Race and the Juvenile Justice System

[Lewdog]

And Trump and Sessions decision to over-ride Obama's practice of no longer using private prisons is only going to make it worse... in making the Criminal Justice system an income generating for private companies. All it is going to do is take money out of the citizens... into the federal government... that is funneled to private companies. It's wrong.

I'm not concerned about private prisons. Because ANY GOVT prison uses outside services right now for damn near everything anyways. You're arguing over who FINANCES THE construction and who designs them really. Govt does a shitty job of Real Estate development and people processing. If you modified the Drug War -- you wouldn't NEED to expand them. If you sent criminal aliens HOME, you wouldn't NEED to expand them.

Wrong. You need to study more about the problems of private prisons. If you will actually listen to the reasons why then I'll tell you. But I'm not going to waste my time if you are going to just wave it off with your hand.

Start a thread. Can't do it here. But I've done this many times before and there is nothing INHERENTLY EFFICIENT or NOBLE about the govt being in the laundry and food and medical services biz in prisons. And nothing EVIL about the fact that PRIVATE individuals risk their OWN MONEY and time to assist the govt in those services or turn a profit. The govt has virtually no penalties for bad performance. A contract prison does.

You're wrong... and this isn't about food, laundry, and medical services. And it has a lot to do with this thread, because private prisons are all about keeping prisons full to make more money. Empty prisons don't turn a profit.

You've brought up education and how it plays a large role in incarceration rates... well it cost money to educate people, whether it be getting them a GED, allowing them to take college courses, or teaching them a vocational job. That's money that private prisons are NOT going to spend. They are all about nothing but being warehouses for people.

Start a thread. The PRISONS have NO POWER "to keep themselves full".. Anything that happens in a prison that affects length of stay is subject to investigation and JUDICIAL action.

Wrong. They have control over keeping track of good time, and when prisoners do not learn life skills, increase their education, or learn a trade while incarcerated in order to ease them back into society, rather than just being warehoused, it only increases recidivism instead of helping to lower it. This is relevant to this thread no matter how many times you want to say it isn't. Private Prisons also have the opportunity to withhold ""good time" earned from the inmates which again increases their prison sentences outside the scope of a court. So here you have Black inmates who have already been given harsher, longer sentences than other races, and now in these private prisons are not getting rehabilitated to become better contributing members of society through programs to make them better people, nor getting the proper care for their problems like drug addiction or mental health issues... and they are going back into society to become criminals again, in a turnstyle effect that fills the prisons back up.

 

[flacaltenn]

Now is that because of racism? Or is it because they have poor family upbringing? Those parents just don't knw how to raise their kids because they never had good parents themselves. Or they only get to talk to their fathers in prison one a month or so and they look up to the rich guy on the neighborhood who is a drug dealer.This is the kind of shit I have read and its wrong.

Well that's where the numbers and statistics come in. Let's be clear -- ANY "judgement" on juvy incarceration rate CAN BE related to race --- WITHOUT --- the cause being racism.. Simply because of the "other factors" that I've been mentioning and that YOU -- seem to be dismissing out of hand.

So -- Let's take a look at an EXCELLENT study from Brookings..

Ten Economic Facts about Crime and Incarceration in the United States | The Hamilton Project

Let's start with the comment you just made about kids seeing their Dad's in prison...

According to the numbers.. If Black ad doesn't have a HS diploma, there's a 50/50 chance that his children WILL be seeing on rare occasions thru a prison window. This risk goes down by more than 1/2 if he does. Now notice carefully that there is a RACIAL DISPARITY here. No magnified effect for whites. But that's because of RELATIVE crime rates in the 2 cohorts. AND ---- other factors. LOTS of other factors including the really simple fact of poorer administration of JUSTICE in low income communities. In those communities, a simple traffic violation can ESCALATE into warrants, court dates and jail time. Like in the Ferguson effect.

So why is Black Dad more likely to BE behind bars? The answer is -- he wasn't ALWAYS that more likely to be there. It's been getting ASTRONOMICALLY worse in our lifetimes. Explanation from the link for the next chart.

