It will be Republican Chuck Hagel 4 Defense Secretary: Whoo Hoo! Fight is on.

[Procrustes Stretched]

By AMBASSADOR MICHAEL GUEST | 1/6/13 9:09 PM EST

Why, then, should any of us freeze-frame Hagel’s comments 15 years ago — even as many of us, gay and straight, gladly acknowledge that America’s understanding of, and attitudes toward, sexual orientation and gender identity are changing rapidly?
...

I consider Hormel both a trailblazer and a mentor. Three years after his nomination, I became our country’s first openly gay Senate-confirmed ambassador. At the time, a number of people commented to me or, more often, behind my back that I shouldn’t serve as America’s face to the world for no other reason than I am gay.
...

Like Hagel’s apology to Hormel, many of these voices subsequently have admitted that they were wrong.
...

I cannot claim I know Hagel well. But as a career diplomat, I had occasions to work with him and his staff. In that work, I found Hagel to be a man of integrity — honest and direct in his assessments and willing to seek common ground.

He was true to his word. And if Hagel says he would fully implement the repeal of “don’t ask, don’t tell,” I take him at his word.

Don't judge Chuck Hagel by 1998 comment - Ambassador Michael Guest - POLITICO.com

"Hagel opposed the nomination on grounds that Hormel is “aggressively gay” — for which Hagel has since apologized. Hormel has accepted that apology and seems willing to move on."

i know that's what ambassador guest said. and i heard chuck todd say that this morning. but this is the last i heard from hormel, himself:

James Hormel: I question the sincerity of Chuck Hagel’s ‘so-called apology’

*snip*

But in an interview this afternoon, the target of the 1998 slur, leading gay philanthropist James Hormel, told me he never received an apology from Hagel himself, questioned the sincerity of the apology, and said the incident should still raise questions about whether Hagel is the right man to oversee the repeal of don’t ask don’t tell.

“I have not received an apology,” Hormel, who is a major figure in Democratic politics, told me. “I thought this so-called apology, which I haven’t received, but which was made public, had the air of being a defensive move on his part.” Hormel added that the apology appeared to have been given “only in service of his attempt to get the nomination.”

James Hormel: I question the sincerity of Chuck Hagel’s ‘so-called apology’

I would understand Hormel not being the most unbiased here...but a outspoken gay ambassador who has worked with Hagel yet is no personal friend of his has vouched for him

If that isn't good enough for people then people who feel that way will never see progress in others views of gays.


and btw, is Hormel now saying he accepts the apology but thinks it is a false one? not very diplomatic, is it? sounds catty and queenie if you ask me

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

A politician apologizes for a comment that could hurt him politically. Whoda thunk it possible?

How did that work out for Trent Lott?

Forgiveness is a one way street depending on political winds

 

[Ravi]

I certainly don't hate Israel. I just do not view Israel as any more special than any of our other allies, whether it's Britain, Japan, Canada, etc. But they wield outsized influence over this country that our other allies do not. And we get very little out of the relationship.

What sort of outsized influence are you talking about?

I don't remember huge coverage and outrage from FOX Newsertainment over whether Obama was going to make time to meet the Japanese PM, or whether Obama's outreach to China was a slap in the face of Japan.

Feel free to change those countries to South Korea/North Korea if you do not believe that Japan has faced a constant threat from China (they have).

FOX has always used Israel as a tool.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

I certainly don't hate Israel. I just do not view Israel as any more special than any of our other allies, whether it's Britain, Japan, Canada, etc. But they wield outsized influence over this country that our other allies do not. And we get very little out of the relationship.

What sort of outsized influence are you talking about?

I don't remember huge coverage and outrage from FOX Newsertainment over whether Obama was going to make time to meet the Japanese PM, or whether Obama's outreach to China was a slap in the face of Japan.

Feel free to change those countries to South Korea/North Korea if you do not believe that Japan has faced a constant threat from China (they have).

Of course Israel has outsized influence and a special relationship with the US. Good gawd, defenders of Israel need to stop denying this and state why the special relationship exists.

I am a huge supporter of Israel. I know that Israel is unlike any other nation. It is a nation we helped create. It is a nation we have a love hate relationship with. It is surrounded by people who vow to throw it into the sea.

