It Was Done on Tobacco. It Can Be Done on Guns.

[dblack]

We have not banned smoking...only made is socially unacceptable and inconvenient.

Infringing rights doesn't require banning them. Using the law to make something 'unacceptable and inconvenient' counts too.

Social standards change. Not as many people hunt, NRA fear mongering is not as effective

Social standards are fine, as long as they aren't enforced by law. That's when rights are sacrificed.

 

[OldLady]

Lahkota the fake injun....real Indians defend the second amendment. Native culture is gun culture. Chief liekota wouldn't know about that.

The "real Indians" around here have Constitutions that do not incorporate a 2nd amendment. No mention of bearing arms as an individual right. I can't remember the last time there was a shooting on one of the reservations, either. Knives are a lot more common in a fight.

 

[rightwinger]

We have not banned smoking...only made is socially unacceptable and inconvenient

We are slowly doing the same thing with guns as the number or households owning guns has dropped significantly

You seriously believe that link and graph after everything you read in the news the past decade?


What do you smoke?


This is mo

The number of guns has gone up......more guns in your gun cabinet.
The number of households having those gun cabinets is decreasing

 

[SwimExpert]

By Dennis A. Henigan

The American people can overcome the gun lobby, but only if we confront, and expose, three myths that have long dominated the gun debate and given the politicians a ready excuse for inaction.

First, we must not let the opponents of reform get away with the empty bromide that "guns don't kill people, people kill people." Does any rational person really believe that the Sandy Hook killer could have murdered twenty-seven people in minutes with a knife or a baseball bat? Guns enable people to kill, more effectively and efficiently than any other widely available weapon.

Second, we must challenge the idea that no law can prevent violent people from getting guns. This canard is refuted by the experience of every other western industrialized nation. Their violent crime rates are comparable to ours. But their homicide rates are exponentially lower because their strong gun laws make it harder for violent individuals to get guns.

Third, we must not accept the notion that our Constitution condemns us to the continued slaughter of our children. It is true that the Supreme Court has expanded gun rights in recent years; it is equally true that the Court has insisted that the right allows for reasonable restrictions. In his opinion in the Heller Second Amendment case, Justice Scalia listed restrictions on "dangerous and unusual weapons" among the kinds of gun laws that are still "presumptively lawful." Assault weapons that fire scores of rounds without reloading surely are "dangerous and unusual."

The tobacco control movement overcame some equally powerful mythology to fundamentally alter American attitudes toward tobacco products. The tobacco industry's effort to sow confusion and uncertainty about the link between smoking and disease eventually was exposed as a fraud. The entrenched view that smoking was simply a bad habit that individuals can choose to break was destroyed by evidence that the tobacco companies knew that nicotine was powerfully addictive and engineered their cigarettes to ensure that people got hooked and stayed hooked. The assumption that smoking harms only the smoker was contradicted by the overwhelming evidence of the danger of second-hand smoke.

Once these myths were exposed, attitudes changed, policies changed and we started saving countless lives. Since youth smoking peaked in the mid-1990s, smoking rates have fallen by about three-fourths among 8th graders, two-thirds among 10th graders and half among 12th graders. A sea change has occurred on the tobacco issue.

Similarly fundamental change can come to the gun issue as well. The myths about gun control, however, still have a hold on too many of our political leaders and their constituents. We will hear them repeated again and again in the coming weeks of intense debate. Every time we hear them, we must respond and we must persuade.

There is too much at stake to be silent.

More: Dennis A. Henigan: It Was Done on Tobacco. It Can Be Done on Guns

No.

 

[rightwinger]

We got smoking down from 50% to under 20%
Households with guns are down from 50% to 33%

The culture of owning a gun has been diminishing

 

[dblack]

We got smoking down from 50% to under 20%
Households with guns are down from 50% to 33%

The culture of owning a gun has been diminishing

Yep. And that's a good thing. But we shouldn't let that get encoded into law.

Funny thing is, threatening gun rights actually works against that goal. Gun sales spike every time new legislation is proposed to limit their purchase. If we are secure in our rights to buy guns when needed, we don't need to keep a stockpile. On the other hand, a looming legislative threat provides incentive to buy and stash more guns now, rather than wait until later when they might become unavailable.

 

[rightwinger]

We got smoking down from 50% to under 20%
Households with guns are down from 50% to 33%

The culture of owning a gun has been diminishing

Yep. And that's a good thing. But we shouldn't let that get encoded into law.

Funny thing is, threatening gun rights actually works against that goal. Gun sales spike every time new legislation is proposed to limit their purchase. If we are secure in our rights to buy guns when needed, we don't need to keep a stockpile. On the other hand, a looming legislative threat provides incentive to buy and stash more guns now, rather than wait until later when they might become outlawed.

