"Love your enemies"

[Delta4Embassy]

A curious verse. Though in religions maybe not as much as elsewhere. I've pondered it a lot with the Gaza campaign raging, and Iraq heating back up. I must admit I never agreed with it until recently when I started thinking of it another way:

Everyone loves their own side. They don't get "pos-rep" for doing so though.

But do we judge ourselves for how we treat our own side, team, religion, community, or nation? Or is the real judgement to come in how we treat our enemies? Laws governing the conducting of wars are ancient. This too used to seem silly to me when you're talking about killing people and dropping bombs on cities. But even in that sort of madness and chaos some civility is possible in not waging your war against those who are not your enemy.

We judge our enemies by how they treat us. If you wage war against others waging war back at you you're pardonable for slugging it out amongst yourselves. But if you go after your enemy's non-combatants, their children, their livestock, etc. you'll be judged by the entire world and very negatively. Every war involves a war of ideas. In this, being 'better' than your enemy is critically important. If you jump down into the mud and slime with them doing as they do you loose this war.

Loving our enemies makes a lot of sense then. But it's important to realize who our enemies are. It's not their kids, livestock, infrastructure, women, or even men; it's whoever's fighting back against you. If they don't wanna fight you, they're not your enemy.

Even Torah has stuff about how to conduct a religiously sanctionable war. Just as most nations do to this day. One day it'd be swell if we evolved beyond warring in the first place, but evolution's slow and happens over millions of years. Modern humans aren't very old at all so we have a lot of evolving and growing up to do.

 

[Avatar4321]

The whole point behind it is our enemies aren't really our enemies. They are brothers who are lost and need to be reclaimed. We do this by loving them though they might use us and treat us badly.

War is, sadly, a necessary evil at times. Our job is to still love our enemies and not delight in their bloodshed.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

I don't believe war's a necessity so much as an inexorable part of our natures. We're not the only species to wage war so maybe it's something found in all life? Or at least until it evolves beyond it if that's even possible. Are vastly older spiecies on this planet who still fight for the sake of objectives other than food.

 

[PratchettFan]

Love requires openness and courage. To love means you let down your own defenses and accept others as they are. Hatred is about being closed and afraid, which is our natural state. We hate that which we do not understand because we are afraid of it. To love your enemies means to let go of your fear, to live your life under your own control and not under the control of your fear. It means to understand that if you hate because you think you are hated, you have handed the control of your life to others.

 

[UllysesS.Archer]

This is one of my biggest struggles, day in and day out. I know what the Bible says, and what Jesus taught, but, there is much hatred in my heart for those who hurt children.

I try everyday to be more forgiving of them, than I was the day before, but I mostly feel even more hatred for them.

I am not the man I should be, but thank God I am not the man I used to be.

 

[PratchettFan]

This is one of my biggest struggles, day in and day out. I know what the Bible says, and what Jesus taught, but, there is much hatred in my heart for those who hurt children.

I try everyday to be more forgiving of them, than I was the day before, but I mostly feel even more hatred for them.

I am not the man I should be, but thank God I am not the man I used to be.

Nothing he taught was easy and none of us are perfect.

I get some people are damaged. They may have no control over what they do. However, if I see a rabid dog I do not struggle over its intent. I do not hate it, but I do put it down. Not because of what it has done but to prevent it from harming anyone in the future.

 

[Carlsen]

The whole point behind it is our enemies aren't really our enemies. They are brothers who are lost and need to be reclaimed. We do this by loving them though they might use us and treat us badly.

War is, sadly, a necessary evil at times. Our job is to still love our enemies and not delight in their bloodshed.

My enemies are not m y brothers. They are m y enemies and to say I love them it is to let them controlle my life. As the enemy controlle your life he will tell you what to do and then kill you. So to say you love your enemy is stupid thing

.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

A curious verse. Though in religions maybe not as much as elsewhere. I've pondered it a lot with the Gaza campaign raging, and Iraq heating back up. I must admit I never agreed with it until recently when I started thinking of it another way:

Everyone loves their own side. They don't get "pos-rep" for doing so though.

But do we judge ourselves for how we treat our own side, team, religion, community, or nation? Or is the real judgement to come in how we treat our enemies? Laws governing the conducting of wars are ancient. This too used to seem silly to me when you're talking about killing people and dropping bombs on cities. But even in that sort of madness and chaos some civility is possible in not waging your war against those who are not your enemy.

We judge our enemies by how they treat us. If you wage war against others waging war back at you you're pardonable for slugging it out amongst yourselves. But if you go after your enemy's non-combatants, their children, their livestock, etc. you'll be judged by the entire world and very negatively. Every war involves a war of ideas. In this, being 'better' than your enemy is critically important. If you jump down into the mud and slime with them doing as they do you loose this war.

