Is obama a socilist, or a fascist?

[regent]

How we use these names, fascist, communist, socialist, liberal, conservative, Marxist, have no real meaning but only end up as a form of name-calling. One time I asked each poster that used socialism for a definition and most did not answer, and of the large number I asked, only two gave me a dictionary definition, which did not fit their usage. It fits in with those that believed the Soviet Union practiced Marxian communism or that Hitler was a socialist.

 

[Foxfyre]

How we use these names, fascist, communist, socialist, liberal, conservative, Marxist, have no real meaning but only end up as a form of name-calling. One time I asked each poster that used socialism for a definition and most did not answer, and of the large number I asked, only two gave me a dictionary definition, which did not fit their usage. It fits in with those that believed the Soviet Union practiced Marxian communism or that Hitler was a socialist.

This is the problem. There ate the European definitions. There are dictionary defintiions. And there is the reality of the modern day American definitions for left, right, liberal, conservative, socialist, communist, facist, etc.

Those willing to have a serious, grown up discussion on the topic will recognize and accommodate the differences in those definitions.

The rest will refuse to accept any realities regarding that and, as you say, just use them as perjoratives and insults.

 

[JakeStarkey]

How we use these names, fascist, communist, socialist, liberal, conservative, Marxist, have no real meaning but only end up as a form of name-calling. One time I asked each poster that used socialism for a definition and most did not answer, and of the large number I asked, only two gave me a dictionary definition, which did not fit their usage. It fits in with those that believed the Soviet Union practiced Marxian communism or that Hitler was a socialist.

This is the problem. There ate the European definitions. There are dictionary defintiions. And there is the reality of the modern day American definitions for left, right, liberal, conservative, socialist, communist, facist, etc.

Those willing to have a serious, grown up discussion on the topic will recognize and accommodate the differences in those definitions.

The rest will refuse to accept any realities regarding that and, as you say, just use them as perjoratives and insults.

The only definitions that count are the political and historical definitions.

The made-up of definitions of far right and far left are just that, made up, and have no basis in historical reality.

 

[Oddball]

How we use these names, fascist, communist, socialist, liberal, conservative, Marxist, have no real meaning but only end up as a form of name-calling. One time I asked each poster that used socialism for a definition and most did not answer, and of the large number I asked, only two gave me a dictionary definition, which did not fit their usage. It fits in with those that believed the Soviet Union practiced Marxian communism or that Hitler was a socialist.

This is the problem. There ate the European definitions. There are dictionary defintiions. And there is the reality of the modern day American definitions for left, right, liberal, conservative, socialist, communist, facist, etc.

Those willing to have a serious, grown up discussion on the topic will recognize and accommodate the differences in those definitions.

The rest will refuse to accept any realities regarding that and, as you say, just use them as perjoratives and insults.

The differences are in form, not substance.

Fascism: Willy Messerchmitt and Krupp can hang a shingle with their names on their arms factories.

Communism: Mikoyan & Guerivich and Mikhail Kalashnikov can't.

 

[007]

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Well Ernie, considering when obama was running for state senator in Illinois he was a member of the Chicago New Party which are socialist democrats you be the judge,

Obama and the New Party | | Conservative News, Views & Books

 

[francoHFW]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

He's just a your average, garden-variety clueless dumb fuck. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[buckeye45_73]

buckeye claims he is GOP and very hard right. He believes that he like, Santorum, is the heart of the GOP. No, he is not, not even close, not anywhere near mainstream America or mainstream GOP. A true conservative is compassionate, and he made no apology to me for jumping me for being "late" (really?) in reply, or inquire as to the dying child's fate.

You made a claim, lumped everybody you do not like as Left, New Left, extreme left (the terms kept changing) but never told us what (1) the New Left is, (2) why it is the New Left, and how it applies to the problem, which you do not bother to identify, other than everything wrong in America is attributable to the "New Left".

You then rant about the French revolutions of 1789 and 1848, uses Marxian rhetoric (which you clearly donot understand), and fail to link Marx to the causes of the revolutions and the those revolutions to our "New Left".

Then you demand I refute your unsupported assertion. I demand that you have differentiate the New Left from the Old Left and the various groupings within it and how the differ or not from the center.

You must define the Left and go forward. Your premise, your burden, and you have failed so far.

Oh please JAke you claim you're middle of the road, but you know everything about every political philosphy. You have never answered one question, you dont know about the French Revolution and you keep saying "rational" and "new left" but we get no examples and no definitions from the genius. I'm still waiting.......Or do you have anything?

 

[buckeye45_73]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

I doubt Franco realizes what day it is...

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

obama's a centrist compared to whom?

 

[buckeye45_73]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

obama's a centrist compared to whom?

Stalin or Hitler, it had to be said

 

[JakeStarkey]

buckeye claims he is GOP and very hard right. He believes that he like, Santorum, is the heart of the GOP. No, he is not, not even close, not anywhere near mainstream America or mainstream GOP. A true conservative is compassionate, and he made no apology to me for jumping me for being "late" (really?) in reply, or inquire as to the dying child's fate.

You made a claim, lumped everybody you do not like as Left, New Left, extreme left (the terms kept changing) but never told us what (1) the New Left is, (2) why it is the New Left, and how it applies to the problem, which you do not bother to identify, other than everything wrong in America is attributable to the "New Left".

