Palestine Today

[P F Tinmore]

'This Divestment Bill Hurts My Feelings', by Remi Kanazi

 

[rylah]

All lies. There is no Israeli occupation, rather there is security control. The Arabs in the territories are citizens of the PA and receive travel documents from the PA that are widely recognized by other countries. They have the right to vote in PA elections and are free to build and farm in areas A and B, as per the Oslo agreement. Only terrorists are shot and only the homes of terrorists are bulldozed. None of them are having their land taken away from them and Israeli courts have restored land that may have been taken unjustly in the past.

Correction. Only PALESTINIAN terrorists.

My point, of course, is that the only Palestinians who are shot are terrorists and then only when it is not possible to subdue them without putting others in danger. You, of course, are only capable of seeing this situation in racist terms.

That isn’t true. Non terrorists have been shot, though to be fair, compared to many, the IDF is exceedingly careful of civilian casualties.

How many homes of Jewish terrorists have been bulldozed? I will wait.

Oh...and enlighten me on all this supposed racism because I am not seeing it.

You post this because you are unable to see things except through racist eyes. Only terrorists have been de;oberately shot and only when they could not be subdued in other ways without endangering more people. I am unaware of any cases in which Jewish terrorists could not be subdued without lethal force. Clearly, it would never occur to you to ask about the circumstances under which terrorists have been shot.

What is racist about what what I said? Your fall back seems to be to scream racist.

What have I said that is racist?

You did not answer my question. Why is it Jewish terrorists do not get their family homes bulldozed?

The question is about citizenship rather than ethnicity.
And cultural focus on death culture backed by a state policy of incentives for individuals to commit murder and suicide.

You don't expect a country to punish its murderers as those of an enemy state.

 

[Coyote]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, et al,

This is true, as far as it goes.

Rocco, most stone throwing is, despite bad outcomes, the result of angry kids...not terrorism, right?

But if the intent is to terrorize a particular group of people...then it becomes terrorism doesn’t it? So if Palestinians do it for that reason and Jews do it for that reason,they are the same, yes?

(COMMENT)

The "stone-throwing" is NOT an "act of terrorism" (in and by itself). It is a "criminal act" that results in the support, facilitates of terrorist activity; or encouraging terrorist activities.

Stone-throwing is also used as a means to incite further violence. In some cases, "stone-throwing" is an action that is specifically designed to be a media event contrived and choreographed for maximum presentation for a propaganda effect of exaggerated events.

Remember, "stone-throwing" is against International Humanitarian Law. It is not justified action or response to enforcement of law and order by any force construed to be an "Occupying Power."

₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪​

I have noticed that the pro-Hostile Arab Palestinians movements like to portray the Arab Palestinian as victims using "stone-throwing" against a foreign oppressor as a lawful sign of displeasure. Conditioning the statement as if the act were legal and the Israeli response against the assault is illegal. Such an interpretation is 180º out of phase with the truth.


Most Respectfully,
R

Then would you agree that Jewish stone throwers (as in the settlers stoning Palestinians) acting the same as the Palestinians?

 

[toomuchtime_]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, et al,

This is true, as far as it goes.

Rocco, most stone throwing is, despite bad outcomes, the result of angry kids...not terrorism, right?

But if the intent is to terrorize a particular group of people...then it becomes terrorism doesn’t it? So if Palestinians do it for that reason and Jews do it for that reason,they are the same, yes?

(COMMENT)

The "stone-throwing" is NOT an "act of terrorism" (in and by itself). It is a "criminal act" that results in the support, facilitates of terrorist activity; or encouraging terrorist activities.

Stone-throwing is also used as a means to incite further violence. In some cases, "stone-throwing" is an action that is specifically designed to be a media event contrived and choreographed for maximum presentation for a propaganda effect of exaggerated events.

Remember, "stone-throwing" is against International Humanitarian Law. It is not justified action or response to enforcement of law and order by any force construed to be an "Occupying Power."

₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪​

I have noticed that the pro-Hostile Arab Palestinians movements like to portray the Arab Palestinian as victims using "stone-throwing" against a foreign oppressor as a lawful sign of displeasure. Conditioning the statement as if the act were legal and the Israeli response against the assault is illegal. Such an interpretation is 180º out of phase with the truth.


Most Respectfully,
R

Then would you agree that Jewish stone throwers (as in the settlers stoning Palestinians) acting the same as the Palestinians?