Loving our enemies makes a lot of sense then. But it's important to realize who our enemies are. It's not their kids, livestock, infrastructure, women, or even men; it's whoever's fighting back against you. If they don't wanna fight you, they're not your enemy.

Even Torah has stuff about how to conduct a religiously sanctionable war. Just as most nations do to this day. One day it'd be swell if we evolved beyond warring in the first place, but evolution's slow and happens over millions of years. Modern humans aren't very old at all so we have a lot of evolving and growing up to do.

Why do you think your view of how things work is how everyone thinks. You do not speak for me. You should start using I instead of we in your posts, it would make you look a lot less arrogant.

Now that that rebuke is out of the way, why do you think that the Torah applies to a New Testament verse?

Loving your enemy happens at a personal level, it doesn't apply to nations. It doesn't even apply to people who aren't Christians. Does that make you feel better?

 

[Indeependent]

Matthew 5:44...Another turn the other cheek suck up verse.
No basis in rabbinic tradition.
In fact, quite the contrary...kill your enemies dead.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I don't believe war's a necessity so much as an inexorable part of our natures. We're not the only species to wage war so maybe it's something found in all life? Or at least until it evolves beyond it if that's even possible. Are vastly older spiecies on this planet who still fight for the sake of objectives other than food.

I hate to point out the obvious, but evolution is all about one species surviving at the expense of others. In other words, only delusional idiots think it is possible to evolve beyond war. The only way evolutionary war will end is when a single species manages to completely control the entire universe. In other words, that species would have to become God.

That said, human beings have both free will and an awareness of the consequences of their actions. There is no need for us to wait for evolution to end before we choose not to go to war.

 

[DriftingSand]

Love is defined in many different ways. I love folks enough to want to tell them the truth. Sometimes they hate me for it. I love folks enough that I want them to see God's Kingdom someday. Sometimes they hate me for even believing in a Kingdom. I love folks enough that I don't want them living a lie. Sometimes they hate me because they prefer to live the lie.

But the Bible also says that we are to love our neighbors. So if I see my neighbor's life in jeopardy then I may have to take drastic action against a would-be foe. The question then arises: Am I hating my enemy when I love my neighbor? Nope -- because the "enemy" the Bible is talking about are our brothers who may disagree with me on one issue or another -- it's not talking about the kind that means us bodily harm.

 

[Avatar4321]

The whole point behind it is our enemies aren't really our enemies. They are brothers who are lost and need to be reclaimed. We do this by loving them though they might use us and treat us badly.

War is, sadly, a necessary evil at times. Our job is to still love our enemies and not delight in their bloodshed.

My enemies are not m y brothers. They are m y enemies and to say I love them it is to let them controlle my life. As the enemy controlle your life he will tell you what to do and then kill you. So to say you love your enemy is stupid thing

.

To have enemies is a stupid thing.

 

[Lipush]

A curious verse. Though in religions maybe not as much as elsewhere. I've pondered it a lot with the Gaza campaign raging, and Iraq heating back up. I must admit I never agreed with it until recently when I started thinking of it another way:

Everyone loves their own side. They don't get "pos-rep" for doing so though.

But do we judge ourselves for how we treat our own side, team, religion, community, or nation? Or is the real judgement to come in how we treat our enemies? Laws governing the conducting of wars are ancient. This too used to seem silly to me when you're talking about killing people and dropping bombs on cities. But even in that sort of madness and chaos some civility is possible in not waging your war against those who are not your enemy.

We judge our enemies by how they treat us. If you wage war against others waging war back at you you're pardonable for slugging it out amongst yourselves. But if you go after your enemy's non-combatants, their children, their livestock, etc. you'll be judged by the entire world and very negatively. Every war involves a war of ideas. In this, being 'better' than your enemy is critically important. If you jump down into the mud and slime with them doing as they do you loose this war.

Loving our enemies makes a lot of sense then. But it's important to realize who our enemies are. It's not their kids, livestock, infrastructure, women, or even men; it's whoever's fighting back against you. If they don't wanna fight you, they're not your enemy.

Even Torah has stuff about how to conduct a religiously sanctionable war. Just as most nations do to this day. One day it'd be swell if we evolved beyond warring in the first place, but evolution's slow and happens over millions of years. Modern humans aren't very old at all so we have a lot of evolving and growing up to do.

Judaism doesn't say anything about "loving your enemy". The exact opposite, it says in the Torah- "He who rises up to kill you, awaken early and kill him first".

