Messiah Bin David Messiah Bin Joseph Messiah For All

[Shusha]

How do you not buy in to that construct of God, and this world when you are living in such a place?

That is a denial of reality.

Not reality. In my reality G-d created us exactly as He wanted us to be. We are never separated from Him. Can't be separated from Him. We are of Him.

There is no need for all this wages of sin and debt and payment. Nor the farce of G-d killing Himself.

Our G-d is right here.

 

[The Original Tree]

How do you not buy in to that construct of God, and this world when you are living in such a place?

That is a denial of reality.

Not reality. In my reality G-d created us exactly as He wanted us to be. We are never separated from Him. Can't be separated from Him. We are of Him.

There is no need for all this wages of sin and debt and payment. Nor the farce of G-d killing Himself.

Our G-d is right here.

So in your view, there is No Sheol?
If we are never separated from God, then there is No Sin.
If there is No Sin, there is no reason for The Feasts, or Oblations, or Atonement.
There is no reason then to be Jewish or Christian.

Is that what you believe?

 

[hobelim]

Judaism teaches that to sin is a part of life, since there is no perfect man and everyone has an inclination to do evil "from his youth". ... Yom Kippur, the main day of repentance in Judaism, can atone for sins between man and God, but not for sins between man and his fellow, that is until he has appeased his friend.

Wiki

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus, whatever that means. . I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear to buy, no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

 

[Mindful]

Judaism teaches that to sin is a part of life, since there is no perfect man and everyone has an inclination to do evil "from his youth". ... Yom Kippur, the main day of repentance in Judaism, can atone for sins between man and God, but not for sins between man and his fellow, that is until he has appeased his friend.

Wiki

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus. I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear, , no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

Right or wrong?

Hmmm. I'll have to think about that one.

 

[Shusha]

So in your view, there is No Sheol?
If we are never separated from God, then there is No Sin.
If there is No Sin, there is no reason for The Feasts, or Oblations, or Atonement.
There is no reason then to be Jewish or Christian.

Is that what you believe?

Ah ha. Now you are starting to get it.

No, no Hell. No, no Sin (at least not the way you mean it.)

Of course there are still reasons to keep the Festivals and observe the other instructions given to us by G-d. They are for us, after all, not for G-d.

And one either IS Jewish or is not. There is no need for a reason. But I agree entirely that there is no reason to be Christian.

 

[The Original Tree]

Judaism teaches that to sin is a part of life, since there is no perfect man and everyone has an inclination to do evil "from his youth". ... Yom Kippur, the main day of repentance in Judaism, can atone for sins between man and God, but not for sins between man and his fellow, that is until he has appeased his friend.

Wiki

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus, whatever that means. . I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear to buy, no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

That's pretty much what I was trying to discuss. Israel during the Roman Occupation was looking for Messiah, so they believe in Messiah. What they believe in may be different. What the common Jewish citizen believes about Messiah may also be far different than what The Religious Orthodoxy believes.

I do not want to get in to Judaism vs. Christianity. I want to understand the Jewish views of Messiah. So far that hasn't happened. All I have gotten is "I don't believe in this Jesus guy".

The only reason I cite scripture Old Testament and New is to show that there were prophecies in The Old Testament about Messiah. There are a lot of them, and you could write a book on them with how many there were. Messiah is all over the place in the Old Testament, both figuratively and literally.

 

[The Original Tree]

So in your view, there is No Sheol?
If we are never separated from God, then there is No Sin.
If there is No Sin, there is no reason for The Feasts, or Oblations, or Atonement.
There is no reason then to be Jewish or Christian.

Is that what you believe?

Ah ha. Now you are starting to get it.

No, no Hell. No, no Sin (at least not the way you mean it.)

Of course there are still reasons to keep the Festivals and observe the other instructions given to us by G-d. They are for us, after all, not for G-d.

And one either IS Jewish or is not. There is no need for a reason. But I agree entirely that there is no reason to be Christian.

So why The Sacrifices? What is the point of that at all? Even God said the sacrifices were for the remission of sins.
God believes there is Sin and that Sin separates His people from Him.

In Leviticus is states that the sacrifices were for sin and to restore the relationship with God, but that the sacrifices were not enough to completely remove sin.

What was the purpose of animal sacrifices in the Old Testament?

Old Testament Sacrifices | Learn The Bible

This nature is best explained in the New Testament books that deal with the Old Testament sacrifices. Let me give you some verses.

Hebrews 10:4
states, "For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins." This shows that the animal sacrifices could not completely remove their sins.

