Is Government the problem...or the scapegoat?

[bucs90]

We need less government? As batshit crazy as our society is, I'd say we have just barely enough.

 

[bucs90]

Ironic. The most violent nation on Earth...saying it needs less government.

 

[Erand7899]

"Government", as Fox and the right wing love to make into a noun to hate, is NOT the problem. It is the scapegoat. We have many millions of miserable people in this country. They are angry, depressed, bitter, lonely, whatever. And a drug dealer....er, doctor, is more than happy to push a private sector profit tablet (pill) on them to fix it.

But as much as many say "If it werent for the dad gum gubmint, I'd have_______" (Fill in better life goal), would it REALLY be that much better/easier for them? REALLY? Doubtful. See, people dont realize that for what they pay in taxes, they get far more in return. Thats another thread altogether, but, its true. The people with the most wealth WOULD be the biggest targets of crime...and they'd need an entire group of bodyguards if not for law enforcement. Like old days, when kings and royalty had to take groups of armed men with them to protect them, or build castles.

Anyway, most people arent multi-milionaires. Most people pay a fair amount in taxes. Some people pay very little taxes, and those people live shitty lives. I wouldnt trade less taxes for their lives. Funny.

Seems the more people pay in taxes....the better standard of living they have. Hmmmmmm.

No, govt is not the problem. It is the scapegoat for misearble, bitter people who are emotionally bankrupt and have come to realize that more money doesnt mean more happiness.

Your perception of what people think about government would possibly gain some credibility if you could actually understand that it is not all one government. We don't pay taxes to the federal government to provide police protection. We pay taxes to state and local governments for those services.

Those of us who actually understand the structure, and different roles, of the various levels of government desire to keep it that way. I, for one, would like the federal government to return to the role given it by the Constitution. Perhaps, if our senators, congresspersons, and president focused on just those issues, they could actually do that job successfully

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Ironic. The most violent nation on Earth...saying it needs less government.

Yeah, I'm leaving for Rwanda... I hear it's wonderful this time of year.

You'd better check your numbers kid... cause you're way of the mark.

List of countries by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Stephanie]

Ironic. The most violent nation on Earth...saying it needs less government.

you sound like Chris Rock...we need the government, our mommy and daddy
You feel our country is the most violent nation on earth, you should move or never leave your house

How old are you? You sound like you are in high school with all these wild eyed utopia fantasies about what people need and this love of the government?

 

[bucs90]

"Government", as Fox and the right wing love to make into a noun to hate, is NOT the problem. It is the scapegoat. We have many millions of miserable people in this country. They are angry, depressed, bitter, lonely, whatever. And a drug dealer....er, doctor, is more than happy to push a private sector profit tablet (pill) on them to fix it.

But as much as many say "If it werent for the dad gum gubmint, I'd have_______" (Fill in better life goal), would it REALLY be that much better/easier for them? REALLY? Doubtful. See, people dont realize that for what they pay in taxes, they get far more in return. Thats another thread altogether, but, its true. The people with the most wealth WOULD be the biggest targets of crime...and they'd need an entire group of bodyguards if not for law enforcement. Like old days, when kings and royalty had to take groups of armed men with them to protect them, or build castles.

Anyway, most people arent multi-milionaires. Most people pay a fair amount in taxes. Some people pay very little taxes, and those people live shitty lives. I wouldnt trade less taxes for their lives. Funny.

Seems the more people pay in taxes....the better standard of living they have. Hmmmmmm.

No, govt is not the problem. It is the scapegoat for misearble, bitter people who are emotionally bankrupt and have come to realize that more money doesnt mean more happiness.

Your perception of what people think about government would possibly gain some credibility if you could actually understand that it is not all one government. We don't pay taxes to the federal government to provide police protection. We pay taxes to state and local governments for those services.

Those of us who actually understand the structure, and different roles, of the various levels of government desire to keep it that way. I, for one, would like the federal government to return to the role given it by the Constitution. Perhaps, if our senators, congresspersons, and president focused on just those issues, they could actually do that job successfully

The Constitution doesnt allow for an FBI, or DEA. So, when identity thieves in Cali steal an ID in Miami, no local depts have enough jurisdiction to pursue it. The theft happened in Miami, so LAPD cant claim a "victim". Miami PD's budget wont allow them to fly detectives all over the place. SOOOO........thats why the FBI handles crimes across state lines. Same with the DEA.

