Question for those pushing a "living wage"

[kaz]

Bull carp there is no limit to the number of jobs that can be created and filled. The only thing keeping people from finding work is motivation. The primary reason they are not motivated to do so is retarded hand-outs the democrats employ to keep large segments of the population voting for them indefinitely to indefinitely stay on welfare roles. Well that and high taxes, why work when the libtardians are just gonna take your wages?

Have you seen the unemployment rate? Jobs aren't plentiful.

The unemployment rate has nothing to do with the number of available jobs.

People who are unemployed do so voluntarily. One would have to be a complete moron to not be able to get or create a job.

True, the problem is that people think they should get the same job with the same pay they had rather than taking any job and working their way back up.

 

[kaz]

Kids don't wait until our finances are ideal but poorly educated babies makin' babies is a recipe for disaster for everyone.

Working is like walking, you can't go the distance by taking only one step.

How do you know?

You have never worked

Um ... Mr. Pot ...

 

[Erand7899]

You make an interesting point

But as a follow up. If your employee doesn't earn enough to support himself, should the taxpayer make up the difference?

Should an employer have the taxpayers support his employees just so that he can profit off of substandard wages?

What the taxpayers support is up to the taxpayers and what the employer supports is up to the employer. The employee has an obligation to see to his/her own needs.

 

[Brain357]

Let me explain it another way.

Guy at job doesnt get paid enough to cover expenses. His employer can kick him more money or he will look for assistance provided by you and I.

Which is what you've trained him to do. What he should do is work harder, invest in his own training and/or find a better job. You sadly don't even consider those possibilities, you jump right to that he'll go for welfare. Do people not have any responsibility for their own lives?

As an employer, I can tell you the #1 issue with low end workers is they don't care. Now I know you're going to come back with they don't care because they are paid so low, but you're wrong, they are paid so low because they don't care. Paying them more gives us zero care, it just gives them a fatter paycheck. Workers who care have no problem making more than minimum wage.

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

 

[rightwinger]

Bull carp there is no limit to the number of jobs that can be created and filled. The only thing keeping people from finding work is motivation. The primary reason they are not motivated to do so is retarded hand-outs the democrats employ to keep large segments of the population voting for them indefinitely to indefinitely stay on welfare roles. Well that and high taxes, why work when the libtardians are just gonna take your wages?

Have you seen the unemployment rate? Jobs aren't plentiful.

The unemployment rate has nothing to do with the number of available jobs.

People who are unemployed do so voluntarily. One would have to be a complete moron to not be able to get or create a job.

Why conservatives cannot be taken seriously

 

[Brain357]

Bull carp there is no limit to the number of jobs that can be created and filled. The only thing keeping people from finding work is motivation. The primary reason they are not motivated to do so is retarded hand-outs the democrats employ to keep large segments of the population voting for them indefinitely to indefinitely stay on welfare roles. Well that and high taxes, why work when the libtardians are just gonna take your wages?

Have you seen the unemployment rate? Jobs aren't plentiful.

The unemployment rate has nothing to do with the number of available jobs.

People who are unemployed do so voluntarily. One would have to be a complete moron to not be able to get or create a job.

Much harder to get one that is enough to support a family with.

 

[kaz]

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

How can corporations hold down wages? You fundamentally don't understand capitalism. If a company doesn't pay market wages for their needs, they don't get the employees they need to do the job at the quality they require to compete.

They only way they could "hold down wages" would be to fall on a sword and screw themselves. Then they would fail and a smarter company who pays market wages would replace them.

Free markets are free for companies, consumers, workers and all other participants. No one can manipulate it except government, and that is because only government can use force to impose it's will on unwilling participants.

Honestly, explaining freedom to you people should be like explaining snacks to a dog, but unfortunately it's like explaining brain surgery to a goldfish. You just don't get it.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Let me explain it another way.

