Obama the record setter

[Freewill]

No growth in the US GNP since 2010, is that the point you are making?

 

[Mac1958]

We're not going to fully or honestly understand the true level of global contagion from the most complicated financial meltdown in history for a while.

Until then, this stuff is just political catnip.
.

Really? After 8 years, we still don't know? Who is still trying to figure it out? In 8 years it couldn't be figured out so action could be taken? That is scary. What is maybe worse is that action was taken.

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

I didn't say I have no idea what happened. I said we don't yet know the full extent of the damage or its long term ramifications, and we probably won't for a while.

The US was definitely the epicenter of the Meltdown, but because the global economy is so symbiotic, every advanced country was, and is, adversely affected.

Yes, I'm worried about the contagion too. What I'm seeing, however, is a lot of partisan slap-fighting and finger-pointing that does nothing to address it.
.

Let's back up here. What we are seeing is not the effect of the metldown per se but the effects of policies enacted because of it. Dodd Frank was enacted in direct response to the meltdown. And it has achived its purpose in turning banks into essentially gov't monopolies. This has stifled innovation and dynamism in the economy. A nd that is merely one example. The moral hazard of too big to fail has been enshrined in law and figures into many calculations. GM's sham bankruptcy and creditor screw still plays in people's minds.
But the meltdown was not felt in every country. Israel managed to avoid it, thanks in large part to the brilliant Bank of Israel President who now sits on the Fed. Germany was far less affected than other countries in part because it refused to engage in the wholesale monkeying with the economy the US did.
The main issue is slow to no growth caused by gov't policies. Zero interest rates have failed to move that, and negative ones won't do any better.

Well, I guess I can get started on that book.

We're not going to fully or honestly understand the true level of global contagion from the most complicated financial meltdown in history for a while.

Until then, this stuff is just political catnip.
.

Really? After 8 years, we still don't know? Who is still trying to figure it out? In 8 years it couldn't be figured out so action could be taken? That is scary. What is maybe worse is that action was taken.

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

I didn't say I have no idea what happened. I said we don't yet know the full extent of the damage or its long term ramifications, and we probably won't for a while.

The US was definitely the epicenter of the Meltdown, but because the global economy is so symbiotic, every advanced country was, and is, adversely affected.

Yes, I'm worried about the contagion too. What I'm seeing, however, is a lot of partisan slap-fighting and finger-pointing that does nothing to address it.
.

I provided you with a link: What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

It might be too simple of an explanation for you, being a professional as you like to point out. But for me it makes the situation very easy to understand and there are no politics involved.

Maybe using that site for a reference, has the US done anything to stop this from happening again? I already see a housing bubble forming.

There was far more to it than that. Greenspan keeping interest rates too low for too long and refusing to regulate markets or insane derivatives, abject failure of the ratings agencies to do their job, those insane derivatives being marketed globally, consumers knowing they were biting off more than they could chew. Pretty much every rule of prudent monetary and personal finance were ignored for too long.

There have been some improvements, but the banks are still Too Big To Fail. The housing bubble was coast to coast last time, not this time. We're not heading into 2008/2009.
.

 

[g5000]

No growth in the US GNP since 2010, is that the point you are making?

The point is the US is doing better than the UK and the Eurozone. The point is that there are global forces affecting our economy.

Dumbshit.

 

[Freewill]

The number one threat to the US is the federal debt. It's a bigger threat than the Muslims in your closet, the Mexicans under your bed, the homosexuals in your cake, and the Ebola in your toothpaste, combined.

Now I know how much you retards like to blame the other other guy, or the other party, for this problem, and that's just how your puppet masters want you to think, as they steal more and more from you and your future.

Divide and conquer.

Don't be such saps.

Rewind back to 2008/2009. Remember the fight within the RNC over bailing out the auto industry? Remember the fight about the stimulus plans? Remember the predictions? See what is happening? Instead of making those banks that did this to us we bailed them out. Painful it would have been but we would have climbed out. But this massive debt put on us to bail out banks to big to fail, we may never recover. And no, the Iraqi war was not the problem.

 

[g5000]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

 

[Freewill]

No growth in the US GNP since 2010, is that the point you are making?

The point is the US is doing better than the UK and the Eurozone. The point is that there are global forces affecting our economy.

Dumbshit.

Oh good, all three got punched in the face, the US's hurt less because we stopped bleeding sooner.

 

[g5000]

The number one threat to the US is the federal debt. It's a bigger threat than the Muslims in your closet, the Mexicans under your bed, the homosexuals in your cake, and the Ebola in your toothpaste, combined.

Now I know how much you retards like to blame the other other guy, or the other party, for this problem, and that's just how your puppet masters want you to think, as they steal more and more from you and your future.

Divide and conquer.

Don't be such saps.

