If walls won't work...why do so many secure places have walls???

[Flopper]

No, its there to keep those who want to kill us, out.

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

Except that we have Obamacare...we don't have a wall built by the Mexican government.

And we're not likely to

 

[S.J.]

It's more about a psychological Wall (physical too of course)

It's there

to tell the beggars

you are not wanted here.

No, its there to keep those who want to kill us, out.

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

And a helluva lot cheaper.

 

[charwin95]

how did those MEN with a dream for a trancontinental railroad get their rail road building supplies delivered to them Pogo ??

Exactly right.

We can build a transcontinental railroad in the 1800s.
We can build the god damn hoover dam (no pun!)
We built a space station and are heading to Mars.
We have 8,000 man nuclear aircraft carriers that can sail 20 years without refueling
Libs say we can build high speed, low energy rail all across the nation
We built an Internet capable of allowing instant face to face communication on a 6 inch phone from China to Florida



BUT WE CAN'T BUILD A FUCKING BRICK WALL IN THE TEXAS DESERT FOLKS. Just can't do it.

Calm down Buc you might get a stroke. Nobody said that we cannot build a golden wall. Sure we can build a wall.
However IMHO and IME........ I don't think the wall is necessary. Why I said that?
Our borders are far more secure than what people think. It's a lot harder to cross these borders illegally compared in last 3 or 4 years. Numbers of illegal crossings are way way down the lowest in 20 years. Number of illegal apprehension is up. We doubled the number of BP agents and we are still hiring more BP. We invested billions in new technology.
As I previously posted its very easy to breach the wall.


Fewer immigrants are entering the U.S. illegally, and that’s changed the border security debate

------------------------------------------------- BS Charwin , of course any crossing illegal is reason for the wall and wall breachers will need to be hunted down and destroyed Charwin !!

The estimate to build the wall is between 15 to 25 billions. Excluding maintenance....... So if 300 illegals get thru our border each year. Is that a good justification to build the wall? People like you, Bucs and other Trump sympathizers the answer is YES.......
Then, how about the thousands and thousands of tourist that violates their visas each year? How about the H1 and H2 people that violates their visas?

-------------------------------------- B.S. , my estimate says about 10 - 11 billion , you seem to think that if you post something then it is automatically true . No matter though , if it were to cost 25 billion that's ok with me Charwin . Build the wall , Go Trump !!

The 10 billions estimate you mentioned came from CNN video. I know you forgot something.
Did they mentioned........... Labor, heavy equipments, pave road how to get to those borders, pave road along the border walls, purchase land from private owners, housings for the construction workers, facilities ( at least 300 ) where to make the precast cement wall, maintenance? Did they include those on their estimates? The answer is no, no, no, no, no and no.

BTW...... Here is the estimates per mile (2009) in building those roads. My SWAG minimum 2,500 miles.

 

[charwin95]

how did those MEN with a dream for a trancontinental railroad get their rail road building supplies delivered to them Pogo ??

Exactly right.

We can build a transcontinental railroad in the 1800s.
We can build the god damn hoover dam (no pun!)
We built a space station and are heading to Mars.
We have 8,000 man nuclear aircraft carriers that can sail 20 years without refueling
Libs say we can build high speed, low energy rail all across the nation
We built an Internet capable of allowing instant face to face communication on a 6 inch phone from China to Florida



BUT WE CAN'T BUILD A FUCKING BRICK WALL IN THE TEXAS DESERT FOLKS. Just can't do it.

Calm down Buc you might get a stroke. Nobody said that we cannot build a golden wall. Sure we can build a wall.
However IMHO and IME........ I don't think the wall is necessary. Why I said that?
Our borders are far more secure than what people think. It's a lot harder to cross these borders illegally compared in last 3 or 4 years. Numbers of illegal crossings are way way down the lowest in 20 years. Number of illegal apprehension is up. We doubled the number of BP agents and we are still hiring more BP. We invested billions in new technology.
As I previously posted its very easy to breach the wall.


Fewer immigrants are entering the U.S. illegally, and that’s changed the border security debate

That is wrong....obama has been playing games with the numbers to hide how many are getting in.....

Maybe a link or something guy? This is not about a thing that you can tack something in your waist. You know what I'm saying?

 

[charwin95]

Folks....I had to take a drive out towards the north part of town today and passed by the Charleston Air Force Base. It had walls all around it. So does the Charleston jail.

I jog our beautiful downtown bridge often and it overlooks historic Charleston harbor. The harbor the real pirate Blackbeard blockaded. And it contains Fort Sumter....massive island fort in the middle of the harbor. Huge walls.