Guy at job doesnt get paid enough to cover expenses. His employer can kick him more money or he will look for assistance provided by you and I. Guy doesnt care that you think he should take it on the chin. So he applies for assistance provided by you and I.

Guy receives assistance and never gave one shit about your ideas of "toughening it out".

So in reality, back on earth, when it comes to substandard wages you have a choice between employer or the rest of us.

Or, Plan C ... he will do the right thing and find a better paying job or take a 2nd job like millions of others have done.

Yeah in another world other than the one with this economy

 

[ClosedCaption]

Let me explain it another way.

Guy at job doesnt get paid enough to cover expenses. His employer can kick him more money or he will look for assistance provided by you and I. Guy doesnt care that you think he should take it on the chin. So he applies for assistance provided by you and I.

Guy receives assistance and never gave one shit about your ideas of "toughening it out".

So in reality, back on earth, when it comes to substandard wages you have a choice between employer or the rest of us.

No matter what the minimum wage is, you folks will always call it substandard, you just keep moving the goal post. Can you swear if the minimum wage is raised to 10 dollars they won't change the eligibility for assistance. Of course you can't because you know they will.

Once again, you are assuming and never asked any question. Pretty easy to fight strawmen since they dont hit back

 

[Erand7899]

In another thread someone claimed that people have a right to be paid enough to support a family. I'd like to hear input from others on this.



Does a person with a paper route have the right to be paid enough to support a family?

Should a grocery bagger get paid enough to support a family?

What is the lowest level of job where you think the employers should be required to pay their employees enough to support a family? And how large of a family should this job be able to support?

If my brother quit his computer job and went to work as a Wal-Mart stocker, should he be able to expect Wal-Mart to pay him enough to support his six children?

While the other thread implies that Republicans are against higher wages because business will suffer, you seem to be against them because poor people are undeserving of higher wages.

Are both true at the same time?

Or is the former given as the excuse, while the real reason is the latter?

I don't know any Republicans that are opposed to higher wages. Many Republicans are opposed to government mandated wage rates because everyone will suffer to some degree. Workers, whether they be poor or rich, deserve no more than the wages they agree to work for. Many poor people are poor because they have few, if any, marketable skills.

 

[RKMBrown]

Let me explain it another way.

Guy at job doesnt get paid enough to cover expenses. His employer can kick him more money or he will look for assistance provided by you and I.

Which is what you've trained him to do. What he should do is work harder, invest in his own training and/or find a better job. You sadly don't even consider those possibilities, you jump right to that he'll go for welfare. Do people not have any responsibility for their own lives?

As an employer, I can tell you the #1 issue with low end workers is they don't care. Now I know you're going to come back with they don't care because they are paid so low, but you're wrong, they are paid so low because they don't care. Paying them more gives us zero care, it just gives them a fatter paycheck. Workers who care have no problem making more than minimum wage.

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

I started my own software company way back in the 80s. It was easy. Made tons, sold it. Took a good job, moved on to a better job. Paid to much in taxes. Now I have an even better job that does not make me pay as much in taxes and I get to work from home. If I want I could go back to work for myself with about a weeks effort on any one of a million different types of jobs. I really don't see where all the crying about there being no jobs is coming from. Not when all it takes to have a job is to be willing to do work that is marketable to customers.

When I was 10 I got a job cutting lawns. Knock knock want me to cut your grass? no ... next door. yes... cut it collect move to the next one. Investment zero lawn mower and gas donated as a hand-up. TEN YEARS OLD instant job creator.

 

[OKTexas]

You guys are just clueless

You respond to a problem that affects over 30 million people with a solution that works for a single person

There are not 30 million extra jobs out there so that every person working and needing government assistance can work 60 or 70 hour weeks. Most of these people struggle to find a job that gives them 40 hour weeks
And no, there are not an additional 30 million lawn cutting jobs or babysitting jobs so the working poor can supplement their income

The taxpayer fills the void or the employer fills the void. Who would you rather have do it?

