Number of guns in society falling sharply

[Uncensored2008]

Katz -

For the 6,593th time - the NUMBER OF HOUSEHOLDS owning weapons has dropped.

It may well be that the total number of guns is up.

No it hasn't.

You were shown to be fabricating stats on this 70 pages back.

Gun ownership is at an all time high. Background check requests are at an all time high. Women taking hand gun training is at an all time high.

You of the anti-liberty side seem to thing that if you lie enough, you'll alter reality.

 

[Ernie S.]

Katz -

For the 6,593th time - the NUMBER OF HOUSEHOLDS owning weapons has dropped.

It may well be that the total number of guns is up.

NO!!! the number of households owning guns has gone up. Hell, the population has about doubled during the span you referred to early in the thread.
The percentage of households that own guns has gone down slightly.
Of course, then you have all the people who say "Nope, I don't have any guns here." for whatever reason.
Leading reason that we can infer from all the inner city gun violence is that there are a whole lot of guns in the possession of people who are not legally allowed to own guns. The second reason, as has been pointed out, is if someone calls me (legally allowed to own guns) and asks if I own a firearm, I will answer "No. I don't own A firearm." (I own MANY firearms.)

 

[Saigon]

Ernie

NO!!! the number of households owning guns has gone up.

Proof? Links?

 

[Saigon]

You of the anti-liberty side seem to thing that if you lie enough, you'll alter reality.

Says the person claiming New Zealand has a socialist government - and backs his claim up with an article from 1984. About a politician who was not socialist either.

 

[westwall]

Uncensored -

New Zealand has a CONSERVATIVE government. Period.

btw. New Zealand has NEVER had a socialist government.

You are a fucking moron (as if we didn't already know that) if you believe that. I spent a great deal of time in New Zealand in the late 1980's (I still own a home on the Coromandel) and yes, it was most certainly (and still is) essentially a socialist country. 3 million people live on the islands and 900,000 actually work. All the rest are on public assistance.

Medical care is free but terribly bad. The Christchurch hospital was less well equipped than the ski resorts we would go to. You see the ski resorts got money from tourism so had the latest and best.

In fact Langes government was brought down when it was reported that the government was paying for the Black Power gang to travel to Nelson for their annual get together.....after it had been reported that the gang was actually the highest grossing company in New Zealand.....and yes, it is a criminal gang. Back then they had revenues of 1 billion NZ. The next biggest company (legit) was Briarleys with a gross revenue of 340 million.

 

[westwall]

You of the anti-liberty side seem to thing that if you lie enough, you'll alter reality.

Says the person claiming New Zealand has a socialist government - and backs his claim up with an article from 1984. About a politician who was not socialist either.

I was there at the time and yes, he was a socialist, you silly liar.

 

[Unkotare]

Fact is, Japan is a society which has spent the last 2000 years making Suicide palatable.

Western society has done much to discourage it. .

More stupid, bigoted stereotyping from the left. What a surprise.

 

[Unkotare]

I do love how they cherry pick the information about Japan.

Yes, a country that has such institutions as "Kamikazes" and "Hari-Kiri" in their history are more likely to have a flippant attitude towards suicide.

Talk about cherry picking...you fucking bigot. All warrior societies have a history of similar practices and sentiments. YOU are cherry picking to justify your ignorance and fundamental racist attitude.

 

[Ernie S.]

Ernie -

Now Finland, the best I can find out is less than 0.1% black, so I would say that excluding blacks and Hispanics from our homicide rates would be a fairer comparison.

Finland has a terribly high homicide rate, because we have a very high level of gun ownership - I believe the 4th highest in the developed world.

We are no model for any country looking to lower the homicide rate.

The only difference is that most Finns are aware of this, and want to do better.

PLEASE use the quote function. If you are going to selectively quote my work, the very least you could do is provide the linkback for people to refer to.

 

[Unkotare]

Ernie -

Now Finland, the best I can find out is less than 0.1% black, so I would say that excluding blacks and Hispanics from our homicide rates would be a fairer comparison.

Finland has a terribly high homicide rate, because we have a very high level of gun ownership - I believe the 4th highest in the developed world.

We are no model for any country looking to lower the homicide rate.

The only difference is that most Finns are aware of this, and want to do better.

PLEASE use the quote function. If you are going to selectively quote my work, the very least you could do is provide the linkback for people to refer to.

It is not something he does by 'accident,' I suspect.

 

[Ernie S.]

Ernie

NO!!! the number of households owning guns has gone up.

Proof? Links?

1970 total US Households = 63,401
2013 total US households = 125,000 (extrapolated from 2002 data)
1970 50% of households had guns = 31,700 families had guns
2013 34% of households had guns = 42,500 families had guns

Simple math, really.

 

[Ernie S.]

Ernie -



Finland has a terribly high homicide rate, because we have a very high level of gun ownership - I believe the 4th highest in the developed world.

We are no model for any country looking to lower the homicide rate.

The only difference is that most Finns are aware of this, and want to do better.

PLEASE use the quote function. If you are going to selectively quote my work, the very least you could do is provide the linkback for people to refer to.

It is not something he does by 'accident,' I suspect.

