Little Sympathy for California Fire Victims

[Kentucky_Conservative]

If you remove the strong winds at 85+ mph and the heat from the equations that might work.

So you have this sprinkler running on top of your roof. With the strong Santa Ana winds and the heat. At least minimum of 125°. And the directions of the strong winds?
How long is that water going to sticks to your roof?

WHY are liberals' brains so DENSE?!? I am not talking about a SPRINKLER. I am talking about a WALL OF WATER washing over the roof, NON-STOP, with the water being collected at the base of the home and returned to the pool for reapplication.

In Palm Spring it gets very hot during summer 104° to 108°. I sprayed water all over it dried up in seconds. That is without the strong hot winds.

Again, I am not talking about "sprinkling" your roof with some sissy Wal-Mart garden attachment. I am talking about 10,000 gallons of water PER HOUR being poured over your home. That is more than three 55 gallon OIL BARRELS of water per minute. No garden hose can produce THAT volume of water.

 

[charwin95]

That’s really, really stupid.

Has it been tried? No? THAT is really, really stupid!

I’m an engineer. No one tried because it’s really stupid.
The heat alone will melt that tubings that you are talking about.

Oh? STEEL pipes will melt? Really? So 1" black steel pipes with water running through them will melt in a brush fire. Is THAT what you are telling us, engineer? Because I can boil water in a PAPER CUP. Engineer, my ass.

1. You assumed that everyone have swimming pool.
2. You assumed that your water will stick to your roof with the heat & strong winds.
3. You assumed that the heat & winds has zero directions.
4. If you remove the strong winds & heat from the equation that might work.

Aside from that you’ve been watching too much movies.

 

[charwin95]

If you remove the strong winds at 85+ mph and the heat from the equations that might work.

So you have this sprinkler running on top of your roof. With the strong Santa Ana winds and the heat. At least minimum of 125°. And the directions of the strong winds?
How long is that water going to sticks to your roof?

WHY are liberals' brains so DENSE?!? I am not talking about a SPRINKLER. I am talking about a WALL OF WATER washing over the roof, NON-STOP, with the water being collected at the base of the home and returned to the pool for reapplication.

In Palm Spring it gets very hot during summer 104° to 108°. I sprayed water all over it dried up in seconds. That is without the strong hot winds.

Again, I am not talking about "sprinkling" your roof with some sissy Wal-Mart garden attachment. I am talking about 10,000 gallons of water PER HOUR being poured over your home. That is more than three 55 gallon OIL BARRELS of water per minute. No garden hose can produce THAT volume of water.

You are not reading my post. You are just staring at it.
You can call it whatever you want. It doesn’t matter.
Read my post again.

 

[NotYourBody]

Boy didn't that strike a nerve and prove how right I really am.

No, you are not right. You are just arrogant and egotistical.

Water on a cold home soaks the walls. Soaks the framing.

REALLY? So when it RAINS on your home (cold water applied to the exterior of your home) , the framing inside of the walls becomes soaked? The drywall becomes soft and wet? The insulation is now soaked and MOLD is now a concern? The beading water runs out into your living room beneath the baseboards? Are you trying to pass off that bullshit as fact?

A superheated fire with 80 mile an hour wind cold home go boom.

You are so full of crap you should change your name to BANDINI.

Take the average friendly camp fire and throw in wet wood. Snap, crackle, pop as the water expands and turns to steam. Embers go flying. The wet wood still catches and burns. Please quit while you are ahead. You have never seen fires like this. When I want tornado advice I'll call you.

You are comparing tossing wet wood into a campfire to a brushfire burning past a home that is COATED with a wall of water?

Quit while YOU are ahead. You are talking out of your ass.

All homes built in California have sprinkler systems. In this kind of fire they are useless.

I am not talking about an interior sprinkler system. I am talking about a pump that sucks the water out of the pool at 1500 gallons per minute, DRENCHES the home's exterior, and returns the water to the pool via a channel system for reapplication.