Not as many young boys are picking up the gun culture from their fathers. Not as many go hunting, there are not as many gun ranges, fewer places to go out and shoot your guns
Ammunition is becoming expensive. Costs money to go out and fire a couple dozen rounds

Same thing happened to cigarettes. They became more expensive, fewer places to smoke, parents are not passing down their smoking habit

 

[dblack]

We got smoking down from 50% to under 20%
Households with guns are down from 50% to 33%

The culture of owning a gun has been diminishing

Yep. And that's a good thing. But we shouldn't let that get encoded into law.

Funny thing is, threatening gun rights actually works against that goal. Gun sales spike every time new legislation is proposed to limit their purchase. If we are secure in our rights to buy guns when needed, we don't need to keep a stockpile. On the other hand, a looming legislative threat provides incentive to buy and stash more guns now, rather than wait until later when they might become outlawed.

Not as many young boys are picking up the gun culture from their fathers. Not as many go hunting, there are not as many gun ranges, fewer places to go out and shoot your guns
Ammunition is becoming expensive. Costs money to go out and fire a couple dozen rounds

Same thing happened to cigarettes. They became more expensive, fewer places to smoke, parents are not passing down their smoking habit

Again, all that's a good thing as long as it isn't enforced by law.

 

[koshergrl]

Lahkota the fake injun....real Indians defend the second amendment. Native culture is gun culture. Chief liekota wouldn't know about that.

The "real Indians" around here have Constitutions that do not incorporate a 2nd amendment. No mention of bearing arms as an individual right. I can't remember the last time there was a shooting on one of the reservations, either. Knives are a lot more common in a fight.

Indians are also American citizens. They have the right to bear arms regardless. And rez shootings are quite common. Particularly now the gangs have moved in.

 

[koshergrl]

Umatilla Reservation shooting victim identified

 

[koshergrl]

1 Dead in Shooting at Pala Indian Reservation

 

[mdk]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

 

[RandallFlagg]

Hardcore NRA wingnuts need to be thinking about two words: "Compromise" and "Consensus"...

Tell you what there Chief. You put your war bonnet on and come for my guns. Fuck you and your compromise and consensus.

You'll get your ass sent to the "happy hunting ground" faster than you can say "wampum".

Pay no attention to the Washington redskin... He too politically correct to have a spine.

Agreed. One would think that this Indian (if, indeed, he is that) would understand the importance of being able to stand up to a tyrannical power. I have nothing but absolute respect for the natives american Indians. Their problem? They gave up too quickly.

I was talking to the guys at the VFW last night and my good friend, the Sheriff of our little county (and a vet as well). We all see what is coming, in the event that one of these communists are elected president. It WILL mean the end of the country as we know it. We all agreed. You come for our guns - of course the LEO will get them. But at what cost? Someone has to come through the door first. And, the idea of LEO attempting to enforce an unconstitutional executive order - or knowing that the Constitution has been "gutted" - well, I just can't see it happening.

 

[OldLady]

1 Dead in Shooting at Pala Indian Reservation

You're on the West coast, yes?

Lahkota the fake injun....real Indians defend the second amendment. Native culture is gun culture. Chief liekota wouldn't know about that.

The "real Indians" around here have Constitutions that do not incorporate a 2nd amendment. No mention of bearing arms as an individual right. I can't remember the last time there was a shooting on one of the reservations, either. Knives are a lot more common in a fight.

Indians are also American citizens. They have the right to bear arms regardless. And rez shootings are quite common. Particularly now the gangs have moved in.

Sorry to hear about gangs getting involved out there. Never good news. Neither of the articles you linked me were evidence for your argument, though. Neither the shooter nor the victim that died was a tribal member in Umatilla shooting; they found a man dead on the rez in Pala, but have no idea who the shooter was.

 

[rightwinger]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

 

[mdk]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

And I'll fight you every step of the way.

 

[rightwinger]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

And I'll fight you every step of the way.

Public opinion is turning against you.....Gun ownership is on the decline

What do you care? You still got your guns don't you?

 

[mdk]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

And I'll fight you every step of the way.

Public opinion is turning against you.....Gun ownership is on the decline

What do you care? You still got your guns don't you?

I do, and so should other Americans.

 

[rightwinger]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

And I'll fight you every step of the way.

Public opinion is turning against you.....Gun ownership is on the decline

What do you care? You still got your guns don't you?

I do, and so should other Americans.

You fuss too much

All gun nuts do

 

[mdk]

Smoking isn't a right; owning a gun on other hand...

I can't believe this needs to be explained to people. Wait...yes, I can. lol

Doesn't matter...same tactics can be used against both

Make gun ownership as socially irresponsible as smoking

And I'll fight you every step of the way.

Public opinion is turning against you.....Gun ownership is on the decline

What do you care? You still got your guns don't you?

I do, and so should other Americans.

You fuss too much

All gun nuts do

So now I am gun nut?! Too funny. Good luck in your crusade, you'll certainly need it. lol