PV Solar in California uses 23 Billion Gallons of Water!

[HenryBHough]

Frequently proposed in California (but not yet put into effect): Required metering of water drawn from your own well and payment to government per gallon.

Not far behind: Required metering of electricity produced by your own solar panels or wind machines and payment to government per kWh.

But it won't be "taxes". It'll have some clever name like "power cost equalization fee".

 

[ScienceRocks]

If it wasn't for solar Califorina would be having black outs up the butt right now. Solar is keeping the state afloat.

 

[HenryBHough]

If it wasn't for solar Califorina would be having black outs up the butt right now. Solar is keeping the state afloat.

You might wish to reconsider the use of the word "afloat" in connection with California while the opportunity to edit remains unforeclosed.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Solar energy "kills birds"?
Solar energy "destroys farmland"?



Denialists.... SMH

Alarming Rate Of Bird Deaths As New Solar Plants Scorch Animals In Mid-Air

 

[ScienceRocks]

Water is costly, as well as the fuel, coal or natural gas to run the plant. Sunlight costs nothing, and the comparison of 26 gallons per megawatt to 500 to 50,000 gallons of water per megawatt for coal pretty well guarntees the end of coal fired plants.

They don't want to think about math as it destroys their argument. Kind of like the fbi crime stats destroy the argument of the left on race and crime.

 

[elektra]

I figured Elektra would be posting- after all someone else posted a thread about 'good alternative energy'.

She is pretty psycho when it comes to any kind of energy that isn't nuclear or made from dead dinosaurs.

What would be a relevant comparison is:
how many gallons of water per Mwh do the various forms of electrical generation require:
Nuclear
Solar
Natural Gas (including factoring in gas extraction)
Coal (including factoring in coal extraction)
Wind
Hydroelectric.

Hydroelectric would 'consume' a lot of water, but it flows downstream to other users.

It would be interesting to get less anti-alternative energy hysteria and more facts.

Relative to the amount of energy produced, which in Solar's case, is next to nothing. 23 billion gallons of water for almost no electricity is hardly what you want to compare, is it?

What would be a relevant comparison is:
how many gallons of water per Mwh do the various forms of electrical generation require:
Nuclear
Solar
Natural Gas (including factoring in gas extraction)
Coal (including factoring in coal extraction)
Wind
Hydroelectric.

Yet you just throw out numbers.

How many billions of gallons of water are used to produce energy made by coal fired plants?

Start your own OP.

What is relevant, is as you cry there is no water in california, you have no complaints that Solar has increased the use of water in California, by 23 billion gallons.

Sandia Labs is my source, hardly throwing out numbers, as you state.

 

[elektra]

Water is costly, as well as the fuel, coal or natural gas to run the plant. Sunlight costs nothing, and the comparison of 26 gallons per megawatt to 500 to 50,000 gallons of water per megawatt for coal pretty well guarntees the end of coal fired plants.

They don't want to think about math as it destroys their argument. Kind of like the fbi crime stats destroy the argument of the left on race and crime.

We don't? As you post endless bullshit mattpew.

Where is you math, how about adding the total cost of all those solar plants you post about, how about some math, mattpew, or are you a lazy hypocrite.

 

[elektra]

In the data provided by Averyt et al. (2011) and UCS (2012), with water use factors by Macknick et al. (2011), consumption factor estimates for solar PV range from 0 to 33 gallons/MWh, with a median value reported at 26 gallons/MWh. These factors were considered for determining O&M water use for the expanded database, however in order to calculate water consumption, an estimate of the electricity generation is necessary, and this data was not readily available. In addition, PV systems don’t require active cooling like traditional power plants, with O&M water use only for washing panels and potable usage for those monitoring activities at the site. It follows that calculating O&M usage would be more accurate as a function of the total size of the PV power plant (number of modules, or area covered) rather than the production output in units such as MWh/yr. For these reasons, the approach developed in the BLM PEIS Methodology was utilized as it represents the most current research on water use estimates for large utility-scale PV facilities. There are a few cases where estimates are made based on generation to allow for a comparison between PV and CSP facilities. It should be noted that these estimates using BLM data cannot be truly validated until large facilities are built, and water use data is reported to the BLM, the US Energy Information Administration (EIA) or other agencies.

http://energy.sandia.gov/wp/wp-content/gallery/uploads/SAND2013_5238.pdf

First, thank you for the site, Elektra. I had been looking for a credible estimate of the use of water by PV installations for quite a while.

So, the estimate for use after construction for PV utility grade installations is about 26 gallons per Megawatt.

Let us compare that with coal fired plants;

How it Works Water for Coal Union of Concerned Scientists

Coal-fired power plants, which produce almost half of the country’s electricity, have significant impacts on water quantity and quality in the United States. Water is used to extract, wash, and sometimes transport the coal; to cool the steam used to make electricity in the power plant; and to control pollution from the plant. The acts of mining and burning coal, as well as dealing with the waste, also can have major effects on water quality.