To make the home even MORE fire resistant, a home could have a large tank (or two, or three) of liquid CO2 and a pipe system that runs through the home. When the fire reaches the actual home, a valve can be opened to INFLATE the home with CO2, thereby displacing oxygen. The home will not burn is there is no oxygen to feed the fire. The fire will burn past the home and leave it relatively unscathed.

Neither was she talking about an interior sprinkler system....she was talking exterior. I love it when people who have NO CLUE about life in California try to "explain" it to us.

I lived in SoCal for 40 years. Quit talking out of your ass.

She certainly WAS talking about an interior sprinkler system. California does NOT require homes to install an exterior lawn sprinkler system. I am talking about a REAL flow of water through a series of REAL spray nozzles applied to the home's EXTERIOR. Think 'Fire Hose'

Do you know how fast your system would clog up? Do you have any idea how much debris is flying during a fire tornado? It rains down. Who will be there to keep cleaning the filter?

And how will that keep the hot ash and embers from flying into the attic ventilation louvers and up under the eaves. Because lots and lots of these house fires are caused by embers blowing into attics.

And what is running your pump if the electricity is out?

 

[NotYourBody]

Once upon a time I was forced to live in California for the work I was doing. Notably, in recent years, that company has fled to Canada. In any case I had a typical California House with a cedar-shingle roof. I kept the brush around it well trimmed. Bought 200-feet of light plastic drip irrigation tubing and spread it out on the roof. Punched about 500 holes in it with an ice pick. Connected it to my generator-powered well pump. When the evacuation order came I fueled up the generator, cranked it up and left. When I got back the house was in fine shape though a little soggy. Two neighbors came home to crispy remains. Then I had to face the critics cries over my having "wasted ground water".

They didn't bitch long. Their insurance settlements took months and the commute from the motel where they living was too long for them to picket much.

You know that cedar roofs are a no no now?

Yes in modern times we use concrete tile roofs.

 

[charwin95]

If you remove the strong winds at 85+ mph and the heat from the equations that might work.

So you have this sprinkler running on top of your roof. With the strong Santa Ana winds and the heat. At least minimum of 125°. And the directions of the strong winds?
How long is that water going to sticks to your roof?

WHY are liberals' brains so DENSE?!? I am not talking about a SPRINKLER. I am talking about a WALL OF WATER washing over the roof, NON-STOP, with the water being collected at the base of the home and returned to the pool for reapplication.

In Palm Spring it gets very hot during summer 104° to 108°. I sprayed water all over it dried up in seconds. That is without the strong hot winds.

Again, I am not talking about "sprinkling" your roof with some sissy Wal-Mart garden attachment. I am talking about 10,000 gallons of water PER HOUR being poured over your home. That is more than three 55 gallon OIL BARRELS of water per minute. No garden hose can produce THAT volume of water.

Liberals?
I just love it when you mixed political bullshit to the discussions. This is not about political beliefs. It’s about common sense and stupidity.

 

[NotYourBody]

You know that cedar roofs are a no no now?

I would hope so but I escaped California about 20 years ago and don't keep track of their madness. If you are correct then surely it's not for fire prevention - rather to SaveThe Cedars! Around the time I left there was pressure to outlaw exterior sprinkler systems to prevent the "waste" of water.

I don't think that actually was passed and if it wasn't, my having brought it back up might well touch off riots demanding it be imposed.

Funny, I was here 20 years ago and nobody was after my sprinkler system.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Liberals?
I just love it when you mixed political bullshit to the discussions. This is not about political beliefs. It’s about common sense and stupidity.

Correct. Common sense says when a roof or a wall is inundated with a steady flow of water over its entire surface, it will not catch fire during a brushfire. Stupidity argues that this is the same as sprinkling water onto the surface with a garden hose.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

You are not reading my post. You are just staring at it.
You can call it whatever you want. It doesn’t matter.
Read my post again.