Obviously, when Israelis and Palestinians are throwing stones at eah other they are doing the same thing.

 

[Coyote]

How many Area C settlements include Arabs?

How many settlements are Jewish only?

How many are Arab only?

Your hypocrisy is in calling out Jews for Jewish-only settlements while failing to call out Arabs for Arab-only settlements in Area C (and Areas A and B and Gaza and the entire ME).

How is it hypocritical? You are comparing apples and oranges in Area C. The settlement program is a POLITICAL program. Not a random migration of peoples into new areas. Not the unjust expulsion of Jews from multiple Arab countries if that is what you are referring to. All that is is attempting to divert away from a particular issue.

You want to talk how wrong it was for Arab countries to expel their Jews? Fine, because I am pretty sure we agree on that.

You want talk about how Arab countries refuse to allow Jews to live there? I suspect we agree on the wrongness of that.

You want to talk about how the Palestinians won’t allow Jews to remain there? I suspect we agree there too, it is wrong.

So let’s actually discuss settlements without mandating calling out all these other things. Settlements of ISRAELI CITIZENS. Not Palestinians, but citizens who are supposed to all have the same rights except for settlements.

It is especially egregious since Israel's legal system demands equality while Palestine's legal system demands segregation. Arabs demanding to live in an Israeli settlement will be legally supported. Jews demanding to live in an Arab settlement will be murdered.

Legally...in law..yes. But practice? When municipal governments act otherwise?

Israeli Arabs suffer from the same housing shortages and overcrowding (possibly more so) as Jews. So..why no Hill Top Arab settlements?

 

[rylah]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, et al,

This is true, as far as it goes.

Rocco, most stone throwing is, despite bad outcomes, the result of angry kids...not terrorism, right?

But if the intent is to terrorize a particular group of people...then it becomes terrorism doesn’t it? So if Palestinians do it for that reason and Jews do it for that reason,they are the same, yes?

(COMMENT)

The "stone-throwing" is NOT an "act of terrorism" (in and by itself). It is a "criminal act" that results in the support, facilitates of terrorist activity; or encouraging terrorist activities.

Stone-throwing is also used as a means to incite further violence. In some cases, "stone-throwing" is an action that is specifically designed to be a media event contrived and choreographed for maximum presentation for a propaganda effect of exaggerated events.

Remember, "stone-throwing" is against International Humanitarian Law. It is not justified action or response to enforcement of law and order by any force construed to be an "Occupying Power."

₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪​

I have noticed that the pro-Hostile Arab Palestinians movements like to portray the Arab Palestinian as victims using "stone-throwing" against a foreign oppressor as a lawful sign of displeasure. Conditioning the statement as if the act were legal and the Israeli response against the assault is illegal. Such an interpretation is 180º out of phase with the truth.


Most Respectfully,
R

Then would you agree that Jewish stone throwers (as in the settlers stoning Palestinians) acting the same as the Palestinians?

Except almost no Israeli does that,
while it's a wide spread cultural phenomena among Muslims backed by their states,
also practiced as capital punishment for transgressing Sharia.

When Israelis throw stones it's a scoop for the news, while a common practice among Arabs that everyone takes for granted.

 

[Coyote]

That isn’t true. Non terrorists have been shot, though to be fair, compared to many, the IDF is exceedingly careful of civilian casualties.

How many homes of Jewish terrorists have been bulldozed? I will wait.

Oh...and enlighten me on all this supposed racism because I am not seeing it.

Besides Baruch Goldstein, how many Jewish terrorists have there been?

If stone throwers are terrorists then the ones that have lobbed stones at Palestinians, including one that killed a Palestinian mother; the ones that kidnapped an Arab boy, poured gasoline on him and burned him alive; the ones that firebombed a house in Duma killing most of the family inside. If you consider non lethal assaults and property destruction to be terrorism then there are more examples.

Did any Jewish terrorist homes get bulldozed?

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

 

[rylah]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, toomuchtime_, et al,

Well, I don't think that is what International Law says.

Only terrorists are shot and only the homes of terrorists are bulldozed. None of them are having their land taken away from them and Israeli courts have restored land that may have been taken unjustly in the past.

Correction. Only PALESTINIAN terrorists.