Rewind back to 2008/2009. Remember the fight within the RNC over bailing out the auto industry? Remember the fight about the stimulus plans? Remember the predictions? See what is happening? Instead of making those banks that did this to us we bailed them out. Painful it would have been but we would have climbed out. But this massive debt put on us to bail out banks to big to fail, we may never recover. And no, the Iraqi war was not the problem.

The Republicans were busy doubling the federal debt when they had the reins of power. That's all you need to know to explode the myth that the Democrats are the only big spenders.

It took both parties to run up this debt. Obama had barely anything to do with it.

As for the zombie banks, they should have been propped up only long enough to break them up and sell off the pieces.

In the next crash, the banks are going to be Too Big To Save.

 

[Mac1958]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

 

[g5000]

No growth in the US GNP since 2010, is that the point you are making?

The point is the US is doing better than the UK and the Eurozone. The point is that there are global forces affecting our economy.

Dumbshit.

Oh good, all three got punched in the face, the US's hurt less because we stopped bleeding sooner.

We are the proverbial cleanest shirt in a pile of dirty shirts.

This hack partisan bullshit of finger pointing at Obama or Bush or who the fuck ever, is retarded.

The person most responsible for our debt is looking back at you in the mirror. The sooner we face the TRUTH, the sooner we can recover.

I fear that isn't not going to happen, though. I think you tards are too far gone.

 

[g5000]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

 

[Mac1958]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Yes, it was far more than a housing bubble.
.

 

[Freewill]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Is there a bubble in bonds?

In order for a crash there has to be "pretend" value. Such as the inflated value of housing. When the housing market bubble burst the prices of housing didn't crash to zero they crash to a value of where they should have been. Only problem, people and banks were stuck with pretend equity. Banks had over extended themselves and with held loans, the economy that depends on loans contracted.

 

[g5000]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Is there a bubble in bonds?

Hello? ZIRP! NIRP! Derp!

 

[Slade3200]

Sub 3% growth is a disaster. IT is the reason recent college grads are living in mom's basement unable to find more than a part time job and posting on this forum. It is the reason people are putting off getting married and having children. It is stagnation and loss of status in the world. And it is all due to Obama's policies, which have penalized success and supplemented failure. He is the POTUS: Piece of Totally Useless Shit.

Bush vs. Obama who's policy's were better for America?

Bush, hands down.

Explain... as I remember the Bush term ending with a pretty bad economic crash and a war that the majority of Americans in both sides feel was a Yuuuge mistake or flat out deception.

 

[Slade3200]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Is there a bubble in bonds?

In order for a crash there has to be "pretend" value. Such as the inflated value of housing. When the housing market bubble burst the prices of housing didn't crash to zero they crash to a value of where they should have been. Only problem, people and banks were stuck with pretend equity. Banks had over extended themselves and with held loans, the economy that depends on loans contracted.

Yes, the banks have way too much control, corruption, and fraud. This extends to many levels of our political system as well. It was responsible for the economic collapse and the slow recovery and amazingly enough, NOTHING was really done about it... We are back to business as usual. It baffles me. Whether you like him or not you gotta give Bernie Sanders some credit for blasting this message across America... We need to open our ears

 

[Slade3200]

We're not going to fully or honestly understand the true level of global contagion from the most complicated financial meltdown in history for a while.

Until then, this stuff is just political catnip.
.

Really? After 8 years, we still don't know? Who is still trying to figure it out? In 8 years it couldn't be figured out so action could be taken? That is scary. What is maybe worse is that action was taken.

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

Well, okay, maybe you're right. I'm in the business, and we think that the contagion is still playing out, but maybe you know.

I don't know a damn thing about why it happened, it isn't my job, it is YOUR job as far as I understand. I have opinions but that is about it. I hired a financial adviser to tell me what went wrong and what to do. If you are telling me he and you have no real idea then what in the hell are we paying you for? I could make guesses in the stock market and do as well as he is doing.

So in your opinion, what has been the global macro effect of the Meltdown, why are credit markets around the world still so mangled, and when did the contagion stop being a factor in financial markets?

Again, I worked in maintenance and operations my entire life, I am not an expert on the economy. Interesting you said "what are the effects" instead of "what were the causes." Apparently something went on to cause a global meltdown. The question, which would seem to be an easy one to answer is, did the US drag down the rest of the world or did they all fall together? If the former then that isolates the question to the US. If the later that does make it harder but not impossible to determine. I don't see what is going to change to make people understand, or maybe that is the way "they" want it.

What you are saying about a contagion is what worries me. It is like saying that people are dying but in 8 years we don't know why.

I'll fall back on what my Father told me 50 years ago. He said that every once in awhile the rich take back their money. That to me seems to be exactly what happened. If we are waiting for that to be the answer found, I think we will still be waiting 8 years from now.

Let me know, I'll write a freakin' book.

I am not sure what set you undies on fire. I just think that after 8 years the wonderment would be gone. It seems that books have already been written. Here is an article that may be of interest to you.

