Is There A God?

[Mudda]

I have concluded that human kind, for some reason (to which I have opinions) feel a need to belong. They believe they have to belong to something or they have no meaning or purpose. Religion is one of the biggest drawers for those who seek to belong to something. Political parties is another. Both are free and it costs nothing to join and feel connected to other like believing human beings. A person can 'fellowship' with a church 'brother' or 'sister', or create vote for __ signs with their fellow politician adorers. Of course this doesn't just apply to religion and politics, it applies to anything in which people join and claim to belong to.

You have made a very astute observation. This is not only true today, but it is true since the beginning of mankind. Therefore, we can only conclude it is a part of man's nature. So the question becomes, why? The simplest answer is that man is compulsive. Think of it like height... some of us are tall and some of us are short but we all have some degree of height, right. Same thing for compulsion, we all have some degree of it. Some more than others. That's why some of us are alcoholics or drug addicts or workaholics or sex addicts, etc. Most of us though choose to worship ourselves. And therein lies the problem. When we worship ourselves we become self centric and are unable to see reality because we keep skewing it with our self centric bias.

So... in effect we all worship something because it is in our nature to do so. Most of us worship ourselves, most of us only see what we want to see and few of us see things for how they really are. The only choice we have is in choosing what we will worship. Choose wisely.

What a huge load of fartsmoke. YOU have the need to worship something and to follow a random set of rules.

I'm not trying to convince you. I couldn't care less what you think, say or do. At any point in our lives we are the sum of our choices. You live your life your way and I'll live my life my way. Fair enough?

You're choice is to be desperate to worship an invisible being that can't be proven, least of all by you. What a waste of time.

 

[ding]

You're choice is to be desperate to worship an invisible being that can't be proven, least of all by you. What a waste of time.

No. My choice is to live life to its fullest and not be a slave to meaningless pursuits such as making arguments against the beliefs of others.

 

[Divine Wind]

No, I'm not. I'm insisting that one cannot prove the existence of an all powerful being to a certainty, any more than I could prove the existence of magick to a certainty.

I've stated the same thing several times which is why it's a matter of faith, not science.

 

[Mudda]

No such thing has yet to be proven. Not even a very appealing theory.

So then my answer would have no meaning to you and therefore, your question is illogical.

So, you really think that there's an invisible being picking and choosing who's going to get into his club and who is going to the oven?

No. I believe that is our decision.

So you're afraid to answer because you know you can't logically justify it. Like a lot of other times. Got it.

No. I already explained this to you. You asked me if I believed in heaven. I asked you what heaven meant to you because I couldn't answer unless I understood what you thought heaven was. I can't say I believe in what you think it is unless you can tell me what you think it is. We might be talking about two different things. That's why when you told me that you didn't believe there was any such thing, it would have been illogical to tell you if I believed in heaven. You tell me what you believe heaven is and I can tell you if I believe in it. Fair enough? Now do you understand?

This is me outsmarting you. You don't have enough sand in your pants for these discussions.

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

 

[ding]

So you're afraid to answer because you know you can't logically justify it. Like a lot of other times. Got it.

No. I already explained this to you. You asked me if I believed in heaven. I asked you what heaven meant to you because I couldn't answer unless I understood what you thought heaven was. I can't say I believe in what you think it is unless you can tell me what you think it is. We might be talking about two different things. That's why when you told me that you didn't believe there was any such thing, it would have been illogical to tell you if I believed in heaven. You tell me what you believe heaven is and I can tell you if I believe in it. Fair enough? Now do you understand?

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.Got it.

Sure I can. That's not what you asked.

 

[Mudda]

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

 

[ding]

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

 

[Mudda]

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

 

[ding]

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

 

[Mudda]

So you can't even express what heaven means to you. Got it.

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

 

[Czernobog]

No, I'm not. I'm insisting that one cannot prove the existence of an all powerful being to a certainty, any more than I could prove the existence of magick to a certainty.

I've stated the same thing several times which is why it's a matter of faith, not science.

And in that we are in agreement. Also, as a matter of full disclosure, I should say that I do believe in divinity. I just reject the Christian conception of that divinity.

I do not believe that it is either omnipresent, nor omniscient. I also do not believe that it "demands" anything of creation. I do not believe divinity to be nearly so oppressive, nor petty. Nor do I believe it to be perfect. Pre-Christian societies recognised divinity to be capable of flaws, and even mistakes. So do I.

Sent from my 5054N using Tapatalk

 

[ding]

Sure I can.

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

Do you have another widely accepted scientific explanation for the beginning of Creation?

 

[Buck111]

I have concluded that human kind, for some reason (to which I have opinions) feel a need to belong. They believe they have to belong to something or they have no meaning or purpose. Religion is one of the biggest drawers for those who seek to belong to something. Political parties is another. Both are free and it costs nothing to join and feel connected to other like believing human beings. A person can 'fellowship' with a church 'brother' or 'sister', or create vote for __ signs with their fellow politician adorers. Of course this doesn't just apply to religion and politics, it applies to anything in which people join and claim to belong to.

You have made a very astute observation. This is not only true today, but it is true since the beginning of mankind. Therefore, we can only conclude it is a part of man's nature. So the question becomes, why? The simplest answer is that man is compulsive. Think of it like height... some of us are tall and some of us are short but we all have some degree of height, right. Same thing for compulsion, we all have some degree of it. Some more than others. That's why some of us are alcoholics or drug addicts or workaholics or sex addicts, etc. Most of us though choose to worship ourselves. And therein lies the problem. When we worship ourselves we become self centric and are unable to see reality because we keep skewing it with our self centric bias.