Can't help but wonder.....why do places that want to be secure almost all have walls? And why do liberals oppose America having walls?

The people that want to flood this country with people that drove down wages in CA and NY are the same ones who are against the wall while they're raising the minimum -wage.

Talking about being on both sides of an issue......
Jeezus.

That is incorrect........ I know tons of people and I have not met a single person that support illegals. And I don't see any members here that supports illegals either.......
However........... WE have more common sense, reality and decency. Sorry to say that.

 

[charwin95]

It's more about a psychological Wall (physical too of course)

It's there

to tell the beggars

you are not wanted here.

No, its there to keep those who want to kill us, out.

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

 

[koshergrl]

No, its there to keep those who want to kill us, out.

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

 

[Never3ndr]

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

Says the person that stated that the wall is more doable than Obamacare when we have Obamacare, but don't have a wall built by Mexicans along our Southern border. #idiot

 

[koshergrl]

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

Says the person that stated that the wall is more doable than Obamacare when we have Obamacare, but don't have a wall built by Mexicans along our Southern border. #idiot

I know you think you made sense there. Maybe try again?

 

[Never3ndr]

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

Says the person that stated that the wall is more doable than Obamacare when we have Obamacare, but don't have a wall built by Mexicans along our Southern border. #idiot

I know you think you made sense there. Maybe try again?

Sure, where is our wall that is built by Mexicans along our Southern border? You clearly stated that it is more doable than Obamacare. As we already have Obamacare implemented I'm simply asking you to point towards this wall you know of. As it is more doable, and many Americans obviously are interested in it, it certainly has already been constructed. I am simply unaware of this fact. Please provide the link, point me towards this wall built by Mexicans that is so doable that we have already constructed it to prove your point.

If you cannot follow that simple, spelled-out, train of thought. You may want to never engage in a discussion again.

 

[koshergrl]

Uh...I never said we had a wall. If you think that something has to occur before it is possible, then your problems are bigger than I can overcome on a mere message board. I can teach you to engage in intelligent conversation, and I can teach you to debate intelligently...but I won't do it for free.

 

[charwin95]

That would make more sense if something like that worked. As is, it won't, unless you are actually volunteering to quit your job, move to Texas and man the wall yourself. Oh, and by the way, also volunteering hundreds of thousands of other Americans to do the same.

Again, the cost does not justify it. Just building a wall won't really stop anything. If you want to actually make the border secure than that would cost more resources than any reasonable American is willing to give up. The only ACTUAL solution is to look to change our policies regarding both immigration and drug control.

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

We are talking about a wall then you brought up Obamacare. You are not making sense at all.

 

[koshergrl]

oh bullshit. Walls do work. Lets put mexicans to work building it. Give them a piece of land on the border and a rifle and let them build and defend it themselves. NOBODY will get through.

Talking tough behind your key board........ but can you be more realistic? At least.

A wall is a lot more doable than Obamacare ever had a chance of being...

I hope you realize that a Wall and Obamacare is totally different. Can you be more realistic? #2

I'm sorry you're incapable of intelligent discussion and therefore a waste of time.

We are talking about a wall then you brought up Obamacare. You are not making sense at all.

No. The theory was that a wall was financially impossible...and I reminded you that Obamacare is financially impossible....but we still have it.

 

[whitehall]

No matter how hard progressives try to change the interpretation of language the word "wall" still translates to security. America's southern border doesn't have to be a physical wall but it has to insure the security of the U.S. against alien invaders.

 

[OnePercenter]

Folks....I had to take a drive out towards the north part of town today and passed by the Charleston Air Force Base. It had walls all around it. So does the Charleston jail.

I jog our beautiful downtown bridge often and it overlooks historic Charleston harbor. The harbor the real pirate Blackbeard blockaded. And it contains Fort Sumter....massive island fort in the middle of the harbor. Huge walls.


Can't help but wonder.....why do places that want to be secure almost all have walls? And why do liberals oppose America having walls?

Folks....I had to take a drive out towards the north part of town today and passed by the Charleston Air Force Base. It had walls all around it. So does the Charleston jail.

I jog our beautiful downtown bridge often and it overlooks historic Charleston harbor. The harbor the real pirate Blackbeard blockaded. And it contains Fort Sumter....massive island fort in the middle of the harbor. Huge walls.


Can't help but wonder.....why do places that want to be secure almost all have walls? And why do liberals oppose America having walls?

How much do you want to spend? Illegal aliens come in from BOTH borders.

The much less costly answer is to arrest, fine, and incarcerate employers that knowingly hire illegals. The only problem is that Sheriff Joe's reelection funds come from those employers. Isn't greed a wonderful thing?

