Precision in Nature: Evidence of God or Accidents?

[Youwerecreated]

Why do you get on here and pretend to care about scientific evidence while simultaneously saying things like "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

You don't care that there's zero scientific support for that lunacy, so why do you pretend to care about scientific support in other areas?

Make an argument will you that is legit.

I happily will, once you provide scientific evidence that "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

 

[Alter2Ego]

I doubt the species who are a part of the 99.9% that ended up extinct would agree with the whole precision in nature view.

Or all the people who have died from horrible diseases for nothing. Unless God is trying to kill us with precision.

ALTER2EGO -to- OOH POO PAH DOO & DR.DROCK:

QUESTION: Who was it that caused animals to become extinct by killing off the creatures for sport, polluting the land and the animals' environment, chopped down trees the animals relied upon, spilled oil in the ocean and killed of fish and birds, etc.?

ANSWER: Rebellious humans who have no respect for God's laws.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Make an argument will you that is legit.

I happily will, once you provide scientific evidence that "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

 

[Dr.Drock]

If you are operating on dogmatic religious belief, which appears to be the case, then we have nothing to talk about at all. As for explaining away prophecies, that's of course quite simple; there is no prophecy in the Bible whose fulfillment cannot be accounted for by one of creative interpretation of later scriptures, deliberate falsification of them with earlier prophecies in mind, or, at best, normal human psychic ability. Also, the Bible is not one work but a collection of works joined together by fallible human authorities, and so even evidence of extraordinary content in one book of the Bible does nothing to support claims about any other book of the Bible.

ALTER2EGO -to- DRAGON:
Unless you can present examples of this, you are merely expressing your personal opinion and repeating what you heard from other atheists. How about you present Bible book, chapter, and verse where these supposed manipulated prophesies occurred?

But of course, if you are a dogmatist, as seems to be the case, you will not pay attention to any of this. If you want to discuss the origin of species on a scientific basis, I'll join in. If all you want is to spout Christian dogma, I'm not interested and will ignore you henceforth. Id appreciate it if you would make that clear, just for convenience' sake.

ALTER2EGO -to- DRAGON:
I have every intention of exposing evolution theory as a myth on this forum. And I will do it by means of scientific evidence. I will be starting a thread on that topic shortly.

Post the thread when you start it I would like to watch it.

Nevermid Doc he hates evidence or questions that his fellow evolutionist ignore or can't answer.

I don't know what my opinion is on those, as I've never seen who respects biology dodge a question about biology.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I happily will, once you provide scientific evidence that "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Your point ?

 

[Youwerecreated]

ALTER2EGO -to- DRAGON:
Unless you can present examples of this, you are merely expressing your personal opinion and repeating what you heard from other atheists. How about you present Bible book, chapter, and verse where these supposed manipulated prophesies occurred?



ALTER2EGO -to- DRAGON:
I have every intention of exposing evolution theory as a myth on this forum. And I will do it by means of scientific evidence. I will be starting a thread on that topic shortly.

Post the thread when you start it I would like to watch it.

Nevermid Doc he hates evidence or questions that his fellow evolutionist ignore or can't answer.

I don't know what my opinion is on those, as I've never seen a question anyone who respects biology dodge a question about biology.

Well two of them have been ignored in this thread or dragon did give an opinion that has no backing.

Where did intelligence originate from ?

How did life begin ? do you have an opinion ?

 

[Alter2Ego]

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

Logic based upon the dismissal of evidence is flawed logic--which is what you're bringing to the table. For instance, the first 60 elements found within the Periodic Table of the Elements of planet earth are so interrelated and precise that scientists refer to it as Periodic LAW. The existence of Laws aka precision indicates an INTELLIGENT DESIGNER directed the outcome.

Evidence of God's existence is dismissed every single time one ignores the complexity of the natural world. Flawed logic also results from ignorance or lack of knowledge of certain scientific facts. To avoid the trap of stubbornness, one must allow logic and evidence to interact.

The Big Bang Theory is just that--a theory, and one that will never be proven as it amounts to nothing more than speculation aka personal opinions. Nobody can explain how this theory of expanding space is an explanation for the appearance of planets with their individual gravitational fields that prevents them from crashing into each other, and the fact that certain planets work to the advantage of earth.