It's something he, Jake and poo it have learned from TDM.

 

[Ernie S.]

Saigon -

We [Finns] are no model for any country looking to be regarded as intellectually honest

See how that works, Gook?

 

[Missourian]

Uncensored -

New Zealand, Belgium, and France - all leftist enclaves of zero gun rights, all have higher rates.

Oh dear.

New Zealand has a CONSERVATIVE government, genius. Belgium has a blue-red coalition, so you are batting 0.33.

I'm not sure Joe has ever said guns CAUSE suicide, but I know I haven't. Guns ENABLE suicide, and that has been statistically proven in Australia.

This argument is undermined by the UK suicide rates which after being on the decline, spiked AFTER the 1997 Firearms Act, and remained at that heightened level for 4 years...resuming the decline at a similar rate as before the 1997 confiscation.

​

You'll also notice that the suicide rate in the UK is only .2 less per 100,000 than the U.S. (11.8 and 12 respectively) with only 4% of UK suicides being by firearm.

The method of suicide transferred from firearms to hanging and poisoning.

Obviously rope ENABLES hanging and the solution is to restrict it's sale?

If common sense didn't show the error of this reasoning...the historical evidence above should prove it.

They banned firearms and that didn't reduce their suicides at a rate faster than it was already declining...ban rope and they'll asphyxiate themselves with carbon monoxide...ban combustion engines and they'll leap from tall buildings...ad infinitum...

 

[M14 Shooter]

He's got the idiot part down pat. The useful part needs work.

And yet it is the two of you and Rabbi who have spent the last two week's spamming the thread with comments such as these.

Say what you like about Joe - he has stuck to the topic!

Yes he spams (as do you) with false facts. That's not discussion, that's propaganda.

In both cases, it is best described as lying.

Further proof that the anti-gun loons cannot argue from anything other than emotion, ignorance and/or dihonesty.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

 

[Missourian]

Watch this.

There were 16,259 homicides a year in the U.S.

Four percent of the U.S. population is LGBT.

If we assume that LGBT's account for an equal proportion of murders as their proportion of the population...that's 650 murders committed by gays.

There were 679 homicides committed using any type of long gun...included are all shotguns and rifles.

Of this category, so called "assault rifles" make up 5% of long guns in the U.S., but just for arguments sake we'll attribute a ridiculously high 25% of all long gun homicides to "assault weapons"...170 homicides.

650 homicides committed by homosexuals and 170 homicides committed using so called "assault weapons" total in the U.S.

Will Ferrell is almost four time more likely to be killed by a homosexual than an assault rifle.

 

[Meister]

Ernie

NO!!! the number of households owning guns has gone up.

Proof? Links?

1970 total US Households = 63,401
2013 total US households = 125,000 (extrapolated from 2002 data)
1970 50% of households had guns = 31,700 families had guns
2013 34% of households had guns = 42,500 families had guns

Simple math, really.

Have you tried to buy ammo lately? Shheeeesh, I had to wait 2 weeks to pick up some 45-70's.....this was at Cabelas.....4 boxes came in and I picked up 3 of them, left one for seed.
I tried to get the ammo at other sporting goods stores and online, they all were backlogged.

Yes, we have less households owning guns these days.
I think there are still plenty that have the guns.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Ernie




Proof? Links?

1970 total US Households = 63,401
2013 total US households = 125,000 (extrapolated from 2002 data)
1970 50% of households had guns = 31,700 families had guns
2013 34% of households had guns = 42,500 families had guns

Simple math, really.

Have you tried to buy ammo lately? Shheeeesh, I had to wait 2 weeks to pick up some 45-70's.....this was at Cabelas.....4 boxes came in and I picked up 3 of them, left one for seed.
I tried to get the ammo at other sporting goods stores and online, they all were backlogged.

Yes, we have less households owning guns these days.
I think there are still plenty that have the guns.

I have about 35 contacts for ammo I'm buying it left and right. None on line all local sources. The only type of ammo that seems to be a problem is 22 LR and 45 acp.

 

[Missourian]

1970 total US Households = 63,401
2013 total US households = 125,000 (extrapolated from 2002 data)
1970 50% of households had guns = 31,700 families had guns
2013 34% of households had guns = 42,500 families had guns

Simple math, really.

Have you tried to buy ammo lately? Shheeeesh, I had to wait 2 weeks to pick up some 45-70's.....this was at Cabelas.....4 boxes came in and I picked up 3 of them, left one for seed.
I tried to get the ammo at other sporting goods stores and online, they all were backlogged.

Yes, we have less households owning guns these days.
I think there are still plenty that have the guns.

I have about 35 contacts for ammo I'm buying it left and right. None on line all local sources. The only type of ammo that seems to be a problem is 22 LR and 45 acp.

Can't get anything out here. No .17HMR, no .22, no 9mm, no .223, no 30-30...

No handgun ammunition at all.

My local Wal-mart was out of 12 Gauge shotshells!

They had some slugs and buckshot, but #3 on down was MIA.

I scrounged around and got enough #5 and #6 to do some squirrel hunting...but just barely.

Bass Pro has plenty of 30-.06 and .270...and some of the more esoteric rounds, but they are pretty tapped out.