I read your post. You presented a scenario where a SPRINKLER would wet down a roof. That means the sprinkler will throw water into the air, and it will fall onto the roof. You argue that the heat and winds would defeat the sprinkler's efforts to prevent the roof from igniting, and you would be correct.

I am not talking about a sprinkler. I am not talking about spraying water into the air before it hits the surface of a roof or a wall. I am talking about running water down along a roof or wall DIRECTLY. The water would exit the pipe and run directly across the roof and directly down the wall.

I am talking about a plumbing system that inundates a surface with water.

Assume you had a toilet made out of wood. Now, could you set it on fire with a heat source equal to that of a brush fire while someone is sprinkling water onto the sides with a spray bottle? Yes, of course you could. A SPRITZ of water cannot combat the BTUs of a constant heat source. Eventually the toilet would catch fire, despite the best efforts of the person with the spray bottle.

Do you think you could set that toilet on fire, if I clogged the drain, and opened the water feed line fully to allow the water to spill out equally around all sides of the toilet bowl down to the floor non-stop? No, of course you couldn't. The water flow would eliminate any heat applied to the wooden toilet as fast as you could apply that heat. You would never be able to ignite the wooden toilet.

 

[charwin95]

Boy didn't that strike a nerve and prove how right I really am.

No, you are not right. You are just arrogant and egotistical.

Water on a cold home soaks the walls. Soaks the framing.

REALLY? So when it RAINS on your home (cold water applied to the exterior of your home) , the framing inside of the walls becomes soaked? The drywall becomes soft and wet? The insulation is now soaked and MOLD is now a concern? The beading water runs out into your living room beneath the baseboards? Are you trying to pass off that bullshit as fact?

A superheated fire with 80 mile an hour wind cold home go boom.

You are so full of crap you should change your name to BANDINI.

Take the average friendly camp fire and throw in wet wood. Snap, crackle, pop as the water expands and turns to steam. Embers go flying. The wet wood still catches and burns. Please quit while you are ahead. You have never seen fires like this. When I want tornado advice I'll call you.

You are comparing tossing wet wood into a campfire to a brushfire burning past a home that is COATED with a wall of water?

Quit while YOU are ahead. You are talking out of your ass.

All homes built in California have sprinkler systems. In this kind of fire they are useless.

I am not talking about an interior sprinkler system. I am talking about a pump that sucks the water out of the pool at 1500 gallons per minute, DRENCHES the home's exterior, and returns the water to the pool via a channel system for reapplication.

To make the home even MORE fire resistant, a home could have a large tank (or two, or three) of liquid CO2 and a pipe system that runs through the home. When the fire reaches the actual home, a valve can be opened to INFLATE the home with CO2, thereby displacing oxygen. The home will not burn is there is no oxygen to feed the fire. The fire will burn past the home and leave it relatively unscathed.

Neither was she talking about an interior sprinkler system....she was talking exterior. I love it when people who have NO CLUE about life in California try to "explain" it to us.

I lived in SoCal for 40 years. Quit talking out of your ass.

She certainly WAS talking about an interior sprinkler system. California does NOT require homes to install an exterior lawn sprinkler system. I am talking about a REAL flow of water through a series of REAL spray nozzles applied to the home's EXTERIOR. Think 'Fire Hose'

Do you know how fast your system would clog up? Do you have any idea how much debris is flying during a fire tornado? It rains down. Who will be there to keep cleaning the filter?

And how will that keep the hot ash and embers from flying into the attic ventilation louvers and up under the eaves. Because lots and lots of these house fires are caused by embers blowing into attics.

And what is running your pump if the electricity is out?

Let me an answer that if you don’t mind

Who will clean the clog? Kentuckyc will do it during fire.

Embers? There are no embers during those fires. LOL.

Electricity? There is this power generator that use GASOLINE or portable generator battery operated will run at least 2 hours. That dude will be there tomorrow to refill the generator with gasoline and recharge those batteries.

