Moving forward

[Coyote]

We are a country of laws, and we are a country where a person is innocent until proven guilty - not the other way around.

And we are also taught that evidence beyond reasonable doubt infers guilt or innocence on the accused. A lack of indictment does not indicate a lack of guilt.

No, it doesn't - however, it's the best means we have in determining if there is sufficient evidence and more important - quality evidence. Not conspiracy theory. Not unproven allegations. And that sort of stuff has repeatedly been lobbed at her and then roundly debunked. And when her detractors don't like that - they attack the debunking sites as partisan with yet more conspiracy theories.

If we refuse to consider the quality of the evidence, or indictments themselves then what are we actually proving? Little more than we hate Mr. Z or Ms. Y and the facts be dammned.

Otherwise, it's just another witchhunt.

 

[skye]

Forward with Trump!!!!!!!

 

[SwimExpert]

Congress will go into recess before Trump takes office

And now, they won't be. They may be ineffective at passing laws, but they aren't stupid.

Apparently you're fucking stupid. In case you didn't notice, we just had an election yesterday. The new Congress will be sat come January 3rd. Trump won't take office until January 20th. It is impossible for Congress to not go into recess before Trump takes office. Fucking moron.

 

[Pumpkin Row]

We are a country of laws, and we are a country where a person is innocent until proven guilty - not the other way around. It may not work 100% of the time, but it's the BEST system humanity has yet to come with that is just and fair. Because of that - we do not submit people to trial by mob, or the court of public opinion. We require certain standards of evidence be met. We don't convict based on hearsay, innuendo, conspiracy theory or unsubtantiated rumor and there is a LOT of that going around.

If I were to label someone "evil" I darn well want proof and I would hope you would also.

Indictments mean there is sufficient evidence for a case to be made. Otherwise, consider the claims, hearsay, ,innuendo, hearsay, innuendo, conspiracy theory or unsubtantiated rumors going around concerning Donald Trump: women who have accused him of rape, sexual assault, and even child-rape (an ongoing lawsuit - not a criminal case). No indictments yet. Should we assume then "hearsay, innuendo, conspiracy theory or unsubtantiated rumors" carry the same weight as that of evidence gathered in criminal investigations that lead to indictments? If hold Trump to those same standards you use for Clinton - Trump is GUILTY of rape, sexual assault, child rape. Pretty evil stuff. And that is just one category of the many charges that get levied at him from his critics.

Again, proof was provided. You just ignored it, much like the media. If Hillary lies about it, well, that's all of the proof most Democrats need, hence her high number of votes from immoral people.

I never doubted that Donald Trump molested people. He's a bad person, and I've said he's a bad person many times on this forum. You seem to think I don't apply the same level of standards to every person. Difference here is that Donald Trump didn't commit crimes on the same level Hillary did. Besides, Hillary got a child rapist off, despite knowing he was guilty, and enabled a serial rapist. She's every bit as guilty as Trump would be.

Clinton is so techtarded she uses an ancient model of Blackberry that can't even be bought new anymore. She doesn't know how to use a desktop computer. So how exactly is she going to have a skill to evilly manipulate complex informational systems? She used a server because Colin Powell recommended it (and, I think it's important to point out here - others have done the same thing, and why? Becuase the US government, including the State Department uses incredibly primative technology, security is embarresingly poor, and they've been previously hacked). Clinton has other people downloading stuff for her. And she is supposed to be clever enough techwise to "bleach her servers"? I think if she were that clever she would have gotten rid of a whole lot more stuff with the "bleach" and that would have saved a lot of headache for her. Multiple investigations, DoJ, FBI, Republican Congress have failed to turn up anything significant other than the fact that she was reprehensibly careless and should have known better. THAT is a legitimate attack to use against her. The rest not so much given the lack of any real evidence to support it.

Techtarded? Solid President material, there.