Without intelligent direction, things would result by chance occurrences known as accidents. Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary defines an accident as a "nonessential event that happens by chance and has undesirable or unfortunate results." As previously stated, the precision (which leaves no room for accidents) found in the world around us cries out to the existence of an intelligent, supernatural Designer or God. Things happening at random aka by accident cannot result in precision. Take, for example, the following.

Consider the earth's measurements and its location in our solar system. Earth is just the right size for our existence. If earth were slightly larger, its gravity would be stronger, with the result that hydrogen--a light gas--would not be able to escape the gravity of a bigger earth. The result? Earth's atmosphere would kill us because of the accumulation of hydrogen. On the other hand, if earth were slightly smaller, life-sustaining oxygen would escape and surface water would evaporate. In this case, we would also die.

Furthermore, the earth is at an ideal distance from the sun. Both astronomer John Barrow and mathematician Frank Tipler studied "the ratio of the Earth's radius and distance from the Sun" and concluded that human life would not exist "were this ratio slightly different from what it is observed to be." (Source: The Anthropic Cosmological Principle, by John D. Barrow and Frank J. Tipler, copyright 1986, Oxford University Press)

In his book, Professor David L. Block wrote: "Calculations show that had the earth been situated only 5 percent closer to the sun, a runaway greenhouse effect [overheating of the earth] would have occurred about 4000 million years ago. If, on the other hand, the earth were placed only 1 percent further from the sun, runaway glaciation [huge sheets of ice covering much of the globe] would have occurred some 2000 million years ago." (Source: Our Universe: Accident Or Design? by David L. Block (1992)

 

[Dr.Drock]

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Your point ?

Cuz you just asked me how the earth rotates. Now provide the scientific evidence that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

 

[Alter2Ego]

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Your point ?

Cuz you just asked me how the earth rotates. Now provide the scientific evidence that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Human sin (beginning with the rebellion of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden) did indeed bring about imperfect conditions. But that is with reference to life on earth among humans and other life forms. It had nothing to do with the literal earth.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Post the thread when you start it I would like to watch it.

Nevermid Doc he hates evidence or questions that his fellow evolutionist ignore or can't answer.

I don't know what my opinion is on those, as I've never seen a question anyone who respects biology dodge a question about biology.

Well two of them have been ignored in this thread or dragon did give an opinion that has no backing.

Where did intelligence originate from ?

How did life begin ? do you have an opinion ?

Microbial intelligence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't know how life began, if you're interested in learning, which you aren't, you can naviagate this page below to learn the basics. The above link shows where intelligence originated.

Abiogenesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And if you translate "I don't know" to mean "god did it", you'd be mistaken.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Your point ?

Cuz you just asked me how the earth rotates. Now provide the scientific evidence that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Human sin (beginning with the rebellion of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden) did indeed bring about imperfect conditions. But that is with reference to life on earth among humans and other life forms. It had nothing to do with the literal earth.

scientific evidence

I need science to back what I'm saying, please play by the same rules or stop disputing science if you don't take it seriously anyways.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I happily will, once you provide scientific evidence that "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

We can begin with the 2nd law of thermo dynamics. It is evidence of everything is in the state of decay.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which Jehovah God had made. And he said to the woman, Is it so that God has said, You shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Gen 3:2 And the woman said to the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said to the woman, You shall not surely die,
Gen 3:5 for God knows that in the day you eat of it, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as God, knowing good and evil.
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasing to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make wise, she took of its fruit, and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.
Gen 3:7 And the eyes of both of them were opened. And they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made girdles for themselves.
Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day. And Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God in the middle of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:9 And Jehovah God called to Adam and said to him, Where are you?
Gen 3:10 And he said, I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I am naked, and I hid myself.
Gen 3:11 And He said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you that you should not eat?
Gen 3:12 And the man said, The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.
Gen 3:13 And Jehovah God said to the woman, What is this you have done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.
Gen 3:14 And Jehovah God said to the serpent, Because you have done this you are cursed more than all cattle, and more than every animal of the field. You shall go upon your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life.
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He will bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel.
Gen 3:16 To the woman He said, I will greatly increase your sorrow and your conception. In pain you shall bear sons, and your desire shall be toward your husband, and he shall rule over you.
Gen 3:17 And to Adam He said, Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree, of which I commanded you, saying, You shall not eat of it! The ground is cursed for your sake. In pain shall you eat of it all the days of your life.
Gen 3:18 It shall also bring forth thorns and thistles to you, and you shall eat the herb of the field.
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are, and to dust you shall return.
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she was the mother of all living.
Gen 3:21 And for Adam and his wife Jehovah God made coats of skins, and clothed them.
Gen 3:22 And Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,
Gen 3:23 therefore Jehovah God sent him out from the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he had been taken.
Gen 3:24 And He drove out the man. And He placed cherubs at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Perfection was lost when they were removed from the garden of eden and sin passed on to all.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