Hebrews 10:11-12
states, "And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God." This passage contrasts the temporary effect of the Old Testament sacrifices with the absolute sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 7:19
reads, "For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God." The sacrifices were a part of the law and this verse says that they made nothing perfect. But the better hope of Jesus Christ perfected our salvation.

Hebrews 9:13
explains the purpose of the sacrifices: "For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh." They were given for the sanctifying of the flesh, not the absolute salvation of the soul.

Now, why did their flesh need to be sanctified? This was necessary because God came to make His dwelling with the Israelites.

Leviticus 16:16
states, "And he shall make an atonement for the holy place, because of the uncleanness of the children of Israel, and because of their transgressions in all their sins: and so shall he do for the tabernacle of the congregation, that remaineth among them in the midst of their uncleanness." This and other verses emphasis the importance of being holy because of the presence of God among them.

The sacrifices covered their sins but they did not completely do away with their sins. Consider this entire passage:

Hebrews 10:1
For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshipers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

The reason they had to keep coming back is because the sacrifices did not entirely do away with their sins.

 

[Shusha]

So why The Sacrifices?

They are not for G-d. They are for us. Physical acts which draw us closer to G-d.

What is the point of that at all?

Because being a Jew is about action, not belief. It is acting on what G-d has taught us.

Even God said the sacrifices were for the remission of sins.

The sacrifices themselves are only outward expressions of the actions which achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d. The sacrficies are entirely unnecessary. What is required is repentance, making amends, prayer and a return to the actions which G-d instructed us to take.

 

[hobelim]

Judaism teaches that to sin is a part of life, since there is no perfect man and everyone has an inclination to do evil "from his youth". ... Yom Kippur, the main day of repentance in Judaism, can atone for sins between man and God, but not for sins between man and his fellow, that is until he has appeased his friend.

Wiki

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus, whatever that means. . I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear to buy, no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

That's pretty much what I was trying to discuss. Israel during the Roman Occupation was looking for Messiah, so they believe in Messiah. What they believe in may be different. What the common Jewish citizen believes about Messiah may also be far different than what The Religious Orthodoxy believes.

I do not want to get in to Judaism vs. Christianity. I want to understand the Jewish views of Messiah. So far that hasn't happened. All I have gotten is "I don't believe in this Jesus guy".

The only reason I cite scripture Old Testament and New is to show that there were prophecies in The Old Testament about Messiah. There are a lot of them, and you could write a book on them with how many there were. Messiah is all over the place in the Old Testament, both figuratively and literally.

From what I gather many Jews reject Jesus out of hand just because of the dumb things that Christians claim about him. I can't blame them for that. That being said another objection is that Jesus never built a temple, he was rejected despised and crucified, Rome wasn't immediately destroyed therefore the messianic age did not begin. Many other messianic expectations about the end of time, the end of death, universal peace in nature, the dead to come out of their graves, literally, are just as irrational as Christian expectations for Jesus to float down from the sky.

Maybe one day someone will realize that the promise for the messiah to reestablish the sanctuary of God in their midst was never about him building a temple.

Maybe not.

 

[The Original Tree]

So why The Sacrifices?

They are not for G-d. They are for us. Physical acts which draw us closer to G-d.

What is the point of that at all?

Because being a Jew is about action, not belief. It is acting on what G-d has taught us.

Even God said the sacrifices were for the remission of sins.

The sacrifices themselves are only outward expressions of the actions which achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d. The sacrficies are entirely unnecessary. What is required is repentance, making amends, prayer and a return to the actions which G-d instructed us to take.

But G-d says there is sin.....and you say you are never Separated from G-d, so why the need to achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d if you are never separated from him, and there is no sin?

 

[The Original Tree]

Judaism teaches that to sin is a part of life, since there is no perfect man and everyone has an inclination to do evil "from his youth". ... Yom Kippur, the main day of repentance in Judaism, can atone for sins between man and God, but not for sins between man and his fellow, that is until he has appeased his friend.

Wiki

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus, whatever that means. . I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear to buy, no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

That's pretty much what I was trying to discuss. Israel during the Roman Occupation was looking for Messiah, so they believe in Messiah. What they believe in may be different. What the common Jewish citizen believes about Messiah may also be far different than what The Religious Orthodoxy believes.

I do not want to get in to Judaism vs. Christianity. I want to understand the Jewish views of Messiah. So far that hasn't happened. All I have gotten is "I don't believe in this Jesus guy".

The only reason I cite scripture Old Testament and New is to show that there were prophecies in The Old Testament about Messiah. There are a lot of them, and you could write a book on them with how many there were. Messiah is all over the place in the Old Testament, both figuratively and literally.