The Constitution would NOT allow for federal firefighters to assist with a fire that was only inside borders of Colorado.

The Constitution would NOT allow for FEMA to exist, much less give money from other state's taxpayers to the peopel of New Jersey.

There is a LOT the Constitution doesnt allow for....that we do anyway.

AND THANK GOD WE DO IT, it saves a lot of lives and suffering. I sure didnt see the private sector volunteering up resources to do the above things. In fact, most private sector companies, like insurance companies or banks, REFUSE to help a citizen UNLESS they first call the government (cops) and make an official report first. "GO TO THE GOVERNMENT FIRST BEFORE WE'LL EVEN BEGIN TO HELP YOU".

 

[Erand7899]

"See, people dont realize that for what they pay in taxes, they get far more in return."


Thank you for explaining the problem so succinctly. This is exactly why we have a $16 trillion debt. Getting "far more in return" than we paid for.

Gimme gimme gimme, and make that guy over there pay for it. Or borrow from China and Japan to gimme what I want.

See....what poor people need is stability, a safety net. Their lives suck, and the pay little in taxes. But, they get a modest safety net.

What rich people need is protection. In any other time in history, their lives would need 24/7 protection from several armed men, due to simply having wealth. Today, the rich dont need that. They have a military and police to protect their incredible standard of living. And thus, they pay for just that.

The middle? They get a bit of both. A safety net should they fall. And, some protection for what they have aquired. This is the hardest working of the three groups.

And yes, the reason we have a huge debt is that the government gives back far more than it takes. We need to slash some of that protection for the rich, and some of that safety net for the poor.

How about a 1 for 1 for 1 deal? $1 in defense cuts + $1 in entitlement cuts + $1 in tax increases. Every single dollar of each must be met with the other 2. Eventually, we'll be balanced.

Wow! A 1 for 1 for 1 deal? You could be a Republican, except for your contrived concept of class behavior. Members of all classes work hard, and members of all classes do not work at all. People get rich by not only working hard, but by working smart, and letting their money work for them as well. Try it, you might like it.

BTW, you might consider that their can be no thrill of victory, unless their is also the agony of defeat. One enjoys his gains in direct relation to the risks that he took to get them.

 

[Avatar4321]

Ironic. The most violent nation on Earth...saying it needs less government.

We aren't the most violent nation on earth. Been to Hondoras any time soon? Or maybe Mexico? There are tons of nations more violent.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Is Government the problem...or the scapegoat?

The latter.

 

[Avatar4321]

We need less government? As batshit crazy as our society is, I'd say we have just barely enough.

You want the crazy people in government making rules for the rest of us? Heck yeah we need less government. I don't want some nutjob telling me what I can and cannot do to take care of my family, friends, and in my job.

 

[Avatar4321]

Your perception of what people think about government would possibly gain some credibility if you could actually understand that it is not all one government. We don't pay taxes to the federal government to provide police protection. We pay taxes to state and local governments for those services.

Those of us who actually understand the structure, and different roles, of the various levels of government desire to keep it that way. I, for one, would like the federal government to return to the role given it by the Constitution. Perhaps, if our senators, congresspersons, and president focused on just those issues, they could actually do that job successfully

I often wonder why people blur the lines between the Federal, State, and local governments. Is it intentional or done out of ignorance?

 

[bucs90]

The people who bitch and whine the most about how much they dont need the government.....are the ones who are the most spoiled brats of society who have no clue how great they have it.

 

[g5000]

"See, people dont realize that for what they pay in taxes, they get far more in return."


Thank you for explaining the problem so succinctly. This is exactly why we have a $16 trillion debt. Getting "far more in return" than we paid for.

Gimme gimme gimme, and make that guy over there pay for it. Or borrow from China and Japan to gimme what I want.

See....what poor people need is stability, a safety net. Their lives suck, and the pay little in taxes. But, they get a modest safety net.

What rich people need is protection. In any other time in history, their lives would need 24/7 protection from several armed men, due to simply having wealth. Today, the rich dont need that. They have a military and police to protect their incredible standard of living. And thus, they pay for just that.

