I'm right about World Trade Centers and have an idea how they fell

[Skylar]

Any variant of the Truther conspiracy that posits that flight 77 didn't crash into the Pentagon. The 'official version' is that Flight 77 did crash into the Pentagon. Which you insist you 'know' didn't happen.

The evidence overwhelmingly demonstrates that it did.

No, it's the lack of evidence that is of concern....like how they have never released footage of the alleged attack except for 4 frames that you can't make out what it is that hits the building.

The obvious problem Mr. "Nothing can ever convince me' is that you assume that there is video of the plane hitting the pentagon that isn't being released. But you have nothing to factually back that assumption. You merely believe it to be so....because nothing can ever convince you. And your assumption is irrational. As the the frame rate on the cameras filming an area including the impact zone were entirely too slow to capture the impacting plane.

So you have an irrational assumption backed by nothing. And on this alone, you ignore overwhelming evidence affirming that the plane hit the Pentagon.

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

....and the list of overwhelming evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon. And you ignore every last bit of it, without exception. Why would you do this? You explained it to me the first time we talked:

"Nothing will ever convince me"

But why would a rational person ignore the mountains of evidence confirming Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon? They wouldn't. And they overwhelmingly don't. As the alternative theories given by Truthers are stupidly complicated, horrible explanations of the events, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

While Flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon is simple and overwhelming supported by evidence.

Dozens of witnesses said they heard explosions in the basements of both WTC 1 and 2...why is their testimony not credible but the ones that claim they say a plane hit the Pentagon are? Where are the wings to the airliner? They certainly didn't go through that small hole and if they were knocked off on the way into the building, how was this amateur pilot able to steer it?
Why is there not a scratch on the Pentagon lawn since this alleged airliner came in on a flat trajectory? 1,500 pics and not one seat cushion or piece of luggage in any of them? Why were there so many war games going on that day while leaving only two fighter jets to protect the east coast? The Pentagon has the most secured airspace in the world but yet an amateur pilot beat their system? Dick Cheney gave stand down orders:

MR. HAMILTON: We thank you for that. I wanted to focus just a moment on the Presidential Emergency Operating Center. You were there for a good part of the day. I think you were there with the vice president. And when you had that order given, I think it was by the president, that authorized the shooting down of commercial aircraft that were suspected to be controlled by terrorists, were you there when that order was given?

MR. MINETA: No, I was not. I was made aware of it during the time that the airplane coming into the Pentagon. There was a young man who had come in and said to the vice president, "The plane is 50 miles out. The plane is 30 miles out." And when it got down to, "The plane is 10 miles out," the young man also said to the vice president, "Do the orders still stand?" And the vice president turned and whipped his neck around and said, "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" 2

Ah, Conspiracy Whacka-mole!

I ask you questions about the Pentagon....so you switch to WTC 1 and 2. And if I address WTC 1 and 2 you switch to WTC 7. And when I address WTC 7, you switch to the Pentagon.

If your argument had actual merit, you wouldn't need to run everytime I pointed out the truck sized holes in yoru claims. Again, the evidence confirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon is absolutely overwhelming:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

You ignore all of this evidence.....and then make up your own story, backed by jack shit. And contradicted by the actual evidence.

Which is exactly why the Truther conspiracy isn't taken seriously. Even you don't take your bullshit seriously. As when faced with the evidence....you change the topic.

No, I askted legitimate questions about the Pentagon.

No, you're running. Your theory doesn't work. You have no credible explanation for the mountains of evidence that you ignore. You can't offer us any explanation that takes into account the ACTUAL evidence....that isn't stupidly complicated, wildly complex, baseless, and contradicted by OTHER evidence.

Your entire argument is ignoring the evidence. ANd then running every time I ask you to give me a credible reason why a rational person would ignore the same. And you have no such reason.

Why would a rational person ignore the bodies of Flight 77 passengers and crew being pulled from the Pentagon?

Why would a rational person ignore the radar data tracking Flight 77? Your *own* account of Cheney *relies* on that tracking data. Yet you ignore it utterly. How irrational is that?

Why would a rational person ignore the debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 at the crash site......not only the exact plane, with American Airline colors, but the exact model that American Airlines used?

Why would a rational person ignore the dozens and *dozens* of witnesses that either watched the impact of the plane or watched it fly immediately over I-395 before hitting the Pentagon?

If your argument had merit, you wouldn't have to run from these basic, simple questions. Yet you run every single time.

You seem to be only interested in eye witnesses at the Pentagon that saw a plane but not the witnesses of people and fire-fighters that heard explosions in the basement and lower floors. WTC 7 collapse is a slam dunk as far as I am concerned that it was a planned demolition. In some videos you can see the charges going off and you have Silverstein say they decided to "pull it" which
is a demolition term. The only problem with that is how did they put the explosives put in place? A demolition takes a few weeks to plan. Nothing is going to convince you and that's fine. It's your whining about people that question this false flag event that is amusing.

Conspiracy Whack-a-mole isn't gonna help you now, Dale.

We're talking about the Pentagon. And you're running desperately from that discussion. And we both know why:

You can't credibly explain away the *mountains* of evidence you're ignoring. You know that any 'alternative theory' that you could offer us is wildly irrational, stupidly complicated, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

So you're avoiding a discussion of the evidence like it was on fire. And demonstrating why the Truther conspiracy just isn't taken seriously. As even its adherents can't polish that turd of an explanation. And abandon it the moment its challenged.

Exactly as you're doing right now. Nothing will ever convince you, indeed.

 

[Dale Smith]

No, it's the lack of evidence that is of concern....like how they have never released footage of the alleged attack except for 4 frames that you can't make out what it is that hits the building.

The obvious problem Mr. "Nothing can ever convince me' is that you assume that there is video of the plane hitting the pentagon that isn't being released. But you have nothing to factually back that assumption. You merely believe it to be so....because nothing can ever convince you. And your assumption is irrational. As the the frame rate on the cameras filming an area including the impact zone were entirely too slow to capture the impacting plane.

So you have an irrational assumption backed by nothing. And on this alone, you ignore overwhelming evidence affirming that the plane hit the Pentagon.

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

....and the list of overwhelming evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon. And you ignore every last bit of it, without exception. Why would you do this? You explained it to me the first time we talked:

"Nothing will ever convince me"

But why would a rational person ignore the mountains of evidence confirming Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon? They wouldn't. And they overwhelmingly don't. As the alternative theories given by Truthers are stupidly complicated, horrible explanations of the events, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

While Flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon is simple and overwhelming supported by evidence.

Dozens of witnesses said they heard explosions in the basements of both WTC 1 and 2...why is their testimony not credible but the ones that claim they say a plane hit the Pentagon are? Where are the wings to the airliner? They certainly didn't go through that small hole and if they were knocked off on the way into the building, how was this amateur pilot able to steer it?
Why is there not a scratch on the Pentagon lawn since this alleged airliner came in on a flat trajectory? 1,500 pics and not one seat cushion or piece of luggage in any of them? Why were there so many war games going on that day while leaving only two fighter jets to protect the east coast? The Pentagon has the most secured airspace in the world but yet an amateur pilot beat their system? Dick Cheney gave stand down orders:

MR. HAMILTON: We thank you for that. I wanted to focus just a moment on the Presidential Emergency Operating Center. You were there for a good part of the day. I think you were there with the vice president. And when you had that order given, I think it was by the president, that authorized the shooting down of commercial aircraft that were suspected to be controlled by terrorists, were you there when that order was given?

MR. MINETA: No, I was not. I was made aware of it during the time that the airplane coming into the Pentagon. There was a young man who had come in and said to the vice president, "The plane is 50 miles out. The plane is 30 miles out." And when it got down to, "The plane is 10 miles out," the young man also said to the vice president, "Do the orders still stand?" And the vice president turned and whipped his neck around and said, "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" 2

Ah, Conspiracy Whacka-mole!

I ask you questions about the Pentagon....so you switch to WTC 1 and 2. And if I address WTC 1 and 2 you switch to WTC 7. And when I address WTC 7, you switch to the Pentagon.

If your argument had actual merit, you wouldn't need to run everytime I pointed out the truck sized holes in yoru claims. Again, the evidence confirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon is absolutely overwhelming:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

You ignore all of this evidence.....and then make up your own story, backed by jack shit. And contradicted by the actual evidence.

Which is exactly why the Truther conspiracy isn't taken seriously. Even you don't take your bullshit seriously. As when faced with the evidence....you change the topic.

No, I askted legitimate questions about the Pentagon.

No, you're running. Your theory doesn't work. You have no credible explanation for the mountains of evidence that you ignore. You can't offer us any explanation that takes into account the ACTUAL evidence....that isn't stupidly complicated, wildly complex, baseless, and contradicted by OTHER evidence.

Your entire argument is ignoring the evidence. ANd then running every time I ask you to give me a credible reason why a rational person would ignore the same. And you have no such reason.

Why would a rational person ignore the bodies of Flight 77 passengers and crew being pulled from the Pentagon?

Why would a rational person ignore the radar data tracking Flight 77? Your *own* account of Cheney *relies* on that tracking data. Yet you ignore it utterly. How irrational is that?

Why would a rational person ignore the debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 at the crash site......not only the exact plane, with American Airline colors, but the exact model that American Airlines used?

Why would a rational person ignore the dozens and *dozens* of witnesses that either watched the impact of the plane or watched it fly immediately over I-395 before hitting the Pentagon?

If your argument had merit, you wouldn't have to run from these basic, simple questions. Yet you run every single time.

You seem to be only interested in eye witnesses at the Pentagon that saw a plane but not the witnesses of people and fire-fighters that heard explosions in the basement and lower floors. WTC 7 collapse is a slam dunk as far as I am concerned that it was a planned demolition. In some videos you can see the charges going off and you have Silverstein say they decided to "pull it" which
is a demolition term. The only problem with that is how did they put the explosives put in place? A demolition takes a few weeks to plan. Nothing is going to convince you and that's fine. It's your whining about people that question this false flag event that is amusing.

Conspiracy Whack-a-mole isn't gonna help you now, Dale.

We're talking about the Pentagon. And you're running desperately from that discussion. And we both know why:

You can't credibly explain away the *mountains* of evidence you're ignoring. You know that any 'alternative theory' that you could offer us is wildly irrational, stupidly complicated, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

So you're avoiding a discussion of the evidence like it was on fire. And demonstrating why the Truther conspiracy just isn't taken seriously. As even its adherents can't polish that turd of an explanation. And abandon it the moment its challenged.

Exactly as you're doing right now. Nothing will ever convince you, indeed.