Specifically, each point reflects the percent chance that a man born within a given range of years will have spent time in prison by age thirty to thirty-four. Notably, most men who are ever incarcerated enter prison for the first time before age thirty-five, and so these cumulative risks by age thirty to thirty-four are reflective of lifetime risks.

Men in the first birth cohort, 1945–49, reached their mid-thirties by 1980 just as the incarceration rate began a steady incline. For all education levels within this age group, only an 8-percentage point differential separated white and African American men in terms of imprisonment risk (depicted by the difference between the two solid lines on the far left of figure 7). As the incarceration rate rose, however,discrepancies between races became more apparent. Men born in the latest birth cohort, 1975–79, reached their mid-thirties around 2010; for this cohort, the difference in cumulative risk of imprisonment between white and African American men is more than double the difference for the first birth cohort (as seen on the far right of figure 7).

These racial disparities become particularly striking when considering men with low educational attainment. Over 53 percentage points distance white and African American male high school dropouts in the latest birth cohort (depicted by the difference between the two dashed lines on the far right of figure 7), with male African American high school dropouts facing a nearly 70 percent cumulative risk of imprisonment. This high risk of imprisonment translates into a higher chance of being in prison than of being employed. For African American men in general, it translates into a higher chance of spending time in prison than of graduating with a four-year college degree (Pettit 2012; Pettit and Western 2004).

If it's RACISM pal --- then THESE NUMBERS SAY -- racism is getting worse -- not better. But over those time segments, the DROPOUT rate skyrocketed for Blacks in inner cities and the problem was largely IGNORED by Political Leadership and then FOUGHT over as a Teacher-Student-Parent war. And finally -- LATELY -- just papered over by the failing schools and administrators by having them FUDGE the graduation requirements to make the numbers look better. I don't think RACISM has gotten that much worse since if Black men GET a HS education -- the gap shows not much "racial bias"..

Flacaltenn, you want to deny racism but when you start talking about \blacks or any other racial group besides whites racism is a factor. Period. I don't dismiss anything I add. Everything you show here no matter how much you don't like it, Is impacted by racism. .

Poor education results ARE a form of racism to some extent. MOSTLY because the Govt GIVES UP on Black children and assumes they are gonna fail. They CONSTANTLY lower expectations. Largely because the schools in question are run by lefty govts that VIEW Blacks as incapable of Academic excellence.

I love it when I can BE the optimist. And I'm telling you -- I could walk into Philly "bad town" McD's burger joint tomorrow -- steal 15 random Black kids that are heading for a life of econ disaster and turn them into Chemical Engineers, Doctors, Scientists and Financial Analysts. But the 1st thing I got to do --- is get them OUT of "bad town" Philly.. You tell ME --- WHY do families and folks STAY in these places? Do they not know how BIG and diverse this country is?

No the government doesn't give up on black kids. And to your last paragraph I've done all that and the kids did not have to move. You tell me, why is it that you would ask such a dumb ass question? .What is bad town philly? How does it get that way? Do you have a clue?

Of COURSE they are giving up on Black children. Don't expect them to NEED Advanced Placement courses or SAT prep. They don't even expect them to graduate by the SAME STANDARDS as the rest of county or state. Or to graduate at all in the recent past.

How many STEM students HAVE you produced? I don't think we're talking the same results. You can get kids to college to play ball and come out unprepared to do much of anything else. So just GETTING INTO a college is not the goalline. In FACT -- in a lot of cases, there are better paths that include teaching them how to INVENT, INNOVATE, INVEST, PROMOTE. Those are 21st Century econ survival tools.

It wasn't a dumb ass question. They are NOT gonna survive economically or academically in the bad parts of Baltimore or Philly. Or at least there's gonna be a measurable disparity in the outcome --- versus getting them the HELL out of there. Why don't take a trip to Atlanta and check out the lower cost of living, better school opportunities? Even SMALL town life is safer and more affordable..

So WHY is there NOT SOME KIND of exodus from these places??