(COMMENT)

What I think it says, and what is being done, in the case obligations under international law of is this:

1. Calls upon all States to adopt such measures as may be necessary and appropriate and in accordance with their obligations under international law to:

(a) Prohibit by law incitement to commit a terrorist act or acts;

(b) Prevent such conduct;

(c) Deny safe haven to any persons with respect to whom there is credible and relevant information giving serious reasons for considering that they have been guilty of such conduct;​

​

This comes under the much broader heading of “Denying Safe Haven to those who Finance, Plan, Support or Commit Terrorist Acts or Provide Safe Havens, and Preventing Terrorists from Abusing the Asylum System, in conformity with International Law”. This can be seen in more detail in the Open briefing of the Counter-Terrorism Committee.

This is the implementation of clearing property that “constitutes a severe security threat and can provide cover to suicide bombers and other terrorists hiding among civilian population.”

(OTHER CONCERNS)

This is not to be confused with the process by which private property is taken for the purpose of public use. Prior to the taking, the property is said to be “condemned property”, meaning that it has been marked for destruction or modification in order that the plot of land can be used for public use.

And we should not get this confused with the condemnation of "substandard buildings" under the provisions of the Occupation Law, which, in addition thereto, presents an immediate and imminent threat to public safety. Such threats may arise by virtue of numerous circumstances such as, but not limited to, substantial risk of collapse or danger of fire.


Most Respectfully,
R

The original premise was: only the homes of terrorists are bulldozed.

This is not true. The vast number of homes bulldozed is for Israel to steal the land.

That's just a silly sound byte.

When a squatter builds a shack in the middle of Central Park, it doesn't become his land.
Neither law enforcement is "stealing land" when applied to illegal Arab settlements.

So, Palestinians building on their own land is an illegal settlement.

Another silly sound byte.

That's the same if you name your daughter 'New York' and whine claiming its "her land" when removed from a shack in the middle of Times Square.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

Besides Baruch Goldstein, how many Jewish terrorists have there been?

If stone throwers are terrorists then the ones that have lobbed stones at Palestinians, including one that killed a Palestinian mother; the ones that kidnapped an Arab boy, poured gasoline on him and burned him alive; the ones that firebombed a house in Duma killing most of the family inside. If you consider non lethal assaults and property destruction to be terrorism then there are more examples.

Did any Jewish terrorist homes get bulldozed?

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

Of course the murder of that Arab boy was unjustified, and especially because of the particularly horrible way he died. Still, though, it did not happen out of the blue, and did not come out of nowhere. The nation of Israel is very small and the kidnapping of the 3 Israeli boys plunged the entire country into a national tragedy. Everyone was praying for them, including Diaspora Jews. My mom, sister and even my sensitive nephew all shed tears over them. The fact that they were missing for quite some time, were prayed over, and then finally found dead, all played into the national trauma. As tragic as the Arab boy's death was, it didn't happen inside of a vaccuum. Leaving out the background and context of the Arab boy's murder is kind of misleading, imo.

 

[rylah]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, toomuchtime_, et al,

Well, I don't think that is what International Law says.

Correction. Only PALESTINIAN terrorists.

(COMMENT)

What I think it says, and what is being done, in the case obligations under international law of is this:

1. Calls upon all States to adopt such measures as may be necessary and appropriate and in accordance with their obligations under international law to:

(a) Prohibit by law incitement to commit a terrorist act or acts;

(b) Prevent such conduct;

(c) Deny safe haven to any persons with respect to whom there is credible and relevant information giving serious reasons for considering that they have been guilty of such conduct;​

​

This comes under the much broader heading of “Denying Safe Haven to those who Finance, Plan, Support or Commit Terrorist Acts or Provide Safe Havens, and Preventing Terrorists from Abusing the Asylum System, in conformity with International Law”. This can be seen in more detail in the Open briefing of the Counter-Terrorism Committee.

This is the implementation of clearing property that “constitutes a severe security threat and can provide cover to suicide bombers and other terrorists hiding among civilian population.”

(OTHER CONCERNS)

This is not to be confused with the process by which private property is taken for the purpose of public use. Prior to the taking, the property is said to be “condemned property”, meaning that it has been marked for destruction or modification in order that the plot of land can be used for public use.

And we should not get this confused with the condemnation of "substandard buildings" under the provisions of the Occupation Law, which, in addition thereto, presents an immediate and imminent threat to public safety. Such threats may arise by virtue of numerous circumstances such as, but not limited to, substantial risk of collapse or danger of fire.