Not ducking anything and I haven't seen a mountain of evidence that lets your beloved "gubermint" off the hook. This wasn't a series of unfortunate events, this wasn't due to incompetence. This was a very compartmentalized false flag event with a huge agenda. They had the Patriot Act written in advance and all the mechanisms in place for this spy grid ready to go...all they needed was a new "Pearl Harbor" and that is what 9/11/01 accomplished.

 

[Dale Smith]

I came across an old post on FB I wish to share......

Al qaeda was a CIA invention which translated means "the base" i.e a computer base of operatives trained and funded by the CIA that were also called the "mujahideen" in Afghanistan in 1979 to fight a proxy war in Afghanistan. They were supported and urged on by Zbigniew Brzezinski, a globalist and proponent of a New World Order. Zbigniew was Jimmy Carter's National Security adviser as well as the organizer of the Trilateral Commission, one of three "think tank" groups that REALLY set policy. Osama Bin Laden's CIA name was Tim Osman and he died of marfan's syndrome in late 2001. He was even treated in July of 2001 at a military hospital in Dubai and this was confirmed by Dr.Steve Pieczenik who was deputy assistant secretary of state under Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance and James Baker. His expertise includes foreign policy, international crisis management and psychological warfare. He served the presidential administrations of Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush in the capacity of deputy assistant secretary . SO bin laden lasting another 10 years with a terminal disease with no cure and having to be on kidney dialysis is pretty ludicrous. The CIA funded "al qaeda" admitting to the events of 9/11 are actually funny to me now. My theory is that the plane that went down in Pennsylvania was actually headed to NYC and building 7. The SEC, FBI, CIA and NSA had field offices containing sensitive information on an ongoing investigation into securities and corporate fraud that had they been allowed to go forward, would have put a lot of high profile people in jail.

One of the crimes that the SEC was investigating was a black op funded by the "Black Eagle Trust Fund" to crush the ruble in September of 1991 by destabilizing it using a complex international network of banks and holding companies mostly have to do with oil and natural gas....... and the ten year window to cash 240 billion dollars in bonds was closing.... oddly enough, 9/12/01 was the last day that the Black Eagle Trust could try and pass it through but in order to do that, it would have to pass the "sniff test" of the Security Exchange Commission that already had them on their radar. After 9/11, 240 billion dollars of covert securities had to be electronically cleared without scrutiny and that was able to happen when the Federal Reserve declared an emergency and invoked its “emergency powers” that very afternoon. The Office of Naval Intelligence was also investigating this.... as well as the missing 2.3 TRILLION dollars that Donald Rumsfeld said the Pentagon could not account for in a press briefing on 9/10/01. Their offices were on the side of the Pentagon that was hit by the missile (no, not a plane) and destroyed all evidence and ended any further investigation.This was a deliberate act to destroy evidence. There are MANY things that do not add up or should pass any kind of sniff test....like people on the ground hearing multiple explosions, the free fall of the buildings with no resistance, etc, etc....

On November 1, 2001, President George W. Bush, issued Executive Order 13233 on the basis of “national security” and concealed the records of past presidents, especially his father’s activities. Consequently, those records are no longer accessible to the public.

 

[Dale Smith]

Let's play a game called "Which One Is Scarier?"

Scenario #1 19 muslim extremists armed with nothing but box cutter blades taking down the Pentagon and out-witting NORAD while performing incredible aeronautic maneuvers with limited flight training after a night of doing cocaine and drinking at a strip joint.....

Scenario #2 That 260 BILLION Federal Reserve Notes per year spent on just the NSA and the North American Aerospace Defense Command that couldn't intercept any of the hijacked planes.

Scenario #3 High rise buildings collapsing due to kerosene based jet fuel that could never melt steel beam supports encased in concrete even if they burned for weeks.......

 

[Skylar]

The obvious problem Mr. "Nothing can ever convince me' is that you assume that there is video of the plane hitting the pentagon that isn't being released. But you have nothing to factually back that assumption. You merely believe it to be so....because nothing can ever convince you. And your assumption is irrational. As the the frame rate on the cameras filming an area including the impact zone were entirely too slow to capture the impacting plane.

So you have an irrational assumption backed by nothing. And on this alone, you ignore overwhelming evidence affirming that the plane hit the Pentagon.

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

....and the list of overwhelming evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon. And you ignore every last bit of it, without exception. Why would you do this? You explained it to me the first time we talked:

"Nothing will ever convince me"

But why would a rational person ignore the mountains of evidence confirming Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon? They wouldn't. And they overwhelmingly don't. As the alternative theories given by Truthers are stupidly complicated, horrible explanations of the events, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

While Flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon is simple and overwhelming supported by evidence.

Dozens of witnesses said they heard explosions in the basements of both WTC 1 and 2...why is their testimony not credible but the ones that claim they say a plane hit the Pentagon are? Where are the wings to the airliner? They certainly didn't go through that small hole and if they were knocked off on the way into the building, how was this amateur pilot able to steer it?
Why is there not a scratch on the Pentagon lawn since this alleged airliner came in on a flat trajectory? 1,500 pics and not one seat cushion or piece of luggage in any of them? Why were there so many war games going on that day while leaving only two fighter jets to protect the east coast? The Pentagon has the most secured airspace in the world but yet an amateur pilot beat their system? Dick Cheney gave stand down orders:

MR. HAMILTON: We thank you for that. I wanted to focus just a moment on the Presidential Emergency Operating Center. You were there for a good part of the day. I think you were there with the vice president. And when you had that order given, I think it was by the president, that authorized the shooting down of commercial aircraft that were suspected to be controlled by terrorists, were you there when that order was given?

MR. MINETA: No, I was not. I was made aware of it during the time that the airplane coming into the Pentagon. There was a young man who had come in and said to the vice president, "The plane is 50 miles out. The plane is 30 miles out." And when it got down to, "The plane is 10 miles out," the young man also said to the vice president, "Do the orders still stand?" And the vice president turned and whipped his neck around and said, "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" 2

Ah, Conspiracy Whacka-mole!

I ask you questions about the Pentagon....so you switch to WTC 1 and 2. And if I address WTC 1 and 2 you switch to WTC 7. And when I address WTC 7, you switch to the Pentagon.

If your argument had actual merit, you wouldn't need to run everytime I pointed out the truck sized holes in yoru claims. Again, the evidence confirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon is absolutely overwhelming:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

You ignore all of this evidence.....and then make up your own story, backed by jack shit. And contradicted by the actual evidence.

Which is exactly why the Truther conspiracy isn't taken seriously. Even you don't take your bullshit seriously. As when faced with the evidence....you change the topic.

No, I askted legitimate questions about the Pentagon.

No, you're running. Your theory doesn't work. You have no credible explanation for the mountains of evidence that you ignore. You can't offer us any explanation that takes into account the ACTUAL evidence....that isn't stupidly complicated, wildly complex, baseless, and contradicted by OTHER evidence.

Your entire argument is ignoring the evidence. ANd then running every time I ask you to give me a credible reason why a rational person would ignore the same. And you have no such reason.

Why would a rational person ignore the bodies of Flight 77 passengers and crew being pulled from the Pentagon?

Why would a rational person ignore the radar data tracking Flight 77? Your *own* account of Cheney *relies* on that tracking data. Yet you ignore it utterly. How irrational is that?

Why would a rational person ignore the debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 at the crash site......not only the exact plane, with American Airline colors, but the exact model that American Airlines used?

Why would a rational person ignore the dozens and *dozens* of witnesses that either watched the impact of the plane or watched it fly immediately over I-395 before hitting the Pentagon?

If your argument had merit, you wouldn't have to run from these basic, simple questions. Yet you run every single time.

You seem to be only interested in eye witnesses at the Pentagon that saw a plane but not the witnesses of people and fire-fighters that heard explosions in the basement and lower floors. WTC 7 collapse is a slam dunk as far as I am concerned that it was a planned demolition. In some videos you can see the charges going off and you have Silverstein say they decided to "pull it" which
is a demolition term. The only problem with that is how did they put the explosives put in place? A demolition takes a few weeks to plan. Nothing is going to convince you and that's fine. It's your whining about people that question this false flag event that is amusing.

Conspiracy Whack-a-mole isn't gonna help you now, Dale.

We're talking about the Pentagon. And you're running desperately from that discussion. And we both know why:

You can't credibly explain away the *mountains* of evidence you're ignoring. You know that any 'alternative theory' that you could offer us is wildly irrational, stupidly complicated, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

So you're avoiding a discussion of the evidence like it was on fire. And demonstrating why the Truther conspiracy just isn't taken seriously. As even its adherents can't polish that turd of an explanation. And abandon it the moment its challenged.

Exactly as you're doing right now. Nothing will ever convince you, indeed.

Not ducking anything and I haven't seen a mountain of evidence that lets your beloved "gubermint" off the hook.

You've done nothing but ducking. You're in a full rout, refusing to discus the evidence. You reject the 'official story', but when I challenge you to give me a rational reason WHY you reject the specific evidence.......you change the topic.

I ask you about the bodies of the passengers and crew from Flight 77 being pulled from the crash site in the Pentagon. And you babble about Larry Silverstein.

I ask you about the wreckage consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 was pulled Pentagon......and you babble about WTC 7.

I ask you about the very radar records that *you're* citing as evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon........and you babble about explosions in the basement of the World Trade center.

You starkly refuse to address the evidence. Every time I mention it, you flee. Every time I bring it up, you give us another excuse why you can't address it. Your entire conspiracy is an 'Emperor's New Clothes' parable. As the *moment* we demand you address the evidence and note you can't back your narrative with jack shit....

..........your entire story is abandoned. And you run.

This wasn't a series of unfortunate events, this wasn't due to incompetence. This was a very compartmentalized false flag event with a huge agenda. They had the Patriot Act written in advance and all the mechanisms in place for this spy grid ready to go...all they needed was a new "Pearl Harbor" and that is what 9/11/01 accomplished.

So I ask you about how both of the black boxes from Flight 77 were pulled from the Pentagon.....and you start babbling about Pearl Harbor.

Laughing....even YOU can't make your bullshit work. The moment I challenge you on the evidence, you abandon your conspiracy and run. As we both know your narrative is stupidly complicated, uselessly elaborate, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

What else can you do but run?

 

[Skylar]

I came across an old post on FB I wish to share......