 

[eagle1462010]

US-Mexico Border Fence / Great Wall of Mexico

But Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said a wall running the length of a border would cost too much. A 2,000 mile state-of-the-art border fence has been estimated to cost between four and eight billion dollars. Costs for a wall that would run the entire length of the border might be as low as $851 million for a standard 10-foot prison chain link fence topped by razor wire. For another $362 million, the fence could be electrified. A larger 12-foot tall, two-foot-thick concrete wall painted on both sides would run about $2 billion. Initially it was estimated that the San Diego fence would cost $14 million -- about $1 million a mile. The first 11 miles of the fence eventually cost $42 million -- $3.8 million per mile, and the last 3.5 miles may cost even more since they cover more difficult terrain. An additional $35 million to complete the final 3.5 miles was approved in 2005 by the Department of Homeland Security -- $10 million per mile.

The REAL ID bill conference report contained a provision that would complete the US-Mexico border fence in San Diego. But it went much farther than that. It gives the Department of Homeland security unprecedented and unchecked authority to waive all legal requirements necessary to build such fences, not only in San Diego, but anywhere else along the 2,000 mile border with Mexico and our 4,000 mile border with Canada.

In August 2005 the governors of New Mexico and Arizona declared a state of emergency, saying their states were suffering because the federal government had failed to stem the tide of drug smuggling and illegal immigration. The declarations by New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson and Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano freed up a combined $2.2 million to eight border counties in those states.

On 14 December 2005 Mexican President Vicente Fox denounced as "disgraceful and shameful" a proposal to build a high-tech wall on the US-Mexico border to stop illegal immigrants. Media reports on 21 December 2005 quoted Foreign Secretary Luis Ernesto Derbez as saying, " Mexico is not going to bear, it is not going to permit, and it will not allow a stupid thing like this wall."

DHS's U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) contractor, the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (USACE), had completed about 73 miles of primary SBI fencing costing approximately $198 million as of September 30, 2007, and about 215 miles of fencing costing about $625 million as of October 31, 2008. Seventy-one of the miles completed as of September 30, 2007, were pedestrian fencing completed at costs ranging from $400,000 to $4.8 million per mile and averaging $2.8 million per mile. CBP had also finished about 2 miles of vehicle fencing at a cost of $2.8 million. Pedestrian fencing accounted for 140 of the miles that CBP had completed as of October 31, 2008, with costs ranging from $400,000 to $15.1 million per mile for an average of $3.9 million per mile. Seventy-five of the miles were vehicle fencing and costs ranged from $200,000 to $1.8 million per mile, averaging $1.0 million per mile. The per mile costs to build the fencing varied considerably because of the type of fencing, topography, materials used, land acquisition costs, and labor costs, among other things.

For fiscal years 2006 through 2009, the SBI program received about $3.6 billion in appropriated funds. Of this amount, by late 2008 about $2.4 billion had been allocated to complete approximately 670 miles of vehicle and pedestrian fencing along the roughly 2,000 miles of border between the United States and Mexico. In March the Tactical Infrastructure / Border Fence Program was transferred to U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) Office of Finance, Facilities Management and Engineering (FM&E) from the Secure Border Initiative (SBI).

 

[eagle1462010]

Trump has stated the wall would cost between 8 to 10 Billion.........Higher than the site posted.......Without the border agents no wall can secure the border............so he has proposed tripling the border agents..........that over time will be a large commitment..........but should it secure the border the savings to this country would be enormous.

Immigration Reform

 

[Flopper]

Exactly right.

We can build a transcontinental railroad in the 1800s.
We can build the god damn hoover dam (no pun!)
We built a space station and are heading to Mars.
We have 8,000 man nuclear aircraft carriers that can sail 20 years without refueling
Libs say we can build high speed, low energy rail all across the nation
We built an Internet capable of allowing instant face to face communication on a 6 inch phone from China to Florida



BUT WE CAN'T BUILD A FUCKING BRICK WALL IN THE TEXAS DESERT FOLKS. Just can't do it.

Calm down Buc you might get a stroke. Nobody said that we cannot build a golden wall. Sure we can build a wall.
However IMHO and IME........ I don't think the wall is necessary. Why I said that?
Our borders are far more secure than what people think. It's a lot harder to cross these borders illegally compared in last 3 or 4 years. Numbers of illegal crossings are way way down the lowest in 20 years. Number of illegal apprehension is up. We doubled the number of BP agents and we are still hiring more BP. We invested billions in new technology.
As I previously posted its very easy to breach the wall.


Fewer immigrants are entering the U.S. illegally, and that’s changed the border security debate

------------------------------------------------- BS Charwin , of course any crossing illegal is reason for the wall and wall breachers will need to be hunted down and destroyed Charwin !!

