Muslim baker...make me a Mohammed cake; Muslim hotel owner...host my pork festival; Can they refuse?

[Kondor3]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

 

[Syriusly]

Yep. I live in South Carolina. ..one of the only other states with such a law...which would allow the Muslim to say no based on religion.


But...I suggest folks in more liberal areas like California or New York....host a religious party cecelebrating diversity!

Find a Muslim owned bakery. Order a Jesus cake and a Buddah cake and especially a big beautiful prophet Mohammed cake!

Slice those delicious caricature cakes up and celebrate.

Im sure the tolerant liberals would agree that the Muslim baker cannot discriminate and will make me those cakes...including the Mohammed cake. His turban will.be cream cheese icing...yum...im slicing that head off first!

1) First find a Muslim baker who as part of his business decorates cakes with images on them (remember you cannot demand that a business provide a service or good it normally does not provide)
2) Then stand back and watch in dismay as the law does not apply to your scenario. The law doesn't say you have a right to be an idiot or a bigot- only that you provide your customary service regardless of race, religion, country of origin and in some places- sexual orientation.
3) Now- if that Muslim bakery refused to sell you a cake because you asked him to write "Jesus is King" on it- then you would have a case- and I would support your discrimination case against him.

ALL bakeries which make custom cakes create custom imaged cakes Jesus talk about stretching.

Feel free to show me a Muslim bakery which does make custom cakes with images on them.

I mean all of you are so proud of your flawed analogy- you must be able to find an example- right?

LOL......

Meanwhile- if that Muslim bakery refused to sell you a cake because you asked him to write "Jesus is King" on it- then you would have a case- and I would support your discrimination case against him

And you would still be wrong.

A man ought be free to tell ANY customer to get out of HIS business for ANY reason, or no reason at all. It's HIS business.

And that is your opinion.

Meanwhile, since 1964, business's have known that legally that is not correct.

Feel free to lead the charge to repeal the 1964 Civil Right Acts.

 

[Kondor3]

Yep. I live in South Carolina. ..one of the only other states with such a law...which would allow the Muslim to say no based on religion.


But...I suggest folks in more liberal areas like California or New York....host a religious party cecelebrating diversity!

Find a Muslim owned bakery. Order a Jesus cake and a Buddah cake and especially a big beautiful prophet Mohammed cake!

Slice those delicious caricature cakes up and celebrate.

Im sure the tolerant liberals would agree that the Muslim baker cannot discriminate and will make me those cakes...including the Mohammed cake. His turban will.be cream cheese icing...yum...im slicing that head off first!

1) First find a Muslim baker who as part of his business decorates cakes with images on them (remember you cannot demand that a business provide a service or good it normally does not provide)
2) Then stand back and watch in dismay as the law does not apply to your scenario. The law doesn't say you have a right to be an idiot or a bigot- only that you provide your customary service regardless of race, religion, country of origin and in some places- sexual orientation.
3) Now- if that Muslim bakery refused to sell you a cake because you asked him to write "Jesus is King" on it- then you would have a case- and I would support your discrimination case against him.

By that same logic, a Christian baker can say that he does not normally provide cake-top decorations of same-sex couples.

Problem solved, yes?

 

[Ravi]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

A muslim doesn't have to bake a cake with Mo on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else. A christian doesn't have to bake a cake with kill Jesus on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else.

How many times will you ask the same stupid questions?

 

[Ravi]

Yep. I live in South Carolina. ..one of the only other states with such a law...which would allow the Muslim to say no based on religion.


But...I suggest folks in more liberal areas like California or New York....host a religious party cecelebrating diversity!

Find a Muslim owned bakery. Order a Jesus cake and a Buddah cake and especially a big beautiful prophet Mohammed cake!

Slice those delicious caricature cakes up and celebrate.

Im sure the tolerant liberals would agree that the Muslim baker cannot discriminate and will make me those cakes...including the Mohammed cake. His turban will.be cream cheese icing...yum...im slicing that head off first!