Most Respectfully,
R

The original premise was: only the homes of terrorists are bulldozed.

This is not true. The vast number of homes bulldozed is for Israel to steal the land.

That's just a silly sound byte.

When a squatter builds a shack in the middle of Central Park, it doesn't become his land.
Neither law enforcement is "stealing land" when applied to illegal Arab settlements.

So, Palestinians building on their own land is an illegal settlement.

Well...as far as I can tell, Arab Israelis have not been granted permits to create new settlements in the Area C, they are frequently denied building and expansion permits, and their government invests far less in their infrastructure than in that of it's Jewish citizens, even to the point of providing infrastructure to illegal (under Israeli law) settlements. So it is certainly inequitable. The other thing that increases the divide is Israel's Jewish citizens get a lot of funding from outside donors that is expressly for Jewish settlement. I dont think it's Arab citizens do to same extent. So there is both a political and financial preference for expanding Jewish housing.

Jews get funding from Jewish donors,
while Arabs from the EU, UN, the Arab League and the rest the world.

The question is rather how many Israeli Arabs requested a permit to build in Judea?

 

[toomuchtime_]

Besides Baruch Goldstein, how many Jewish terrorists have there been?

If stone throwers are terrorists then the ones that have lobbed stones at Palestinians, including one that killed a Palestinian mother; the ones that kidnapped an Arab boy, poured gasoline on him and burned him alive; the ones that firebombed a house in Duma killing most of the family inside. If you consider non lethal assaults and property destruction to be terrorism then there are more examples.

Did any Jewish terrorist homes get bulldozed?

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

There is no moral equivalence here. When the Palestinian boy was tortured and killed, the state of Israel arrested and prosecuted the perpetrators, one mentally disturbed adult and a few children he had influence over, but when the three Israeli boys were murdered the killers became Palestinian culture heroes and their families were paid handsomely for the killings. While there are very infrequent terrorist attacks by Israelis against Palestinians, daily there are several attempted terrorist attacks by Palestinians against Israelis; when an Israeli commits an act of terror, he is punished, but when a Palestinian commits an act of terror against an Israeli, he is celebrated by the people and rewarded by the government.

Incitement to terrorism is crime in Israel, but it is pervasive among the Palestinians, it comes from every aspect of their society, their schools, their mosques, their media, and certainly from all their political leaders. While there are some radical voices among Israelis, they are widely and publicly condemned, but there are only radical voices among the Palestinians because to object to killing Jews would make you a collaborator and put your life in danger. Only someone as profoundly racist as yourself would fail to see these differences.

 

[rylah]

How many Area C settlements include Arabs?

How many settlements are Jewish only?

How many are Arab only?

Your hypocrisy is in calling out Jews for Jewish-only settlements while failing to call out Arabs for Arab-only settlements in Area C (and Areas A and B and Gaza and the entire ME).

How is it hypocritical? You are comparing apples and oranges in Area C. The settlement program is a POLITICAL program. Not a random migration of peoples into new areas. Not the unjust expulsion of Jews from multiple Arab countries if that is what you are referring to. All that is is attempting to divert away from a particular issue.

You want to talk how wrong it was for Arab countries to expel their Jews? Fine, because I am pretty sure we agree on that.

You want talk about how Arab countries refuse to allow Jews to live there? I suspect we agree on the wrongness of that.

You want to talk about how the Palestinians won’t allow Jews to remain there? I suspect we agree there too, it is wrong.

So let’s actually discuss settlements without mandating calling out all these other things. Settlements of ISRAELI CITIZENS. Not Palestinians, but citizens who are supposed to all have the same rights except for settlements.

It is especially egregious since Israel's legal system demands equality while Palestine's legal system demands segregation. Arabs demanding to live in an Israeli settlement will be legally supported. Jews demanding to live in an Arab settlement will be murdered.

Legally...in law..yes. But practice? When municipal governments act otherwise?

Israeli Arabs suffer from the same housing shortages and overcrowding (possibly more so) as Jews. So..why no Hill Top Arab settlements?

In reality, there's no house shortage or overcrowding outside the scope of propaganda and construction contractors' schemes (which is dominated by the Arab sector) to keep prices high.