We can begin with the 2nd law of thermo dynamics. It is evidence of everything is in the state of decay.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which Jehovah God had made. And he said to the woman, Is it so that God has said, You shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Gen 3:2 And the woman said to the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said to the woman, You shall not surely die,
Gen 3:5 for God knows that in the day you eat of it, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as God, knowing good and evil.
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasing to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make wise, she took of its fruit, and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.
Gen 3:7 And the eyes of both of them were opened. And they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made girdles for themselves.
Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day. And Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God in the middle of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:9 And Jehovah God called to Adam and said to him, Where are you?
Gen 3:10 And he said, I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I am naked, and I hid myself.
Gen 3:11 And He said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you that you should not eat?
Gen 3:12 And the man said, The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.
Gen 3:13 And Jehovah God said to the woman, What is this you have done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.
Gen 3:14 And Jehovah God said to the serpent, Because you have done this you are cursed more than all cattle, and more than every animal of the field. You shall go upon your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life.
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He will bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel.
Gen 3:16 To the woman He said, I will greatly increase your sorrow and your conception. In pain you shall bear sons, and your desire shall be toward your husband, and he shall rule over you.
Gen 3:17 And to Adam He said, Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree, of which I commanded you, saying, You shall not eat of it! The ground is cursed for your sake. In pain shall you eat of it all the days of your life.
Gen 3:18 It shall also bring forth thorns and thistles to you, and you shall eat the herb of the field.
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are, and to dust you shall return.
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she was the mother of all living.
Gen 3:21 And for Adam and his wife Jehovah God made coats of skins, and clothed them.
Gen 3:22 And Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,
Gen 3:23 therefore Jehovah God sent him out from the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he had been taken.
Gen 3:24 And He drove out the man. And He placed cherubs at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Perfection was lost when they were removed from the garden of eden and sin passed on to all.

Am I not making myself clear? I said scientific evidence.

 

[Youwerecreated]

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Your point ?

Cuz you just asked me how the earth rotates. Now provide the scientific evidence that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

No I didn't

 

[Youwerecreated]

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

We can begin with the 2nd law of thermo dynamics. It is evidence of everything is in the state of decay.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which Jehovah God had made. And he said to the woman, Is it so that God has said, You shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Gen 3:2 And the woman said to the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said to the woman, You shall not surely die,
Gen 3:5 for God knows that in the day you eat of it, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as God, knowing good and evil.
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasing to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make wise, she took of its fruit, and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.
Gen 3:7 And the eyes of both of them were opened. And they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made girdles for themselves.
Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day. And Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God in the middle of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:9 And Jehovah God called to Adam and said to him, Where are you?
Gen 3:10 And he said, I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I am naked, and I hid myself.
Gen 3:11 And He said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you that you should not eat?
Gen 3:12 And the man said, The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.
Gen 3:13 And Jehovah God said to the woman, What is this you have done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.
Gen 3:14 And Jehovah God said to the serpent, Because you have done this you are cursed more than all cattle, and more than every animal of the field. You shall go upon your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life.
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He will bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel.
Gen 3:16 To the woman He said, I will greatly increase your sorrow and your conception. In pain you shall bear sons, and your desire shall be toward your husband, and he shall rule over you.
Gen 3:17 And to Adam He said, Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree, of which I commanded you, saying, You shall not eat of it! The ground is cursed for your sake. In pain shall you eat of it all the days of your life.
Gen 3:18 It shall also bring forth thorns and thistles to you, and you shall eat the herb of the field.
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are, and to dust you shall return.
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she was the mother of all living.
Gen 3:21 And for Adam and his wife Jehovah God made coats of skins, and clothed them.
Gen 3:22 And Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,
Gen 3:23 therefore Jehovah God sent him out from the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he had been taken.
Gen 3:24 And He drove out the man. And He placed cherubs at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Perfection was lost when they were removed from the garden of eden and sin passed on to all.

