Joe the Plumber says sorry about your kids but

[TooTall]

The right wingers care more about their guns than about saving lives. That is apparent.

We are emotionally involved with our knives as well.

 

[JoeB131]

[

So preventing someone from stealing your wallet somehow doesn't count as preventing a crime? Does a rape victim chasing off an assailant not count either?

And why are we going to eliminate all crimes prevented with guns and only count homicides with guns for our rational in determining the value of having a gun? That's kind stupid.

Also, by your own guidelines, guns used to prevent any harm to yourself are not only discounted but the fact you didn't kill the assailant also counts against you as a reason to own one.

If you didn't need to kill the assailant, he probably wasn't that dangerous to start with.

Here's the real problem. when your figures are 65,000 to 2 million DGU (Defensive Gun Usages), then you have a definition that is statistically meaningless.

So I discount the, "My gun made me feel brave" along side "my gun allowed me to terrorize my old lady and kids". I don't count either.

Compared to ones that result in a dead body. 201 dead bodies that had it coming.

32,000 who didn't.

Not worth it.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Hey, you don't get to move the goalposts because you had your ass handed to you.

Some guy may have killed you for your wallet, joe.
And yes, a gun can make your house safer.....too bad you didn't read the article I sourced regarding home invasions....oh what's the use, I'm not here to fix stupid, that's up to your family.

Having read your three posts in this discussion, you really don't have a clue with what your talking about.

Yeah, I don't read articles from the Gun Nutters telling you you need a gun.

Fact is, if there were real value to gun ownership, the NRA wouldn't be telling congress to shut down gun studies.

They'd be supporting those gun studies and trumpetting the data on Main Street.

 

[Meister]

[

Hey, you don't get to move the goalposts because you had your ass handed to you.

Some guy may have killed you for your wallet, joe.
And yes, a gun can make your house safer.....too bad you didn't read the article I sourced regarding home invasions....oh what's the use, I'm not here to fix stupid, that's up to your family.

Having read your three posts in this discussion, you really don't have a clue with what your talking about.

Yeah, I don't read articles from the Gun Nutters telling you you need a gun.

Fact is, if there were real value to gun ownership, the NRA wouldn't be telling congress to shut down gun studies.

They'd be supporting those gun studies and trumpetting the data on Main Street.

Deny facts all you want, guns have helped far more than they have hurt. Now go seek some help.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

[

So preventing someone from stealing your wallet somehow doesn't count as preventing a crime? Does a rape victim chasing off an assailant not count either?

And why are we going to eliminate all crimes prevented with guns and only count homicides with guns for our rational in determining the value of having a gun? That's kind stupid.

Also, by your own guidelines, guns used to prevent any harm to yourself are not only discounted but the fact you didn't kill the assailant also counts against you as a reason to own one.

If you didn't need to kill the assailant, he probably wasn't that dangerous to start with.

Here's the real problem. when your figures are 65,000 to 2 million DGU (Defensive Gun Usages), then you have a definition that is statistically meaningless.

So I discount the, "My gun made me feel brave" along side "my gun allowed me to terrorize my old lady and kids". I don't count either.

Compared to ones that result in a dead body. 201 dead bodies that had it coming.

32,000 who didn't.

Not worth it.

So you still discount the possession of a firearm as being the primary reason, possibly the only one, that chased off an assailant. The gun did the job but you seem to think it could have been done with what exactly? A rape whistle, hashtag on Twitter (I know you people are all about hashtags), maybe a facebook post, or as a last result finger guns.

What made this asshole run away was a gun, not one of your fantasies eliminates that option but an actual fucking gun. Your criminal was rendered not dangerous because the victim over powered him, with a gun. He wouldn't have attacked if he was worried about a Facebook post.

No our definition is just fine. You're the one trying to make the actual realities meaningless by putting restrictions on what can be defined as a gun defense.

I'm pretty sure nobody here is going to defend terrorizing your old lady with a gun as defense. Now if she pulled one on him and chased him off we would but since she didn't kill him you would discount this as some kind of gun escalation on her part. Nice job giving the criminals the high ground here.

