Is Obama a liar?

[Faun]

Again, who is paying you to repeat these disingenuous talking points? Because of the consistency of those talking points, I am becoming increasing convinced that somebody is assigning them.

Get your own job.


Since RomneyCare is the only other implementation of such a plan, I'm amazed you find it conspiratorial that they're compared.


Says you. Folks from Massachusetts say otherwise...

Massachusetts poll finds high satisfaction under 'RomneyCare'


The same people who subsidize RomneyCare -- taxpayers.

Oh good. The taxpayers now get to subsidize Massachusetts AND the entire country. Sure glad you advised us of that comforting fact. In addition to fewer employment opportunities and much higher costs, should be a piece of cake.

And as for that "Massachusetts satisfaction" site you linked, I read the article under the headline. This is most of it:

The survey also suggested several areas that still need improvement in the state's healthcare system.

Nearly 80 percent said cost is the most important healthcare issue facing Massachusetts compared with access to care and quality of care. Another 65 percent said their healthcare costs are more expensive than last year.

The survey also found a 6 percent rise in the share of Massachusetts residents (31 percent) who reported using the emergency room last year. ER visits were more frequent among people age 40 and younger compared with the elderly.

The trend is problematic given the state's desire to constrain healthcare cost growth. The emergency room is one of the most expensive medical venues, and people without health insurance sometimes use it for basic care — a factor behind the state's individual mandate to buy health coverage.

I'm not finding a lot of positives there. Do you?

And there is this from Politico:

Re Romneycare:

But some who are closely watching Massachusetts are more candid about it — and they say it has some serious problems.

“The reality is it performed very poorly,” said Douglas Holtz-Eakin, a former Congressional Budget Office director and president of the American Action Forum. He’s one of the most vocal critics of the plan. “A huge mark against it is it didn’t control health care costs at all.”

Health care costs per capita were 27 percent higher in Massachusetts than in the rest of the country in 2004, two years before the state plan was signed, Holtz-Eakin says. By 2009, it was 30 percent higher than the national average.

The law’s failure to rein in health care costs is widely acknowledged by nonpartisan analysts, as well as conservative critics. But there’s more material for critics to work with if either party wanted to use it. For example, emergency room use has gone up, not down — undermining the law’s effort to get that problem under control by expanding coverage.

State health policy officials issued a report last month showing a 6 percent increase in emergency room use from 2006 to 2010, the first four years when the law was in effect. That figure has confounded proponents of the law, who hoped emergency room care would plummet when residents had access to insurance and primary-care doctors.

Detractors in the Bay State also say the law has done little to dent the surging demand seen by the state’s largest safety-net hospitals.

Read more: Big ?Romneycare? secret: It didn?t rein in costs - Jennifer Haberkorn and Kyle Cheney - POLITICO.com

So you folks who have been designated Obama and Obamacare apologists, how truthful are you being about the success of Romneycare? How truthful are you and our fearless leader being about the prognosis for the costs and repercussions of Obamacare?

In case you're not already aware -- the American tax payer was already flipping the bill for healthcare where many people relied on overly expensive emergency-room care for their primary care.

 

[Faun]

Insurance premiums are higher in Massachusetts than almost anywhere, and they have risen at a faster pace since Romneycare was implemented. That's ONE state, with a pretty high median income level, where most people already had health insurance.

Not exactly...

• Massachusetts has long been a high health care spending state, and the 2006 health reform law did not significantly increase the rate of growth in the state’s health insurance premiums.

• Higher costs were not caused or markedly accelerated by health reform, as Massachusetts has been a high spending state for years.

http://bluecrossmafoundation.org/sites/default/files/Cost%20Deck%20March%20report.pdf

Seems MA has long been among the most costly in terms of healthcare.

RomneyCare has had insignificant impact on that.

That's because most of the harm was done with the 1996 Health Care reform law.

Feel free to prove that healthcare in MA wasn't among the highest prior to 1996,

 

[Amelia]

Massachusetts is a single state. I am talking about obama's ACA. The roll out has been wildly successful, now, hasn't it?