Am I not making myself clear? I said scientific evidence.

Is this not what we observe today ?

 

[Dr.Drock]

Another YWC discussion and again it turns into a "The Bible is proof of the Bible" blathering.

I'm trying to lower my standards as much as I can. Give me any scientific evidence, hell it can be crazy shit, just anything remotely scientific to try to marginally back some semblance of your claim.

 

[Dr.Drock]

We can begin with the 2nd law of thermo dynamics. It is evidence of everything is in the state of decay.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which Jehovah God had made. And he said to the woman, Is it so that God has said, You shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Gen 3:2 And the woman said to the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, neither shall you touch it, lest you die.
Gen 3:4 And the serpent said to the woman, You shall not surely die,
Gen 3:5 for God knows that in the day you eat of it, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as God, knowing good and evil.
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasing to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make wise, she took of its fruit, and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.
Gen 3:7 And the eyes of both of them were opened. And they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made girdles for themselves.
Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of Jehovah God walking in the garden in the cool of the day. And Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of Jehovah God in the middle of the trees of the garden.
Gen 3:9 And Jehovah God called to Adam and said to him, Where are you?
Gen 3:10 And he said, I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I am naked, and I hid myself.
Gen 3:11 And He said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you that you should not eat?
Gen 3:12 And the man said, The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.
Gen 3:13 And Jehovah God said to the woman, What is this you have done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.
Gen 3:14 And Jehovah God said to the serpent, Because you have done this you are cursed more than all cattle, and more than every animal of the field. You shall go upon your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life.
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He will bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel.
Gen 3:16 To the woman He said, I will greatly increase your sorrow and your conception. In pain you shall bear sons, and your desire shall be toward your husband, and he shall rule over you.
Gen 3:17 And to Adam He said, Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree, of which I commanded you, saying, You shall not eat of it! The ground is cursed for your sake. In pain shall you eat of it all the days of your life.
Gen 3:18 It shall also bring forth thorns and thistles to you, and you shall eat the herb of the field.
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are, and to dust you shall return.
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she was the mother of all living.
Gen 3:21 And for Adam and his wife Jehovah God made coats of skins, and clothed them.
Gen 3:22 And Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,
Gen 3:23 therefore Jehovah God sent him out from the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he had been taken.
Gen 3:24 And He drove out the man. And He placed cherubs at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

Perfection was lost when they were removed from the garden of eden and sin passed on to all.

Am I not making myself clear? I said scientific evidence.

Is this not what we observe today ?

No, actually we observe the opposite as no one has ever discovered a species of snake that can talk.

Try again, with science this time.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I happily will, once you provide scientific evidence that "sin brought about non perfect conditions."

Well as usual you can't do what is asked of you. I will work on your request and it will be in the new thread.

CCMR - Ask A Scientist!

Here's why the earth rotates.

I happily await your very scientific link that's had many scientists contribute to it, that shows how sin brought about non perfect conditions.

Don't you find it funny that the planet turning on the right axis and at the right speed or do you concern yourself with such thinking ?

 

[Youwerecreated]

Am I not making myself clear? I said scientific evidence.

Is this not what we observe today ?

No, actually we observe the opposite as no one has ever discovered a species of snake that can talk.

Try again, with science this time.

That is the only thing you locked in on in that passage

 

[Youwerecreated]

Another YWC discussion and again it turns into a "The Bible is proof of the Bible" blathering.

I'm trying to lower my standards as much as I can. Give me any scientific evidence, hell it can be crazy shit, just anything remotely scientific to try to marginally back some semblance of your claim.

So why is everything in a state of decay ?

This natural process that caused man to get better and better still we grow old and die. Why ?

Why does everything start out healthy and good unless affected by bad genes and eventually dies ?