You then rant about the French revolutions of 1789 and 1848, uses Marxian rhetoric (which you clearly donot understand), and fail to link Marx to the causes of the revolutions and the those revolutions to our "New Left".

Then you demand I refute your unsupported assertion. I demand that you have differentiate the New Left from the Old Left and the various groupings within it and how the differ or not from the center.

You must define the Left and go forward. Your premise, your burden, and you have failed so far.

Oh please JAke you claim you're middle of the road, but you know everything about every political philosphy. You have never answered one question, you dont know about the French Revolution and you keep saying "rational" and "new left" but we get no examples and no definitions from the genius. I'm still waiting.......Or do you have anything?

I am right of center, yes, and you are to the far, far right, yes.

I know clearly about the French Revolution, and that is what I was correcting you about.

You are the one who has to give the definitions and points clearly because you are the one making the affirmative point. The obligation is yours.

Really, don't thank me: I am glad to school you.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

buckeye claims he is GOP and very hard right. He believes that he like, Santorum, is the heart of the GOP. No, he is not, not even close, not anywhere near mainstream America or mainstream GOP. A true conservative is compassionate, and he made no apology to me for jumping me for being "late" (really?) in reply, or inquire as to the dying child's fate.

You made a claim, lumped everybody you do not like as Left, New Left, extreme left (the terms kept changing) but never told us what (1) the New Left is, (2) why it is the New Left, and how it applies to the problem, which you do not bother to identify, other than everything wrong in America is attributable to the "New Left".

You then rant about the French revolutions of 1789 and 1848, uses Marxian rhetoric (which you clearly donot understand), and fail to link Marx to the causes of the revolutions and the those revolutions to our "New Left".

Then you demand I refute your unsupported assertion. I demand that you have differentiate the New Left from the Old Left and the various groupings within it and how the differ or not from the center.

You must define the Left and go forward. Your premise, your burden, and you have failed so far.

Oh please JAke you claim you're middle of the road, but you know everything about every political philosphy. You have never answered one question, you dont know about the French Revolution and you keep saying "rational" and "new left" but we get no examples and no definitions from the genius. I'm still waiting.......Or do you have anything?

I am right of center, yes, and you are to the far, far right, yes.

I know clearly about the French Revolution, and that is what I was correcting you about.

You are the one who has to give the definitions and points clearly because you are the one making the affirmative point. The obligation is yours.

Really, don't thank me: I am glad to school you.

jokey anyone who has dealings with you know what you are. You are center anything. You are far left.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

I doubt Franco realizes what day it is...

Fascism can be either right wing or left wing totalitarian statism. Depends on the economic philosophy the leaders are pushing. bigreb and buckeye would be right wing statist fascists, forcing collaboration of government and business rather than nationalizing businesses and industries.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

I doubt Franco realizes what day it is...

Fascism can be either right wing or left wing totalitarian statism. Depends on the economic philosophy the leaders are pushing. bigreb and buckeye would be right wing statist fascists, forcing collaboration of government and business rather than nationalizing businesses and industries.

Jokey is an idiot. he so far left he makes bill aryes look like a centrist

 

[Flopper]

Ok, explain the rational left and the far left to me? I'm talking about as it is NOW. Not things like classical liberalism. I'm a conservative, that IS a classical liberal (hence I dont support monarchy and am for as much freedom as possible) Who is rational liberal and who is far left?

What's the point in labeling anyone according to ideologies such liberal or conservative. If you exclude the political junkies and pundits, most people have conservative views on some issue, liberal views on others and conflicting views on still other issues. We should evaluate solutions to our problems based on their own merit, without concern as to weather it passes some ideological litmus test.

Ideology is your point of view. Ok, people that have liberal and conservative views? MAybe on minor stuff, I suppose you could be against abortion and pro gay, but you really dont see it line up that way. Or you could be for massive taxes on the rich, but be against excessive regulation, but again, it doesnt usually line up that way.

I think my neighbor is quite typical of a very large segment of the American public. He loves the outdoors, hunts and fishes and is strongly against gun control yet he strongly supports environmental causes and government crackdown on polluters. He thinks taxes are too low on the wealthy and everyone should pay more. He favors a flat tax. He thinks government should cut back on entitlement spending. He against abortion but believes women should have some choice. He's OK with gay marriage, but wouldn't bother to sign a petition or vote for it. He thinks we should work a lot harder to secure our boarders but is against deportation for those that are contributing to society. I don't think he fits in any little ideological box. He's an American with differing views on different issues.

 

[francoHFW]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

You're a GD brainwashed ignoramus. Do some research, or enjoy hell.

 

[Peach]

The OP and the article are total fear monfering BULLSHYTTE. Obama is a pragmatic centrist. ACA reforms our ridiculously expensive health system without socializing ANYTHING, same with the rest of his ideas. Just intelligence and knowledge- stuff not seen from Pubs, just lies, hypocrisy, hate, and greed/cronyism. Pub dupes!

You do realise facism is a left wing ideology, correct?

No one can 'realize' that which is false. Fascism is the very end of the right wing spectrum; most large communist societies have become totalitarian, but that is not a reflection of ideology at the beginning, rather human frailty.