What there is, are millenials who expect to live in Tel-Aviv and the surrounding area, where a single room apartment rent is worth 2-3 rents of a normal one in the north and south.

Arabs have an access to building materials and workers at much, much lower price rates -
for reasons mentioned above. And while an average Jewish family with 4 kids is content with an apartment in a building, the same Arab family will usually build a multi level house just for themselves.

And again how many Israeli Arabs requested a permit to build in Judea?

 

[Coyote]

If stone throwers are terrorists then the ones that have lobbed stones at Palestinians, including one that killed a Palestinian mother; the ones that kidnapped an Arab boy, poured gasoline on him and burned him alive; the ones that firebombed a house in Duma killing most of the family inside. If you consider non lethal assaults and property destruction to be terrorism then there are more examples.

Did any Jewish terrorist homes get bulldozed?

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

Of course the murder of that Arab boy was unjustified, and especially because of the particularly horrible way he died. Still, though, it did not happen out of the blue, and did not come out of nowhere. The nation of Israel is very small and the kidnapping of the 3 Israeli boys plunged the entire country into a national tragedy. Everyone was praying for them, including Diaspora Jews. My mom, sister and even my sensitive nephew all shed tears over them. The fact that they were missing for quite some time, were prayed over, and then finally found dead, all played into the national trauma. As tragic as the Arab boy's death was, it didn't happen inside of a vaccuum. Leaving out the background and context of the Arab boy's murder is kind of misleading, imo.

Nothing happens in a vacuum. Palestinians have also murdered innocent out of revenge for the killing of a Palestinian... it is not misleading to “leave it out” because bringing it in is a way of subtly justifying it (as Palestinians have done at times to justify murder) In and of itself, the kidnapping and murder of those three boys was horrific. But it should not in any way be used to explain (justify) what was done out of revenge.

 

[Coyote]

If stone throwers are terrorists then the ones that have lobbed stones at Palestinians, including one that killed a Palestinian mother; the ones that kidnapped an Arab boy, poured gasoline on him and burned him alive; the ones that firebombed a house in Duma killing most of the family inside. If you consider non lethal assaults and property destruction to be terrorism then there are more examples.

Did any Jewish terrorist homes get bulldozed?

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

There is no moral equivalence here. When the Palestinian boy was tortured and killed, the state of Israel arrested and prosecuted the perpetrators, one mentally disturbed adult and a few children he had influence over, but when the three Israeli boys were murdered the killers became Palestinian culture heroes and their families were paid handsomely for the killings. While there are very infrequent terrorist attacks by Israelis against Palestinians, daily there are several attempted terrorist attacks by Palestinians against Israelis; when an Israeli commits an act of terror, he is punished, but when a Palestinian commits an act of terror against an Israeli, he is celebrated by the people and rewarded by the government.

Incitement to terrorism is crime in Israel, but it is pervasive among the Palestinians, it comes from every aspect of their society, their schools, their mosques, their media, and certainly from all their political leaders. While there are some radical voices among Israelis, they are widely and publicly condemned, but there are only radical voices among the Palestinians because to object to killing Jews would make you a collaborator and put your life in danger. Only someone as profoundly racist as yourself would fail to see these differences.

Is that all you can do? Scream “racist”?

Please note, I am not and have not defended the fact that the Palestinians protect their murderers.

 

[rylah]

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

There is no moral equivalence here. When the Palestinian boy was tortured and killed, the state of Israel arrested and prosecuted the perpetrators, one mentally disturbed adult and a few children he had influence over, but when the three Israeli boys were murdered the killers became Palestinian culture heroes and their families were paid handsomely for the killings. While there are very infrequent terrorist attacks by Israelis against Palestinians, daily there are several attempted terrorist attacks by Palestinians against Israelis; when an Israeli commits an act of terror, he is punished, but when a Palestinian commits an act of terror against an Israeli, he is celebrated by the people and rewarded by the government.

Incitement to terrorism is crime in Israel, but it is pervasive among the Palestinians, it comes from every aspect of their society, their schools, their mosques, their media, and certainly from all their political leaders. While there are some radical voices among Israelis, they are widely and publicly condemned, but there are only radical voices among the Palestinians because to object to killing Jews would make you a collaborator and put your life in danger. Only someone as profoundly racist as yourself would fail to see these differences.

Is that all you can do? Scream “racist”?