From what I gather many Jews reject Jesus out of hand just because of the dumb things that Christians claim about him. I can't blame them for that. That being said another objection is that Jesus never built a temple, he was rejected despised and crucified, Rome wasn't immediately destroyed therefore the messianic age did not begin. Many other messianic expectations about the end of time, the end of death, universal peace in nature, the dead to come out of their graves, literally, are just as irrational as Christian expectations for Jesus to float down from the sky.

Maybe one day someone will realize that that the expectation for the messiah to reestablish the sanctuary of God in their midst was never about building a temple.

Maybe not.

You can make the same arguments about Moses. How could Moses be sent by God, if Moses took 40 years to get Israel to the Promised Land and then was not allowed to enter it himself?

But Moses was of God. He spent 40 years as an Egyptian, 40 Years Exiled , and 40 Years with Israel in The Wilderness be Chastened and Purified.

Also, The Temple was destroyed exactly 40 years after Christ' crucifixion. 40 years is a number that represents two things.

1.) A period of opportunity for repentance, and purification.
2.) A period once 40 days is reached for judgment, or for mercy.

Another example is of Noah and the Flood. It rained 40 days and 40 nights.
The Ark was a type of salvation.

There are a lot of parallels that can be drawn.

Just because something does not happen immediately does not mean God is not going to work to make it happen.

The Diaspora in my opinion began in 70 AD under the cruelty of Rome and with the destruction of The Temple as prophesied by Daniel and others.

The Restoration of Israel as prophesied and the gathering together again of Israel in to The Promised land as prophesied did not happen until nearly 2,000 years later.

 

[Shusha]

But G-d says there is sin.....and you say you are never Separated from G-d, so why the need to achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d if you are never separated from him, and there is no sin?

But sin is only a stepping off of the path. You step back on. Its that simple.

Never separated*. But certainly one can be closer and more "in tune" with Him at some times in our lives than others. We step off the path and get lost. But the path doesn't disappear.










*Though there is nuance here that I am not getting into. Basics first.

 

[hobelim]

Sin is disobedience to Gods law. Sin is only a part of life because people do not understand the meaning of the words nor the hidden subjects of the divine commands.

According to the story Jesus did away with sin by revealing the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law. According to the story Jesus removed the burden of the law which is the death, the promised maledictions for noncompliance by making the right way to follow the law, the way to eternal life clear.. According to the story by doing so Jesus made the talmud, what he called 'the traditions of men' and the wrong way to follow the law, obsolete.

According to the story all that anyone had to do back then was decide whether Jesus who said 'eat my flesh' was right or wrong about kosher law, whether standing guard over the purity of your own mind or being very careful about whats for dinner reflects the will and wisdom of God.

Now that you know what the argument between Jesus and the 'orthodox' was all about, you get to decide too.

Choose wisely (lol, and try not to laugh). If scripture is true, it is literally a matter of life or death.

I'm not into Jesus. Sorry.

lol.. I didn't mean for you to think that I was suggesting that you should be into Jesus, whatever that means. . I was showing what the argument between Jesus and the religious elite was about. Nothing really complicated about it. No need to admit you are a worthless piece of garbage, no tithing required, no special underwear to buy, no reason to pray to a mangod, no need to eat him.

Whatever you are into or not into and whether you like it or not, now you really won't be able stop your mind from thinking about who was right or wrong back then, if you are a thinker.

That's pretty much what I was trying to discuss. Israel during the Roman Occupation was looking for Messiah, so they believe in Messiah. What they believe in may be different. What the common Jewish citizen believes about Messiah may also be far different than what The Religious Orthodoxy believes.

I do not want to get in to Judaism vs. Christianity. I want to understand the Jewish views of Messiah. So far that hasn't happened. All I have gotten is "I don't believe in this Jesus guy".

The only reason I cite scripture Old Testament and New is to show that there were prophecies in The Old Testament about Messiah. There are a lot of them, and you could write a book on them with how many there were. Messiah is all over the place in the Old Testament, both figuratively and literally.

From what I gather many Jews reject Jesus out of hand just because of the dumb things that Christians claim about him. I can't blame them for that. That being said another objection is that Jesus never built a temple, he was rejected despised and crucified, Rome wasn't immediately destroyed therefore the messianic age did not begin. Many other messianic expectations about the end of time, the end of death, universal peace in nature, the dead to come out of their graves, literally, are just as irrational as Christian expectations for Jesus to float down from the sky.