Al qaeda was a CIA invention which translated means "the base" i.e a computer base of operatives trained and funded by the CIA that were also called the "mujahideen" in Afghanistan in 1979 to fight a proxy war in Afghanistan. They were supported and urged on by Zbigniew Brzezinski, a globalist and proponent of a New World Order. Zbigniew was Jimmy Carter's National Security adviser as well as the organizer of the Trilateral Commission, one of three "think tank" groups that REALLY set policy. Osama Bin Laden's CIA name was Tim Osman and he died of marfan's syndrome in late 2001. He was even treated in July of 2001 at a military hospital in Dubai and this was confirmed by Dr.Steve Pieczenik who was deputy assistant secretary of state under Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance and James Baker. His expertise includes foreign policy, international crisis management and psychological warfare. He served the presidential administrations of Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush in the capacity of deputy assistant secretary . SO bin laden lasting another 10 years with a terminal disease with no cure and having to be on kidney dialysis is pretty ludicrous. The CIA funded "al qaeda" admitting to the events of 9/11 are actually funny to me now. My theory is that the plane that went down in Pennsylvania was actually headed to NYC and building 7. The SEC, FBI, CIA and NSA had field offices containing sensitive information on an ongoing investigation into securities and corporate fraud that had they been allowed to go forward, would have put a lot of high profile people in jail.

One of the crimes that the SEC was investigating was a black op funded by the "Black Eagle Trust Fund" to crush the ruble in September of 1991 by destabilizing it using a complex international network of banks and holding companies mostly have to do with oil and natural gas....... and the ten year window to cash 240 billion dollars in bonds was closing.... oddly enough, 9/12/01 was the last day that the Black Eagle Trust could try and pass it through but in order to do that, it would have to pass the "sniff test" of the Security Exchange Commission that already had them on their radar. After 9/11, 240 billion dollars of covert securities had to be electronically cleared without scrutiny and that was able to happen when the Federal Reserve declared an emergency and invoked its “emergency powers” that very afternoon.

On November 1, 2001, President George W. Bush, issued Executive Order 13233 on the basis of “national security” and concealed the records of past presidents, especially his father’s activities. Consequently, those records are no longer accessible to the public.

Laughing....back to conspiracy Whack-a-mole, huh? Its not going to help, Dale. As each time you spam, each time you give me excuses why you can't address the evidence, each time you run with your tail tucked between your legs.......you only demonstrate my point:

Your explanation of events is awful. Its spectacularly stupid, wildly irrational, fantastically complicated, factually baseless and overwhelmingly contradicted by evidence. Which is why when I ask you specific questions about the evidence.......you desperately try to change the topic to *anything* else. Anything but the evidence:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.
The American Society of Civil Engineers study of the damage and debris at the crash site finding that the damage to the Pentagon was consisted with the impact from a 757.

You ignore all of it. That's all your conspiracy is: ignoring the evidence. And then offering a stupidly awful conspiracy account instead. One that simply makes no sense.

Dale........you're not willing to deal with the evidence. You can't handle reality. You've constructed this elaborate fantasy because its emotionally easier for you to process your insanely complicated delusion than deal with the actual facts of the situation.

But the world doesn't disappear just because you close your eyes, Dale. And the facts don't magically change to match your fantasy just because you're unprepared and unwilling to face reality. Get used to the idea.

 

[Skylar]

Let's play a game called "Which One Is Scarier?"

Scenario #1 19 muslim extremists armed with nothing but box cutter blades taking down the Pentagon and out-witting NORAD while performing incredible aeronautic maneuvers with limited flight training after a night of doing cocaine and drinking at a strip joint.....

And how did they 'outwit NORAD'. NORAD monitors Air Intercept Defense Zones, protecting our nation from foreign warplanes seeking to enter our airspace.

Tell me, Dale.....how many of the planes used in 911 hit targets in the Air Intercept Defense Zones that NORAD monitors?

And tell me, Dale....what's this?

What are those gray zones, Dale? And what would be their relevance in your claims that the hijackers 'outwitted' NORAD?

Remember, Dale.....you don't actually know what the fuck you're talking about.

 

[Dale Smith]

Dozens of witnesses said they heard explosions in the basements of both WTC 1 and 2...why is their testimony not credible but the ones that claim they say a plane hit the Pentagon are? Where are the wings to the airliner? They certainly didn't go through that small hole and if they were knocked off on the way into the building, how was this amateur pilot able to steer it?
Why is there not a scratch on the Pentagon lawn since this alleged airliner came in on a flat trajectory? 1,500 pics and not one seat cushion or piece of luggage in any of them? Why were there so many war games going on that day while leaving only two fighter jets to protect the east coast? The Pentagon has the most secured airspace in the world but yet an amateur pilot beat their system? Dick Cheney gave stand down orders:

MR. HAMILTON: We thank you for that. I wanted to focus just a moment on the Presidential Emergency Operating Center. You were there for a good part of the day. I think you were there with the vice president. And when you had that order given, I think it was by the president, that authorized the shooting down of commercial aircraft that were suspected to be controlled by terrorists, were you there when that order was given?

MR. MINETA: No, I was not. I was made aware of it during the time that the airplane coming into the Pentagon. There was a young man who had come in and said to the vice president, "The plane is 50 miles out. The plane is 30 miles out." And when it got down to, "The plane is 10 miles out," the young man also said to the vice president, "Do the orders still stand?" And the vice president turned and whipped his neck around and said, "Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?" 2

Ah, Conspiracy Whacka-mole!

I ask you questions about the Pentagon....so you switch to WTC 1 and 2. And if I address WTC 1 and 2 you switch to WTC 7. And when I address WTC 7, you switch to the Pentagon.

If your argument had actual merit, you wouldn't need to run everytime I pointed out the truck sized holes in yoru claims. Again, the evidence confirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon is absolutely overwhelming:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

You ignore all of this evidence.....and then make up your own story, backed by jack shit. And contradicted by the actual evidence.

Which is exactly why the Truther conspiracy isn't taken seriously. Even you don't take your bullshit seriously. As when faced with the evidence....you change the topic.

No, I askted legitimate questions about the Pentagon.

No, you're running. Your theory doesn't work. You have no credible explanation for the mountains of evidence that you ignore. You can't offer us any explanation that takes into account the ACTUAL evidence....that isn't stupidly complicated, wildly complex, baseless, and contradicted by OTHER evidence.

Your entire argument is ignoring the evidence. ANd then running every time I ask you to give me a credible reason why a rational person would ignore the same. And you have no such reason.

Why would a rational person ignore the bodies of Flight 77 passengers and crew being pulled from the Pentagon?

Why would a rational person ignore the radar data tracking Flight 77? Your *own* account of Cheney *relies* on that tracking data. Yet you ignore it utterly. How irrational is that?

Why would a rational person ignore the debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 at the crash site......not only the exact plane, with American Airline colors, but the exact model that American Airlines used?

Why would a rational person ignore the dozens and *dozens* of witnesses that either watched the impact of the plane or watched it fly immediately over I-395 before hitting the Pentagon?

If your argument had merit, you wouldn't have to run from these basic, simple questions. Yet you run every single time.

You seem to be only interested in eye witnesses at the Pentagon that saw a plane but not the witnesses of people and fire-fighters that heard explosions in the basement and lower floors. WTC 7 collapse is a slam dunk as far as I am concerned that it was a planned demolition. In some videos you can see the charges going off and you have Silverstein say they decided to "pull it" which
is a demolition term. The only problem with that is how did they put the explosives put in place? A demolition takes a few weeks to plan. Nothing is going to convince you and that's fine. It's your whining about people that question this false flag event that is amusing.

Conspiracy Whack-a-mole isn't gonna help you now, Dale.

We're talking about the Pentagon. And you're running desperately from that discussion. And we both know why:

You can't credibly explain away the *mountains* of evidence you're ignoring. You know that any 'alternative theory' that you could offer us is wildly irrational, stupidly complicated, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

So you're avoiding a discussion of the evidence like it was on fire. And demonstrating why the Truther conspiracy just isn't taken seriously. As even its adherents can't polish that turd of an explanation. And abandon it the moment its challenged.

Exactly as you're doing right now. Nothing will ever convince you, indeed.

Not ducking anything and I haven't seen a mountain of evidence that lets your beloved "gubermint" off the hook.

You've done nothing but ducking. You're in a full rout, refusing to discus the evidence. You reject the 'official story', but when I challenge you to give me a rational reason WHY you reject the specific evidence.......you change the topic.

I ask you about the bodies of the passengers and crew from Flight 77 being pulled from the crash site in the Pentagon. And you babble about Larry Silverstein.

I ask you about the wreckage consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 was pulled Pentagon......and you babble about WTC 7.

I ask you about the very radar records that *you're* citing as evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon........and you babble about explosions in the basement of the World Trade center.

You starkly refuse to address the evidence. Every time I mention it, you flee. Every time I bring it up, you give us another excuse why you can't address it. Your entire conspiracy is an 'Emperor's New Clothes' parable. As the *moment* we demand you address the evidence and note you can't back your narrative with jack shit....

..........your entire story is abandoned. And you run.

This wasn't a series of unfortunate events, this wasn't due to incompetence. This was a very compartmentalized false flag event with a huge agenda. They had the Patriot Act written in advance and all the mechanisms in place for this spy grid ready to go...all they needed was a new "Pearl Harbor" and that is what 9/11/01 accomplished.

So I ask you about how both of the black boxes from Flight 77 were pulled from the Pentagon.....and you start babbling about Pearl Harbor.

Laughing....even YOU can't make your bullshit work. The moment I challenge you on the evidence, you abandon your conspiracy and run. As we both know your narrative is stupidly complicated, uselessly elaborate, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

What else can you do but run?

No bodies were pulled from the Pentagon as it was reported that they were burnt beyond recognition and could not be recovered....how convenient.

 

[Dale Smith]

Let's play a game called "Which One Is Scarier?"

Scenario #1 19 muslim extremists armed with nothing but box cutter blades taking down the Pentagon and out-witting NORAD while performing incredible aeronautic maneuvers with limited flight training after a night of doing cocaine and drinking at a strip joint.....

And how did they 'outwit NORAD'. NORAD monitors Air Intercept Defense Zones, protecting our nation from foreign warplanes seeking to enter our airspace.

Tell me, Dale.....how many of the planes used in 911 hit targets in the Air Intercept Defense Zones that NORAD monitors?

And tell me, Dale....what's this?

What are those gray zones, Dale? And what would be their relevance in your claims that the hijackers 'outwitted' NORAD?

Remember, Dale.....you don't actually know what the fuck you're talking about.

Pilots for 9/11 Truth has reported that the data stream from the flight data recorder (FDR) for American Airlines flight 77, which allegedly struck the Pentagon on 9/11, shows that the cockpit door never opened during the entire 90 minute flight. The data was provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), which has refused to comment.