Please note, I am not and have not defended the fact that the Palestinians protect their murderers.

Palestinians don't just protect murderers,
their state runs a pay-for-slay policy, openly inciting them to murder promising fat salaries, and the more they murder the more they receive.

 

[toomuchtime_]

How many Area C settlements include Arabs?

How many settlements are Jewish only?

How many are Arab only?

Your hypocrisy is in calling out Jews for Jewish-only settlements while failing to call out Arabs for Arab-only settlements in Area C (and Areas A and B and Gaza and the entire ME).

How is it hypocritical? You are comparing apples and oranges in Area C. The settlement program is a POLITICAL program. Not a random migration of peoples into new areas. Not the unjust expulsion of Jews from multiple Arab countries if that is what you are referring to. All that is is attempting to divert away from a particular issue.

You want to talk how wrong it was for Arab countries to expel their Jews? Fine, because I am pretty sure we agree on that.

You want talk about how Arab countries refuse to allow Jews to live there? I suspect we agree on the wrongness of that.

You want to talk about how the Palestinians won’t allow Jews to remain there? I suspect we agree there too, it is wrong.

So let’s actually discuss settlements without mandating calling out all these other things. Settlements of ISRAELI CITIZENS. Not Palestinians, but citizens who are supposed to all have the same rights except for settlements.

It is especially egregious since Israel's legal system demands equality while Palestine's legal system demands segregation. Arabs demanding to live in an Israeli settlement will be legally supported. Jews demanding to live in an Arab settlement will be murdered.

Legally...in law..yes. But practice? When municipal governments act otherwise?

Israeli Arabs suffer from the same housing shortages and overcrowding (possibly more so) as Jews. So..why no Hill Top Arab settlements?

First you put up a post riddled with lies about "Jew only" settlements and then you bristle when someone calls you on it. With the exception of compulsory military service, Arab Israelis have all the same rights and responsibilities as other Israelis, and few other countries have invested in the outreach efforts to their minorities as Israeli has.

Your dim witted question about Arab settlements in area C is the product of your extensive ignorance and bigotry. First, any settlement in area C would be an Israeli settlement and subject to Israeli law, so it could not be exclusively for Jews or Arabs, and while to your racist eyes, if only Arabs lived there, it would be an Arab settlement, to the Palestinians it would be just one more Israeli settlement and the Arab Israelis who lived there would be seen as collaborators.

You work so hard to try to justify your irrational hostility toward Israel, and yet the harder you try, the more you expose your own bigotry.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

There is no moral equivalence here. When the Palestinian boy was tortured and killed, the state of Israel arrested and prosecuted the perpetrators, one mentally disturbed adult and a few children he had influence over, but when the three Israeli boys were murdered the killers became Palestinian culture heroes and their families were paid handsomely for the killings. While there are very infrequent terrorist attacks by Israelis against Palestinians, daily there are several attempted terrorist attacks by Palestinians against Israelis; when an Israeli commits an act of terror, he is punished, but when a Palestinian commits an act of terror against an Israeli, he is celebrated by the people and rewarded by the government.

Incitement to terrorism is crime in Israel, but it is pervasive among the Palestinians, it comes from every aspect of their society, their schools, their mosques, their media, and certainly from all their political leaders. While there are some radical voices among Israelis, they are widely and publicly condemned, but there are only radical voices among the Palestinians because to object to killing Jews would make you a collaborator and put your life in danger. Only someone as profoundly racist as yourself would fail to see these differences.

Is that all you can do? Scream “racist”?

Please note, I am not and have not defended the fact that the Palestinians protect their murderers.

lol I clearly said much more than that, but typically, your racism prevents you from seeing any more than that.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Very conveniently, you seem to “forget “ the above was in response to the three Israeli boys kidnapped by Hamas and murdered

When you say something like that, it implies that that some how excuses it or justifies it.

It does not matter one bit what was in response to. The boy that was murdered did nothing to deserve it.

Neither did the three boys that were murdered. Why didn’t you mention them ? Because Jewish lives do not matter

Why did I need to? Did it change the horrible murder of the one boy? Does it justify it in your eyes?

When you talk about the murder of a Jew, do you bring up prior murders of Palestinians? So much of this is “revenge” why don’t you bring up prior killings?

Because it does not matter. It in no way what so ever justifies what was done.