Maybe one day someone will realize that that the expectation for the messiah to reestablish the sanctuary of God in their midst was never about building a temple.

Maybe not.

You can make the same arguments about Moses. How could Moses be sent by God, if Moses took 40 years to get Israel to the Promised Land and then was not allowed to enter it himself?

But Moses was of God. He spent 40 years as an Egyptian, 40 Years Exiled , and 40 Years with Israel in The Wilderness be Chastened and Purified.

Also, The Temple was destroyed exactly 40 years after Christ' crucifixion. 40 years is a number that represents two things.

1.) A period of opportunity for repentance, and purification.
2.) A period once 40 days is reached for judgment, or for mercy.

Another example is of Noah and the Flood. It rained 40 days and 40 nights.
The Ark was a type of salvation.

There are a lot of parallels that can be drawn.

Just because something does not happen immediately does not mean God is not going to work to make it happen.

The Diaspora in my opinion began in 70 AD under the cruelty of Rome and with the destruction of The Temple as prophesied by Daniel and others.

The Restoration of Israel as prophesied and the gathering together did not happen until nearly 2,000 years later.

I don't see how one thing has to do with the other.


Whatever the flavor of their own beliefs the Jews have valid objections to Christian claims about Jesus and their derogatory views of Judaism. Thats just obvious to me.

So it took 40 years or 40 days or ali baba and the forty thieves. Who can say. I think that the number 40 was just standard shorthand back then meaning a very long time.

And why would it be surprising that it took so long for Moses to lead the people through the wilderness of sin?

It is much easier to deceive a hundred thousand people than it is to lead even one person to the truth.

 

[Shusha]

The number 40, as I'm given to understand, represents renewal or change or transition. It also represents a generation.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

So why The Sacrifices?

They are not for G-d. They are for us. Physical acts which draw us closer to G-d.

What is the point of that at all?

Because being a Jew is about action, not belief. It is acting on what G-d has taught us.

Even God said the sacrifices were for the remission of sins.

The sacrifices themselves are only outward expressions of the actions which achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d. The sacrficies are entirely unnecessary. What is required is repentance, making amends, prayer and a return to the actions which G-d instructed us to take.

But G-d says there is sin.....and you say you are never Separated from G-d, so why the need to achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d if you are never separated from him, and there is no sin?

Judaisms god is not the same as our God, this is why they say that their god says there is no sin and no Hell. So I maintain my position that their messiah they wait for is going to be what in our Bible tells us will be The Anti-Christ. I think it would help if Christians begin to realise we have ZERO in common with Judaism, it's beliefs or it's rituals this is not rocket science, if we did have ANYTHING in common with that crowd then we would HAVE to begin with also REJECTING Jesus Christ as The Messiah, then REJECT there is no Heaven OR Hell, then REJECT there is NO Resurrection OR Afterlife, this is not rocket science, it is easy to comprehend:

Judaism = NO Jesus Christ The Messiah.
Judaism = NO sin.
Judaism = NO Hell.
Judaism = NO Heaven.
Judaism = NO Resurrection OR Afterlife.

Christianity = Jesus Christ IS The Messiah.
Christianity = YES there is sin.
Christianity = YES there is a Hell.
Christianity = YES there is a Heaven.
Christianity = YES there IS Resurrection AND an Afterlife.

Oil and water oil and water. The majority of what is in our Christian Bible Judaism REJECTS, they want to brainwash those who they think they can get to to get them to follow THEM instead, they do this not openly but in a subtle way the End Game as their god instructs them is to convince as many Christians as they can to turn AWAY from Jesus Christ who is Our Salvation and instead to follow their Pagan god who will put his representative on this earth during The End Times a man in human form who will perform with the power from Satan perform the miracles so that Judaism will then say THIS MAN IS THE MESSIAH, he will have the rebuilding of The Third Temple as his seat, he will enter it and perform The Abomination of Desolation which will be him declaring himself Jesus Christ and x amount of Christians who have the Judaism Fetish will FOLLOW and ACCEPT him and WILL take The Mark of The Beast and will be thrown into The Eternal Lake of Fire with The Anti-Christ and The False Prophet. They do NOT FEAR Hell like we Christians are taught to FEAR Hell and Eternal Damnation, their version of Hell is our version of Heaven, everything is inverted and upside down in their world.

 

[Shusha]

Lucy Hamilton

Actually, many (most?) Jews believe in some sort of afterlife.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Lucy Hamilton

Actually, many (most?) Jews believe in some sort of afterlife.