The FDR is one of two “black boxes” in every commercial airliner, which are used after accidents to help determine the cause of a crash. One black box records flight data, the other records voice data (everything said in the cockpit during the flight). With those two sets of data, NTSB investigators can usually piece together the events that led to a crash. The status of the door to the cockpit is checked every four seconds throughout a flight and relayed as a simple 0 or 1, where 0=closed and 1=open, with approximately 1,300 door status checks performed during AA77’s 90 minute flight. Every one of those door status checks shows as a 0, indicating that the door to the cockpit never opened during the entire flight.

Accident investigators monitor the cockpit door with the FDR because it may yield clues to pilot error in a crash. The FDR begins recording once the pilots are in their seats and readying for takeoff, and the plane cannot take off unless the FDR is working.

The official story about flight 77 is that five Muslim terrorists brandishing box cutters forced their way into the cockpit and herded two pilots, four flight attendants and all the passengers to the back of the plane. This story came into being via Ted Olson, US Solicitor General, who told CNN — that he received two phone calls from his wife Barbara Olson, a passenger on the doomed flight. Ted Olson’s story changed several times. Sometimes he claimed that the calls from his wife were made from seat back phones, other times that she used her cell phone.

According to American Airlines customer service, the American Airlines maintenance manual for that aircraft, and American Airlines Captain Ralph Kolstad, seatback phones on 757s had been deactivated prior to 9/11/01. (They were later removed entirely, as they never worked well.)

Barbara Olson couldn’t have used a cell phone either: numerous 9/11 researchers, most notably David Ray Griffin, have pointed out that cell phones did not work on airplanes on 9/11. The speed and altitude of a commercial airliner both present overwhelming obstacles to a cell phone’s need to lock onto a cell tower and then hand off to another tower in a new location.

It was the FBI that revealed the evidence that decisively disproves Ted Olson’s story. In the Zacarias Moussaoui trial in 2006, the FBI presented a report on the cell phone calls from all four 9/11 flights. Their report on AA77 shows that there was only one phone call from Barbara Olson, but that it was an unconnected call lasting zero seconds. So Ted Olson either lied about receiving calls from his wife or was deceived into believing he received calls from her.

According to the UK Telegraph, Barbara Olson delayed her flight on 9/11 so that she could have breakfast with her husband on his birthday. That delay put her on the doomed flight. Ted Olson remarried in 2006 to tax attorney Lady Booth, whom he reportedly met the year after Barbara died.

There are numerous oddities and contradictions about AA77’s black boxes.

The government claims that the voice data recorder was damaged during the crash and that no usable data was retrieved from it. If true, this would be the first time in aviation history that a solid-state data recorder was destroyed during a crash.

While it was widely reported in the media that the FDR for AA77 was found at 4 am on September 14, 2001, the file containing the FDR data was dated over four hours earlier. In other words, we are asked to believe that the data from the FDR was downloaded prior to the FDR being found.

 

[Skylar]

Ah, Conspiracy Whacka-mole!

I ask you questions about the Pentagon....so you switch to WTC 1 and 2. And if I address WTC 1 and 2 you switch to WTC 7. And when I address WTC 7, you switch to the Pentagon.

If your argument had actual merit, you wouldn't need to run everytime I pointed out the truck sized holes in yoru claims. Again, the evidence confirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon is absolutely overwhelming:

Parts consistent with a Boeing 757 being pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Parts consistent with a Boeing 757-223, the exact model that American Airlines used for Flight 77, being pulled from Pentagon the crash site.
Both voice and data flight recorders from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
The bodies of passengers and crew from flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon crash site.
Damage consistent with an impact from a boeing 757 at the Pentagon crash site.
Dozens if not hundreds of witnesses who saw a plane consistent with FLight 77 flying toward or impacting the Pentagon
Debris consistent with American Airlines flight 77 strewn around the crash site.
Radar records tracking Flight 77 flying toward the Pentagon, with the plane being tracked crashing at that exact site.

You ignore all of this evidence.....and then make up your own story, backed by jack shit. And contradicted by the actual evidence.

Which is exactly why the Truther conspiracy isn't taken seriously. Even you don't take your bullshit seriously. As when faced with the evidence....you change the topic.

No, I askted legitimate questions about the Pentagon.

No, you're running. Your theory doesn't work. You have no credible explanation for the mountains of evidence that you ignore. You can't offer us any explanation that takes into account the ACTUAL evidence....that isn't stupidly complicated, wildly complex, baseless, and contradicted by OTHER evidence.

Your entire argument is ignoring the evidence. ANd then running every time I ask you to give me a credible reason why a rational person would ignore the same. And you have no such reason.

Why would a rational person ignore the bodies of Flight 77 passengers and crew being pulled from the Pentagon?

Why would a rational person ignore the radar data tracking Flight 77? Your *own* account of Cheney *relies* on that tracking data. Yet you ignore it utterly. How irrational is that?

Why would a rational person ignore the debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 at the crash site......not only the exact plane, with American Airline colors, but the exact model that American Airlines used?

Why would a rational person ignore the dozens and *dozens* of witnesses that either watched the impact of the plane or watched it fly immediately over I-395 before hitting the Pentagon?

If your argument had merit, you wouldn't have to run from these basic, simple questions. Yet you run every single time.

You seem to be only interested in eye witnesses at the Pentagon that saw a plane but not the witnesses of people and fire-fighters that heard explosions in the basement and lower floors. WTC 7 collapse is a slam dunk as far as I am concerned that it was a planned demolition. In some videos you can see the charges going off and you have Silverstein say they decided to "pull it" which
is a demolition term. The only problem with that is how did they put the explosives put in place? A demolition takes a few weeks to plan. Nothing is going to convince you and that's fine. It's your whining about people that question this false flag event that is amusing.

Conspiracy Whack-a-mole isn't gonna help you now, Dale.

We're talking about the Pentagon. And you're running desperately from that discussion. And we both know why:

You can't credibly explain away the *mountains* of evidence you're ignoring. You know that any 'alternative theory' that you could offer us is wildly irrational, stupidly complicated, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

So you're avoiding a discussion of the evidence like it was on fire. And demonstrating why the Truther conspiracy just isn't taken seriously. As even its adherents can't polish that turd of an explanation. And abandon it the moment its challenged.

Exactly as you're doing right now. Nothing will ever convince you, indeed.

Not ducking anything and I haven't seen a mountain of evidence that lets your beloved "gubermint" off the hook.

You've done nothing but ducking. You're in a full rout, refusing to discus the evidence. You reject the 'official story', but when I challenge you to give me a rational reason WHY you reject the specific evidence.......you change the topic.

I ask you about the bodies of the passengers and crew from Flight 77 being pulled from the crash site in the Pentagon. And you babble about Larry Silverstein.

I ask you about the wreckage consistent with an American Airlines 757-223 was pulled Pentagon......and you babble about WTC 7.

I ask you about the very radar records that *you're* citing as evidence affirming that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon........and you babble about explosions in the basement of the World Trade center.

You starkly refuse to address the evidence. Every time I mention it, you flee. Every time I bring it up, you give us another excuse why you can't address it. Your entire conspiracy is an 'Emperor's New Clothes' parable. As the *moment* we demand you address the evidence and note you can't back your narrative with jack shit....

..........your entire story is abandoned. And you run.

This wasn't a series of unfortunate events, this wasn't due to incompetence. This was a very compartmentalized false flag event with a huge agenda. They had the Patriot Act written in advance and all the mechanisms in place for this spy grid ready to go...all they needed was a new "Pearl Harbor" and that is what 9/11/01 accomplished.

So I ask you about how both of the black boxes from Flight 77 were pulled from the Pentagon.....and you start babbling about Pearl Harbor.

Laughing....even YOU can't make your bullshit work. The moment I challenge you on the evidence, you abandon your conspiracy and run. As we both know your narrative is stupidly complicated, uselessly elaborate, backed by jack shit, and contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

What else can you do but run?

No bodies were pulled from the Pentagon as it was reported that they were burnt beyond recognition and could not be recovered....how convenient.

Says who? Remember, you routinely tell us utter bullshit. Remember 'Dr. Steve' who was in the CIA for 30 years, who had a 'top general' tell him how 911 was done? When we fact checked your claims, it turns out the Dr. Steve Pieczenik never worked for the CIA. Let alone worked for the CIA for '30 years'. Nor can Steve even name the 'top general' that told him how 911 was done. Nor back any portion of his story with the slightest evidence.

Nothing in your account checks out.

You don't fact check the horseshit you repeat, Dale. Making you an unreliable source. So.....you'll need to factually demonstrate that no bodies were pulled from the Pentagon. As you merely 'saying' it is so is meaningless. As you either lie, or routinely don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

 

[Skylar]

Pilots for 9/11 Truth has reported that the data stream from the flight data recorder (FDR) for American Airlines flight 77, which allegedly struck the Pentagon on 9/11, shows that the cockpit door never opened during the entire 90 minute flight. The data was provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), which has refused to comment.

The FDR is one of two “black boxes” in every commercial airliner, which are used after accidents to help determine the cause of a crash. One black box records flight data, the other records voice data (everything said in the cockpit during the flight). With those two sets of data, NTSB investigators can usually piece together the events that led to a crash. The status of the door to the cockpit is checked every four seconds throughout a flight and relayed as a simple 0 or 1, where 0=closed and 1=open, with approximately 1,300 door status checks performed during AA77’s 90 minute flight. Every one of those door status checks shows as a 0, indicating that the door to the cockpit never opened during the entire flight.

Accident investigators monitor the cockpit door with the FDR because it may yield clues to pilot error in a crash. The FDR begins recording once the pilots are in their seats and readying for takeoff, and the plane cannot take off unless the FDR is working.

The official story about flight 77 is that five Muslim terrorists brandishing box cutters forced their way into the cockpit and herded two pilots, four flight attendants and all the passengers to the back of the plane. This story came into being via Ted Olson, US Solicitor General, who told CNN — that he received two phone calls from his wife Barbara Olson, a passenger on the doomed flight. Ted Olson’s story changed several times. Sometimes he claimed that the calls from his wife were made from seat back phones, other times that she used her cell phone.

According to American Airlines customer service, the American Airlines maintenance manual for that aircraft, and American Airlines Captain Ralph Kolstad, seatback phones on 757s had been deactivated prior to 9/11/01. (They were later removed entirely, as they never worked well.)

Barbara Olson couldn’t have used a cell phone either: numerous 9/11 researchers, most notably David Ray Griffin, have pointed out that cell phones did not work on airplanes on 9/11. The speed and altitude of a commercial airliner both present overwhelming obstacles to a cell phone’s need to lock onto a cell tower and then hand off to another tower in a new location.