Tell you what ... when all open positions are filled we will revisit your POV but even you must know that as those jobs are filled, the economy will expand to accommodate the spending of the new employees and - BAM! - more employees will be needed.
Frankly, one such as you has no business referring to anyone else as "clueless."

Right now there are three people seeking a job for every opening. That is down from seven during the height of the recession. That is the economic reality of today's market. There are no 30 million jobs for people looking to work second jobs

The current job market also favors the employer. It provides a labor pool willing to take low wages and low benefits

Who makes up the difference? The taxpayer

Yet there are tens of thousands of jobs going unfilled because we don't have a qualified workforce. There are grants available for low income people to get the training yet you see advertising from these schools trying to find students. The training is out there, the good jobs are there, now we just need people with the want to.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Bull carp there is no limit to the number of jobs that can be created and filled. The only thing keeping people from finding work is motivation. The primary reason they are not motivated to do so is retarded hand-outs the democrats employ to keep large segments of the population voting for them indefinitely to indefinitely stay on welfare roles. Well that and high taxes, why work when the libtardians are just gonna take your wages?

Have you seen the unemployment rate? Jobs aren't plentiful.

The unemployment rate has nothing to do with the number of available jobs.

People who are unemployed do so voluntarily. One would have to be a complete moron to not be able to get or create a job.

True but the number of jobs available does have something to do with the number of jobs available and once again. There arent many.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Let me explain it another way.

Guy at job doesnt get paid enough to cover expenses. His employer can kick him more money or he will look for assistance provided by you and I.

Which is what you've trained him to do. What he should do is work harder, invest in his own training and/or find a better job. You sadly don't even consider those possibilities, you jump right to that he'll go for welfare. Do people not have any responsibility for their own lives?

As an employer, I can tell you the #1 issue with low end workers is they don't care. Now I know you're going to come back with they don't care because they are paid so low, but you're wrong, they are paid so low because they don't care. Paying them more gives us zero care, it just gives them a fatter paycheck. Workers who care have no problem making more than minimum wage.

No matter how much you yell, no one is going to suffer because you think they should. Thats what you dont seem to understand.

Its reality, you dont like reality so you advocate for something other than reality Sorry?

 

[Brain357]

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

How can corporations hold down wages? You fundamentally don't understand capitalism. If a company doesn't pay market wages for their needs, they don't get the employees they need to do the job at the quality they require to compete.

They only way they could "hold down wages" would be to fall on a sword and screw themselves. Then they would fail and a smarter company who pays market wages would replace them.

Free markets are free for companies, consumers, workers and all other participants. No one can manipulate it except government, and that is because only government can use force to impose it's will on unwilling participants.

Honestly, explaining freedom to you people should be like explaining snacks to a dog, but unfortunately it's like explaining brain surgery to a goldfish. You just don't get it.

You seem to not understand capitalism. These big corporations colluded to not hire each other's workers and hold down wages. Not a free market when there is collusion.

 

[boedicca]

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

How can corporations hold down wages? You fundamentally don't understand capitalism. If a company doesn't pay market wages for their needs, they don't get the employees they need to do the job at the quality they require to compete.

They only way they could "hold down wages" would be to fall on a sword and screw themselves. Then they would fail and a smarter company who pays market wages would replace them.

Free markets are free for companies, consumers, workers and all other participants. No one can manipulate it except government, and that is because only government can use force to impose it's will on unwilling participants.

Honestly, explaining freedom to you people should be like explaining snacks to a dog, but unfortunately it's like explaining brain surgery to a goldfish. You just don't get it.

You seem to not understand capitalism. These big corporations colluded to not hire each other's workers and hold down wages. Not a free market when there is collusion.

You seem to not understand capitalism. Such collusion is not capitalism, it's a hallmark of cronyism.

Many of the ills you blame on capitalism have absolutely nothing to do with it.

 

[Brain357]

Which is what you've trained him to do. What he should do is work harder, invest in his own training and/or find a better job. You sadly don't even consider those possibilities, you jump right to that he'll go for welfare. Do people not have any responsibility for their own lives?