So... in effect we all worship something because it is in our nature to do so. Most of us worship ourselves, most of us only see what we want to see and few of us see things for how they really are. The only choice we have is in choosing what we will worship. We should all choose wisely.

I suspect it is conditioning and not nature that makes human beings feel a need to worship.

 

[Mudda]

Then go for it.

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

Do you have another widely accepted scientific explanation for the beginning of Creation?

So heaven for you is the singularity? That's where you want to go?

 

[ding]

I have concluded that human kind, for some reason (to which I have opinions) feel a need to belong. They believe they have to belong to something or they have no meaning or purpose. Religion is one of the biggest drawers for those who seek to belong to something. Political parties is another. Both are free and it costs nothing to join and feel connected to other like believing human beings. A person can 'fellowship' with a church 'brother' or 'sister', or create vote for __ signs with their fellow politician adorers. Of course this doesn't just apply to religion and politics, it applies to anything in which people join and claim to belong to.

You have made a very astute observation. This is not only true today, but it is true since the beginning of mankind. Therefore, we can only conclude it is a part of man's nature. So the question becomes, why? The simplest answer is that man is compulsive. Think of it like height... some of us are tall and some of us are short but we all have some degree of height, right. Same thing for compulsion, we all have some degree of it. Some more than others. That's why some of us are alcoholics or drug addicts or workaholics or sex addicts, etc. Most of us though choose to worship ourselves. And therein lies the problem. When we worship ourselves we become self centric and are unable to see reality because we keep skewing it with our self centric bias.

So... in effect we all worship something because it is in our nature to do so. Most of us worship ourselves, most of us only see what we want to see and few of us see things for how they really are. The only choice we have is in choosing what we will worship. We should all choose wisely.

I suspect it is conditioning and not nature that makes human beings feel a need to worship.

If that were the case it would not have been a constant throughout time.

 

[ding]

I've already told you what it is. Hell is being separated from God. Heaven is not being separated from God. All matter and energy was created when space and time were created. Every part of you was literally created when Creation was created. Heaven is just going home.

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

Do you have another widely accepted scientific explanation for the beginning of Creation?

So heaven for you is the singularity? That's where you want to go?

No. Not being separated from God is heaven. I thought we went through this already.

 

[Mudda]

Going home where? Got some proof of this "home" you speak of?

Where your matter came from. Do you need proof where your matter came from? Are the laws of physics not good enough for you?

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

Do you have another widely accepted scientific explanation for the beginning of Creation?

So heaven for you is the singularity? That's where you want to go?

No. Not being separated from God is heaven. I thought we went through this already.

You said "home" is "Where your matter came from". So matter came from not being separated from god?

 

[Buck111]

I have concluded that human kind, for some reason (to which I have opinions) feel a need to belong. They believe they have to belong to something or they have no meaning or purpose. Religion is one of the biggest drawers for those who seek to belong to something. Political parties is another. Both are free and it costs nothing to join and feel connected to other like believing human beings. A person can 'fellowship' with a church 'brother' or 'sister', or create vote for __ signs with their fellow politician adorers. Of course this doesn't just apply to religion and politics, it applies to anything in which people join and claim to belong to.

You have made a very astute observation. This is not only true today, but it is true since the beginning of mankind. Therefore, we can only conclude it is a part of man's nature. So the question becomes, why? The simplest answer is that man is compulsive. Think of it like height... some of us are tall and some of us are short but we all have some degree of height, right. Same thing for compulsion, we all have some degree of it. Some more than others. That's why some of us are alcoholics or drug addicts or workaholics or sex addicts, etc. Most of us though choose to worship ourselves. And therein lies the problem. When we worship ourselves we become self centric and are unable to see reality because we keep skewing it with our self centric bias.

So... in effect we all worship something because it is in our nature to do so. Most of us worship ourselves, most of us only see what we want to see and few of us see things for how they really are. The only choice we have is in choosing what we will worship. We should all choose wisely.

I suspect it is conditioning and not nature that makes human beings feel a need to worship.

If that were the case it would not have been a constant throughout time.

Maybe I should have said fear and conditioning. Fear of the unknown. Fear of death. Fear of no longer existing. I know of no other animal than the human animal who has these fears and a need for a god to rule them.

 

[Divine Wind]

You mean the singularity that exploded into the Big Bang? Or something else?

With the explosion of the Singularity, all space time began. "Let there be light". So what caused the Singularity? What was before (despite the fact there really isn't a "before" where the beginning of time is concerned. We just don't have the language to say otherwise)

Before the Oscillating Universe theory was disproved, it was plausible to think in terms of "always". Now we cannot. The Universe had a definite beginning and we know it will have a cold, endlessness which never ends. Why? What are the external forces that are causal to the origin of our Universe? Why do most people get a sense there is something beyond physical reality? Most meaning about 98% of the human population throughout history.

 

[Divine Wind]

And in that we are in agreement. Also, as a matter of full disclosure, I should say that I do believe in divinity. I just reject the Christian conception of that divinity.

I do not believe that it is either omnipresent, nor omniscient. I also do not believe that it "demands" anything of creation. I do not believe divinity to be nearly so oppressive, nor petty. Nor do I believe it to be perfect. Pre-Christian societies recognised divinity to be capable of flaws, and even mistakes. So do I.

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Thanks for the background. Again, it's a matter of faith, of belief. While you reject the Christian concept of divinity, do you also reject all other concepts? Except witchery, obviously.

Like the previous martial arts analogy, religion, IMHO, is simply a style, a path to same end: spiritual growth, if not enlightenment. Yes, some people misuse it just as some misuse witchcraft, cars, alcohol, guns and anything else. All are simply tools, a means to an end, but some people forget about the end.