One thing everybody keeps missing in this "Romneycare is obamacare" nonsense.....

The people of Massachusetts WANTED Romneycare.

The people of America DO NOT WANT AND HAVE NEVER WANTED obamacare.

A good president does what he feels is best for the nation, not what is popular.

Wow.

A good dictator maybe.

A good president of a democratic republic doesn't lie to the nation to get legislation passed against their will and condescend to them and tell them that when they finally understand what what he has done for them they'll appreciate it.

 

[Stephanie]

The GOP wanted a one year delay to the individual mandate, as does 75% of Americans and many Democrats. The DNC was so against the idea that they let the government be shut down rather than negotiate.

Stop acting like it was cataclysmic--it was less than 15% of the government. I know you are going to pull some number out and say it 'cost the government blah blah blah because of the shut down'. In one month the government debt jumped over $400 billion and those that are making these claims don't give a damn.

Despite the efforts of this administration to "make the shutdown as painful as possible", and a willing media that dutifully parrotted DNC talking points--the government shutdown did not impact average Americans.

You poor victim.

The Boehner shutdown costs about $24B according to multiple estimates.

And ObamaCare will cost $Ts. I'd ask you to do the math, but I doubt you can perform simple arithmetic.

all she does is repeat the DNC talking points over and over in her snooty condescending way, so don't expect anything else

she's become just a troll along with her liberal sheep buddy, faun

 

[Faun]

That would be me.
obama's intent was to have a single payer system but realized that doing so in one fell swoop had no chance of passing. So, he designed a system that had to fail.
It will fail. Hopefully, it will fail in 2015 or before so there is a Conservative government in place to fix it. God help us if it waits past the 2016 elections. If we end up with Hillary, obama gets his way.

It was not his intent for this system to fail. Evidence of that is found in the fact that he did not come up with much of the current system. Conservatives created much of it back in the 80's. Was it their intent for it to fail then? Was it Romney's intent for it to fail in MA? Also, Congressional Democrats drafted the bill and debated for most of 2009 to decide what to put in it.

Bottom line is this.....

obama lied through his teeth.

dimocrap scum lied through their teeth.

the DISGUSTING FILTH in the LSM lied and covered for them for the last 5 years.

The ONLY people that have tried to tell you the truth about this mess has been Republicans and FNC. And they have both been proven exactly correct.

Romney didn't lie to get his Health Care Reform passed in The People's Republic of Massachusetts. He didn't have to. The people of Mass wanted it.

dimocrap scum lied their FUCKING ASSES OFF to get obamacare passed.

THAT is what we're pissed off about.

FUCK the details. dimocraps are lying scumbags and that's what counts.

the Stuttering Clusterfuck Of A Lying Scumbag's latest excuse is that 15 Million people losing their Insurance is too small a number to get excited about.

right

But the ENDA bill affects fewer butt-rangers than that and obama was all about getting that passed.

Fuck obama and FUCK dimocraps.

And frankly, it's too bad. We needed something like this to get done.

Republicans were in the mood to go for it but obama is such an arrogant fuckstick and such a lying scumbag and dimocraps are such heavy-handed Nazis that they wouldn't even talk to Republicans.

And now this thing is going to go down in flames and we may not see another attempt to straighten out our Health Insurance mess for a decade or more.

And this thing IS going down.. In flames.

Believe it. dimocraps are too stupid to make something this complicated work.

Republicans? We could have done it in our sleep

Republicans can't do shit. Hell, they ran the government for 6 years under Bush and another 6 years under Clinton and destroyed our economy.

At any rate, let me know when there's a president who doesn't lie.

 

[Faun]

One thing everybody keeps missing in this "Romneycare is obamacare" nonsense.....

The people of Massachusetts WANTED Romneycare.

The people of America DO NOT WANT AND HAVE NEVER WANTED obamacare.

A good president does what he feels is best for the nation, not what is popular.