1) First find a Muslim baker who as part of his business decorates cakes with images on them (remember you cannot demand that a business provide a service or good it normally does not provide)
2) Then stand back and watch in dismay as the law does not apply to your scenario. The law doesn't say you have a right to be an idiot or a bigot- only that you provide your customary service regardless of race, religion, country of origin and in some places- sexual orientation.
3) Now- if that Muslim bakery refused to sell you a cake because you asked him to write "Jesus is King" on it- then you would have a case- and I would support your discrimination case against him.

By that same logic, a Christian baker can say that he does not normally provide cake-top decorations of same-sex couples.

Problem solved, yes?

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But apparently many of you are too stupid to realize this.

 

[Kondor3]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Only if it is a product they offer. JESUS CHRIST you people are morons.

And our Christian baker does not offer cake-top decorations featuring same-sex couples.

Does that work for you, according to your logic?

 

[Ravi]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Only if it is a product they offer. JESUS CHRIST you people are morons.

And our Christian baker does not offer cake-top decorations featuring same-sex couples.

Does that work for you, according to your logic?

Yep.

 

[Kondor3]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

A muslim doesn't have to bake a cake with Mo on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else. A christian doesn't have to bake a cake with kill Jesus on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else.

How many times will you ask the same stupid questions?

As many times as it takes to get you Gay Mafia supporters to cut the Christian baker enough slack to wiggle out of baking the gay wedding cake featuring images of same-sex couples.

 

[Syriusly]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

Once again- look to the law- the law doesn't care about the religious beliefs of the business owner- only about whether the discrimination is lawful or not

The Colorado Civil Rights Commission is the state agency established to administer and enforce Colorado’s anti-discrimination laws in employment, housing and public accommodations. Colorado law prohibits such discrimination based on race, color, national origin, ancestry, sex, sexual orientation, creed, religion, disability (mental and physical), familial status (housing only), marital status (housing and public accommodations only), marriage to a co-worker (employment only), and age (employment only).

Who would either baker be discriminating against?

If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake to a gay couple because the couple are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to a gay couple- because they are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to Joe Blow, the asshole- because he is being an asshole- that is not covered by the law.

 

[Kondor3]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Only if it is a product they offer. JESUS CHRIST you people are morons.

And our Christian baker does not offer cake-top decorations featuring same-sex couples.

Does that work for you, according to your logic?

Yep.

There we go.

Problem solved.

Now...

What will your position be, when the Gay freak-a-zoids take the Christian baker to court, for refusing to affix a same-sex-couple decoration on top?

 

[Syriusly]

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

A muslim doesn't have to bake a cake with Mo on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else. A christian doesn't have to bake a cake with kill Jesus on it. But if he does it for one person, he cannot refuse to do it for anyone else.

How many times will you ask the same stupid questions?

As many times as it takes to get you Gay Mafia supporters to cut the Christian baker enough slack to wiggle out of baking the gay wedding cake featuring images of same-sex couples.

"Gay Mafia"= people who ask that business's follow the law.

 

[ogibillm]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Only if it is a product they offer. JESUS CHRIST you people are morons.

And our Christian baker does not offer cake-top decorations featuring same-sex couples.

Does that work for you, according to your logic?

Of course. Now if the baker allows couples to procure their own cake tops and that he then incorporates into the cake he would have to allow gay couples to do the same

 

[Kondor3]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

Once again- look to the law- the law doesn't care about the religious beliefs of the business owner- only about whether the discrimination is lawful or not

The Colorado Civil Rights Commission is the state agency established to administer and enforce Colorado’s anti-discrimination laws in employment, housing and public accommodations. Colorado law prohibits such discrimination based on race, color, national origin, ancestry, sex, sexual orientation, creed, religion, disability (mental and physical), familial status (housing only), marital status (housing and public accommodations only), marriage to a co-worker (employment only), and age (employment only).

Who would either baker be discriminating against?

If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake to a gay couple because the couple are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to a gay couple- because they are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to Joe Blow, the asshole- because he is being an asshole- that is not covered by the law.