I'm not poking you here. I NEED your expertise and unique knowledge due to your skin color qualification.

A lot of Black families KNOW their school choices are crap. The ones that care will do EVERYTHING to get a limited slot in a fucking LOTTERY to determine which lucky Black kids get to go to a FUNCTIONING school.. THOUSANDS line up -- only HUNDREDS get the tickets. Go watch the movie "Waiting for Superman".. Look at what the options are if you want your kid to APPRECIATE and love and be successful at learning..

 

[IM2]

IM2 were all your college professors Black? Or did you tell your White professors they were full of shit and that you couldn't learn anything from them because they can't understand the subject unless they are Black?

I did tell some of them that. Yes.

I did a speech and paper on juvenile delinquency after working with kids who were juvenile delinquents for 5 years and the professor who had done no real work with juvenile delinquents tried telling me what I did mot know and we went at it. I remember an English professor trying to tell me how blacks speak differently too. You can try arguing this weak line of stuff all you want but you made comments about the black family and you are not black nor have you lived in a black family in order to make the claims you made.

Bullshit... what you have done is become a perfect example of reverse racism... and no matter how loudly you yell about racism, you... yes YOU are now part of the problem, not part of the solution.

There is mo reverse racism in any of this. It is not reverse racism to tell someone white who has made totally incorrect comments about blacks that they do not know how blacks do things based upon their incorrect comments..

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

 

[Lewdog]

IM2 were all your college professors Black? Or did you tell your White professors they were full of shit and that you couldn't learn anything from them because they can't understand the subject unless they are Black?

I did tell some of them that. Yes.

I did a speech and paper on juvenile delinquency after working with kids who were juvenile delinquents for 5 years and the professor who had done no real work with juvenile delinquents tried telling me what I did mot know and we went at it. I remember an English professor trying to tell me how blacks speak differently too. You can try arguing this weak line of stuff all you want but you made comments about the black family and you are not black nor have you lived in a black family in order to make the claims you made.

Bullshit... what you have done is become a perfect example of reverse racism... and no matter how loudly you yell about racism, you... yes YOU are now part of the problem, not part of the solution.

There is mo reverse racism in any of this. It is not reverse racism to tell someone white who has made totally incorrect comments about blacks that they do not know how blacks do things based upon their incorrect comments..

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

Wrong... not because THEY couldn't relate, but because so often the Black people in the community are like you and are so full of reverse racism that they won't listen to someone that isn't Black.

 

[bgrouse]

What is bad town philly? How does it get that way? Do you have a clue?

It's the people in a town that generally make a town good or bad.

 

[IM2]

Now is that because of racism? Or is it because they have poor family upbringing? Those parents just don't knw how to raise their kids because they never had good parents themselves. Or they only get to talk to their fathers in prison one a month or so and they look up to the rich guy on the neighborhood who is a drug dealer.This is the kind of shit I have read and its wrong.

Well that's where the numbers and statistics come in. Let's be clear -- ANY "judgement" on juvy incarceration rate CAN BE related to race --- WITHOUT --- the cause being racism.. Simply because of the "other factors" that I've been mentioning and that YOU -- seem to be dismissing out of hand.

So -- Let's take a look at an EXCELLENT study from Brookings..

Ten Economic Facts about Crime and Incarceration in the United States | The Hamilton Project

Let's start with the comment you just made about kids seeing their Dad's in prison...

According to the numbers.. If Black ad doesn't have a HS diploma, there's a 50/50 chance that his children WILL be seeing on rare occasions thru a prison window. This risk goes down by more than 1/2 if he does. Now notice carefully that there is a RACIAL DISPARITY here. No magnified effect for whites. But that's because of RELATIVE crime rates in the 2 cohorts. AND ---- other factors. LOTS of other factors including the really simple fact of poorer administration of JUSTICE in low income communities. In those communities, a simple traffic violation can ESCALATE into warrants, court dates and jail time. Like in the Ferguson effect.

