Justifiable use of deadly force or not?

[westwall]

Maybe. The Statute of limitations on Murder is FOREVER. If the AG's office determines at ANY TIME, in the future, that there is probable cause for a murder charge, they can file one.

Already adjudicated by a judge.

Murder has no Statute of Limitations dude.

 

[OODA_Loop]

I believe the guy was in his rights to shoot the dude but I really dont believe it was necessary.

I avoid interaction with people unless I know them.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Murder has no Statute of Limitations dude.

This matter is closed by court action and charging would be double jeopardy, um dude.

 

[sealybobo]

“Pretty sure”?

A Florida man fatally shot another over a parking space — and it was legal. Here’s why.

Gunman in parking space shooting not charged because of 'Stand Your Ground' law

WATCH: Pinellas County Sheriff says no charges for 'Stand Your Ground' shooter

Then you have this one....
Stand Your Ground: Shooter in parking space dispute will not be arrested

From your link...

This will go to the state attorney. Drejka will not be charged [and] will not be arrested by us," Sheriff Gualtieri said. "The state attorney will review it and either he’ll concur or not. And, if he concurs, then there’ll be no charge. Period. If he doesn’t concur, then he’ll make a determination as to what to do with it. And, if he feels like he can overcome that heavy burden at a Stand Your Ground hearing of proving by clear and convincing evidence that Drejka was not entitled to use force in this circumstance, then that’s the state attorney’s determination to make."

Why do you think I said then you have this one?

Seems the Sheriff has decided not to charge him based on his interpretation of Stand your Ground

The State Attorney May interpret differently and respond to public pressure

While the DA may pursue charges they have to prove the guy wasnt in fear for his life.
Pretty tough case to make.

They can’t prove if he was afraid. Of course he was. But was it justifiable homocide? No.

If you’re attacking me and I pull a gun and you stop, I can’t shoot

 

[OODA_Loop]

Take away: You can shoot someone COM and they can still continue the attack.

Bet it was .380(acp)

 

[westwall]

Murder has no Statute of Limitations dude.

This matter is closed by court action and charging would be double jeopardy, um dude.

It can't be double jeopardy because he hasn't been to trial yet. Where the hell did you learn your legalese? A Cracker Jack box?

 

[OODA_Loop]

If you’re attacking me and I pull a gun and you stop, I can’t shoot

Not necessarily.

 

[OODA_Loop]

It can't be double jeopardy because he hasn't been to trial yet. Where the hell did you learn your legalese? A Cracker Jack box?

SYG hearing in front of judge adjudicated the matter.

This wasnt prosecutors not pressing charges - this matter went to court.

 

[rightwinger]

So as long as your afraid, your justified in taking another mans life? Taking another mans life is dependent on your emotional state?

The guy assaulted him.
Play stupid games win stupid prizes.

Would it be ok for a child to do this on the play ground? Since when does the punishment for assault involve the DEATH PENALTY? Has anyone ever been given the death penalty for pushing a man to the ground in the United States?

People have been killed from being pushed to the ground...

But he wasn’t

So he wasn’t justified to use deadly force

Wrong. How stupid are you? Wait till you are killed; and then use deadly force? Try it, and let us know how that works out...

Shoot first, ask questions later

This is a situation where an armed citizen did not save a life
An overreaction by an armed citizen turned a shouting and shoving situation into a homicide

 

[westwall]

It can't be double jeopardy because he hasn't been to trial yet. Where the hell did you learn your legalese? A Cracker Jack box?

SYG hearing in front of judge adjudicated the matter.

Only in this initial presentation. He hasn't had a prelim, he hasn't been arrested. Thus your claim of double jeopardy is ridiculous. Like I said before. If the AG's office is able to come up with further evidence that shows this was premeditated they can refile and get the ball rolling again.

You need to stop watching TV criminal shows. They are not accurate.

 

[OODA_Loop]

This is a situation where an armed citizen did not save a life
An overreaction by an armed citizen turned a shouting and shoving situation into a homicide

No ask yourself a question then shoot if the answer warrants it.
He may of saved his own life.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Only in this initial presentation. He hasn't had a prelim, he hasn't been arrested. Thus your claim of double jeopardy is ridiculous. Like I said before. If the AG's office is able to come up with further evidence that shows this was premeditated they can refile and get the ball rolling again.

You need to stop watching TV criminal shows. They are not accurate.

Not under Florida SYG law.

 

[westwall]

The guy assaulted him.
Play stupid games win stupid prizes.

Would it be ok for a child to do this on the play ground? Since when does the punishment for assault involve the DEATH PENALTY? Has anyone ever been given the death penalty for pushing a man to the ground in the United States?

People have been killed from being pushed to the ground...

But he wasn’t

So he wasn’t justified to use deadly force

Wrong. How stupid are you? Wait till you are killed; and then use deadly force? Try it, and let us know how that works out...

Shoot first, ask questions later

This is a situation where an armed citizen did not save a life
An overreaction by an armed citizen turned a shouting and shoving situation into a homicide

Indeed it did. And yet armed citizens do this far LESS frequently than cops do. Go figure.