[paste:font size="4"][1] Table 1 shows water requirements in gallons per megawatt-hour (MWh, or thousand kilowatt-hours) of electricity production. (Despite their name, dry-cooling systems still require water for system maintenance, cleaning, and blowdown, as explained below).[2]

Table 1: Water requirements for cooling by type in gallons per megawatt-hour for conventional coal power plants[3]
The choice of cooling system used in a coal plant affects not only its water requirements but also the efficiency of the power plant as a whole. According to estimates by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), coal plants that use dry cooling produce about seven percent less power than those that use wet-recirculating systems.[4] Because coal power derives all of its energy from producing steam, dry cooling has a greater impact on the efficiencies of coal-fired plants than on most natural gas-fired ones. [5],[6]

So, with coal, we are looking at 500 gallons to 50,000 gallons per Megawatt.

Quite a comparison to the 26 gallons per megawatt for PV.

We ain't building coal plants in california, are we moron! In fact we are shutting them down.

Old Crock, you posted in the thread, california has 1 year of water left, so how is it we can us 23 billion gallons on Solar, when we will run out of water in 1 year.

Answer a question for once, moron.

 

[ralfy]

Oil, water, and many other material resources are used to manufacture many things.

 

[elektra]

How is it that California has so much water to build Solar, yet we will be out of water in 11 months?

 

[Old Rocks]

You state that California is shutting down coal fired plants. See, whenever you shut one of them down, you can add at least 20 times the generating power in solar without any net gain in water usage. So the more coal plants shut down, the more power California has.

 

[elektra]

You state that California is shutting down coal fired plants. See, whenever you shut one of them down, you can add at least 20 times the generating power in solar without any net gain in water usage. So the more coal plants shut down, the more power California has.

20 times the power? Solar produces 20 times the power of coal? In your wet dreams.

Even cleantechnia does not make claims that outrageous.

 

[skookerasbil]

Clearly coal is on its last legs!!!

[URL=http://s42.photobucket.com/user/baldaltima/media/8abb9baf6-4.jpg.html][/URL]

 

[skookerasbil]

And lookie what Germany is doing between now and 2020!!!!


[URL=http://s42.photobucket.com/user/baldaltima/media/coalfired.jpg.html][/URL]




Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooops!!!

 

[skookerasbil]

God bless these people who can navigate life in a perpetual state of delusion!!! Fascinating shit!!!

 

[mamooth]

Indeed. How crazy does one have to be to think that a coal plant which consumes 20 times as much water per megawatt is more efficient with water? Anyone thinking that has to be totally brain dead. There's no other way to put it. Skook and Elektra are morons.

Why are they so stupid? I think we're seeing a couple of bad cases of "The liberals always beat me up on the playground, even the girls" syndrome. Now they hate everything liberals do, but the liberals do sensible things, so skook and elektra always choose the least sensible thing to do, purely out of spite.

Get over it, will you two? Just because everyone laughed at your sissified mannerisms does not justify you embracing policies that will kill people and cost everyone big bucks.

And Elektra, stop claiming California only has a year of water left. That's just whack.

 

[elektra]

Indeed. How crazy does one have to be to think that a coal plant which consumes 20 times as much water per megawatt is more efficient with water? Anyone thinking that has to be totally brain dead. There's no other way to put it. Skook and Elektra are morons.

Why are they so stupid? I think we're seeing a couple of bad cases of "The liberals always beat me up on the playground, even the girls" syndrome. Now they hate everything liberals do, but the liberals do sensible things, so skook and elektra always choose the least sensible thing to do, purely out of spite.

Get over it, will you two? Just because everyone laughed at your sissified mannerisms does not justify you embracing policies that will kill people and cost everyone big bucks.

And Elektra, stop claiming California only has a year of water left. That's just whack.

Nice rant maMOOT. Is this more of your "SCIENCE".

Yes how crazy, for you to compare a Coal Energy to Solar Energy, Solar does not produce a fraction of what Coal produces, further Solar increases the use of Coal, you must burn Coal to fabricate "Solar Power" plants.

Yes maMOOT, when one can only troll and flame, they have admitted they have admitted they lost the argument. Funny how you have no science maMOOT yet you claim to be based in "science".

Lets see, I am "brain dead", a "moron", "stupid", I "get beat up", I post out of "spite", I am "laughed" at, I have "sissified mannerisms", I embrace policies the "kill people", wow maMOOT, 8 flames and trolls in one post, what is it maMOOT that has you in such an uproar, the truth slap you in the face again?

Oh, and yes, according to the "Liberals", there is 11 months of water left, bitch at them if you do not like it.

California has about one year of water left US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

 

[kiwiman127]

Great, Elektra started her 948th anti-alternative energy thread. Obsessed or what?

 

[elektra]

Great, Elektra started her 948th anti-alternative energy thread. Obsessed or what?

View attachment 38819

And that makes your 6400th post? What does that say about you? That you are obsessed, a hypocrite, and a liar.

Alternative Energy? Is that what you call Solar and Wind that cost us trillions yet deliver nothing?

I bet your 6401th post will be much smarter, yes? (and how many posts have I made?)

 

[Old Rocks]

Wind is presently cheaper than dirty coal, and solar will soon be. Not only that, the use of coal for generation is declining in the US and will continue to decline, while solar and wind are increasing in double digit compounded per year. Cry us a river, old girl.