So why is Black Dad more likely to BE behind bars? The answer is -- he wasn't ALWAYS that more likely to be there. It's been getting ASTRONOMICALLY worse in our lifetimes. Explanation from the link for the next chart.

Specifically, each point reflects the percent chance that a man born within a given range of years will have spent time in prison by age thirty to thirty-four. Notably, most men who are ever incarcerated enter prison for the first time before age thirty-five, and so these cumulative risks by age thirty to thirty-four are reflective of lifetime risks.

Men in the first birth cohort, 1945–49, reached their mid-thirties by 1980 just as the incarceration rate began a steady incline. For all education levels within this age group, only an 8-percentage point differential separated white and African American men in terms of imprisonment risk (depicted by the difference between the two solid lines on the far left of figure 7). As the incarceration rate rose, however,discrepancies between races became more apparent. Men born in the latest birth cohort, 1975–79, reached their mid-thirties around 2010; for this cohort, the difference in cumulative risk of imprisonment between white and African American men is more than double the difference for the first birth cohort (as seen on the far right of figure 7).

These racial disparities become particularly striking when considering men with low educational attainment. Over 53 percentage points distance white and African American male high school dropouts in the latest birth cohort (depicted by the difference between the two dashed lines on the far right of figure 7), with male African American high school dropouts facing a nearly 70 percent cumulative risk of imprisonment. This high risk of imprisonment translates into a higher chance of being in prison than of being employed. For African American men in general, it translates into a higher chance of spending time in prison than of graduating with a four-year college degree (Pettit 2012; Pettit and Western 2004).

If it's RACISM pal --- then THESE NUMBERS SAY -- racism is getting worse -- not better. But over those time segments, the DROPOUT rate skyrocketed for Blacks in inner cities and the problem was largely IGNORED by Political Leadership and then FOUGHT over as a Teacher-Student-Parent war. And finally -- LATELY -- just papered over by the failing schools and administrators by having them FUDGE the graduation requirements to make the numbers look better. I don't think RACISM has gotten that much worse since if Black men GET a HS education -- the gap shows not much "racial bias"..

Flacaltenn, you want to deny racism but when you start talking about \blacks or any other racial group besides whites racism is a factor. Period. I don't dismiss anything I add. Everything you show here no matter how much you don't like it, Is impacted by racism. .

Poor education results ARE a form of racism to some extent. MOSTLY because the Govt GIVES UP on Black children and assumes they are gonna fail. They CONSTANTLY lower expectations. Largely because the schools in question are run by lefty govts that VIEW Blacks as incapable of Academic excellence.

I love it when I can BE the optimist. And I'm telling you -- I could walk into Philly "bad town" McD's burger joint tomorrow -- steal 15 random Black kids that are heading for a life of econ disaster and turn them into Chemical Engineers, Doctors, Scientists and Financial Analysts. But the 1st thing I got to do --- is get them OUT of "bad town" Philly.. You tell ME --- WHY do families and folks STAY in these places? Do they not know how BIG and diverse this country is?

No the government doesn't give up on black kids. And to your last paragraph I've done all that and the kids did not have to move. You tell me, why is it that you would ask such a dumb ass question? .What is bad town philly? How does it get that way? Do you have a clue?

Of COURSE they are giving up on Black children. Don't expect them to NEED Advanced Placement courses or SAT prep. They don't even expect them to graduate by the SAME STANDARDS as the rest of county or state. Or to graduate at all in the recent past.

How many STEM students HAVE you produced? I don't think we're talking the same results. You can get kids to college to play ball and come out unprepared to do much of anything else. So just GETTING INTO a college is not the goalline. In FACT -- in a lot of cases, there are better paths that include teaching them how to INVENT, INNOVATE, INVEST, PROMOTE. Those are 21st Century econ survival tools.

It wasn't a dumb ass question. They are NOT gonna survive economically or academically in the bad parts of Baltimore or Philly. Or at least there's gonna be a measurable disparity in the outcome --- versus getting them the HELL out of there. Why don't take a trip to Atlanta and check out the lower cost of living, better school opportunities? Even SMALL town life is safer and more affordable..