There is no moral equivalence here. When the Palestinian boy was tortured and killed, the state of Israel arrested and prosecuted the perpetrators, one mentally disturbed adult and a few children he had influence over, but when the three Israeli boys were murdered the killers became Palestinian culture heroes and their families were paid handsomely for the killings. While there are very infrequent terrorist attacks by Israelis against Palestinians, daily there are several attempted terrorist attacks by Palestinians against Israelis; when an Israeli commits an act of terror, he is punished, but when a Palestinian commits an act of terror against an Israeli, he is celebrated by the people and rewarded by the government.

Incitement to terrorism is crime in Israel, but it is pervasive among the Palestinians, it comes from every aspect of their society, their schools, their mosques, their media, and certainly from all their political leaders. While there are some radical voices among Israelis, they are widely and publicly condemned, but there are only radical voices among the Palestinians because to object to killing Jews would make you a collaborator and put your life in danger. Only someone as profoundly racist as yourself would fail to see these differences.

Is that all you can do? Scream “racist”?

Please note, I am not and have not defended the fact that the Palestinians protect their murderers.

Palestinians do not just protect their murderers, if the victim is a Jew, they encourage them, they celebrate them and they pay them. Racist that you are, you continue to ignore the facts.

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, et al,

This is true, as far as it goes.

Rocco, most stone throwing is, despite bad outcomes, the result of angry kids...not terrorism, right?

But if the intent is to terrorize a particular group of people...then it becomes terrorism doesn’t it? So if Palestinians do it for that reason and Jews do it for that reason,they are the same, yes?

(COMMENT)

The "stone-throwing" is NOT an "act of terrorism" (in and by itself). It is a "criminal act" that results in the support, facilitates of terrorist activity; or encouraging terrorist activities.

Stone-throwing is also used as a means to incite further violence. In some cases, "stone-throwing" is an action that is specifically designed to be a media event contrived and choreographed for maximum presentation for a propaganda effect of exaggerated events.

Remember, "stone-throwing" is against International Humanitarian Law. It is not justified action or response to enforcement of law and order by any force construed to be an "Occupying Power."

₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪​

I have noticed that the pro-Hostile Arab Palestinians movements like to portray the Arab Palestinian as victims using "stone-throwing" against a foreign oppressor as a lawful sign of displeasure. Conditioning the statement as if the act were legal and the Israeli response against the assault is illegal. Such an interpretation is 180º out of phase with the truth.


Most Respectfully,
R

Then would you agree that Jewish stone throwers (as in the settlers stoning Palestinians) acting the same as the Palestinians?

They are not the same at all. The settlers are occupiers while the Palestinians are the occupied. They are coming from two different places.

 

[rylah]

RE: Palestine Today
⁜→ Coyote, et al,

This is true, as far as it goes.

Rocco, most stone throwing is, despite bad outcomes, the result of angry kids...not terrorism, right?

But if the intent is to terrorize a particular group of people...then it becomes terrorism doesn’t it? So if Palestinians do it for that reason and Jews do it for that reason,they are the same, yes?

(COMMENT)

The "stone-throwing" is NOT an "act of terrorism" (in and by itself). It is a "criminal act" that results in the support, facilitates of terrorist activity; or encouraging terrorist activities.

Stone-throwing is also used as a means to incite further violence. In some cases, "stone-throwing" is an action that is specifically designed to be a media event contrived and choreographed for maximum presentation for a propaganda effect of exaggerated events.

Remember, "stone-throwing" is against International Humanitarian Law. It is not justified action or response to enforcement of law and order by any force construed to be an "Occupying Power."

₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪₪​

I have noticed that the pro-Hostile Arab Palestinians movements like to portray the Arab Palestinian as victims using "stone-throwing" against a foreign oppressor as a lawful sign of displeasure. Conditioning the statement as if the act were legal and the Israeli response against the assault is illegal. Such an interpretation is 180º out of phase with the truth.


Most Respectfully,
R

Then would you agree that Jewish stone throwers (as in the settlers stoning Palestinians) acting the same as the Palestinians?

They are not the same at all. The settlers are occupiers while the Palestinians are the occupied. They are coming from two different places.

Another silty sound byte.

Fact is, so called "Palestinians" came from the same Arab countries from where they expelled the Jews. Only that the latter can actually pronounce "Palestine" and understand what the word means, while Arabs don't.