What Caused the Financial Crisis & Recession? | Positive Money

I didn't say I have no idea what happened. I said we don't yet know the full extent of the damage or its long term ramifications, and we probably won't for a while.

The US was definitely the epicenter of the Meltdown, but because the global economy is so symbiotic, every advanced country was, and is, adversely affected.

Yes, I'm worried about the contagion too. What I'm seeing, however, is a lot of partisan slap-fighting and finger-pointing that does nothing to address it.
.

Let's back up here. What we are seeing is not the effect of the metldown per se but the effects of policies enacted because of it. Dodd Frank was enacted in direct response to the meltdown. And it has achived its purpose in turning banks into essentially gov't monopolies. This has stifled innovation and dynamism in the economy. A nd that is merely one example. The moral hazard of too big to fail has been enshrined in law and figures into many calculations. GM's sham bankruptcy and creditor screw still plays in people's minds.
But the meltdown was not felt in every country. Israel managed to avoid it, thanks in large part to the brilliant Bank of Israel President who now sits on the Fed. Germany was far less affected than other countries in part because it refused to engage in the wholesale monkeying with the economy the US did.
The main issue is slow to no growth caused by gov't policies. Zero interest rates have failed to move that, and negative ones won't do any better.

True the government regulations are a wet blanket of sorts, but are you honestly advocating for how things were before? You think if we lift all the regulations and let the banks and lenders take back full control they will magically turn into saints and value fairness and compassion over their paychecks. Greed destroyed that industry and they did it to themselves. They can not be trusted. The government has its fair shares of dirt as well but really what choice do we have?

What we should really do is take it a step further and break them up!

 

[Slade3200]

The number one threat to the US is the federal debt. It's a bigger threat than the Muslims in your closet, the Mexicans under your bed, the homosexuals in your cake, and the Ebola in your toothpaste, combined.

Now I know how much you retards like to blame the other other guy, or the other party, for this problem, and that's just how your puppet masters want you to think, as they steal more and more from you and your future.

Divide and conquer.

Don't be such saps.

Rewind back to 2008/2009. Remember the fight within the RNC over bailing out the auto industry? Remember the fight about the stimulus plans? Remember the predictions? See what is happening? Instead of making those banks that did this to us we bailed them out. Painful it would have been but we would have climbed out. But this massive debt put on us to bail out banks to big to fail, we may never recover. And no, the Iraqi war was not the problem.

Do you understand why we bailed the banks out? Do you know the effects that would have happened to us common folk if the government wouldn't have bailed them out?

 

[Freewill]

The housing bubble was coast to coast last time
.

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Is there a bubble in bonds?

Hello? ZIRP! NIRP! Derp!

So why do you think the next crash will be bonds? they seem to me to be already crashing. And if they crash even more we are really screwed.

 

[Freewill]

The number one threat to the US is the federal debt. It's a bigger threat than the Muslims in your closet, the Mexicans under your bed, the homosexuals in your cake, and the Ebola in your toothpaste, combined.

Now I know how much you retards like to blame the other other guy, or the other party, for this problem, and that's just how your puppet masters want you to think, as they steal more and more from you and your future.

Divide and conquer.

Don't be such saps.

Rewind back to 2008/2009. Remember the fight within the RNC over bailing out the auto industry? Remember the fight about the stimulus plans? Remember the predictions? See what is happening? Instead of making those banks that did this to us we bailed them out. Painful it would have been but we would have climbed out. But this massive debt put on us to bail out banks to big to fail, we may never recover. And no, the Iraqi war was not the problem.

Do you understand why we bailed the banks out? Do you know the effects that would have happened to us common folk if the government wouldn't have bailed them out?

Well considering the effects that the bail outs had, the banks tightening loans, the effects of no bailout to us would have been bad for sure. But we would have taken our lumps then and moved on. It appears to me, and I can be very wrong, that we didn't fix anything, we went into deep debt and are heading for the same thing to happen all over again. Except this time we don't have the debt to buy ourselves out of it and we are in worse shape in the economy.

I don't truth Mrs. Tuluza Clinton to fix it, we need Trump.

 

[Mac1958]

No, the derivatives bubble was global.

I think he's talking about housing prices only.
.

If this was just a housing bubble, it would not have done anywhere near the damage which occurred.

This was a derivatives bubble. Houses just happened to be the underlying assets, but it could just as easily have been tulips.

The next crash, it will be bonds.

Is there a bubble in bonds?

Hello? ZIRP! NIRP! Derp!

So why do you think the next crash will be bonds? they seem to me to be already crashing. And if they crash even more we are really screwed.

The crash would be in the price of bonds, not the yields. It's a teeter totter - yields are extremely low, prices are extremely high.

This will depend on how well the Fed backs out of QE. Too fast or too slow and rates could spike. This is all a function of the money-printing we've been doing for years.

The crash is not a sure thing by any means, but it definitely is possible. Ironically, the mediocre growth we've seen has kept interest rates at bay for the most part.
.