So WHY is there NOT SOME KIND of exodus from these places??

I'm not poking you here. I NEED your expertise and unique knowledge due to your skin color qualification.

A lot of Black families KNOW their school choices are crap. The ones that care will do EVERYTHING to get a limited slot in a fucking LOTTERY to determine which lucky Black kids get to go to a FUNCTIONING school.. THOUSANDS line up -- only HUNDREDS get the tickets. Go watch the movie "Waiting for Superman".. Look at what the options are if you want your kid to APPRECIATE and love and be successful at learning..

.Yes it was a dumb ass question. And we are talking about the same thing.

Why should they have to leave their friends when the community can get improved?

.Funny how these cities don't have money to improve these communities until it's time to gentrify.

 

[Kat]

 

[IM2]

I did tell some of them that. Yes.

I did a speech and paper on juvenile delinquency after working with kids who were juvenile delinquents for 5 years and the professor who had done no real work with juvenile delinquents tried telling me what I did mot know and we went at it. I remember an English professor trying to tell me how blacks speak differently too. You can try arguing this weak line of stuff all you want but you made comments about the black family and you are not black nor have you lived in a black family in order to make the claims you made.

Bullshit... what you have done is become a perfect example of reverse racism... and no matter how loudly you yell about racism, you... yes YOU are now part of the problem, not part of the solution.

There is mo reverse racism in any of this. It is not reverse racism to tell someone white who has made totally incorrect comments about blacks that they do not know how blacks do things based upon their incorrect comments..

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

Wrong... not because THEY couldn't relate, but because so often the Black people in the community are like you and are so full of reverse racism that they won't listen to someone that isn't Black.

Wrong. Let's see if I can apply your logic here correctly. I am a man but I make a bunch of comments about what its like to be a pregnant. woman. A woman tells me I am wrong but I continue arguing with her telling her how wrong she is and what its like to be pregnant. So then finally the woman tells me that I would not know since I have never been a wo,an or pregnant that she is now a sexist.

 

[Lewdog]

Bullshit... what you have done is become a perfect example of reverse racism... and no matter how loudly you yell about racism, you... yes YOU are now part of the problem, not part of the solution.

There is mo reverse racism in any of this. It is not reverse racism to tell someone white who has made totally incorrect comments about blacks that they do not know how blacks do things based upon their incorrect comments..

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

Wrong... not because THEY couldn't relate, but because so often the Black people in the community are like you and are so full of reverse racism that they won't listen to someone that isn't Black.

Wrong. Let's see if I can apply your logic here correctly. I am a man but I make a bunch of comments about what its like to be a pregnant. woman. A woman tells me I am wrong but I continue arguing with her telling her how wrong she is and what its like to be pregnant. So then finally the woman tells me that I would not know since I have never been a wo,an or pregnant that she is now a sexist.

No.. is every Gynecologist a woman? How did you get a Masters degree with zero skills in logic?

 

[flacaltenn]

Well that's where the numbers and statistics come in. Let's be clear -- ANY "judgement" on juvy incarceration rate CAN BE related to race --- WITHOUT --- the cause being racism.. Simply because of the "other factors" that I've been mentioning and that YOU -- seem to be dismissing out of hand.

So -- Let's take a look at an EXCELLENT study from Brookings..

Ten Economic Facts about Crime and Incarceration in the United States | The Hamilton Project

Let's start with the comment you just made about kids seeing their Dad's in prison...

According to the numbers.. If Black ad doesn't have a HS diploma, there's a 50/50 chance that his children WILL be seeing on rare occasions thru a prison window. This risk goes down by more than 1/2 if he does. Now notice carefully that there is a RACIAL DISPARITY here. No magnified effect for whites. But that's because of RELATIVE crime rates in the 2 cohorts. AND ---- other factors. LOTS of other factors including the really simple fact of poorer administration of JUSTICE in low income communities. In those communities, a simple traffic violation can ESCALATE into warrants, court dates and jail time. Like in the Ferguson effect.

