Is homosexuality a choice or not

[Rigby5]

Tomboy girls and sissy boys are not necessarily gay. Being gay is a choice made at puberty or later. Usually as a result of a failure with the opposite sex.

Doubtful, since puberty is not a choice.

 

[Rigby5]

WTF does that have to do with it? No one said it was genetic.

Being left handed is genetic, but not identified as to how yet.
So it is related since it proved we know very little about what each gene actually does.

 

[Leo123]

I do not know enough to say, but it can NOT be proven either way.
We do NOT understand what genes do what, nearly that well, and most genes have dozens if not hundreds of effects and implications.
And again, we have no sexual orientation until puberty, in which case there is plenty of opportunity to be affected by external hormones, like pesticides.

I would humbly add: and trannie pushing pests.

 

[Rigby5]

I merely posted a scientific study that debunks the myth that people are born gay.

Except that it did not debunk or establish anything.
We do not know what gene does what.

 

[miketx]

 

[HeyNorm]

So you ignore those that mate for life....I understand why.

Only heterosexuals mate.

You know nothing about that.

 

[Rigby5]

Here is the heart of the study, and clearly is totally and completely wrong.

{...
The study contained two key findings. First, it found that the effect of the genes we inherit from our parents (known as “heritability”) on same-sex orientation was very weak, at only .32 on a scale from 0 (none) to 1 (total) heritability. This means that a person’s developmental environment—which includes diet, family, friends, neighborhood, religion, and a host of other life conditions—is twice as influential on the probability of developing same-sex behavior or orientation as a person’s genes are.

Second, rebutting decades of widespread belief, the study established that “there is certainly no single genetic determinant (sometimes referred to as the ‘gay gene’ in the media)” that causes same-sex sexual behavior. On the contrary, “the variants involved are numerous and spread across the genome.” Each of these genetic variants increases a person’s propensity for same-sex behavior by an infinitesimally small amount. In scientific terms, same-sex orientation and behavior are highly polygenetic.

The logic of these two results—low heritability and high polygenicity—clearly demonstrate that the dominant cultural narrative about sexual orientation—which sees homosexual persons as a distinctly bounded biological class of people who were “born that way”—simply cannot be true.
...}

The second point is that there is no single DNA segment responsible for sexuality.
But that actually is true for almost all traits.
And of course this would then also explain why the inheritance is low from parents.
And obviously, since gay couples produce no offspring, their claim to have studied inheritance of sexuality from parents, seems outright silly.

 

[miketx]

.I understand why.

So, you're a queer. Got it.

 

[Leo123]

Doubtful, since puberty is not a choice.

That got me thinking. Before puberty, after infancy and into childhood, most humans are exposed to heterosexual behavior. That's why it's important that men and women having children should be the norm. During puberty, when hormones start to flow, sexual feelings can be manipulated. Also, we understand that hormones flow in a spectrum in differing individuals. There are heteros that are more identified with their natal sex than others who are still overall heterosexual while being more identified with the opposite sex. I thought everyone already understood this stuff.

 

[Burgermeister]

Practically nobody would choose to be a homosexual. I don't care how hard society works to pretend that it is normal. Everyone knows it isn't, and people want to be normal.

It's obviously a genetic thing.

 

[Leo123]

Practically nobody would choose to be a homosexual. I don't care how hard society works to pretend that it is normal. Everyone knows it isn't, and people want to be normal.

It's obviously a genetic thing.

Yeah but not totally determined by genes. Hormones override everything when puberty starts to set in. At that time, IMO, humans are more susceptible to influences outside the norm and, a child with a leaning toward opposite sex could more easily be manipulated into thinking they were 'born wrong.' Then the 'adults' try to cover up their coercion by telling them homosexuality is 'normal' and everybody else is wrong. Later when the kid heads toward adulthood, they are aghast at what was done to them. Transgender is some really sick shit folks.

 

[Faun]

Is homosexuality a choice or not

Who cares?

 

[Curried Goats]

You will find male or female on the birth record, which is HETEROSEXUAL.