The Talmud says in Baba Metzia 71a- " If thou lend money to any of my people that is poor by thee: my people and a heathen, ‘my people’ has preference; the poor or the rich — the ‘poor’ takes precedence; thy poor and the [general] poor of thy town — thy poor come first; the poor of thy city and the poor of another town — the poor of thine own town have prior rights. The Master said: ‘[If the choice lies between] my people and a heathen — "my people" has preference.’ But is it not obvious?"

The question is not about loving your enemy, such demand is against Judaism, but what it says about people who are not clearly your enemy. Judaism commands to treat the weak with mercy- "Foreign, widow, and orphan shall you not torture", and that goes for those who are also in that catagory in case of war results.

As for treating your own, in Judaism it's a Mitzvah to grant each or your brothern free love and compassion.

 

[Lipush]

The whole point behind it is our enemies aren't really our enemies. They are brothers who are lost and need to be reclaimed. We do this by loving them though they might use us and treat us badly.

War is, sadly, a necessary evil at times. Our job is to still love our enemies and not delight in their bloodshed.

When you see what Daesh does in the middle east, it's hard to imagine love and compassion.

What is the use of such compassion, if it's leading to your demise at the end?

 

[Lipush]

Matthew 5:44...Another turn the other cheek suck up verse.
No basis in rabbinic tradition.
In fact, quite the contrary...kill your enemies dead.

Exactly.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Matthew 5:44...Another turn the other cheek suck up verse.
No basis in rabbinic tradition.
In fact, quite the contrary...kill your enemies dead.

Where'd you go to yeshiva? Qillum al U.?

19. You shall love the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.
- Devarim 10

Love and Brotherhood in Jewish Sources

A large part of Jewish law is about treating people with kindness. The same body of Jewish law that commands us to eat only kosher food and not to turn on lights on Shabbat, also commands us to love both Jews and strangers, to give tzedakah (charity) to the poor and needy, and not to wrong anyone in speech or in business. In fact, acts of kindness are so much a part of Jewish law that the word "mitzvah" (literally, "commandment") is informally used to mean any good deed.
Judaism 101: Love and Brotherhood

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Talmud, Sanhedrin 37a states:

"FOR THIS REASON WAS MAN CREATED ALONE, TO TEACH THEE THAT WHOSOEVER DESTROYS A SINGLE SOUL... SCRIPTURE IMPUTES [GUILT] TO HIM AS THOUGH HE HAD DESTROYED A COMPLETE WORLD; AND WHOSOEVER PRESERVES A SINGLE SOUL..., SCRIPTURE ASCRIBES [MERIT] TO HIM AS THOUGH HE HAD PRESERVED A COMPLETE WORLD."


If we extend love to even our enemies sparing but one...

 

[Avatar4321]

The whole point behind it is our enemies aren't really our enemies. They are brothers who are lost and need to be reclaimed. We do this by loving them though they might use us and treat us badly.

War is, sadly, a necessary evil at times. Our job is to still love our enemies and not delight in their bloodshed.

When you see what Daesh does in the middle east, it's hard to imagine love and compassion.

What is the use of such compassion, if it's leading to your demise at the end?

Death is not the end.

We are taught to have love so we can become like God.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Time to remember that we're Jews. Not Christians, Muslims, or Hindus. Jews, the Chosen Ones. We're supposed to be the good guys. 'Good guys' in movies spare their enemies where ever possible.

In "Man of Steel" Superman only killed Zod after trying above and beyond the call not to, and then only when others were threatened. And if think a Superman movie doesn't enter into it, Superman's creators were Jews who very probably invented him as a metaphor for our Moshiach to come.

Loving our enemies is why we continue to accept offers to negotiate, and accept peace-fire after peace-fire even after every one of them was broken by our enemies. If we can take a day off killing we take a day off. That's how the good guys are supposed to behave.

 

[Lipush]

Talmud, Sanhedrin 37a states:

"FOR THIS REASON WAS MAN CREATED ALONE, TO TEACH THEE THAT WHOSOEVER DESTROYS A SINGLE SOUL... SCRIPTURE IMPUTES [GUILT] TO HIM AS THOUGH HE HAD DESTROYED A COMPLETE WORLD; AND WHOSOEVER PRESERVES A SINGLE SOUL..., SCRIPTURE ASCRIBES [MERIT] TO HIM AS THOUGH HE HAD PRESERVED A COMPLETE WORLD."


If we extend love to even our enemies sparing but one...

The scriptures refer to a soul from the people of Israel. It is important to understand that. Saving lives is a morale code in Judaism, but then again, when it's you or the enemy, the choice to count your life first- Venishmartem Lenafshoteichem is not a suggestion, but commandment.