It was the FBI that revealed the evidence that decisively disproves Ted Olson’s story. In the Zacarias Moussaoui trial in 2006, the FBI presented a report on the cell phone calls from all four 9/11 flights. Their report on AA77 shows that there was only one phone call from Barbara Olson, but that it was an unconnected call lasting zero seconds. So Ted Olson either lied about receiving calls from his wife or was deceived into believing he received calls from her.

According to the UK Telegraph, Barbara Olson delayed her flight on 9/11 so that she could have breakfast with her husband on his birthday. That delay put her on the doomed flight. Ted Olson remarried in 2006 to tax attorney Lady Booth, whom he reportedly met the year after Barbara died.

There are numerous oddities and contradictions about AA77’s black boxes.

The government claims that the voice data recorder was damaged during the crash and that no usable data was retrieved from it. If true, this would be the first time in aviation history that a solid-state data recorder was destroyed during a crash.

While it was widely reported in the media that the FDR for AA77 was found at 4 am on September 14, 2001, the file containing the FDR data was dated over four hours earlier. In other words, we are asked to believe that the data from the FDR was downloaded prior to the FDR being found.

More Conspiracy Whack-a-mole!

Instead of answer any of my questions about the ADIZ, explain how NORAD could have been 'outwitted' by the hijackers when the area that NORAD monitors is OUTSIDE the United States.....you switch topics again. How did I know that was coming?

I'm going to go through this thread and make a list of all the claims you've made....and then abandoned, Dale. But since your rout is at least remotely relevant to the
David Griffith, professional conspiracy theorist, insists that cell phone calls can't be made from planes. The FBI, AT&T, Airfone, the company that ran the phones on the planes, and the actual phone records demonstrate that calls could be made.

Here's the Freedom of Information request for FBI interviews with AT&T, where the company contacted the FBI to report that they were getting calls from a woman claiming to be hijacked and transfering them to Ted Olson's number at the woman's request.

Teresa Gonzalez, operator for AT&T Services AT&T, telephonically contacted the Federal Bureau of Investigation FBI to report an emergency phone call received by AT&T. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, she provided the following information:

Mercy Lorenzo, also an operator with AT&T, received a call from a female passenger on flight 77 requesting to be transferred to telephone number 202514-2201. The female passenger advised the plane was being hi-jacked. Hi-jackers were ordering passengers to move to the back of the plane and were armed with guns and knives. Lorenzo indicated the pilot might not yet be aware of the take over of the plane.

Additionally, the number provided was the number of the passenger's husband. He is a Sergeant and resides in Washington, D.C.

http://911myths.com/images/9/95/265A-NY-280350-302-22170-Unredacted.pdf

Here's the interview with her husband's secretary at the Solicitor Generals office:

Lori Lynn Keyton, Secretary, Department of Justice (DOJ), Washington, D.C., telephone number (202) [redacted, date of birth [redacted] was contacted telephonically at her residence through the DOJ Command Center at (202) 514-5000. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, Keyton provided the following information:

Keyton was working in Ted Olson's Office this morning. She is regularly called there to cover the telephones. At approximately 9:00am, she received a series of approximately six (6) to eight (8) collect telephone calls. Each of the calls was an automated collect call. There was a recording advising of the collect call and requesting she hold for an operator. A short time later another recording stated that all operators were busy, please hang up and try your call later.

Keyton then received a collect call from a live operator. The operator advised that there was an emergency collect call from Barbara Olsen for Ted Olsen. Keyton advised that she would accept the call. Barbara Olsen was put through and sounded hysterical. Barbara Olsen said, "Can you tell Ted.." Keyton cut her off and said, "I'll put him on the line."
There was a second telephone call a few to five (5) minutes later. This time Barbara Olsen was on the line when she answered. She called direct. It was not a collect call. Barbara Olsen said, "It's Barbara." Keyton said, "he's on the phone with the command center, I'll put you through."

http://911myths.com/images/7/74/Team7-Box13-Flight-Call-Notes-and-302s.pdf

With Ted Olsen also confirming that the person on the line was his wife.

Here's the Airfone records from Flight 77 with 4 outgoing calls. Call you insist could never be made. Calls Airfone affirms were. Here's the first attempt, that didn't connect.

Call #2. This one did connect. Note that per Airfone, the customer dialed the operator. Matching the account of AT&T exactly.

With 3 other calls after that. All contradicting your account. Here's the FBI's records on *all* calls from Flight 77:

http://911myths.com/images/7/78/FBI_compilation_re_Flight_77_calls.pdf

See how I did that? I made a claim and I offered the source.

Oh, and Dale....if you're just going to cut and paste articles that you've never read nor fact checked, at least give us the courtesy of citing your sources. As here's your argument, verbatim. Written by someone else.

Flight 77 Cockpit Door Never Opened During 9/11 “Hijack"

Which you already know. But really hope we never found out.

 

[Skylar]

So....your claim that no bodies were pulled out of the Pentagon....abandoned.
Your claim that the hijackers 'outwitted NORAD'....abandoned.
Your claim about Dr. Steve 'working at the CIA for 30 years'........abandoned.

I'm just gonna keep adding to this list as I peruse the wasteland that is the claims you've made.....and then run from when they were challenged.

Sounds like its time for another game of 'Conspiracy Whack-a-mole'!

 

[Dale Smith]

Obviously they did outwit NORAD or NORAD stood down...take your pick.
North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) is responsible for monitoring our skies.The Continental NORAD Region (CONR) is the component of NORAD that provides airspace surveillance and control and directs air sovereignty activities for the Contiguous United States (CONUS).
No bodies of those on the plane were recovered....claimed that it only took them a couple of months to identify the alleged remains they recovered using DNA testing which is ludicrous to say the least. 184 out of 187 identified at a military base no less ...allegedly.

As far as Dr. Steve Piecneznik is concerned, he worked in intelligence and counter-intelligence with many, many reliable contacts. When I have heard him interviewed, whichever host is doing the interviewing always attaches his name to the CIA. His resume is more impressive than just being CIA and he has more credibility and knows more than you or I.
Dr. Steve Pieczenik is a critically acclaimed author of psycho-political thrillers and the co-creator of the New York Times best-selling "Tom Clancy's Op-Center" and "Tom Clancy's Net Force" book series. He is also one of the world's most experienced international crisis managers and hostage negotiators. His novels are based on his twenty years experience in resolving international crises for five U.S. administrations.

Dr. Pieczenik received his B.A. from Cornell University,trained in Psychiatry at Harvard and has both an M.D. from Cornell University Medical College and a Ph.D. in International Relations from M.I.T.

He was the first psychiatrist ever to receive a PhD. focusing on international relations, and is the only psychiatrist to ever have served as a Deputy Assistant Secretary of State. He served four presidents as Deputy Assistant Secretary of State under Nixon, Ford, Carter, and Bush Sr. and was a Senior Policy Planner under president Reagan. Dr. Pieczenik worked directly with, and reported directly to, Secretaries of State Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance, George Schultz and James Baker, as well as the respective White Houses. Dr. Pieczenik was drafted into the Vietnam War. He was assigned in the Public Health Services with the rank of Navy Captain (0-6) to run three psychiatric wards at St. Elizabeth's Hospital in Washington, D.C., including a ward where serial killers were housed. He was subsequently offered a promotion to Rear Admiral (0-7), which he refused on the grounds that he felt honored enough to serve his country, did not want to take a pension and wished to return to civilian life to follow his passions as a physician, entrepreneur and novelist.
Dr. Pieczenik is an expert in psychological warfare, political psychology, regime change, intelligence, counterintelligence and covert operations. During his career as a senior State Department official, Dr. Pieczenik utilized his unique abilities and expertise to develop strategies and tactics that were instrumental in resolving major conflicts in Asia, the Middle East, Latin America, Europe and the United States.
Dr. Pieczenik was the principal International Crisis Manager and Hostage Negotiator under Secretaries Kissinger and Vance. During this time he developed conflict resolution techniques that were instrumental in saving over five hundred hostages in different terrorist episodes, including the Hanafi Muslim Siege in Washington, DC, the TWA Croatian Hijacking, the Aldo Moro Kidnapping, the JRA Hijacking, the PLO Hijacking, and many other incidents involving terrorists such as Idi Amin, Muammar Quaddafi, Carlos, FARC, Abu Nidal and Saddam Hussein. Based on these experiences, Dr. Pieczenik, along with other senior officials at the State Department developed the mandate to create Delta Force and other quick-strike special forces units that could be used in future hostage situations and international crises. Dr. Pieczenik resigned over President Carter's handling of the Iran Hostage siege. He was recruited by Dr. Richard Solomon to the RAND Corporation in Santa Monica, CA to develop the strategy and tactics using the principles of psychological warfare to dismantle the Soviet Union without the use of military force.

Keep reading what I post and perhaps you will eventually stop being a sheeple...one can only hope.

 

[Skylar]

Obviously they did outwit NORAD or NORAD stood down...take your pick.
North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) is responsible for monitoring our skies.The Continental NORAD Region (CONR) is the component of NORAD that provides airspace surveillance and control and directs air sovereignty activities for the Contiguous United States (CONUS).

And the activities that you insist NORAD was 'outsmarted' in was intercepting the hijacked planes. Yet EVERY Air Defense Intercept Zone on 911....was *outside* the United States. NORAD didn't monitor the location of planes in domestic airspace. NORAD's radar network is focused outward, toward incoming foreign warplanes. The only way NORAD knew that there was a hijacking is when the the FAA picked up a phone and told them. The FAA didn't notify NORAD of hijackings until AFTER the first tower had already been hit. And only a minute before the second tower was hit.

Making your 'outwitted NORAD' account nonsense. NORAD doesn't track domestic flights within the US. Nor would they have anyway of telling one plane from another if their transponders were turned off.

Which was the case in every plane used in the 911 attacks.

So why would NORAD have intercepted hijackings they didn't know about, planes they weren't tracking in airspace outside their Air Defense Intercept Zones? Your entire basis of assumption is nonsense.

No bodies of those on the plane were recovered....claimed that it only took them a couple of months to identify the alleged remains they recovered using DNA testing which is ludicrous to say the least. 184 out of 187 identified at a military base no less ...allegedly.

Says you. But when pressed to show us any source other than yourself that says this....you've got jack shit. Your entire argument is circular. Where you insist that there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon....because you insist there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon.

Why would a rational person ignore the ACSE report which shows the location of the bodies, ignore the autospies, ignore the identification of the bodies? Especially when you've got *jack shit* to back up any portion of your account. You have no rational reason to ignore the evidence. You simply do.