The estimate to build the wall is between 15 to 25 billions. Excluding maintenance....... So if 300 illegals get thru our border each year. Is that a good justification to build the wall? People like you, Bucs and other Trump sympathizers the answer is YES.......
Then, how about the thousands and thousands of tourist that violates their visas each year? How about the H1 and H2 people that violates their visas?

-------------------------------------- B.S. , my estimate says about 10 - 11 billion , you seem to think that if you post something then it is automatically true . No matter though , if it were to cost 25 billion that's ok with me Charwin . Build the wall , Go Trump !!

The 10 billions estimate you mentioned came from CNN video. I know you forgot something.
Did they mentioned........... Labor, heavy equipments, pave road how to get to those borders, pave road along the border walls, purchase land from private owners, housings for the construction workers, facilities ( at least 300 ) where to make the precast cement wall, maintenance? Did they include those on their estimates? The answer is no, no, no, no, no and no.

BTW...... Here is the estimates per mile (2009) in building those roads. My SWAG minimum 2,500 miles.

There is no way to estimate the cost because Trump has said his great wall will stretch the Mexican boarder, nearly 2000 miles but he has also said it would be 1,000 miles. He refers to it as as a 50 foot wall. I suppose he means height not length. He has also said it will be 35 to 50 feet high. Good luck with any estimate.

Of course this is totally irrelevant. Between dealing with Mexico, battles with congress, lawsuits from environmental groups, and rebellion in his own party when he starts stealing land from hundreds of ranchers and farmers, he'll be out of office before the first brick is laid on his great wall. All this assumes, Americans would be stupid enough to elect him.

 

[eagle1462010]

Calm down Buc you might get a stroke. Nobody said that we cannot build a golden wall. Sure we can build a wall.
However IMHO and IME........ I don't think the wall is necessary. Why I said that?
Our borders are far more secure than what people think. It's a lot harder to cross these borders illegally compared in last 3 or 4 years. Numbers of illegal crossings are way way down the lowest in 20 years. Number of illegal apprehension is up. We doubled the number of BP agents and we are still hiring more BP. We invested billions in new technology.
As I previously posted its very easy to breach the wall.


Fewer immigrants are entering the U.S. illegally, and that’s changed the border security debate

------------------------------------------------- BS Charwin , of course any crossing illegal is reason for the wall and wall breachers will need to be hunted down and destroyed Charwin !!

The estimate to build the wall is between 15 to 25 billions. Excluding maintenance....... So if 300 illegals get thru our border each year. Is that a good justification to build the wall? People like you, Bucs and other Trump sympathizers the answer is YES.......
Then, how about the thousands and thousands of tourist that violates their visas each year? How about the H1 and H2 people that violates their visas?

-------------------------------------- B.S. , my estimate says about 10 - 11 billion , you seem to think that if you post something then it is automatically true . No matter though , if it were to cost 25 billion that's ok with me Charwin . Build the wall , Go Trump !!

The 10 billions estimate you mentioned came from CNN video. I know you forgot something.
Did they mentioned........... Labor, heavy equipments, pave road how to get to those borders, pave road along the border walls, purchase land from private owners, housings for the construction workers, facilities ( at least 300 ) where to make the precast cement wall, maintenance? Did they include those on their estimates? The answer is no, no, no, no, no and no.

BTW...... Here is the estimates per mile (2009) in building those roads. My SWAG minimum 2,500 miles.

There is no way to estimate the cost because Trump has said his great wall will stretch the Mexican boarder, nearly 2000 miles but he has also said it would be 1,000 miles. He refers to it as as a 50 foot wall. I suppose he means height not length. He has also said it will be 35 to 50 feet high. Good luck with any estimate.

Of course this is totally irrelevant. Between dealing with Mexico, battles with congress, lawsuits from environmental groups, and rebellion in his own party when he starts stealing land from hundreds of ranchers and farmers, he'll be out of office before the first brick is laid on his great wall. All this assumes, Americans would be stupid enough to elect him.

Yawn..........670 miles have been built...........the 40 to 50 foot walls are rhetoric...........it will all come down to cost...........

We could put in Security Chain link Fencing double layer for about 2 Billion in costs.........then put in outposts for the increased border agents..........put up lookout towers at strategic points and secure the border........will some slip through.....of course.......but by far fewer numbers..........

The only thing stopping us from securing our border is the will to do so........

 

[pismoe]

that's speculation on Trumps ability to get things done Flopper , my only issue in this thread is whether the wall can be built . --- What it would take to build Trump's border wall - CNN Video --- certainly looks reasonable to me Flopper !!