And this president is an incompetent slob and an abject failure. PERIOD.

Does this mean he can't count on your vote in 2016?

 

[Amelia]

One thing everybody keeps missing in this "Romneycare is obamacare" nonsense.....

The people of Massachusetts WANTED Romneycare.

The people of America DO NOT WANT AND HAVE NEVER WANTED obamacare.

A good president does what he feels is best for the nation, not what is popular.

Wow.

A good dictator maybe.

A good president of a democratic republic doesn't lie to the nation to get legislation passed against their will and condescend to them and tell them that when they finally understand what what he has done for them they'll appreciate it.

And then a good president doesn't double down on the lies by claiming that he said something other than what he repeatedly said over the course of many years, when what he said for all those years is on the record for all to remember.

That is what a deranged, dishonest, incompetent president does.

Someone who doesn't respect the truth because he is so far removed from it.

Someone who doesn't respect his constituents.

 

[Amelia]

Obama doesn't respect you, Faun.

Deal with it.

 

[Lumpy 1]

Obama doesn't respect you, Faun.

Deal with it.

Some people appreciate being talked down to, lied to, and their decisions made for them, their called Democrats.

 

[Ernie S.]

My apologies ... I mistook you for another poster who said that.

That would be me.
obama's intent was to have a single payer system but realized that doing so in one fell swoop had no chance of passing. So, he designed a system that had to fail.
It will fail. Hopefully, it will fail in 2015 or before so there is a Conservative government in place to fix it. God help us if it waits past the 2016 elections. If we end up with Hillary, obama gets his way.

It was not his intent for this system to fail. Evidence of that is found in the fact that he did not come up with much of the current system. Conservatives created much of it back in the 80's. Was it their intent for it to fail then? Was it Romney's intent for it to fail in MA? Also, Congressional Democrats drafted the bill and debated for most of 2009 to decide what to put in it.

If that's what your handler wants you to say, fine. We all know better.


This is what they were telling us 3 years ago:

My comments bolded.

10 Things Every American Needs to Know about the Health Care Bill:

1. Once reform is fully implemented, over 95% of Americans will have health insurance coverage, including 32 million who are currently uninsured.

Most of those 32 million choose not to be insured, are illegal residents or are covered under medicaid.

2. Health insurance companies will no longer be allowed to deny people coverage because of preexisting conditions--or to drop coverage when people become sick.

Does your auto insurance company cover you for preexisting dents?

3. Just like members of Congress, individuals and small businesses who can't afford to purchase insurance on their own will be able to pool together and choose from a variety of competing plans with lower premiums.

Lower premiums? How's THAT work out?

4. Reform will cut the federal budget deficit by $138 billion over the next ten years, and a whopping $1.2 trillion in the following ten years.

Bullshit!

5. Health care will be more affordable for families and small businesses thanks to new tax credits, subsidies, and other assistance--paid for largely by taxing insurance companies, drug companies, and the very wealthiest Americans.

More bullshit. Some will save on insurance, but the rest will foot the bill. Insurance companies are guaranteed a profit margin and any additional taxes they pay will be passed on to the consumer.

6. Seniors on Medicare will pay less for their prescription drugs because the legislation closes the "donut hole" gap in existing coverage.

Yeah, right. The horror stories are already coming out.

7. By reducing health care costs for employers, reform will create or save more than 2.5 million jobs over the next decade.

Only it's NOT reducing any costs, anywhere! One has to wonder how man bureaucrats will obamacare "create or save". Could that be where the 2.5 million number came from?

8. Medicaid will be expanded to offer health insurance coverage to an additional 16 million low-income people.

And even if they hadn't pulled a half billion from Medicaid to make the numbers work, someone has to pay for 16 million more beneficiaries.

9. Instead of losing coverage after they leave home or graduate from college, young adults will be able to remain on their families' insurance plans until age 26.