Assuming I actually meant Hillary did it herself, directly(I highly doubt there's much she doesn't have other people do for her.) to suit your false Narrative. She literally said Colin Powell had nothing to do with her decision to use it, or at least(To be fair, she rarely keeps with one story. Common among lying pieces of trash.), she said it at one point. Covered in the questioning that was shown live. Not only all of that, but the problem wasn't the server at any point, it was how she used it. She didn't transfer her emails, which she was supposed to. She destroyed Federal Records, against the law. She destroyed the server, which is destruction of evidence. she claimed she turned over all emails, and she did not. She claimed she used one device, she did not. She was lying in an attempt to cover herself, and failed miserably. The only people who believed her were gullible people who will likely be weeded out by natural selection.

Also false, plenty was turned up, and that was reported to the people by Crooked Comie. He just suggested no indictment because God forbid justice be served on the Establishment's watch. Evidence was not lacked, non-crooked people to carry out justice was what was lacking. Morals were lacking.

If she was simply careless, she wouldn't have needed to lie, let alone constantly.

Even the whole "bleach" claim is hilariously misunderstood because Trump, same age as Clinton, is also, despite is aptitude with Twitter, is not very tech saavy himself. IF she had wanted to securely destroy information, using Bleachbit would not have been the best means of doing so. It's far more simple and thorough to physically destroy it or use other methods.

In other words, every criminal that is on the loose or has gotten off is innocent by default. I could steal some random person's cookie, and if I never face punishment, I'm not guilty of that action. I have to say, that's not a very logical outlook on life, especially given the evidence provided for us against Hillary.

We also just ignore evidence if the person in question is an establishment shill, and is running for president. Or maybe that's a requirement to be a Democrat.

If that claim is so demonstrably false, then how many others are little more than conspiracy theory as well?

On the Russians, there is considerable evidence that the Russians were behind the hacks and that is a conclusion that is accepted bipartisanly.

Except there is evidence for the other 'rumors' and 'hearsay', you just ignore it.

There's no actual evidence it was the Russians, and you totally ignored what I was pointing out. They didn't bother denying any of the emails were valid, they just blamed the Russians for hacking them. They said "MAYBE THEY WERE ALTERED" as an after thought WAY later.

What specific "betrayal"? She didn't commit treason, she didn't commit espionage and again - this is where I think indictments are important because at least then the evidence has to meet a certain standard. Corruption? Maybe. But then we've seen similar levels of corruption alleged with Trump and his foundation. So he gets to be "a jerk" and she is labeled "evil"? I think there are a lot of legitimate criticisms of Clinton - questionable personal ethics, possible corruption among others. But I don't see her as Lucifer incarnate.

I'm reserving evil for the Hitlers, Stalins, ISIS and those sort of nasty critters.

Oh please. Her handling of National secrets was easily treason, as was the Benghazi incident. You just don't want to admit that a Republican is a better choice than a Democrat.

I labeled them both varying degrees of evil, if you reread my post. Trump is significantly less evil because, again, Hillary affected the Nation with her massive corruption.

No, she's not Lucifer incarnate, just a spawn of Satan.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

You grasp that Republicans hold the house, right?

The same Republicans who despise Trump.

If the Republicans play the Democrat's game, Trump will use his pen and phone. Remember who set that precedent.

Notice the flip flops? It's a flip flop epidemic.

Congress will go into recess before Trump takes office. Just imagine if Obama uses his pen and phone to install Garland onto the court. Pande-fucking-monium.

If the republicans were smart they would call an emergency session and have a minimal number stay in DC to "work" it would strip obamas ability to appoint Garland without congress.

 

[Manonthestreet]

I would also remind op Obama called us all racists in his inaug ceremony.......first Official act was not an extended hand but hostility......

 

[Coyote]

I would also remind op Obama called us all racists in his inaug ceremony.......first Official act was not an extended hand but hostility......

Oh? Got a quote?

 

[Coyote]

You grasp that Republicans hold the house, right?

The same Republicans who despise Trump.

If the Republicans play the Democrat's game, Trump will use his pen and phone. Remember who set that precedent.

