the draconian restrictions imposed in some states:

Where Do Americans Stand on Abortion?

Most Americans favor abortion being legal to some degree, and a majority self-identify as "pro-choice."

news.gallup.com

Abortion: Democrats’ Lead on Issue Thinner Than Ever

Although nearly half of voters identify as pro-choice on the abortion issue, the Democratic Party’s advantage has dwindled to statistical insignificance.

www.rasmussenreports.com

66% of Voters Oppose Late-Term Abortion

A majority of American voters identify as pro-choice, but don’t think abortion should be legal past the third month of pregnancy.

www.rasmussenreports.com

Majority Now Approve SCOTUS Abortion Ruling

One year after the Supreme Court overturned the 1973 Roe v. Wade ruling, so that each state can now determine its own laws regarding abortion, a majority of voters approve the decision.

www.rasmussenreports.com

 

[pknopp]

So you are happy roe is overturned. It's done.

I'm not. Nothing has been done to lessen abortions. Overturning RvW did nothing to do that.

But you understand that.