I'm still trying to think of why the 32,000 that didn't deserve to die also didn't deserve at least a fighting chance to fight back. But I do see how this could happen with the anti-gun crowd. A disarmed person has the survival rate of being attacked of about what? Zero? I'm not sure of where your numbers come from but just using the basics you have provided 201 people if armed have all lived?. Actually, were all of the people that survived armed? How many of the 32,000 that died were armed? How many of the 201 weren't armed?

So if take a group of 32,201 people, train and arm 201 of them then let the criminals in to attack them you are telling me there will be 32,000 dead and 201 armed people will walk out of this scenario right?

So your solution isn't to arm the 32,000 dead, it's to disarm the 201 that survived because...well, I'm not sure why you think this.

 

[Unkotare]

The way I see it if that guy decided to walk around defenseless that it was his choice to be defenseless and to depend on the cops to protect him. I would call the cops for him but that's about it.

Why am I not surprised at this coming from the likes of you?

My concealed carry permit is for self defense .

It should be, but in your case it sounds like it's a prosthetic that's not getting the job done. You're still dickless. There's a whole range of options between pulling your gun, closing your eyes and firing randomly in a panic while you scream like a little girl, and crawling away on your belly while someone - who might be vulnerable and might be a victim of random violence - gets beat up. It's clear from your comments that the permit hasn't made you any less of a pussy. Being a spineless coward does not equate to 'individualism,' champ.

You're pathetic. Go buy a pit bull and a monster truck as well; Mr. Wee-wee ain't gettin' any bigger regardless.

 

[Unkotare]

Why am I not surprised at this coming from the likes of you?

My concealed carry permit is for self defense not public defense.

If you choose to be defenseless should you not live with the consequences?

The way I see it I am respecting your decisions to depend on the cops to protect you so I'll call them for you and hope they show up in time to save you.

I think Unko misread your intention.

I think I've read his character quite clearly. It's a determination based on more than that one post.

 

[Politico]

[

Joe, you never cease to be entertaining with your two step spin.

You stated that "guns are almost never used to foil a crime".
I clearly gave credible evidence to refute your statement.
You come back with some FBI homicide figure.
So I can only assume that you think that the only crime there is, is homicide.
A very poor attempt of deflection on your behalf.

Uh, no, guy, the homicide stat is the only one that really matters here.

Not "Some guy asked me for my wallet and I chased him off with a gun'. that's not a good enough reason to let you have a gun.

How many times were guns used to prevent great bodily harm by killing the offender.

Not many, accordding to the FBI.

This is the load of shit the NRA sells you fools. The Gun makes your home less safe, not more safe.

Ir doesn't matter how many you deem is enough.

 

[September]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

 

[Noomi]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

But that is why people go and shoot up other people. They have access to this shit.

 

[ScienceRocks]

I am sorry you wish the government to be the only one with access to this shit. You must have more trust in the government than I.

 

[September]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

But that is why people go and shoot up other people. They have access to this shit.

I understand why you feel that way, but some of us would just rather own firearms. Murder existed long before guns came around. Firearms also give some people a sense of security and insurance, in case things get really bad.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Why am I not surprised at this coming from the likes of you?

My concealed carry permit is for self defense .

It should be, but in your case it sounds like it's a prosthetic that's not getting the job done. You're still dickless. There's a whole range of options between pulling your gun, closing your eyes and firing randomly in a panic while you scream like a little girl, and crawling away on your belly while someone - who might be vulnerable and might be a victim of random violence - gets beat up. It's clear from your comments that the permit hasn't made you any less of a pussy. Being a spineless coward does not equate to 'individualism,' champ.

You're pathetic. Go buy a pit bull and a monster truck as well; Mr. Wee-wee ain't gettin' any bigger regardless.

Stop thinking about my penis. You're skeeving me out.

If you or anyone wants to be defenseless that's your choice.
If you would rather have the cops protect you than protect yourself that's your choice and I respect that if you can't live with that then maybe you should learn to defend yourself.

 

[Anathema]

But that is why people go and shoot up other people. They have access to this shit.

So you would rather have seen this guy build a gas-fertilizer bomb and leave it outside a sorority house, taking 2-3 dozen co-eds out instead? You do realize that's the alternative for nuts like him, right?

 

[JoeB131]

[

So you still discount the possession of a firearm as being the primary reason, possibly the only one, that chased off an assailant. The gun did the job but you seem to think it could have been done with what exactly? A rape whistle, hashtag on Twitter (I know you people are all about hashtags), maybe a facebook post, or as a last result finger guns.