Yes but what type of Afterlife and where is it to be? It cannot be in Heaven because if you reject there is no Hell there is no Heaven without having a Hell. Also 90% of the worlds Jews are Secular and Athiest so where are they going?

 

[The Original Tree]

So why The Sacrifices?

They are not for G-d. They are for us. Physical acts which draw us closer to G-d.

What is the point of that at all?

Because being a Jew is about action, not belief. It is acting on what G-d has taught us.

Even God said the sacrifices were for the remission of sins.

The sacrifices themselves are only outward expressions of the actions which achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d. The sacrficies are entirely unnecessary. What is required is repentance, making amends, prayer and a return to the actions which G-d instructed us to take.

But G-d says there is sin.....and you say you are never Separated from G-d, so why the need to achieve a restoration of closeness with G-d if you are never separated from him, and there is no sin?

Judaisms god is not the same as our God, this is why they say that their god says there is no sin and no Hell. So I maintain my position that their messiah they wait for is going to be what in our Bible tells us will be The Anti-Christ. I think it would help if Christians begin to realise we have ZERO in common with Judaism, it's beliefs or it's rituals this is not rocket science, if we did have ANYTHING in common with that crowd then we would HAVE to begin with also REJECTING Jesus Christ as The Messiah, then REJECT there is no Heaven OR Hell, then REJECT there is NO Resurrection OR Afterlife, this is not rocket science, it is easy to comprehend:

Judaism = NO Jesus Christ The Messiah.
Judaism = NO sin.
Judaism = NO Hell.
Judaism = NO Heaven.
Judaism = NO Resurrection OR Afterlife.

Christianity = Jesus Christ IS The Messiah.
Christianity = YES there is sin.
Christianity = YES there is a Hell.
Christianity = YES there is a Heaven.
Christianity = YES there IS Resurrection AND an Afterlife.

Oil and water oil and water. The majority of what is in our Christian Bible Judaism REJECTS, they want to brainwash those who they think they can get to to get them to follow THEM instead, they do this not openly but in a subtle way the End Game as their god instructs them is to convince as many Christians as they can to turn AWAY from Jesus Christ who is Our Salvation and instead to follow their Pagan god who will put his representative on this earth during The End Times a man in human form who will perform with the power from Satan perform the miracles so that Judaism will then say THIS MAN IS THE MESSIAH, he will have the rebuilding of The Third Temple as his seat, he will enter it and perform The Abomination of Desolation which will be him declaring himself Jesus Christ and x amount of Christians who have the Judaism Fetish will FOLLOW and ACCEPT him and WILL take The Mark of The Beast and will be thrown into The Eternal Lake of Fire with The Anti-Christ and The False Prophet. They do NOT FEAR Hell like we Christians are taught to FEAR Hell and Eternal Damnation, their version of Hell is our version of Heaven, everything is inverted and upside down in their world.

I'm not sure you can take one person's view of Judaism and make assumptions from that. I have talked to Jews who believe in just about everything you listed.

And The Creator is the same for Jew as it is for Gentile.

And to make a judgment upon a people saying they will do this and they will do that during The Tribulation, is also rather wrong headed. None of the prophesies specifically state who is going to take The Mark of AntiChrist for instance. In fact, as I have told you before, Jews refuse to worship AntiChrist during The Tribulation and they have to flee in to The Wilderness 'sila' because he makes war against Israel and all those that refuse his mark, for them refusing to worship him.

Do you realize that God actually knows the FINAL NUMBER of believers in Him that The World needs to reach before certain events come to pass?

If that is true, and it is, then there is no point trying to point the finger at anyone.

10 Things Christians Should Know about the End Times

14. Major Events Preceding the Second Coming of Christ | Bible.org

 

[Shusha]

... they want to brainwash those who they think they can get to to get them to follow THEM instead, they do this not openly but in a subtle way the End Game as their god instructs them is to convince as many Christians as they can to turn AWAY from Jesus Christ who is Our Salvation and instead to follow their Pagan god ...

Um no. Judaism rejects trying to convert others. Judaism accepts that there are other ways to worship G-d and that non-Jews are free to hold their own faiths. (As long as the Noahide Laws are followed).

I assure you we are not trying to lead Christians away from their faith. But truthfully, this sort of libel about Jews and their "subtle ways" can be a very harmful idea to put out into the world.

 

[Shusha]

I'm not sure you can take one person's view of Judaism and make assumptions from that. I have talked to Jews who believe in just about everything you listed.

Its not so much that Jews don't have our own ideas about those concepts. We do. But they are very different from the Christian concepts. We don't have heaven, hell, sin, etc as YOU understand them.