We're not talking about The Law.

We're talking about what's Fair.

And, if the treatment of either baker is unfair, then, The Law is unfair, and needs to be changed, yes?

 

[manifold]

Pork festival would likely have to be allowed. I doubt the cake would have to be made. You can see the difference, right?

Nope. Im a customer making a lawful request. Jesus cake. Buddah cake. Mohammed cake. Even a Satan cake for Satanists. ...and one cake thats just solid black and no decorations for atheists.

Religious diversity party. I want Mohammeds turban to be cream cheese icing...slicing his head off first.

Baker is a public business. He has to make it.

I understand the point you're trying to make, but I don't believe it works that way.

In order to craft your hypothetical into a legitimate analog, you might consider this:

Find a Muslim baker, pick a cake from his catalog, and say you need it delivered to your Quran burning party. You see, the lesbo's weren't asking for a special "two dykes scissoring each other" cake, they just wanted a standard wedding cake.

 

[ogibillm]

A Christian being offended or inhibited from fashioning a cake with an image of a homosexual couple upon it, utilizing his religion's bans upon homosexuality as the basis for his refusal?

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

No

 

[Syriusly]

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

Again, it is my understanding that in the cases where bakers or others have been sued it is for refusing to sell a product to a gay couple that they would sell to a straight couple.

So if a gay couple orders a three tier wedding cake out of the baker's portfolio it would not be legal to refuse to sell to them because of their sexual orientation.

You only quoted half the post...

Please address the post in its entirety...

If someone orders a cake from a Muslim baker, with the image of the prophet Muhammed upon it, is the baker obliged to accommodate?

Probably not. that wouldn't be a cake they would sell to anybody.

No?

Your attempt at deflection is both duly noted and duly rejected and called-out.

Try again.

We are dealing in hypotheticals in order to determine the justice or injustice of what a Christian baker can and cannot refuse to bake and for whom.

The valid analogy to a Muslim baker has been served-up, with respect to a cake being ordered, that has the face of Muhammed upon it.

Let's assume for the sake of exploring this hypothetical - in the interest of justice and fairness and equal treatment, that the Christian has refused to bake a cake for a gay marriage, on the grounds that his religion labels homosexuality as immoral and sinful, and that the Muslim has refused to bake a cake with Muhammed's image upon it, on the grounds that his religion forbids graphic portrayals of the human form or the Prophet.

And let's also assume that for every Gay Wedding Cake being requested, that an equal number of Muhammed Face-Cakes are requested.

Is the Muslim baker obliged to bake the cake, just as the Christian baker is?

Yes or No.

Once again- look to the law- the law doesn't care about the religious beliefs of the business owner- only about whether the discrimination is lawful or not

The Colorado Civil Rights Commission is the state agency established to administer and enforce Colorado’s anti-discrimination laws in employment, housing and public accommodations. Colorado law prohibits such discrimination based on race, color, national origin, ancestry, sex, sexual orientation, creed, religion, disability (mental and physical), familial status (housing only), marital status (housing and public accommodations only), marriage to a co-worker (employment only), and age (employment only).

Who would either baker be discriminating against?

If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake to a gay couple because the couple are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to a gay couple- because they are gay- that is covered by the law.
If a Muslim or Christian baker refused to sell a cake with Mohammed's face on it to Joe Blow, the asshole- because he is being an asshole- that is not covered by the law.

We're not talking about The Law.

We're talking about what's Fair.

And, if the treatment of either baker is unfair, then, The Law is unfair, and needs to be changed, yes?

I don't think discrimination against customers based upon their race, religion, color, national origin, ancestry, gender, sexual orientation or disability is fair.

That is what the law addresses. That is why we go by the law rather than what you think is fair.

 

[Camp]

So this acolyte of the Algore Temple of Global Warming has a flat tire on his SUV on the way to choir practice.

I run a tire shop.

He calls me to fix his flat but I see his "Save the Planet" propaganda plastered all over the vehicle and I tell him to fix his own damn tire - 'cause to help him is against my religion.