Notice the flip flops? It's a flip flop epidemic.

Congress will go into recess before Trump takes office. Just imagine if Obama uses his pen and phone to install Garland onto the court. Pande-fucking-monium.

If the republicans were smart they would call an emergency session and have a minimal number stay in DC to "work" it would strip obamas ability to appoint Garland without congress.

Recess appointments can't be used for Supreme Court nominees.

 

[Manonthestreet]

I would also remind op Obama called us all racists in his inaug ceremony.......first Official act was not an extended hand but hostility......

Oh? Got a quote?

Go read the prayers offered during the ceremony.......final paragraph........when I heard that I never listened to another word he said.
Rev. Joseph Lowery Inaugural Benediction. Transcript. - Steven Waldman

 

[oreo]

People are saying we should move on, give Mr. Trump a chance, etc. etc. And yes, we must move on. But my feeling is this - Trump supporters, who are telling me to do this - where were YOU when Obama won? Where was your "give the man a chance" when the Republicans stated out right, before he even entered office, that they would make him a one term president and proceeded to block every thing he attempted? Where were YOU when they insisted, that a man, voted into office by the WILL OF THE PEOPLE, who still had a year remaining in his presidency - was blocked from appointing a Supreme Court Justice as was his right? To then turn around and say we must be gracious and work with the new president is indeed a difficult pill to swallow. I will wait and see. I hope I will be mature enough to not applaud the opposition if they pull a page from the Republican's playbook in these matters...because these actions are truly not in the best interests of our country, but precedents have sadly been set. Trump has won, his supporters deserve what they get and I truly hope it's not as bad as I fear.

What I fear is this. Trump won't be able to unite us, because his character doesn't allow him to. He has stated multiple times, that he will go after those who criticized or opposed him (from individuals to the media), which makes me wonder if he will use the levers of the government he will soon control to do so. We have a justices system, and we should abide by it's decisions not succumb to pitchfork mobs claiming to be justice. It certainly should not be used to enact private revenge.

Can Trump unite us? Do his supporters even WANT that?

I will will wait until the 2014 midyear elections.

It's very possible that Trump will have problems with the Republican congress. Republicans have always been free trade--so when he goes after NAFTA agreements and others, he may find strong opposition to that.

Look those rusted out Factories in the rust belt are never going to open up again. You need investors to do that, and you're not going to find investors willing to do that when they'll still be competing with China and other countries that can operate and sell their products cheaper. IOW they aren't in business to lose money.

The Federal Government cannot force private sector companies to stay in this country, nor would a Republican congress agree to tariffs on American or foreign goods. They never work, they just drive up cost to the consumer and don't create a single job.

So Trump is going to have a heck of a time on these trade agreements, and I doubt he'll get anything done with them.

Trump's best bet is to work on Obamacare over the next two years, and get something done with that, because the midterm election cycle in two years will be coming up and I imagine that Democrats will be taking control of both houses. So it's critical he works on Obamacare now to bring these premiums down to reasonable. We'll see if he's got the brains to do that, or if he wanders off into other issues.

 

[Coyote]

I would also remind op Obama called us all racists in his inaug ceremony.......first Official act was not an extended hand but hostility......

Oh? Got a quote?

Go read the prayers offered during the ceremony.......final paragraph........when I heard that I never listened to another word he said.
Rev. Joseph Lowery Inaugural Benediction. Transcript. - Steven Waldman

Two problems here.

First. Obama didn't say any of it.

And second, final paragraph - that guy isn't calling you racist, more less they guy is calling on everyone to come to together in equality.

That is a real distortion - are really so desperate?

 

[Manonthestreet]

I would also remind op Obama called us all racists in his inaug ceremony.......first Official act was not an extended hand but hostility......

Oh? Got a quote?

Go read the prayers offered during the ceremony.......final paragraph........when I heard that I never listened to another word he said.
Rev. Joseph Lowery Inaugural Benediction. Transcript. - Steven Waldman

Two problems here.