Male and Female correspond to physical traits such as genitalia and chromosomal makeup. Sexuality is something else entirely. Pretending not to understand the difference isn't a good debate tactic, it just makes you look like a Bingo.

Gender dysphoria is the distress a person has with a mismatch between their natal gender and their gender identity. It is better if the identity matches the natal gender. You have no idea what you are talking about.

You don't have any idea what you're talking about. Here is an excerpt from the people who literally write the book on diagnosing gender dysphoria.

What is Gender Dysphoria?

Gender identity is also different from sexual orientation. Sexual orientation refers to the types of people towards which one is sexually attracted. As with people who are cisgender (people whose sex assigned at birth aligns with their gender identity), people who are transgender have a diverse range of sexual orientations.

Do I have to actually spell it out for you? A hetero couple engaging in oral sex can transition to penis in vagina sex which can create a new human being. Oral sex between two males can transition to penis in anus sex which will NEVER create a new human being. Are you really that clueless?

Are you clueless? Did you forget what it is we're actually arguing? The biological components necessary for procreation and the biological desire for sex are not one and the same thing. Most sex isn't done with procreation as the goal but rather sexual satisfaction.

Homosexuality MUST be a choice because it is NORMAL to be hetero. Why is it you are so confused? Have you found that 'gay gene' yet?

Have you found the straight gene yet? Do you understand rational thought? This is a post hoc fallacy.

Evolution favors heterosexuality. I already explained that but you seem to have comprehension problems or, like to ignore uncomfortable truths.

You didn't explain anything. You made a claim that you can't support with a rational argument. Evolution is another idea, like nature and is not an entity with a nervous systems or the ability to create the chemical responses necessary to favor one thing over another. You don't seem to understand what a metaphor is.

Come on now, this thread is not about death. All you're doing is deflecting and spinning now.

You're the one who brought up the idea that nature cares about the continuation of life and yet because of our observations of nature and the laws of physics we know all life on this planet and the universe will eventually end.

 

[Foxfyre]

They were in denial of their bisexuality

I know these people. You don't. So again have a good night.

 

[Leo123]

Male and Female correspond to physical traits such as genitalia and chromosomal makeup. Sexuality is something else entirely. Pretending not to understand the difference isn't a good debate tactic, it just makes you look like a Bingo.

No it isn't. Overwhelmingly 'sexuality' follows natal gender no matter what juvenile names you call me.

You don't have any idea what you're talking about. Here is an excerpt from the people who literally write the book on diagnosing gender dysphoria.

What is Gender Dysphoria?

Gender identity is also different from sexual orientation. Sexual orientation refers to the types of people towards which one is sexually attracted. As with people who are cisgender (people whose sex assigned at birth aligns with their gender identity), people who are transgender have a diverse range of sexual orientations.

Nonsense. Natal sex is what one's gender really is, if that were not the case then there would be no need for 2 different sexes. If you're 'sexually' attracted to your same sex, you have a mental illness. The 'people' you describe are on the fringe.

Are you clueless? Did you forget what it is we're actually arguing? The biological components necessary for procreation and the biological desire for sex are not one and the same thing. Most sex isn't done with procreation as the goal but rather sexual satisfaction.

Have you found the straight gene yet? Do you understand rational thought? This is a post hoc fallacy.

You didn't explain anything. You made a claim that you can't support with a rational argument. Evolution is another idea, like nature and is not an entity with a nervous systems or the ability to create the chemical responses necessary to favor one thing over another. You don't seem to understand what a metaphor is.

You're the one who brought up the idea that nature cares about the continuation of life and yet because of our observations of nature and the laws of physics we know all life on this planet and the universe will eventually end.

Sexual satisfaction enhances and promotes procreation. Homosexuals just co opt sexual gratification as they parrot heterosexuals. Grab your crotch, sweetie. If you have a vagina your genes are female. If you have a penis your genes are male.

I never said nature or evolution were entities, stop projecting. At this point you're arguing with yourself. I was using a METAPHOR you cretin. You know, that thing you said I don't understand? Look in the mirror you idiot.