The middle? They get a bit of both. A safety net should they fall. And, some protection for what they have aquired. This is the hardest working of the three groups.

And yes, the reason we have a huge debt is that the government gives back far more than it takes. We need to slash some of that protection for the rich, and some of that safety net for the poor.

How about a 1 for 1 for 1 deal? $1 in defense cuts + $1 in entitlement cuts + $1 in tax increases. Every single dollar of each must be met with the other 2. Eventually, we'll be balanced.

I'm go for defense cuts. We are still spending at levels not seen since WWII, even after the recent cuts. This simply cannot be justified.

Entitlements are solved by raising the eligibility ages for Social Security and Medicare to at least 70, and indexing them to 9 percent of the population going forward. We are living decades longer than our ancestors, we should not be retiring the same age they did.

Taxes are solved by banning tax expenditures. For every tax break, someone else has to pay more taxes or we have to borrow from China and Japan. Ban tax expenditures, and everyone can pay lower rates. The largest part of the gimme gimme gimme problem is "gimme gimme gimme a tax break/credit/subsidy", and those are paid for by higher tax rates on everyone, and by borrowing from China and Japan.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

The people who bitch and whine the most about how much they dont need the government.....are the ones who are the most spoiled brats of society who have no clue how great they have it.

I'm very aware.. I just don't attribute it to the government cause that's dumb and I realize how much better I'd have it if the government weren't in my wallet at every turn.

 

[Avatar4321]

The people who bitch and whine the most about how much they dont need the government.....are the ones who are the most spoiled brats of society who have no clue how great they have it.

If it weren't for the government taking my money every two weeks, Id be in a much better position financially then I am with them taking my money and wasting it.

 

[Erand7899]

"Government", as Fox and the right wing love to make into a noun to hate, is NOT the problem. It is the scapegoat. We have many millions of miserable people in this country. They are angry, depressed, bitter, lonely, whatever. And a drug dealer....er, doctor, is more than happy to push a private sector profit tablet (pill) on them to fix it.

But as much as many say "If it werent for the dad gum gubmint, I'd have_______" (Fill in better life goal), would it REALLY be that much better/easier for them? REALLY? Doubtful. See, people dont realize that for what they pay in taxes, they get far more in return. Thats another thread altogether, but, its true. The people with the most wealth WOULD be the biggest targets of crime...and they'd need an entire group of bodyguards if not for law enforcement. Like old days, when kings and royalty had to take groups of armed men with them to protect them, or build castles.

Anyway, most people arent multi-milionaires. Most people pay a fair amount in taxes. Some people pay very little taxes, and those people live shitty lives. I wouldnt trade less taxes for their lives. Funny.

Seems the more people pay in taxes....the better standard of living they have. Hmmmmmm.

No, govt is not the problem. It is the scapegoat for misearble, bitter people who are emotionally bankrupt and have come to realize that more money doesnt mean more happiness.

Your perception of what people think about government would possibly gain some credibility if you could actually understand that it is not all one government. We don't pay taxes to the federal government to provide police protection. We pay taxes to state and local governments for those services.

Those of us who actually understand the structure, and different roles, of the various levels of government desire to keep it that way. I, for one, would like the federal government to return to the role given it by the Constitution. Perhaps, if our senators, congresspersons, and president focused on just those issues, they could actually do that job successfully

The Constitution doesnt allow for an FBI, or DEA. So, when identity thieves in Cali steal an ID in Miami, no local depts have enough jurisdiction to pursue it. The theft happened in Miami, so LAPD cant claim a "victim". Miami PD's budget wont allow them to fly detectives all over the place. SOOOO........thats why the FBI handles crimes across state lines. Same with the DEA.

The Constitution would NOT allow for federal firefighters to assist with a fire that was only inside borders of Colorado.

The Constitution would NOT allow for FEMA to exist, much less give money from other state's taxpayers to the peopel of New Jersey.

There is a LOT the Constitution doesnt allow for....that we do anyway.