And this is why the Truthers aren't taken seriously. Their *entire* argument is to ignore the evidence. And even they can't give you a rational reason why.

As far as Dr. Steve Piecneznik is concerned, he worked in intelligence and counter-intelligence with many, many reliable contacts. When I have heard him interviewed, whichever host is doing the interviewing always attaches his name to the CIA. His resume is more impressive than just being CIA and he has more credibility and knows more than you or I.

That's not what you said before. This was:

Then there is the testimony of Dr Steve Pieczenik, who spent thirty years in the CIA that offered to testify in a Senate hearing that a General told him exactly how 9/11 was pulled off. He was also the first to reveal that Osama bin Laden died on December 13 2001 of Marfan's syndrome and had been visited in a military hospital in Dubai and debriefed by the CIA and other intel spooks in July of 2001. He only confirmed what I had already researched but he is definitely a credible source.

And NO WHERE in your entire bio does it even mention the CIA. Let alone Dr. Steve working in the CIA for 30 years. You fucking lied.

Nor can Dr. Steve even *name* the 'top general' he claims 'told him how 911 was pulled off'. Let alone back any of it with evidence. There is no part of your account above that checks out. As for 'knowing more than the rest of us', Steve Pieczenik hadn't worked for the State department since the late 1980s. He has no direct access to any of the sources he claims to cite, nor can he show us any evidence backing any portion of his account.

Once again, when we fact check your claims, they don't check out.

Shocker.

Keep reading what I post and perhaps you will eventually stop being a sheeple...one can only hope.

Dale....even you don't buy your bullshit. As when I specifically question you about the evidence, you try and change the topic. You lie about your sources. And your sources can't back a damn thing they say.

You're simply not prepared to deal with the evidence. You prefer your stupidly elaborate conspiracy fantasy to reality. And nothing can convince you. How do we know? You told us. You're mind is closed and you've committed to ignoring anything that contradicts your conspiracy fantasy.

I can show you the evidence, Dale. But I can't make you think.

 

[Dale Smith]

Pilots for 9/11 Truth has reported that the data stream from the flight data recorder (FDR) for American Airlines flight 77, which allegedly struck the Pentagon on 9/11, shows that the cockpit door never opened during the entire 90 minute flight. The data was provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), which has refused to comment.

The FDR is one of two “black boxes” in every commercial airliner, which are used after accidents to help determine the cause of a crash. One black box records flight data, the other records voice data (everything said in the cockpit during the flight). With those two sets of data, NTSB investigators can usually piece together the events that led to a crash. The status of the door to the cockpit is checked every four seconds throughout a flight and relayed as a simple 0 or 1, where 0=closed and 1=open, with approximately 1,300 door status checks performed during AA77’s 90 minute flight. Every one of those door status checks shows as a 0, indicating that the door to the cockpit never opened during the entire flight.

Accident investigators monitor the cockpit door with the FDR because it may yield clues to pilot error in a crash. The FDR begins recording once the pilots are in their seats and readying for takeoff, and the plane cannot take off unless the FDR is working.

The official story about flight 77 is that five Muslim terrorists brandishing box cutters forced their way into the cockpit and herded two pilots, four flight attendants and all the passengers to the back of the plane. This story came into being via Ted Olson, US Solicitor General, who told CNN — that he received two phone calls from his wife Barbara Olson, a passenger on the doomed flight. Ted Olson’s story changed several times. Sometimes he claimed that the calls from his wife were made from seat back phones, other times that she used her cell phone.

According to American Airlines customer service, the American Airlines maintenance manual for that aircraft, and American Airlines Captain Ralph Kolstad, seatback phones on 757s had been deactivated prior to 9/11/01. (They were later removed entirely, as they never worked well.)

Barbara Olson couldn’t have used a cell phone either: numerous 9/11 researchers, most notably David Ray Griffin, have pointed out that cell phones did not work on airplanes on 9/11. The speed and altitude of a commercial airliner both present overwhelming obstacles to a cell phone’s need to lock onto a cell tower and then hand off to another tower in a new location.

It was the FBI that revealed the evidence that decisively disproves Ted Olson’s story. In the Zacarias Moussaoui trial in 2006, the FBI presented a report on the cell phone calls from all four 9/11 flights. Their report on AA77 shows that there was only one phone call from Barbara Olson, but that it was an unconnected call lasting zero seconds. So Ted Olson either lied about receiving calls from his wife or was deceived into believing he received calls from her.

According to the UK Telegraph, Barbara Olson delayed her flight on 9/11 so that she could have breakfast with her husband on his birthday. That delay put her on the doomed flight. Ted Olson remarried in 2006 to tax attorney Lady Booth, whom he reportedly met the year after Barbara died.

There are numerous oddities and contradictions about AA77’s black boxes.

The government claims that the voice data recorder was damaged during the crash and that no usable data was retrieved from it. If true, this would be the first time in aviation history that a solid-state data recorder was destroyed during a crash.

While it was widely reported in the media that the FDR for AA77 was found at 4 am on September 14, 2001, the file containing the FDR data was dated over four hours earlier. In other words, we are asked to believe that the data from the FDR was downloaded prior to the FDR being found.

More Conspiracy Whack-a-mole!

Instead of answer any of my questions about the ADIZ, explain how NORAD could have been 'outwitted' by the hijackers when the area that NORAD monitors is OUTSIDE the United States.....you switch topics again. How did I know that was coming?

I'm going to go through this thread and make a list of all the claims you've made....and then abandoned, Dale. But since your rout is at least remotely relevant to the
David Griffith, professional conspiracy theorist, insists that cell phone calls can't be made from planes. The FBI, AT&T, Airfone, the company that ran the phones on the planes, and the actual phone records demonstrate that calls could be made.

Here's the Freedom of Information request for FBI interviews with AT&T, where the company contacted the FBI to report that they were getting calls from a woman claiming to be hijacked and transfering them to Ted Olson's number at the woman's request.

Teresa Gonzalez, operator for AT&T Services AT&T, telephonically contacted the Federal Bureau of Investigation FBI to report an emergency phone call received by AT&T. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, she provided the following information:

Mercy Lorenzo, also an operator with AT&T, received a call from a female passenger on flight 77 requesting to be transferred to telephone number 202514-2201. The female passenger advised the plane was being hi-jacked. Hi-jackers were ordering passengers to move to the back of the plane and were armed with guns and knives. Lorenzo indicated the pilot might not yet be aware of the take over of the plane.

Additionally, the number provided was the number of the passenger's husband. He is a Sergeant and resides in Washington, D.C.

http://911myths.com/images/9/95/265A-NY-280350-302-22170-Unredacted.pdf

Here's the interview with her husband's secretary at the Solicitor Generals office:

Lori Lynn Keyton, Secretary, Department of Justice (DOJ), Washington, D.C., telephone number (202) [redacted, date of birth [redacted] was contacted telephonically at her residence through the DOJ Command Center at (202) 514-5000. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, Keyton provided the following information:

Keyton was working in Ted Olson's Office this morning. She is regularly called there to cover the telephones. At approximately 9:00am, she received a series of approximately six (6) to eight (8) collect telephone calls. Each of the calls was an automated collect call. There was a recording advising of the collect call and requesting she hold for an operator. A short time later another recording stated that all operators were busy, please hang up and try your call later.

Keyton then received a collect call from a live operator. The operator advised that there was an emergency collect call from Barbara Olsen for Ted Olsen. Keyton advised that she would accept the call. Barbara Olsen was put through and sounded hysterical. Barbara Olsen said, "Can you tell Ted.." Keyton cut her off and said, "I'll put him on the line."
There was a second telephone call a few to five (5) minutes later. This time Barbara Olsen was on the line when she answered. She called direct. It was not a collect call. Barbara Olsen said, "It's Barbara." Keyton said, "he's on the phone with the command center, I'll put you through."

http://911myths.com/images/7/74/Team7-Box13-Flight-Call-Notes-and-302s.pdf

With Ted Olsen also confirming that the person on the line was his wife.

Here's the Airfone records from Flight 77 with 4 outgoing calls. Call you insist could never be made. Calls Airfone affirms were. Here's the first attempt, that didn't connect.

Call #2. This one did connect. Note that per Airfone, the customer dialed the operator. Matching the account of AT&T exactly.

With 3 other calls after that. All contradicting your account. Here's the FBI's records on *all* calls from Flight 77:

http://911myths.com/images/7/78/FBI_compilation_re_Flight_77_calls.pdf

See how I did that? I made a claim and I offered the source.

Oh, and Dale....if you're just going to cut and paste articles that you've never read nor fact checked, at least give us the courtesy of citing your sources. As here's your argument, verbatim. Written by someone else.

Flight 77 Cockpit Door Never Opened During 9/11 “Hijack"

Which you already know. But really hope we never found out.

"At 8:20 AM, Flight 77 took off from Dulles International Airport, 10 minutes after its scheduled departure time. At 8:46, Flight 77 veered severely off course. At 8:50, the last radio communication was made from the pilots and air traffic control. At 8:56, the jet's transponder was shut off. The pilots' last transmission was "ah direct FALMOUTH American seventy seven thanks." No radio communications from the flight indicated distress.'

Notice the times of the calls. 7:16 AM, 7:18 AM and 7 :19 AM. The times of the call do not line up with departure or alleged hijacking of the plane at all as Eastern standard time is given precedent over Pacific, Mountain and Central standard time.
BTW, it should have been obvious that I cut and pasted an article by Pilots for 9/11 truth given the different colored font. I thought I had posted the link but obviously something went askew. I was at work at the time and trying to keep up with the thread while having to go out and repair a machine. I noticed that you are silent about the cockpit door never being opened.
(PilotsFor911Truth.org) – Newly decoded data provided by an independent researcher and computer programmer from Australia exposes alarming evidence that the reported hijacking aboard American Airlines Flight 77 was impossible to have existed. A data parameter labeled “FLT DECK DOOR”, cross checks with previously decoded data obtained by Pilots For 9/11 Truth from the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) through the Freedom Of Information Act. Also, there have been 14 witnesses that claimed a jet flew over them and then flew over the Pentagon as there was an explosion. Look at the youtube video and tell me with a straight face that this is a plane.....





.

 

[Dale Smith]

A real veteran pilot speaks.

 

[Dale Smith]

Obviously they did outwit NORAD or NORAD stood down...take your pick.
North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) is responsible for monitoring our skies.The Continental NORAD Region (CONR) is the component of NORAD that provides airspace surveillance and control and directs air sovereignty activities for the Contiguous United States (CONUS).