Now what?

Now you hit upon the dilemma of these questions about Mohammed images on a cake or a pork festival conducted by Muslims or Jews. The religious doctrine regarding these things are absolute, certain and long established. You will not find experts that disagree with the claim that these things would absolutely violate an established religions beliefs and doctrines. Not so much with the Christian anti gay views. Many denominations of Christianity argue that the anti gay ideas held by many are anti Christian. Arguments are made that the anti gay idea is political and psychological and not really a teaching of Christianity. Can anyone one just make the claim that their decisions in life are guided by religious belief and be covered with the negative or harmful consequences by claiming religious belief?

 

[bucs90]

So...a Muslim baker should be forced to cater desserts for a black mans barbeque pork festival even if they dont believe in it??? Saying no would discriminate against the

Pork festival would likely have to be allowed. I doubt the cake would have to be made. You can see the difference, right?

Nope. Im a customer making a lawful request. Jesus cake. Buddah cake. Mohammed cake. Even a Satan cake for Satanists. ...and one cake thats just solid black and no decorations for atheists.

Religious diversity party. I want Mohammeds turban to be cream cheese icing...slicing his head off first.

Baker is a public business. He has to make it.

I understand the point you're trying to make, but I don't believe it works that way.

In order to craft your hypothetical into a legitimate analog, you might consider this:

Find a Muslim baker, pick a cake from his catalog, and say you need it delivered to your Quran burning party. You see, the lesbo's weren't asking for a special "two dykes scissoring each other" cake, they just wanted a standard wedding cake.

Fair enough. But I bet the Muslim would refuse catering the Koran burning party.

Cant discriminate against people..but CAN against events.

 

[Kondor3]

I don't think discrimination against customers based upon their race, religion, color, national origin, ancestry, gender, sexual orientation or disability is fair. That is what the law addresses. That is why we go by the law rather than what you think is fair.

Agreed.

We are, indeed, a Nation of Laws, and every American of goodwill is content that it be so.

So this acolyte of the Algore Temple of Global Warming has a flat tire on his SUV on the way to choir practice.

I run a tire shop.

He calls me to fix his flat but I see his "Save the Planet" propaganda plastered all over the vehicle and I tell him to fix his own damn tire - 'cause to help him is against my religion.

Now what?

Now you hit upon the dilemma of these questions about Mohammed images on a cake or a pork festival conducted by Muslims or Jews. The religious doctrine regarding these things are absolute, certain and long established. You will not find experts that disagree with the claim that these things would absolutely violate an established religions beliefs and doctrines. Not so much with the Christian anti gay views. Many denominations of Christianity argue that the anti gay ideas held by many are anti Christian. Arguments are made that the anti gay idea is political and psychological and not really a teaching of Christianity. Can anyone one just make the claim that their decisions in life are guided by religious belief and be covered with the negative or harmful consequences by claiming religious belief?

And many denominations hold otherwise.

What about the ones that hold otherwise?

Especially the ones that have held otherwise in a demonstrable pattern and history that stretches back centuries or even millennia?

 

[Kondor3]

...I don't think discrimination against customers based upon their race, religion, color, national origin, ancestry, gender, sexual orientation or disability is fair. That is what the law addresses. That is why we go by the law rather than what you think is fair.

We are in absolute agreement.

We are Nation of Laws, and every American of goodwill is content that it be so.

Now, we come to the matter of whether we are dealing with a Good or Bad Interpretation of Law, and whether a particular Law or range of Laws, are Good or Bad.

The first hurdle along the path to such an answer is to determine the relative merits and fairness of a given Law.

And, of course, it hardly seems Fair, to any objective soul, that some people are allowed to refuse business based upon Religious beliefs, while others are obliged to accept business despite their objections based upon Religious beliefs.

And, of course, if The Law is unfair, then it needs to be changed.

That may very well be the next legal Attack Vector, in combating the Gay Mafia.

Who, in their right mind, will want to argue against Fair, in the face of such unfairness?