Nations are created all the time throughout history. What makes Israel's creation so different is religion and place. The holy land. Israel was created along with an Arab state in the Palestine. The Arab world rejected reality at the time...

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

What sort of outsized influence are you talking about?

I don't remember huge coverage and outrage from FOX Newsertainment over whether Obama was going to make time to meet the Japanese PM, or whether Obama's outreach to China was a slap in the face of Japan.

Feel free to change those countries to South Korea/North Korea if you do not believe that Japan has faced a constant threat from China (they have).

FOX has always used Israel as a tool.

FOX uses Israel as a tool. So what? Supporters of Israel cross all lines and boundaries

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

A politician apologizes for a comment that could hurt him politically. Whoda thunk it possible?

How did that work out for Trent Lott?

Forgiveness is a one way street depending on political winds

Trent Lott's issues where not 15 years old. He had a pattern that he could not shake. The man is a product of his environment...white, racist, southern, crackerhood.

Not saying he is one, but he grew up in it and it influenced his passions and habits and outlook.

compare Trent to Jimmy Carter


next

 

[Katzndogz]

Trent Lott commented on an issue that happened in 1948. It was considerably older than 15 years.

Nominating Chuck Hagel was a message to republicans that obama wants republicans to be more like Hagel, anti American, dedicating to reducing the military, and supportive of middle eastern terrorism.

 

[GoneBezerk]

obamination likes a wolf in sheep's clothing.

Hagel is for slashing the DoD budget, but most Americans are clueless about that and his anti-Israel comments.

obamination will just claim the GOP is a bunch of radicals for opposing another GOP member for SecDef and most idiot voters will lap it up.

Trent Lott commented on an issue that happened in 1948. It was considerably older than 15 years.

Nominating Chuck Hagel was a message to republicans that obama wants republicans to be more like Hagel, anti American, dedicating to reducing the military, and supportive of middle eastern terrorism.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Trent Lott commented on an issue that happened in 1948. It was considerably older than 15 years.

Nominating Chuck Hagel was a message to republicans that obama wants republicans to be more like Hagel, anti American, dedicating to reducing the military, and supportive of middle eastern terrorism.

Trent Lott's comments were current and he had a difficult time convincing people he was not sympathetic with racists. Lott was not castigated for what happened in 1948.

He became Senate Majority Leader, then fell from power after praising Strom Thurmond's 1948 segregationist Dixiecrat presidential bid.

As majority leader, Lott had a major role in the Senate trial following the impeachment of President Bill Clinton. After the House narrowly voted to impeach Clinton, Lott proceeded with the Senate trial in early 1999, despite criticisms that Republicans were far short of the two-thirds majority required under the Constitution to convict Clinton and remove him from office. He later agreed to a decision to suspend the proceedings after the Senate voted not to convict Clinton. Wikipedia Trent Lott

It is probably true that Lott is not as racist or even a racist at heart, but he did have a history of seeming to condone racism right up until he was attacked.

 

[jillian]

"Hagel opposed the nomination on grounds that Hormel is “aggressively gay” — for which Hagel has since apologized. Hormel has accepted that apology and seems willing to move on."

i know that's what ambassador guest said. and i heard chuck todd say that this morning. but this is the last i heard from hormel, himself:

James Hormel: I question the sincerity of Chuck Hagel’s ‘so-called apology’

*snip*

But in an interview this afternoon, the target of the 1998 slur, leading gay philanthropist James Hormel, told me he never received an apology from Hagel himself, questioned the sincerity of the apology, and said the incident should still raise questions about whether Hagel is the right man to oversee the repeal of don’t ask don’t tell.

“I have not received an apology,” Hormel, who is a major figure in Democratic politics, told me. “I thought this so-called apology, which I haven’t received, but which was made public, had the air of being a defensive move on his part.” Hormel added that the apology appeared to have been given “only in service of his attempt to get the nomination.”

James Hormel: I question the sincerity of Chuck Hagel’s ‘so-called apology’

I would understand Hormel not being the most unbiased here...but a outspoken gay ambassador who has worked with Hagel yet is no personal friend of his has vouched for him

If that isn't good enough for people then people who feel that way will never see progress in others views of gays.

and btw, is Hormel now saying he accepts the apology but thinks it is a false one? not very diplomatic, is it? sounds catty and queenie if you ask me

again, i haven't heard one way or the other whether hormel changed his mind. i was simply pointing out what i knew.

as for 'good enough'. it's a funny thing about that. my understanding of my religion is that it is only for the wronged party to forgive. no one can offer forgiveness for them. so the wrong has to be righted with the person aggrieved in the first instance.