AND THANK GOD WE DO IT, it saves a lot of lives and suffering. I sure didnt see the private sector volunteering up resources to do the above things. In fact, most private sector companies, like insurance companies or banks, REFUSE to help a citizen UNLESS they first call the government (cops) and make an official report first. "GO TO THE GOVERNMENT FIRST BEFORE WE'LL EVEN BEGIN TO HELP YOU".

I wonder how we got along before we had the FBI or the DEA? Somehow, we survived and thrived. Are we thriving now?

All resources used by government comes from the private sector. Government does not create wealth, it just takes it from the private sector.

Private insurance companies did offer flood insurance, before the federal government took the business from them. Those evil private insurance companies actually wanted those people who wanted to live in flood zones and along the beaches to pay for the risk that their choices warranted. Now, people in Kansas and Nebraska get to subsidize those who choose to live in high risk areas.

If all people are created equal, why does the citizen whose house burns down in Iowa, not get a dime from FEMA, while one whose house blows down in a hurricane or Tornado expects the government to build him a new one?

 

[LordBrownTrout]

You're such an anarchist. Screw the big bad government, that 'a boy, tell 'em like it is!!!! Geeeeet er done!!!!! Yahooooo!!!!!

That's not anarchist behavior to demand a govt be responsible and accountable....to which we have neither. Not sure how you surmised that incorrect deduction.

"Screw the govt" is why. That exact attitude lost your side the election. So...you say "screw" the military? Your local cops? Your firemen? Your teachers? "Screw 'em"?????

A good parent demands their kids be "responsible and accountable". But they dont say "Screw my kids".

Your radical right wing side lost the election, and you folks are being brainwashed into an anti-government hatred that is leading you all down a dangerous path to extinction of your ideology.

There's no brainwashing. Look at our debt and deficits, more govt, more worthless laws, creation of whole new departments, and continued irresponsibility and unaccounability. All of that is leading this country to a path to its own extinction. Your apathy towards such ineptitude along with millions of others is just as disturbing.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

If all people are created equal, why does the citizen whose house burns down in Iowa, not get a dime from FEMA, while one whose house blows down in a hurricane or Tornado expects the government to build him a new one?

its simple, a guy who just lost his house to a storm makes a great photo op while millions paying more for their insurance does not!

Similiarly, a hard working union guy getting a raise seems justly rewarded while the millions paying for it in the higher price of union made junk seems irrelevent.

 

[Antares]

(rolling my eyes) Good god all of you leftwing armchair quarterbacks ascribe everything you can think of to us having lost the telection.


Give it up, we lost because there wasn't enough difference between Obama and Romney.

Less of our base voted this time than did when McCain was the nominee.....

Conservatives are tired of being given a choice to vote an Obamaniac or a Conservative light.

You're such an anarchist. Screw the big bad government, that 'a boy, tell 'em like it is!!!! Geeeeet er done!!!!! Yahooooo!!!!!

That's not anarchist behavior to demand a govt be responsible and accountable....to which we have neither. Not sure how you surmised that incorrect deduction.

"Screw the govt" is why. That exact attitude lost your side the election. So...you say "screw" the military? Your local cops? Your firemen? Your teachers? "Screw 'em"?????

A good parent demands their kids be "responsible and accountable". But they dont say "Screw my kids".

Your radical right wing side lost the election, and you folks are being brainwashed into an anti-government hatred that is leading you all down a dangerous path to extinction of your ideology.

 

[Avatar4321]

(rolling my eyes) Good god all of you leftwing armchair quarterbacks ascribe everything you can think of to us having lost the telection.


Give it up, we lost because there wasn't enough difference between Obama and Romney.

Less of our base voted this time than did when McCain was the nominee.....

Conservatives are tired of being given a choice to vote an Obamaniac or a Conservative light.

That's not anarchist behavior to demand a govt be responsible and accountable....to which we have neither. Not sure how you surmised that incorrect deduction.

"Screw the govt" is why. That exact attitude lost your side the election. So...you say "screw" the military? Your local cops? Your firemen? Your teachers? "Screw 'em"?????

A good parent demands their kids be "responsible and accountable". But they dont say "Screw my kids".

Your radical right wing side lost the election, and you folks are being brainwashed into an anti-government hatred that is leading you all down a dangerous path to extinction of your ideology.

Less of our base voted this time, yet Romney got more votes than McCain. How does that work?