 

[toobfreak]

Homosexuality exists at about the same rate across the world regardless of how permissive or restrictive the society. Were it a choice there would barely be any gay people where they kill you for it.

Fallacy of reasoning, Pie! For such a smart democrat, I'm surprised you could make such a mistake. Some people have the biological predisposition (call it genetic or whatever you want) to lean towards being gay regardless of how restrictive or permissive their society is because within every society, are random variables where such people will meet others with that predisposition as well, either through culture or society triggering the full swing towards those leanings.

So yes, homosexuality can be BOTH a genetic predisposition AND a cultural influence!

 

[Leo123]

Fallacy of reasoning, Pie! For such a smart democrat, I'm surprised you could make such a mistake. Some people have the biological predisposition (call it genetic or whatever you want) to lean towards being gay regardless of how restrictive or permissive their society is because within every society, are random variables where such people will meet others with that predisposition as well, either through culture or society triggering the full swing towards those leanings.

So yes, homosexuality can be BOTH a genetic predisposition AND a cultural influence!

They don't want to acknowledge the fact that homosexuality can be influenced upon someone. Especially a young pre-teen. They want everyone to believe homosexuality is genetic and immutable. Meanwhile, they know damn well they are lying through their teeth.

 

[Curried Goats]

No it isn't.

Gender and sexuality are different things.

Overwhelmingly 'sexuality' follows natal gender no matter what juvenile names you call me.

Statistically you're more likely to be heterosexual, so what? Just because something is less likely to happen doesn't make its occurrence a choice.

Nonsense. Natal sex is what one's gender really is, if that were not the case then there would be no need for 2 different sexes. If you're 'sexually' attracted to your same sex, you have a mental illness. The 'people' you describe are on the fringe.

Insisting that people are mentally ill when you don't have the education or credentials to reasonably make that assessment only makes you look delusional.

Sexual satisfaction enhances and promotes procreation. Homosexuals just co opt sexual gratification as they parrot heterosexuals. Grab your crotch, sweetie. If you have a vagina your genes are female. If you have a penis your genes are male.

Maybe you only have sex to procreate but my wife and have sex all the time without any intention of procreation and we are both extremely satisfied, sexually. Covering your ears and shutting your eyes to evidence that disagrees with you is no way to go through life.

I never said nature or evolution were entities, stop projecting. At this point you're arguing with yourself. I was using a METAPHOR you cretin. You know, that thing you said I don't understand? Look in the mirror you idiot.

If you understand these words are metaphores then you know nature and evolution don't really prefer anything, including heterosexual sex or human procreation.

 

[Burgermeister]

If you understand these words are metaphores then you know nature and evolution don't really prefer anything, including heterosexual sex or human procreation.

You can't have your Darwin cake and eat it too. LOL.

 

[Leo123]

Gender and sexuality are different things.

Gender and sex are the same. Your weasel word 'sexuality' is really meaningless. Human beings are overwhelmingly heterosexual so, homosexuals are on the fringes of the population.

Statistically you're more likely to be heterosexual, so what? Just because something is less likely to happen doesn't make its occurrence a choice.

But, you haven't produced any 'gay gene' yet have you? I have already schooled you and given you an experiment to perform on your own crotch. What were your results?

Insisting that people are mentally ill when you don't have the education or credentials to reasonably make that assessment only makes you look delusional.

Anyone who thinks their natal genitals are an accident has either physical problems or mental problems. One does not need a PHD or MD to see that.

Maybe you only have sex to procreate but my wife and have sex all the time without any intention of procreation and we are both extremely satisfied, sexually. Covering your ears and shutting your eyes to evidence that disagrees with you is no way to go through life.

Do you and your wife have children? If so, they are the result of all that good feeling sex you've been having. Were you to be homosexual, all you'd have is shit on your dick.

If you understand these words are metaphores then you know nature and evolution don't really prefer anything, including heterosexual sex or human procreation.

At least try to spell the word (metaphors) properly as you clearly do not know what it means.