And the activities that you insist NORAD was 'outsmarted' in was intercepting the hijacked planes. Yet EVERY Air Defense Intercept Zone on 911....was *outside* the United States. NORAD didn't monitor the location of planes in domestic airspace. NORAD's radar network is focused outward, toward incoming foreign warplanes. The only way NORAD knew that there was a hijacking is when the the FAA picked up a phone and told them. The FAA didn't notify NORAD of hijackings until AFTER the first tower had already been hit. And only a minute before the second tower was hit.

Making your 'outwitted NORAD' account nonsense. NORAD doesn't track domestic flights within the US. Nor would they have anyway of telling one plane from another if their transponders were turned off.

Which was the case in every plane used in the 911 attacks.

So why would NORAD have intercepted hijackings they didn't know about, planes they weren't tracking in airspace outside their Air Defense Intercept Zones? Your entire basis of assumption is nonsense.

No bodies of those on the plane were recovered....claimed that it only took them a couple of months to identify the alleged remains they recovered using DNA testing which is ludicrous to say the least. 184 out of 187 identified at a military base no less ...allegedly.

Says you. But when pressed to show us any source other than yourself that says this....you've got jack shit. Your entire argument is circular. Where you insist that there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon....because you insist there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon.

Why would a rational person ignore the ACSE report which shows the location of the bodies, ignore the autospies, ignore the identification of the bodies? Especially when you've got *jack shit* to back up any portion of your account. You have no rational reason to ignore the evidence. You simply do.

And this is why the Truthers aren't taken seriously. Their *entire* argument is to ignore the evidence. And even they can't give you a rational reason why.

As far as Dr. Steve Piecneznik is concerned, he worked in intelligence and counter-intelligence with many, many reliable contacts. When I have heard him interviewed, whichever host is doing the interviewing always attaches his name to the CIA. His resume is more impressive than just being CIA and he has more credibility and knows more than you or I.

That's not what you said before. This was:

Then there is the testimony of Dr Steve Pieczenik, who spent thirty years in the CIA that offered to testify in a Senate hearing that a General told him exactly how 9/11 was pulled off. He was also the first to reveal that Osama bin Laden died on December 13 2001 of Marfan's syndrome and had been visited in a military hospital in Dubai and debriefed by the CIA and other intel spooks in July of 2001. He only confirmed what I had already researched but he is definitely a credible source.

And NO WHERE in your entire bio does it even mention the CIA. Let alone Dr. Steve working in the CIA for 30 years. You fucking lied.

Nor can Dr. Steve even *name* the 'top general' he claims 'told him how 911 was pulled off'. Let alone back any of it with evidence. There is no part of your account above that checks out. As for 'knowing more than the rest of us', Steve Pieczenik hadn't worked for the State department since the late 1980s. He has no direct access to any of the sources he claims to cite, nor can he show us any evidence backing any portion of his account.

Once again, when we fact check your claims, they don't check out.

Shocker.

Keep reading what I post and perhaps you will eventually stop being a sheeple...one can only hope.

Dale....even you don't buy your bullshit. As when I specifically question you about the evidence, you try and change the topic. You lie about your sources. And your sources can't back a damn thing they say.

You're simply not prepared to deal with the evidence. You prefer your stupidly elaborate conspiracy fantasy to reality. And nothing can convince you. How do we know? You told us. You're mind is closed and you've committed to ignoring anything that contradicts your conspiracy fantasy.

I can show you the evidence, Dale. But I can't make you think.

Dude, I was just like you for over a 11 years......I demonized and marginalized anyone that dared to question our beloved "gubermint" concerning 9/11/01. I would Google and search for any piece of propaganda that I could use in a lame attempt to refute evidence and questions that I never bothered to look at because I didn't want my neat little neocon world turned upside down....so spare me the bullshit, m'kay? I took the blinders off and I went through some really bad times personally where I went from being outgoing and personable to being a total recluse and not wanting to interact with anyone. I became obsessed with finding the truth not only about 9/11 but other events that have shaped this corporation's hold over us and I have a very good grasp on how dire our situation is...... and it doesn't bode well for any of us as it currently stands. I no longer believe in political affiliations because it only serves to divide us and trust me, the ones that really pull the strings have created a number of ways to keep us divided and bickering among each other. You can throw out all the little diversions to your heart's content in hopes that I will stop posting about 9/11/01 but it's not gonna happen....read, learn, evolve. Things are not what you think they are and there is some really bad shit on the horizon unless there is a mass awakening.

 

[Skylar]

Obviously they did outwit NORAD or NORAD stood down...take your pick.
North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) is responsible for monitoring our skies.The Continental NORAD Region (CONR) is the component of NORAD that provides airspace surveillance and control and directs air sovereignty activities for the Contiguous United States (CONUS).

And the activities that you insist NORAD was 'outsmarted' in was intercepting the hijacked planes. Yet EVERY Air Defense Intercept Zone on 911....was *outside* the United States. NORAD didn't monitor the location of planes in domestic airspace. NORAD's radar network is focused outward, toward incoming foreign warplanes. The only way NORAD knew that there was a hijacking is when the the FAA picked up a phone and told them. The FAA didn't notify NORAD of hijackings until AFTER the first tower had already been hit. And only a minute before the second tower was hit.

Making your 'outwitted NORAD' account nonsense. NORAD doesn't track domestic flights within the US. Nor would they have anyway of telling one plane from another if their transponders were turned off.

Which was the case in every plane used in the 911 attacks.

So why would NORAD have intercepted hijackings they didn't know about, planes they weren't tracking in airspace outside their Air Defense Intercept Zones? Your entire basis of assumption is nonsense.

No bodies of those on the plane were recovered....claimed that it only took them a couple of months to identify the alleged remains they recovered using DNA testing which is ludicrous to say the least. 184 out of 187 identified at a military base no less ...allegedly.

Says you. But when pressed to show us any source other than yourself that says this....you've got jack shit. Your entire argument is circular. Where you insist that there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon....because you insist there were no bodies pulled from the Pentagon.

Why would a rational person ignore the ACSE report which shows the location of the bodies, ignore the autospies, ignore the identification of the bodies? Especially when you've got *jack shit* to back up any portion of your account. You have no rational reason to ignore the evidence. You simply do.

And this is why the Truthers aren't taken seriously. Their *entire* argument is to ignore the evidence. And even they can't give you a rational reason why.

As far as Dr. Steve Piecneznik is concerned, he worked in intelligence and counter-intelligence with many, many reliable contacts. When I have heard him interviewed, whichever host is doing the interviewing always attaches his name to the CIA. His resume is more impressive than just being CIA and he has more credibility and knows more than you or I.

That's not what you said before. This was:

Then there is the testimony of Dr Steve Pieczenik, who spent thirty years in the CIA that offered to testify in a Senate hearing that a General told him exactly how 9/11 was pulled off. He was also the first to reveal that Osama bin Laden died on December 13 2001 of Marfan's syndrome and had been visited in a military hospital in Dubai and debriefed by the CIA and other intel spooks in July of 2001. He only confirmed what I had already researched but he is definitely a credible source.

And NO WHERE in your entire bio does it even mention the CIA. Let alone Dr. Steve working in the CIA for 30 years. You fucking lied.

Nor can Dr. Steve even *name* the 'top general' he claims 'told him how 911 was pulled off'. Let alone back any of it with evidence. There is no part of your account above that checks out. As for 'knowing more than the rest of us', Steve Pieczenik hadn't worked for the State department since the late 1980s. He has no direct access to any of the sources he claims to cite, nor can he show us any evidence backing any portion of his account.

Once again, when we fact check your claims, they don't check out.

Shocker.

Keep reading what I post and perhaps you will eventually stop being a sheeple...one can only hope.

Dale....even you don't buy your bullshit. As when I specifically question you about the evidence, you try and change the topic. You lie about your sources. And your sources can't back a damn thing they say.

You're simply not prepared to deal with the evidence. You prefer your stupidly elaborate conspiracy fantasy to reality. And nothing can convince you. How do we know? You told us. You're mind is closed and you've committed to ignoring anything that contradicts your conspiracy fantasy.

I can show you the evidence, Dale. But I can't make you think.

Dude, I was just like you for over a 11 years......I demonized and marginalized anyone that dared to question our beloved "gubermint" concerning 9/11/01. I would Google and search for any piece of propaganda that I could use in a lame attempt to refute evidence and questions that I never bothered to look at because I didn't want my neat little neocon world turned upside down....so spare me the bullshit, m'kay? I took the blinders off and I went through some really bad times personally where I went from being outgoing and personable to being a total recluse and not wanting to interact with anyone. I became obsessed with finding the truth not only about 9/11 but other events that have shaped this corporation's hold over us and I have a very good grasp on how dire our situation is...... and it doesn't bode well for any of us as it currently stands. I no longer believe in political affiliations because it only serves to divide us and trust me, the ones that really pull the strings have created a number of ways to keep us divided and bickering among each other. You can throw out all the little diversions to your heart's content in hopes that I will stop posting about 9/11/01 but it's not gonna happen....read, learn, evolve. Things are not what you think they are and there is some really bad shit on the horizon unless there is a mass awakening.

Dude, you haven't evolved. You've adopted a fantasy that is based on desperate, willful ignorance of the events. You can't handle reality. You can't handle the evidence. So you concoct an elaborate fantasy populated by characters that you can control. As they're products of your imagination.

Dale, its not an uncommon thing for folks do. For some people, its hard to deal with the uncertainty and chaos of the real world. The idea that 19 guys could cause that much harm can be terrifying. And rather than acknowledge that vulnerability, rather than recognize that seeming randomness........folks like you would prefer that everything is actually under control. So they convince themselves of some elaborate conspiracies, where these events were all part of a ludicrously complicated plan by.....someone. Where every aspect of it was part of it was carefully calculated rather than out of our control.

As at least *someone* would be in control of everything. Even if you have to make them up.

Dale.......you've emotionally invented in this fantasy for so long that now you're as committed to the fantasy as you were commited to running away from the fear. But rationally, objectively......you fantasy is an awful explanation of the events. Its like seeing a fast food wrapper in the garbage....and concluding that the only possible explanation for it is vastly advanced alien civilization that traveled to earth to place it there, using mind control technology to plant false memories to convince the entire planet that 'McDonands' actually exists.

Or......maybe someone had a Big Mac.

Your explanation is stupidly awful. As bad as mind controlling aliens placing a McDonald's wrapper in the garbage. Worse, actually. As your conspiracy requires the spontaneous complicity of 10s of thousands of people working in perfect secrecy and maintaining that secrecy for 15 years and counting.

We couldn't keep the secret of the nuclear bomb under wraps for that long. The US government is stupidly porous. We've seen from leak after leak, Snowdens and Mannings and Wikileaks, that we can't keep secrets that long. That our government lacks the competence to pull off the insanely complicated plot....let alone plan it and keep it secret for a decade and a half. Especially considering that most of it happened in open view of the public.