 

[westwall]

Only in this initial presentation. He hasn't had a prelim, he hasn't been arrested. Thus your claim of double jeopardy is ridiculous. Like I said before. If the AG's office is able to come up with further evidence that shows this was premeditated they can refile and get the ball rolling again.

You need to stop watching TV criminal shows. They are not accurate.

Not under Florida SYG law.

Wrong. If what you claim were true martins killer would have never gone to trial. Same State, same laws apply. Good luck with your interpretation.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Wrong. If what you claim were true martins killer would have never gone to trial. Same State, same laws apply. Good luck with your interpretation.

No judge ruled against Zimmerman at the SYG hearing. So it went to full trial. Which upheld the SYG defense.

 

[westwall]

Wrong. If what you claim were true martins killer would have never gone to trial. Same State, same laws apply. Good luck with your interpretation.

No judge ruled against Zimmerman at the SYG hearing. So it went to full trial. Which upheld the SYG defense.

It was the same situation. There was no charge originally brought. Then there was because of public outcry.

 

[OODA_Loop]

It was the same situation. There was no charge originally brought. Then there was because of public outcry.

Zim waived the SYG trail.

This guy did not. So he put on his SYG defense for the judge who dismissed the case

 

[jon_berzerk]

As someone who's owned five businesses, it's not simple to get the police to remove someone from your property. And even if they do, they come right back. Furthermore, the person can get angry at you. It's a bad situation.

And the store owner said the guy kept doing that and he wasn't right. That wouldn't scare you to call the cops on someone aggressive that the cops will just rile off further?

Thats a reasonable point but if the guy was chasing off customers I'm sure he would have called the cops.

we dont know if the owner had in the past

but it seems pretty clear that no legal acrion was taken against the guy to keep him off the property

Yep.
So the the store owner obviously wasnt all that concerned about the guy even though he claimed the guy was a problem.

You made that up. Imagine sitting in a store with a guy is pit bulling a parking space and you're there alone. He said something was wrong with the guy. Psychos are the worst ones to deal with

Made it up?
The guy said he was causing problems.

yes he said that in the news report

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

That's exactly it. That's my issue. Had he been minding his own business and been confronted, then I would have a totally different opinion. Carrying a gun and repeatedly initiating hostility is not consistent with my pro-second amendment views

Nor is it consistent with Florida stand your ground laws which require that the shooter not be the agressor in the conflict. In other words you can't pick a fight with someone so that you can then claim fear for your life and then shoot and kill them

776.041 Use or threatened use of force by aggressor.—The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:

(1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or
(2) Initially provokes the use or threatened use of force against himself or herself, unless:

(a) Such force or threat of force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use or threatened use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or
(b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use or threatened use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use or threatened use of force.​

History.—s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1190, ch. 97-102; s. 7, ch. 2014-195.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine​

 

[kaz]

When you're screaming at a woman in the parking lot waiving your hands, that isn't just words. So seriously, if that happened to your wife, you'd say that? They're just words? Or would you have been very concerned for your wife's safety?

And regardless, when someone shoves you and backs away, that doesn't give you the right to shoot them.

Again, where I'm from, if I'd been armed and screaming at the woman, my community would stop supporting what I did right there. They'd have said I had already violated gun safety standards and created a hostile situation, which you don't do when armed. Then I get shoved by her boyfriend and I gank him? No way, it's not right.

At least not where I was raised

Technically, on the video, the guy advances and only retreats, slightly when the gun is pointed at him..... but between the backing up and shooting there isn't time, and he got shot..... Again, the guy violently attacked the victim....

If you start screaming at a woman in a parking lot while her boyfriend is in the shop while you're armed, you don't belong around guns

It depends on the situation there sport. I agree in principle, but so long as you don't pull the weapon, then what is your beef?

Gun safety starts with avoiding dangerous situations where possible. You don't create a dangerous situation where there could be a shooting. If you're screaming at a woman and her boyfriend is coming out, that right there is setting up a dangerous situation. I mean duh. How do you not get that?

I'm disappointed in all of you who apparently don't view being armed in public as a responsiblity. Particularly 2aguy who is a longtime ally in arguing 2nd amendment rights. What about try NOT to use your gun eludes you?

No kidding. What if you are not able to avoid it. Sometimes a sharp yell will prevent further violence. Not always, but sometimes it is exactly what is needed to deflate a situation. You deal in absolutes and that is a fools way of looking at the world.

ANYONE who carries concealed OF COURSE KNOWS it is a great responsibility. We all KNOW that we are both defenders of ourselves and those who can't defend themselves, and we are also envoys to the world to show the positive aspects of concealed carry. But, there are ALWAYS idiots, who carry for the wrong reasons. Just as there are cops who are cops for all the wrong reasons.

What's the common denominator? PEOPLE!

And yet people are blowing off that the guy with the gun continually confronted people. When he did that over and over, how else would it ever end other than someone being dead? It was just a matter of time.

To me, that's murder