 

[charwin95]

You are not reading my post. You are just staring at it.
You can call it whatever you want. It doesn’t matter.
Read my post again.

I read your post. You presented a scenario where a SPRINKLER would wet down a roof. That means the sprinkler will throw water into the air, and it will fall onto the roof. You argue that the heat and winds would defeat the sprinkler's efforts to prevent the roof from igniting, and you would be correct.

I am not talking about a sprinkler. I am not talking about spraying water into the air before it hits the surface of a roof or a wall. I am talking about running water down along a roof or wall DIRECTLY. The water would exit the pipe and run directly across the roof and directly down the wall.

I am talking about a plumbing system that inundates a surface with water.

Assume you had a toilet made out of wood. Now, could you set it on fire with a heat source equal to that of a brush fire while someone is sprinkling water onto the sides with a spray bottle? Yes, of course you could. A SPRITZ of water cannot combat the BTUs of a constant heat source. Eventually the toilet would catch fire, despite the best efforts of the person with the spray bottle.

Do you think you could set that toilet on fire, if I clogged the drain, and opened the water feed line fully to allow the water to spill out equally around all sides of the toilet down to the floor non-stop? No, of course you couldn't. The water flow would eliminate any heat applied to the wooden toilet as fast as you could apply that heat. You would never be able to ignite the wooden toilet.

Okay. You have this water running on top of your roof.

Let me repeat it again. With the heat and the strong winds. Do you expect that water to stick on top of your roof?
It’s very simple it won’t.

Let me repeat it again. With the heat and the strong winds. Do you expect that water to stick on top of your roof?
It’s very simple. It won’t.

Do you want to repeat it 3x?

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

1. You assumed that everyone have swimming pool.

No. I am saying, as new homes are build in high fire risk areas, or homes that have burnt down are RE-built in those areas, a pool of some sort, even if it is a nice 50,000 gallon underground cistern that is not seen, should be a part of the design, along with a roof and eves design that will facilitate smooth water flow over the edge of the roof and down the walls to the foundation, and a foundation with channels designed to return that water TO the storage bladder for re-use in the event of a fire. A diverter valve or even a simple overflow outlet would allow normal rain water to be expelled tot he street or wherever. In a fire situation, that valve is closed, and water is contained within the structure wetting system.

2. You assumed that your water will stick to your roof with the heat & strong winds.

No. I am correct in stating that a constant flow of water pumped from a water supply such as an underground cistern or a swimming pool that is allowed to run over a roof and down the walls of a structure will be sufficient to prevent combustion of the home's fire resistant or fireproof materials.

3. You assumed that the heat & winds has zero directions.

No. The heat, direction and speed of the wind is irrelevant when using a system such as I have described.

4. If you remove the strong winds & heat from the equation that might work.

It will work in the strongest winds and the hottest fires. Home exterior surfaces can be designed to be channels that do not allow wind to affect the flow. Picture a wall of drinking straws. You can blow as hard as you wish, but you will not affect the water inside of the tubes.

Aside from that you’ve been watching too much movies.

Aside from that, you have been missing too many reading comprehension courses.

 

[Crixus]

The value is in the land. Postcard views everywhere. The polar opposite of Kensucky

Lol, bull shit.

Okay, maybe if the post card is from Somalia.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Do you know how fast your system would clog up? Do you have any idea how much debris is flying during a fire tornado? It rains down. Who will be there to keep cleaning the filter?

Filters can be designed to remove the debris. As for someone to "keep cleaning the filter," A fire burns past a house in about an hour. Long term filter maintenance would not be required.

And how will that keep the hot ash and embers from flying into the attic ventilation louvers and up under the eaves. Because lots and lots of these house fires are caused by embers blowing into attics.