As an employer, I can tell you the #1 issue with low end workers is they don't care. Now I know you're going to come back with they don't care because they are paid so low, but you're wrong, they are paid so low because they don't care. Paying them more gives us zero care, it just gives them a fatter paycheck. Workers who care have no problem making more than minimum wage.

Sounds nice but it seems sometimes big corps are holding down wages and going against the market. Not so easy to go get a better job.
Exclusive: Apple, Google to pay $324 million to settle conspiracy lawsuit

I started my own software company way back in the 80s. It was easy. Made tons, sold it. Took a good job, moved on to a better job. Paid to much in taxes. Now I have an even better job that does not make me pay as much in taxes and I get to work from home. If I want I could go back to work for myself with about a weeks effort on any one of a million different types of jobs. I really don't see where all the crying about there being no jobs is coming from. Not when all it takes to have a job is to be willing to do work that is marketable to customers.

When I was 10 I got a job cutting lawns. Knock knock want me to cut your grass? no ... next door. yes... cut it collect move to the next one. Investment zero lawn mower and gas donated as a hand-up. TEN YEARS OLD instant job creator.

Not going to live off mowing lawns.

 

[Brain357]

How can corporations hold down wages? You fundamentally don't understand capitalism. If a company doesn't pay market wages for their needs, they don't get the employees they need to do the job at the quality they require to compete.

They only way they could "hold down wages" would be to fall on a sword and screw themselves. Then they would fail and a smarter company who pays market wages would replace them.

Free markets are free for companies, consumers, workers and all other participants. No one can manipulate it except government, and that is because only government can use force to impose it's will on unwilling participants.

Honestly, explaining freedom to you people should be like explaining snacks to a dog, but unfortunately it's like explaining brain surgery to a goldfish. You just don't get it.

You seem to not understand capitalism. These big corporations colluded to not hire each other's workers and hold down wages. Not a free market when there is collusion.

You seem to not understand capitalism. Such collusion is not capitalism, it's a hallmark of cronyism.

Many of the ills you blame on capitalism have absolutely nothing to do with it.

I don't blame capitalism, I blame the rich. Our capitalism seems to only help them. They collude and take away the benefits everyone else should get.

 

[RKMBrown]

Have you seen the unemployment rate? Jobs aren't plentiful.

The unemployment rate has nothing to do with the number of available jobs.

People who are unemployed do so voluntarily. One would have to be a complete moron to not be able to get or create a job.

True but the number of jobs available does have something to do with the number of jobs available and once again. There arent many.

Nonsense, the number of jobs available is quite literally INFINITE.

 

[Erand7899]

You make an interesting point

But as a follow up. If your employee doesn't earn enough to support himself, should the taxpayer make up the difference?

Should an employer have the taxpayers support his employees just so that he can profit off of substandard wages?

Is the employee physically and mentally able to seek a higher paying job? Is he physically and mentally able to seek the training needed to qualify for a higher paying job? If he's able to work at a better job, or at least able to prepare for work at a better job, and chooses not to, then taxpayers should not be required to support him.

You seem to assume that there are ample higher paying jobs that remain unfilled.

What if he is functioning to the best of his abilities? Who should make up the difference in his menial wage and what it costs to support a family? His employer or the taxpayer?

Those who the taxpayers are unwilling to support. What should happen to them and their families?

Family, neighbors, churches, etc., were providing charity to those in need, long before government ever got involved, and they still provide many of those services.

I don't buy a junk car, just because it is functioning at the best of its abilities. Every able bodied adult needs to be the primary care giver for themselves and their families. Why should the rest of us be responsible for someone's bad decisions in life?

It is absolutely amazing how many of these poor souls, that cannot seem to feed and house their family properly, always seem to have money for beer, cigerettes, and Friday nights at the pub. Yet, they expect me to sacrifice for their families. I expect them to do a little sacrificing themselves.