The evidence contradicting you is enormous. The holes in your logic, truck sized. And your claims don't make the slightest sense. Yet 'nothing can convince you', as you've already told us. Ignoring evidence and closing your mind isn't 'evolution, Dale. Its self deception.

 

[Skylar]

Pilots for 9/11 Truth has reported that the data stream from the flight data recorder (FDR) for American Airlines flight 77, which allegedly struck the Pentagon on 9/11, shows that the cockpit door never opened during the entire 90 minute flight. The data was provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), which has refused to comment.

The FDR is one of two “black boxes” in every commercial airliner, which are used after accidents to help determine the cause of a crash. One black box records flight data, the other records voice data (everything said in the cockpit during the flight). With those two sets of data, NTSB investigators can usually piece together the events that led to a crash. The status of the door to the cockpit is checked every four seconds throughout a flight and relayed as a simple 0 or 1, where 0=closed and 1=open, with approximately 1,300 door status checks performed during AA77’s 90 minute flight. Every one of those door status checks shows as a 0, indicating that the door to the cockpit never opened during the entire flight.

Accident investigators monitor the cockpit door with the FDR because it may yield clues to pilot error in a crash. The FDR begins recording once the pilots are in their seats and readying for takeoff, and the plane cannot take off unless the FDR is working.

The official story about flight 77 is that five Muslim terrorists brandishing box cutters forced their way into the cockpit and herded two pilots, four flight attendants and all the passengers to the back of the plane. This story came into being via Ted Olson, US Solicitor General, who told CNN — that he received two phone calls from his wife Barbara Olson, a passenger on the doomed flight. Ted Olson’s story changed several times. Sometimes he claimed that the calls from his wife were made from seat back phones, other times that she used her cell phone.

According to American Airlines customer service, the American Airlines maintenance manual for that aircraft, and American Airlines Captain Ralph Kolstad, seatback phones on 757s had been deactivated prior to 9/11/01. (They were later removed entirely, as they never worked well.)

Barbara Olson couldn’t have used a cell phone either: numerous 9/11 researchers, most notably David Ray Griffin, have pointed out that cell phones did not work on airplanes on 9/11. The speed and altitude of a commercial airliner both present overwhelming obstacles to a cell phone’s need to lock onto a cell tower and then hand off to another tower in a new location.

It was the FBI that revealed the evidence that decisively disproves Ted Olson’s story. In the Zacarias Moussaoui trial in 2006, the FBI presented a report on the cell phone calls from all four 9/11 flights. Their report on AA77 shows that there was only one phone call from Barbara Olson, but that it was an unconnected call lasting zero seconds. So Ted Olson either lied about receiving calls from his wife or was deceived into believing he received calls from her.

According to the UK Telegraph, Barbara Olson delayed her flight on 9/11 so that she could have breakfast with her husband on his birthday. That delay put her on the doomed flight. Ted Olson remarried in 2006 to tax attorney Lady Booth, whom he reportedly met the year after Barbara died.

There are numerous oddities and contradictions about AA77’s black boxes.

The government claims that the voice data recorder was damaged during the crash and that no usable data was retrieved from it. If true, this would be the first time in aviation history that a solid-state data recorder was destroyed during a crash.

While it was widely reported in the media that the FDR for AA77 was found at 4 am on September 14, 2001, the file containing the FDR data was dated over four hours earlier. In other words, we are asked to believe that the data from the FDR was downloaded prior to the FDR being found.

More Conspiracy Whack-a-mole!

Instead of answer any of my questions about the ADIZ, explain how NORAD could have been 'outwitted' by the hijackers when the area that NORAD monitors is OUTSIDE the United States.....you switch topics again. How did I know that was coming?

I'm going to go through this thread and make a list of all the claims you've made....and then abandoned, Dale. But since your rout is at least remotely relevant to the
David Griffith, professional conspiracy theorist, insists that cell phone calls can't be made from planes. The FBI, AT&T, Airfone, the company that ran the phones on the planes, and the actual phone records demonstrate that calls could be made.

Here's the Freedom of Information request for FBI interviews with AT&T, where the company contacted the FBI to report that they were getting calls from a woman claiming to be hijacked and transfering them to Ted Olson's number at the woman's request.

Teresa Gonzalez, operator for AT&T Services AT&T, telephonically contacted the Federal Bureau of Investigation FBI to report an emergency phone call received by AT&T. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, she provided the following information:

Mercy Lorenzo, also an operator with AT&T, received a call from a female passenger on flight 77 requesting to be transferred to telephone number 202514-2201. The female passenger advised the plane was being hi-jacked. Hi-jackers were ordering passengers to move to the back of the plane and were armed with guns and knives. Lorenzo indicated the pilot might not yet be aware of the take over of the plane.

Additionally, the number provided was the number of the passenger's husband. He is a Sergeant and resides in Washington, D.C.

http://911myths.com/images/9/95/265A-NY-280350-302-22170-Unredacted.pdf

Here's the interview with her husband's secretary at the Solicitor Generals office:

Lori Lynn Keyton, Secretary, Department of Justice (DOJ), Washington, D.C., telephone number (202) [redacted, date of birth [redacted] was contacted telephonically at her residence through the DOJ Command Center at (202) 514-5000. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and the nature of the interview, Keyton provided the following information:

Keyton was working in Ted Olson's Office this morning. She is regularly called there to cover the telephones. At approximately 9:00am, she received a series of approximately six (6) to eight (8) collect telephone calls. Each of the calls was an automated collect call. There was a recording advising of the collect call and requesting she hold for an operator. A short time later another recording stated that all operators were busy, please hang up and try your call later.

Keyton then received a collect call from a live operator. The operator advised that there was an emergency collect call from Barbara Olsen for Ted Olsen. Keyton advised that she would accept the call. Barbara Olsen was put through and sounded hysterical. Barbara Olsen said, "Can you tell Ted.." Keyton cut her off and said, "I'll put him on the line."
There was a second telephone call a few to five (5) minutes later. This time Barbara Olsen was on the line when she answered. She called direct. It was not a collect call. Barbara Olsen said, "It's Barbara." Keyton said, "he's on the phone with the command center, I'll put you through."

http://911myths.com/images/7/74/Team7-Box13-Flight-Call-Notes-and-302s.pdf

With Ted Olsen also confirming that the person on the line was his wife.

Here's the Airfone records from Flight 77 with 4 outgoing calls. Call you insist could never be made. Calls Airfone affirms were. Here's the first attempt, that didn't connect.

Call #2. This one did connect. Note that per Airfone, the customer dialed the operator. Matching the account of AT&T exactly.

With 3 other calls after that. All contradicting your account. Here's the FBI's records on *all* calls from Flight 77:

http://911myths.com/images/7/78/FBI_compilation_re_Flight_77_calls.pdf

See how I did that? I made a claim and I offered the source.

Oh, and Dale....if you're just going to cut and paste articles that you've never read nor fact checked, at least give us the courtesy of citing your sources. As here's your argument, verbatim. Written by someone else.

Flight 77 Cockpit Door Never Opened During 9/11 “Hijack"

Which you already know. But really hope we never found out.

"At 8:20 AM, Flight 77 took off from Dulles International Airport, 10 minutes after its scheduled departure time. At 8:46, Flight 77 veered severely off course. At 8:50, the last radio communication was made from the pilots and air traffic control. At 8:56, the jet's transponder was shut off. The pilots' last transmission was "ah direct FALMOUTH American seventy seven thanks." No radio communications from the flight indicated distress.'

Notice the times of the calls. 7:16 AM, 7:18 AM and 7 :19 AM. The times of the call do not line up with departure or alleged hijacking of the plane at all as Eastern standard time is given precedent over Pacific, Mountain and Central standard time.

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The times are local times for the Airfone network operation center in Illinois. And would correspond to 8:16 to 8:19 eastern standard time. All well within Flight 77.

The calls demonstrate the Airfone seat back phones were operational. And that calls could be made. Which you've explicitly said wasn't possible.....because the article on the internet from 'Sheila' said so. I'll take AT&T, Airfone, the FBI, and the victim's family over Sheila anyway.

BTW, it should have been obvious that I cut and pasted an article by Pilots for 9/11 truth given the different colored font. I thought I had posted the link but obviously something went askew. I was at work at the time and trying to keep up with the thread while having to go out and repair a machine. I noticed that you are silent about the cockpit door never being opened.
(PilotsFor911Truth.org) – Newly decoded data provided by an independent researcher and computer programmer from Australia exposes alarming evidence that the reported hijacking aboard American Airlines Flight 77 was impossible to have existed. A data parameter labeled “FLT DECK DOOR”, cross checks with previously decoded data obtained by Pilots For 9/11 Truth from the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) through the Freedom Of Information Act. Also, there have been 14 witnesses that claimed a jet flew over them and then flew over the Pentagon as there was an explosion. Look at the youtube video and tell me with a straight face that this is a plane.....

Occam's Razor: the flight deck door sensor wasn't working.

But you demonstrate my point perfectly. We have dozens of witnesses of the crash. We have debris consistent with an American Airlines 757-223. Down to the engine parts being consistent with the engine type that American Airlines had installed on their planes. We have bodies pulled from the Pentagon matching the passengers and crew of Flight 77. We have an American Society of Civil Engineers study of the damage finding it consistent with an impact from a 757. We have both black boxes from Flight 77 pulled from the Pentagon impact site. We have dozens of witnesses who saw the plane fly directly over head as it flew over I-395 in the middle of a traffic jam.

And we have the flight data recording of Flight 77 bringing it from the airport to the crash site, with literally *millions* of data points of that flight recorded.....

And you ignore it all because the flight deck door sensor wasn't working.

That's wildly irrational, Dale. You're too emotionally invested in your conspiracy. As you're defending it beyond all utility, beyond all rationality, ignoring mountains and mountains and mountains of evidence contradicting you. And offering a stupidly awful, wildly complicated, insanely elaborate conspiracy that you can't factually back up in its place.

ANd you can't even tell me *why* you're ignoring the evidence.

 

[Skylar]

Oh, and your lies about Dr. Steve didn't go unnoticed. With Dr. Steve himself able to provide absolutely no evidence to back any part of his story. Nor even a rational explanation WHY a 'top general' would explain all of 911 to a guy who hadn't worked for the US government in 20 years.

But you'll accept any source, no matter how inane, or factually baseless their story....if it confirms what you want to believe. Hell, you'll even lie for them to prop up the fantasy you've invented in so much emotionally.