So why is Black Dad more likely to BE behind bars? The answer is -- he wasn't ALWAYS that more likely to be there. It's been getting ASTRONOMICALLY worse in our lifetimes. Explanation from the link for the next chart.

If it's RACISM pal --- then THESE NUMBERS SAY -- racism is getting worse -- not better. But over those time segments, the DROPOUT rate skyrocketed for Blacks in inner cities and the problem was largely IGNORED by Political Leadership and then FOUGHT over as a Teacher-Student-Parent war. And finally -- LATELY -- just papered over by the failing schools and administrators by having them FUDGE the graduation requirements to make the numbers look better. I don't think RACISM has gotten that much worse since if Black men GET a HS education -- the gap shows not much "racial bias"..

Flacaltenn, you want to deny racism but when you start talking about \blacks or any other racial group besides whites racism is a factor. Period. I don't dismiss anything I add. Everything you show here no matter how much you don't like it, Is impacted by racism. .

Poor education results ARE a form of racism to some extent. MOSTLY because the Govt GIVES UP on Black children and assumes they are gonna fail. They CONSTANTLY lower expectations. Largely because the schools in question are run by lefty govts that VIEW Blacks as incapable of Academic excellence.

I love it when I can BE the optimist. And I'm telling you -- I could walk into Philly "bad town" McD's burger joint tomorrow -- steal 15 random Black kids that are heading for a life of econ disaster and turn them into Chemical Engineers, Doctors, Scientists and Financial Analysts. But the 1st thing I got to do --- is get them OUT of "bad town" Philly.. You tell ME --- WHY do families and folks STAY in these places? Do they not know how BIG and diverse this country is?

No the government doesn't give up on black kids. And to your last paragraph I've done all that and the kids did not have to move. You tell me, why is it that you would ask such a dumb ass question? .What is bad town philly? How does it get that way? Do you have a clue?

Of COURSE they are giving up on Black children. Don't expect them to NEED Advanced Placement courses or SAT prep. They don't even expect them to graduate by the SAME STANDARDS as the rest of county or state. Or to graduate at all in the recent past.

How many STEM students HAVE you produced? I don't think we're talking the same results. You can get kids to college to play ball and come out unprepared to do much of anything else. So just GETTING INTO a college is not the goalline. In FACT -- in a lot of cases, there are better paths that include teaching them how to INVENT, INNOVATE, INVEST, PROMOTE. Those are 21st Century econ survival tools.

It wasn't a dumb ass question. They are NOT gonna survive economically or academically in the bad parts of Baltimore or Philly. Or at least there's gonna be a measurable disparity in the outcome --- versus getting them the HELL out of there. Why don't take a trip to Atlanta and check out the lower cost of living, better school opportunities? Even SMALL town life is safer and more affordable..

So WHY is there NOT SOME KIND of exodus from these places??

I'm not poking you here. I NEED your expertise and unique knowledge due to your skin color qualification.

A lot of Black families KNOW their school choices are crap. The ones that care will do EVERYTHING to get a limited slot in a fucking LOTTERY to determine which lucky Black kids get to go to a FUNCTIONING school.. THOUSANDS line up -- only HUNDREDS get the tickets. Go watch the movie "Waiting for Superman".. Look at what the options are if you want your kid to APPRECIATE and love and be successful at learning..

.Yes it was a dumb ass question. And we are talking about the same thing.

Why should they have to leave their friends when the community can get improved?

.Funny how these cities don't have money to improve these communities until it's time to gentrify.

My Gawd man. People leave their friends all the time. I left 100s of tight friends in Silicon Valley when the economics told me to cash out and leave then. You know what? You can Skype them. You can afford to go visit them on the money you save from lower cost of living in other places. It's a HUGE freaking diff. Sometime 3 to 1 in the costs of the important stuff. But more importantly, you're not "Waiting for Superman". Like that movie I just recommended.