 

[Stephanie]

Pretty funny seeing the left coming to the Republicans rescue...

we know the only reason is that the Dear Leader nominated him..

so transparent

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Pretty funny seeing the left coming to the Republicans rescue...

we know the only reason is that the Dear Leader nominated him..

so transparent

Don't judge Chuck Hagel by 1998 comment
By: Ambassador Michael Guest
January 6, 2013 09:09 PM EST

As an openly gay career Foreign Service officer and former ambassador, I find it disappointing that the debate over Chuck Hagel’s potential nomination as defense secretary has been sideswiped over — let’s face it — flatly intolerant comments Hagel made half a generation ago.

I cannot claim I know Hagel well. But as a career diplomat, I had occasions to work with him and his staff. In that work, I found Hagel to be a man of integrity — honest and direct in his assessments and willing to seek common ground.

He was true to his word. And if Hagel says he would fully implement the repeal of “don’t ask, don’t tell,” I take him at his word.

Our LGBT community should care deeply, of course, about that issue. Should President Barack Obama decide to nominate him to serve our country at the Pentagon, as is widely reported, Hagel should be closely questioned on precisely his leadership to ensure fairness for gay and lesbian military personnel and their families.

While Hagel’s Senate votes on lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues were hardly perfect, they are not reasons to oppose his nomination for defense secretary — especially under the clear leadership of a president who supports LGBT equality goal

Don't judge Chuck Hagel by 1998 comment - POLITICO.com Print View

 

[Truthseeker420]

Poor Republicans were hoping to get Scott Brown back in Congress. GOP just can't win.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

i know that's what ambassador guest said. and i heard chuck todd say that this morning. but this is the last i heard from hormel, himself:



James Hormel: I question the sincerity of Chuck Hagel’s ‘so-called apology’

I would understand Hormel not being the most unbiased here...but a outspoken gay ambassador who has worked with Hagel yet is no personal friend of his has vouched for him

If that isn't good enough for people then people who feel that way will never see progress in others views of gays.

and btw, is Hormel now saying he accepts the apology but thinks it is a false one? not very diplomatic, is it? sounds catty and queenie if you ask me

again, i haven't heard one way or the other whether hormel changed his mind. i was simply pointing out what i knew.

as for 'good enough'. it's a funny thing about that. my understanding of my religion is that it is only for the wronged party to forgive. no one can offer forgiveness for them. so the wrong has to be righted with the person aggrieved in the first instance.

It's about moving forward. As Ambassador Guest so eloquently states "I cannot claim I know Hagel well. But as a career diplomat, I had occasions to work with him and his staff. In that work, I found Hagel to be a man of integrity — honest and direct in his assessments and willing to seek common ground. He was true to his word. And if Hagel says he would fully implement the repeal of “don’t ask, don’t tell,” I take him at his word."

Our LGBT community should care deeply, of course, about that issue. Should President Barack Obama decide to nominate him to serve our country at the Pentagon, as is widely reported, Hagel should be closely questioned on precisely his leadership to ensure fairness for gay and lesbian military personnel and their families.

While Hagel’s Senate votes on lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues were hardly perfect, they are not reasons to oppose his nomination for defense secretary — especially under the clear leadership of a president who supports LGBT equality goals.

The LGBT community, together with all Americans, should care that the secretary of defense pursue all conceivable peaceful options before putting the lives of American men and women at risk.

We should want a defense secretary with international stature and the trust and confidence of the president — both essential elements to effectiveness in this difficult job.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/dont-judge-chuck-hagel-by-1998-comment-85806.html

 

[GoneBezerk]

Idiot...Brown is a MA resident, he doesn't live in NE where Hagel came from.

Oh, you think this is like the NFL where the GOP can send Brown to the NE franchise.....because you are that stupid.

Poor Republicans were hoping to get Scott Brown back in Congress. GOP just can't win.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Idiot...Brown is a MA resident, he doesn't live in NE where Hagel came from.