First. Obama didn't say any of it.

And second, final paragraph - that guy isn't calling you racist, more less they guy is calling on everyone to come to together in equality.

That is a real distortion - are really so desperate?

Everything at an inaug is there on purpose by the President elect.......to believe otherwise is to be dishonest...and yes he is.......

 

[Tresha91203]

He wont actively try to divide us US citizens

Unless they're Muslim.
Or gay.
Or object to having their pussy grabbed.
Or say mean things about him on Twitter.

Trump is pretty moderate to liberal on social issues. He doesn't care if you are gay or straight or trans ... just doesn't care ... like most of us. Trump is against terrorists and those who see but don't say anything. Most Americans are.

Trump is an asshole. He mocks or offends the sensibilities of pretty much everyone equally. Too bad the other side kept anyone of merit running against Hillary. Only crazy Bernie dared and she had to cheat to beat him. She was quite literally the worst possible candidate. Worse than Trump even, who could have just as easily run on the D ticket.

Trump is who we've got. At least its not Hillary.

 

[SwimExpert]

He doesn't care if you are gay or straight or trans ... just doesn't care

You might want to inform Donald Trump, because he appears to have missed that memo.

 

[SwimExpert]

Recess appointments can't be used for Supreme Court nominees.

And when was that amendment ratified?

 

[SwimExpert]

If the republicans were smart they would call an emergency session and have a minimal number stay in DC to "work" it would strip obamas ability to appoint Garland without congress.

That's impossible. The Congress must, by definition, go out of session before January 3, 2017.

 

[koshergrl]

Obama won because of his race. The American people have rejected his policies resoundingly and nationwide.

And where were we? We sure as shit weren't RIOTING.

 

[koshergrl]

People are saying we should move on, give Mr. Trump a chance, etc. etc. And yes, we must move on. But my feeling is this - Trump supporters, who are telling me to do this - where were YOU when Obama won? Where was your "give the man a chance" when the Republicans stated out right, before he even entered office, that they would make him a one term president and proceeded to block every thing he attempted? Where were YOU when they insisted, that a man, voted into office by the WILL OF THE PEOPLE, who still had a year remaining in his presidency - was blocked from appointing a Supreme Court Justice as was his right? To then turn around and say we must be gracious and work with the new president is indeed a difficult pill to swallow. I will wait and see. I hope I will be mature enough to not applaud the opposition if they pull a page from the Republican's playbook in these matters...because these actions are truly not in the best interests of our country, but precedents have sadly been set. Trump has won, his supporters deserve what they get and I truly hope it's not as bad as I fear.

What I fear is this. Trump won't be able to unite us, because his character doesn't allow him to. He has stated multiple times, that he will go after those who criticized or opposed him (from individuals to the media), which makes me wonder if he will use the levers of the government he will soon control to do so. We have a justices system, and we should abide by it's decisions not succumb to pitchfork mobs claiming to be justice. It certainly should not be used to enact private revenge.

Can Trump unite us? Do his supporters even WANT that?

I will will wait until the 2014 midyear elections.

I voted for Obama in 2008 in the hope he would unite us. He failed miserably. People like me did not abandon Obama......Obama abandoned us.

Understand?

You're entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. But I think it needs to be pointed out that that failure rests on Congress - you remember those guys who said, before he ever entered office that they would make him a one-term president and block every bit of legislation he proposed? They certainly tried.

Yeah they were liars and campaigned on those promises..and then they didn't even try.

And now they're getting their asses sent home as well.

Poor commies.

Crow Busters - Crow Recipes

 

[SwimExpert]

Obama won because of his race. The American people have rejected his policies resoundingly and nationwide.

So that's why Hillary Clinton got more votes than Trump?

 

[koshergrl]

Clinton and all her disgusting criminal pals (the ones who aren't already rotting in prison) are going to prison.
Hello karma:

Giuliani on being attorney general: Nobody knows the DOJ better than me