I could see COBRA for "kids" when they leave their parents' plans, but 26 and still on daddy's plan? Grow up!? Hell I had been on my own for 8 years by then. I paid my own health care when I was in college.

10. Community health centers would receive an additional $11 billion, doubling the number of patients who can be treated regardless of their insurance or ability to pay.

Someone has to pay for that! I am unwilling.

 

[Foxfyre]

Obama doesn't respect you, Faun.

Deal with it.

No, people like that don't respect those they can manipulate to parrot the lies and thereby become useful idiots. Or those that are sufficiently corrupt that they accept the duty to come to message boards not to engage in conversation or discussion or debate, but rather to parrot the assigned talking points. You can spot them every time because they ignore whatever is posted that refutes the assigned talking points. They just manuever onto a new page and repeat them again.

The liar for personal gain might admire the prowess of another liar, but he does not respect him or revere him. And he certainly doesn't respect or admire those he can fool into believing the lies or are gullible enough to become his useful idiots. And just like all other corrupt people, the liar will sell out anybody if he sees suffcient advantage for himself in doing so.

 

[Ernie S.]

Same way many Americans will feel about ObamaCare in 50 years.

I guarantee you. obamacare will be an interesting footnote in our history books in the same chapter as Watergate, Teapot Dome and "I didn't have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky".

Yeah, sure.

Glad you agree.

 

[kaz]

Don't change the subject ... we're not talking about states' rights. We're talking about the viability of ObamaCare. You claim it's designed to fail, yet there's already an example of it in action and it has not failed.

You haven't given any example of Obamacare not failing.

As if it's incumbent upon me to prove someone else wrong after they fail to prove themselves right.

I asked you about your statement, and yes, homey, it's for you to defend your statements.

Nowhere has Obamacare succeeded, and your statement, even if Romney care has worked is true, isn't obamacare.

 

[Uncensored2008]

The United States Supreme Court ruled yes.

No, it certainly did not.

 

[Uncensored2008]

And you must be old and stupid if you think Republicans are any more honest than Democrats.

Republicans are filthy, lying fucks - and a thousand times more honest than democrats.

 

[kaz]

As if it's incumbent upon me to prove someone else wrong after they fail to prove themselves right.

Then show us how successful it's been.

Massachusetts poll finds high satisfaction under 'RomneyCare'

Even if you ignore the difference between State and Federal authority under our Constitution, Romneycare is not Obamacare. They are different programs. You said Obamacare has succeeded. So where has it succeeded? You're just making it up. Romneycare is also a disaster, BTW.

 

[Faun]

One thing everybody keeps missing in this "Romneycare is obamacare" nonsense.....

The people of Massachusetts WANTED Romneycare.

The people of America DO NOT WANT AND HAVE NEVER WANTED obamacare.

A good president does what he feels is best for the nation, not what is popular.

Wow.

A good dictator maybe.

Get real. Obama is no more of a dictator than any other U.S. president. He has to follow the same rules as the rest of them.

A good president of a democratic republic doesn't lie to the nation to get legislation passed against their will and condescend to them and tell them that when they finally understand what what he has done for them they'll appreciate it.

Again ... ALL presidents lie. It's what they do. Obama is no exception.

 

[Vox]

Again ... ALL presidents lie. It's what they do. Obama is no exception.

No, he is an exception, since ALL HE DOES are LIES. Always.

 

[Amelia]

Obama is the most dishonest, most divisive, most insulting president in my memory.

And finally, at least for this brief moment, a large segment of the nation is seeing what I see.

Obama is sliding in the polls, not just in his job approval but in what has heretofore been an inexplicably high "likability" rating. Even that has gone underwater.

People will only take being lied to and insulted so long. Well, that is what I want to believe.


I just hope my fellow Americans don't forget and don't let him get away with more damage. By his present lies about his past lies he is showing that he is incorrigible and needs to be fiercely held accountable.

 

[Faun]

Obama doesn't respect you, Faun.

Deal with it.

He doesn't?? Does this mean he's not going to accept my invitation to join me for a beer?