Oh, you think this is like the NFL where the GOP can send Brown to the NE franchise.....because you are that stupid.

Poor Republicans were hoping to get Scott Brown back in Congress. GOP just can't win.

That's why I said poor Republicans. They were wanting Kerry to get picked for the Secretary of Defense so a seat would open up in MA.

You really should think before calling someone stupid.

 

[Synthaholic]

They don't have to, they want to as they are courting votes. Just like they speak to the NAACP and other groups.

Speaking at other groups is more of a partisan nature & they don't represent foreign countries. This is not so w/ the other lobby. It is mandatory/a death knell for the campaign if you don't go suck up to them because of the role of $ in American politics.

I admit it. I put America, and her interests, first.

Do you feel the same way about Greek and Armenian lobbys? Israel certainly isn't the only "foreign power" that has lobby groups in the USA nor is it the only one that effects our foreign policy.

The problem being is that the ONLY foreign lobby group I see lefties criticizing is the one that supports Israel. Certainly you can see why this would cause people to label others anti-semitic.

btw, Jillian is an America-firster. Not that there is anything wrong with being an Israel-firster but get your facts straight.

For the record, I am adamantly opposed to the outsized strength of those two foreign lobbies, also. Both have used their considerable influence to put wedges and roadblocks against closer U.S. relations with Türkiye. They both have enormous influence in California and Hollywood, also. In fact, about 10-15 years ago the son of Lawrence Olivier (I'm pretty sure it was him...) was putting together an epic movie about the life of The Great Man, Kemal Mustapha Ataturk, which was to star Antonio Banderas (which is inspired casting - he would have been perfect). Those two lobbies (especially the Hellenic lobby) squashed it, with Banderas and wife Melanie Griffith actually receiving death threats, which scared the shit out of them.

 

[jillian]

I would understand Hormel not being the most unbiased here...but a outspoken gay ambassador who has worked with Hagel yet is no personal friend of his has vouched for him

If that isn't good enough for people then people who feel that way will never see progress in others views of gays.

and btw, is Hormel now saying he accepts the apology but thinks it is a false one? not very diplomatic, is it? sounds catty and queenie if you ask me

again, i haven't heard one way or the other whether hormel changed his mind. i was simply pointing out what i knew.

as for 'good enough'. it's a funny thing about that. my understanding of my religion is that it is only for the wronged party to forgive. no one can offer forgiveness for them. so the wrong has to be righted with the person aggrieved in the first instance.

It's about moving forward. As Ambassador Guest so eloquently states "I cannot claim I know Hagel well. But as a career diplomat, I had occasions to work with him and his staff. In that work, I found Hagel to be a man of integrity — honest and direct in his assessments and willing to seek common ground. He was true to his word. And if Hagel says he would fully implement the repeal of “don’t ask, don’t tell,” I take him at his word."

Our LGBT community should care deeply, of course, about that issue. Should President Barack Obama decide to nominate him to serve our country at the Pentagon, as is widely reported, Hagel should be closely questioned on precisely his leadership to ensure fairness for gay and lesbian military personnel and their families.

While Hagel’s Senate votes on lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues were hardly perfect, they are not reasons to oppose his nomination for defense secretary — especially under the clear leadership of a president who supports LGBT equality goals.

The LGBT community, together with all Americans, should care that the secretary of defense pursue all conceivable peaceful options before putting the lives of American men and women at risk.

We should want a defense secretary with international stature and the trust and confidence of the president — both essential elements to effectiveness in this difficult job.

Don't judge Chuck Hagel by 1998 comment - Ambassador Michael Guest - POLITICO.com

i just think there were better choices to be made.

 

[Synthaholic]

The only one I've heard talk about his vet record is you Sallow. Stop projecting

Projected what?

This isn't something new. Conservatives have smeared the war records of vets they don't like. From John Kerry to Tammy Duckworth.

Look what they did to Max Cleland.

 

[jillian]

The only one I've heard talk about his vet record is you Sallow. Stop projecting

Projected what?

This isn't something new. Conservatives have smeared the war records of vets they don't like. From John Kerry to Tammy Duckworth.

Look what they did to Max Cleland.

that was an atrocity.

a triple amputee and they merged his face with osama bin laden.

disgusting.