What made this asshole run away was a gun, not one of your fantasies eliminates that option but an actual fucking gun. Your criminal was rendered not dangerous because the victim over powered him, with a gun. He wouldn't have attacked if he was worried about a Facebook post.

Guy, one more time. Other industrialized nations don't let average citizens have guns, they don't have any more crime than we do and in most cases, they have less.

Japanese women can walk down city streets at night alone without any worry about being raped. American women can't say the same.

[
No our definition is just fine. You're the one trying to make the actual realities meaningless by putting restrictions on what can be defined as a gun defense.

I'm pretty sure nobody here is going to defend terrorizing your old lady with a gun as defense. Now if she pulled one on him and chased him off we would but since she didn't kill him you would discount this as some kind of gun escalation on her part. Nice job giving the criminals the high ground here.

Guy, one more time "criminals" aren't the problem. Most people who are killed with guns either kill themselves or are killed by someone they know. This is why a gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill a household member than a Criminal.

[
I'm still trying to think of why the 32,000 that didn't deserve to die also didn't deserve at least a fighting chance to fight back. But I do see how this could happen with the anti-gun crowd. A disarmed person has the survival rate of being attacked of about what? Zero? I'm not sure of where your numbers come from but just using the basics you have provided 201 people if armed have all lived?. Actually, were all of the people that survived armed? How many of the 32,000 that died were armed? How many of the 201 weren't armed?

Well, of the 32,000 gun deaths. 19,000 were suicides. A gun made killing themselves easy. Another 800 of htose were accidents. LIttle Billy found Grandpa's gun on the nightstand. So really, ban private gun ownership, you've already cut that death rate by about 20,000. Of the 11,000 homicides, 80% of those are cases where the victim and killer know each other.

[
So if take a group of 32,201 people, train and arm 201 of them then let the criminals in to attack them you are telling me there will be 32,000 dead and 201 armed people will walk out of this scenario right?

So your solution isn't to arm the 32,000 dead, it's to disarm the 201 that survived because...well, I'm not sure why you think this.

You know, guy, I know you are pissing yourself over the thought of "Criminals".

But here's the thing. America has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world and we lock up more prisoners than any country in the world.

So with all these guns and prisons, why are you always so afraid?

I for one, and tired of watching a huge body count because of your irrational fears.

 

[JoeB131]

[q
Deny facts all you want, guns have helped far more than they have hurt. Now go seek some help.

If that were the case, the NRA wouldn't have gotten Congress to prevent the CDC from doing gun studies.

But the CDC did the Kellerman study, and Holy Shit, a gun in the home is 43 times more likely to kill a family member! We can't let THAT get out! It'll hurt sales!

 

[JoeB131]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

Yeah, because clearly, 32,000 needless gun deaths a year are clearly not enough.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

Yeah, because clearly, 32,000 needless gun deaths a year are clearly not enough.

That figure includes suicides and we all know suicides don't count because suicide is not illegal

Of the remainder of gun deaths 80% are gang related and have nothing to do with the average gun owner.

Why don't you focus your "outrage" and desire for control on the people who are actually causing the carnage and leave the rest of the people alone?

 

[JoeB131]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

Yeah, because clearly, 32,000 needless gun deaths a year are clearly not enough.

That figure includes suicides and we all know suicides don't count because suicide is not illegal

Of the remainder of gun deaths 80% are gang related and have nothing to do with the average gun owner.

Why don't you focus your "outrage" and desire for control on the people who are actually causing the carnage and leave the rest of the people alone?

The ones causing the carnage are the NRA and the gun industry.

OTher countries have figured this out. Average citizens don't need guns.


But Americans are like the class retard who writes down "2+2=Cat" and thinks he's clever while the other kids snicker at him.

 

[Iceweasel]

Are people really complaining about other people owning firearms? If you don't wanna use them, fine. But why get into other people's business and complain about their right to own them? In all honesty, everyone should keep multiple firearms and plenty of ammo at home.

But that is why people go and shoot up other people. They have access to this shit.

You're a liar. I have quick immediate access to numerous options and have never went out to shoot anyone and have no plans to.