Really? You do not believe that a home's exterior can be designed to handle this? Have you ever seen the filters in the hoods over the grills in a burger joint? do you think they handle embers? Homes burn because they are not DESIGNED to deal with hot embers.

And what is running your pump if the electricity is out?

The pump(s) are propane, or gasoline, or diesel, or electrically powered, and resting in fireproof enclosures where they can function normally in the worst fire conditions. Generators can also share this space. An emergency home generator's function is to RUN when the power goes out. PLEASE don't try to argue that this is not possible.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Let me an answer that if you don’t mind

Do you think you can?

Who will clean the clog? Kentuckyc will do it during fire.

The filter would be DESIGNED to handle maximum debris loads for a period of time, unattended.

Water flows through screen. Debris is lifted out of water and captured in a hopper. You morons are so unimaginative!

Embers? There are no embers during those fires. LOL.

Embers are only a problem when they land on something that can be ignited by them.

Electricity? There is this power generator that use GASOLINE or portable generator battery operated will run at least 2 hours. That dude will be there tomorrow to refill the generator with gasoline and recharge those batteries.

Now you are just being deliberately stupid. There is no reason a LARGER quantity of gasoline, or diesel, or propane could not be on hand to run a generator for ANY length of time. Do you believe the farmers who use the diesel pumps to irrigate their fields go refill the fuel tanks every two hours? Moron.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

I cannot believe the level of STUPID I am seeing in these comments!

 

[Gracie]

Meanwhile...did anyone watch Frontline tonight? Its about the Paradise Fire. I haven't seen it yet and am still deciding on whether I WANT to see it since I was there in the middle of it. Still...maybe some will get a clue just how devastating a fire can be that wipes out the whole fucking town, and not one person only looked out for themselves. They helped each other.

Did I ever tell anyone how my van broke down in the middle of escape? Water hose popped off the engine...and as MrG was tightening it back on, everyone passing us at a crawl pace...every darn one of them asked if they could help..or if we wanted to jump in with them. We got the van running again, and wound up in the parking lot of the Save More in Magalia. We were the 5th car there, but within 30 minutes, the parking lot was full of cars and people filling up radiators with water the grocery store supplied us with...FREE. The store also brought out sandwiches from their deli, and chips, and paper smoke masks, and wet towels and paper towels and toilet paper and anything else we needed, they brought out and went from car to car.

Sorry. This thread is supposed to be about making fun of people in such a situation and having no sympathy. I got carried away. I don't think I will watch Frontline after all.

 

[Gracie]

In order for you to lose your home to a fire that quickly WITHOUT ANY WARNING, the gas station directly behind your home would have to had blown up, or the military must have dropped a bomb at your back door. Because any fire that can consume your home that quickly had a good head start, and you just ignored the warnings.

Stupid stupid stupid you are. Stupid.

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Sorry. This thread is supposed to be about making fun of people in such a situation and having no sympathy. I got carried away. I don't think I will watch Frontline after all.

Nope. You are wrong! This thread was NOT created to make fun of anyone. It was created to say, what ever happened to PERSONAL ACCOUNTABILITY?

 

[Kentucky_Conservative]

Stupid stupid stupid you are. Stupid.

So ... there you were, sitting in your home petting your alpaca and watching old Hillary for President videos, when all of a sudden and without ANY warning, your entire home burst into flames! The chair you were sitting in even began to smoke before you could stand up! All you could do was run for the door, take one look back at everything you were going to lose, and head out.

Is that how you lost everything from a fire that happened without any warning?

Or did you smell smoke, and just figure it was someone else's problem? Did you hear sirens and not bother to step outside to see what the fuss was about? I have to wonder, because any fire that could quickly take your home to the point where yo had to 'bug out' probably had a good start on another property first.

Okay, so maybe it was an electrical fire in your home ONLY. They happen. Tell me ... how many certified fire extinguishers hanging in closets and hallways were consumed in the fire? Were you awakened by smoke detectors?

What was the cause of the fire that consumed your home?