And that's exactly what you seem to be doing. Waiting on Superman or the Tooth Fairy. It's not just a matter of money. It's jobs, opportunity to move UP in housing, and crime control. You'd DESTROY the hoods by means of BLACK gentrification as surely as they'd be destroyed by White gentrification. At least the "culture" of those places. It's TAX BASE and RISING home evaluations. You'd be pricing your own out of the neighborhood.

There SHOULD be an Exodus. You're being slow boiled by some of these big city govts and shyster govt services and systems.

 

[flacaltenn]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

 

[Lewdog]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Memphis is an affordable place to live... but their economy is not all that great right now.

 

[Kat]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

 

[Lewdog]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Cheerleader Kat... where is your cheerleading uniform?

 

[flacaltenn]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Heck -- it's a great idea for a Movie at least --- Right?

 

[IM2]

There is mo reverse racism in any of this. It is not reverse racism to tell someone white who has made totally incorrect comments about blacks that they do not know how blacks do things based upon their incorrect comments..

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

Wrong... not because THEY couldn't relate, but because so often the Black people in the community are like you and are so full of reverse racism that they won't listen to someone that isn't Black.

Wrong. Let's see if I can apply your logic here correctly. I am a man but I make a bunch of comments about what its like to be a pregnant. woman. A woman tells me I am wrong but I continue arguing with her telling her how wrong she is and what its like to be pregnant. So then finally the woman tells me that I would not know since I have never been a wo,an or pregnant that she is now a sexist.

No.. is every Gynecologist a woman? How did you get a Masters degree with zero skills in logic?

.Never mind that women were excluded from being doctors for quite a while and that a male gynecologist still would not know what it physically feels like to be a pregnant woman, you fail to admit to the fallacy in your thinking. You have not seen reverse racism in anything I have said.

 

[Kat]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Cheerleader Kat... where is your cheerleading uniform?

Oh I have it on. Repetition ad nauseum drives me up a wall. Had to do something.

 

[Kat]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Heck -- it's a great idea for a Movie at least --- Right?

Yessir!!

 

[Lewdog]

For one, and let me repeat this to you once again...since you didn't listen the first time. I was referring to BLACK JUVENILE OFFENDERS. Not ALL BLACK YOUTH. You keep on going down that strawman argument...

Now, yes, when you have told everyone in this thread that has been saying things and providing information that they can't understand this subject if they aren't Black... that's reverse racism. You've fucked up your own argument and position by spitting the same poison that you say you are against.

But you are wrong abut black juvenile offenders. You see I have been asked by criminal justice pros to sit on committees that worked on issues of youth crime. Why? Because they were white and would admit to the fact that they needed someone black to reach into the black community because they were unable to relate. Therefore what I said to you was not racist. It is a recognized fact that pros working in your field recognize themselves.

I have told exactly 2 people here what you claim.You and Flacaltenn. I have not said that to coyote. .

Wrong... not because THEY couldn't relate, but because so often the Black people in the community are like you and are so full of reverse racism that they won't listen to someone that isn't Black.

Wrong. Let's see if I can apply your logic here correctly. I am a man but I make a bunch of comments about what its like to be a pregnant. woman. A woman tells me I am wrong but I continue arguing with her telling her how wrong she is and what its like to be pregnant. So then finally the woman tells me that I would not know since I have never been a wo,an or pregnant that she is now a sexist.

No.. is every Gynecologist a woman? How did you get a Masters degree with zero skills in logic?

.Never mind that women were excluded from being doctors for quite a while and that a male gynecologist still would not know what it physically feels like to be a pregnant woman, you fail to admit to the fallacy in your thinking. You have not seen reverse racism in anything I have said.

Women were kept from being doctors because of sexism. It has nothing to do with your argument. Your logic is a failure. You said no one can tell a pregnant woman about pregnancy unless they are a woman. Gynecologists are not ALL women. You are wrong. You failed. Try again.

 

[Lewdog]

Grow a beard. Get a big ass cane and LEAD THEM out !!!! With marble tablets in your arms.

I'll suggest a few great places around here for ANY income level.

Cheerleader Kat... where is your cheerleading uniform?

Oh I have it on. Repetition ad nauseum drives me up a wall. Had to do something.