Debate Now Republican candidates discussion, Conservative/libertarian/tea party only

[Foxfyre]

Thank fox. The one thing I am getting concerned about are the new tax plans. Many people call them fantasies because the numbers don't jive. The plans better be ironclad or both republican primary voters and democrats will eviscerate our candidate. KISS. This is the time to create your,own narrative. Do it honestly and do it right.

The President cannot enact a tax plan. He/she can only provide leadership to accomplish one. I trust every one of those people to think it through and come up with something that will work. As I personally support the flat tax concept, I of course mostg appreciate those candidates who are also thinking along those lines. Trump is the only one who seems to support a progressive tax system, and that is a check mark in the negative column for him as I see it. A deal breaker? Not necessarily but I really do hope we get at least a national discussion going on the flat tax and balanced budget concept. And the argument that it won't produce as much revenue is not a reasonable argument with me with a Congress with a track record of spending every penny they get and then some whether or not what they spend is good stewardship of our money. I'm with Ben Carson on the concept that the only way to get Congress to back off spending is to give them less money to spend along with a requirement they have to stay within budget guidelines.

I love Fiorina's proposal who is the ONLY one pushing for a zero base budget concept. Baseline budgeting has been a significant reason the budget has spiraled out of control for decades.

 

[Shrimpbox]

My job is not to just evaluate candidates but to suggest winning strategies. All,that grey matter came through again. All candidates should support a one year moratorium on immigration or acceptance of refugees while we straighten out the system. The country needs time to digest all,the foreign food Obama has been feeding it. Stabilize the situation and reopen our borders after we have adopted solutions to the problem. Immigration in 2016 is totally different than immigration at the end of,the 19 th century. Every social scientist says too much assimilation too soon leads to,the,destruction of a cultural structure that allows for,the rule,of law. Such a moratorium would not,,discriminate against any one group or favor one. It would give the country breathing room. You know what? My talents are being wasted!

 

[Foxfyre]

My job is not to just evaluate candidates but to suggest winning strategies. All,that grey matter came through again. All candidates should support a one year moratorium on immigration or acceptance of refugees while we straighten out the system. The country needs time to digest all,the foreign food Obama has been feeding it. Stabilize the situation and reopen our borders after we have adopted solutions to the problem. Immigration in 2016 is totally different than immigration at the end of,the 19 th century. Every social scientist says too much assimilation too soon leads to,the,destruction of a cultural structure that allows for,the rule,of law. Such a moratorium would not,,discriminate against any one group or favor one. It would give the country breathing room. You know what? My talents are being wasted!

That would work for me. Incidentally caught a bit of Jeb Bush on Fox and Friends this morning, and his ideas about dealing with ISIS were well thought out and merit serious consideration. But he carefully sidestepped the issue of the Syrian refugees. So yes, I wish all the candidates were unified on that issue and your plan sounds as plausible as any.

 

[2aguy]

Well…for me, Ted Cruz would be my pick…however, I will vote for any of the Republicans over hilary….People keep underestimating Trump….he may very well be the nominee...

 

[Foxfyre]

Well…for me, Ted Cruz would be my pick…however, I will vote for any of the Republicans over hilary….People keep underestimating Trump….he may very well be the nominee...

I like Cruz and a Trump/Cruz ticket is being quietly put out there, probably to see if there is any strong push back or maybe just to stir up speculation. Who knows? I am less and less convinced that Trump should be the nominee, but you're right, we have to consider that possibility. Every time I take one of those in depth 'who is your candidate' quizzes, it always comes up with Rubio as the closest match for me. And yet he doesn't appeal to me as much as some others. Go figure.

 

[2aguy]

Well…for me, Ted Cruz would be my pick…however, I will vote for any of the Republicans over hilary….People keep underestimating Trump….he may very well be the nominee...

I like Cruz and a Trump/Cruz ticket is being quietly put out there, probably to see if there is any strong push back or maybe just to stir up speculation. Who knows? I am less and less convinced that Trump should be the nominee, but you're right, we have to consider that possibility. Every time I take one of those in depth 'who is your candidate' quizzes, it always comes up with Rubio as the closest match for me. And yet he doesn't appeal to me as much as some others. Go figure.

I know what it is....he may talk the talk...which is why he seems to match you...but can you trust him to do what he says.....I get the sense that he is going to be another rino......

 

[Foxfyre]

Well…for me, Ted Cruz would be my pick…however, I will vote for any of the Republicans over hilary….People keep underestimating Trump….he may very well be the nominee...

I like Cruz and a Trump/Cruz ticket is being quietly put out there, probably to see if there is any strong push back or maybe just to stir up speculation. Who knows? I am less and less convinced that Trump should be the nominee, but you're right, we have to consider that possibility. Every time I take one of those in depth 'who is your candidate' quizzes, it always comes up with Rubio as the closest match for me. And yet he doesn't appeal to me as much as some others. Go figure.

I know what it is....he may talk the talk...which is why he seems to match you...but can you trust him to do what he says.....I get the sense that he is going to be another rino......

I don't know. He has not proved to be that so far. With a few exceptions his voting record has been pretty good. It would not scare me for Rubio to be the nominee. But it wouldn't thrill me either.

 

[2aguy]

Well…for me, Ted Cruz would be my pick…however, I will vote for any of the Republicans over hilary….People keep underestimating Trump….he may very well be the nominee...

I like Cruz and a Trump/Cruz ticket is being quietly put out there, probably to see if there is any strong push back or maybe just to stir up speculation. Who knows? I am less and less convinced that Trump should be the nominee, but you're right, we have to consider that possibility. Every time I take one of those in depth 'who is your candidate' quizzes, it always comes up with Rubio as the closest match for me. And yet he doesn't appeal to me as much as some others. Go figure.

I know what it is....he may talk the talk...which is why he seems to match you...but can you trust him to do what he says.....I get the sense that he is going to be another rino......

I don't know. He has not proved to be that so far. With a few exceptions his voting record has been pretty good. It would not scare me for Rubio to be the nominee. But it wouldn't thrill me either.

I feel the same way.....I would prefer Cruz...but will take any of the others....

 

[Papageorgio]

Thanks guys for this thread, great discussions and great info.

 

[Foxfyre]

Thanks guys for this thread, great discussions and great info.

Hey Papageorgio, it has been a really good thread. I wish more GOP/conservative types would post here. It is really good to have a thread where we don't have to deal with the drive by insults, etc. and can really discuss the various pros and cons of candidates and issues in depth. It should be obvious that we all don't agree on everybody or everything but I think if we keep hashing it out, we'll know who the best guy to vote for will be by the time our various primary elections come up.

Meanwhile, we should mention that another Presidential hopeful dropped out this week when Bobby Jindal called it quits. I hated that too. He wasn't able to gain any traction, but he knows a LOT, is extremely articulate and able to explain an issue in understandable language, and he added a lot of substance to the debate.

 

[2aguy]

Thanks guys for this thread, great discussions and great info.

Hey Papageorgio, it has been a really good thread. I wish more GOP/conservative types would post here. It is really good to have a thread where we don't have to deal with the drive by insults, etc. and can really has over the various pros and cons of candidates and issues in depth. It should be obvious that we all don't agree on everybody or everything but I think if we keep hashing it out, we'll know who the best guy to vote for will be by the time our various primary elections come up.

Meanwhile, we should mention that another Presidential hopeful dropped out this week when Bobby Jindal called it quits. I hated that too. He wasn't able to gain any traction, but he knows a LOT, is extremely articulate and able to explain an issue, and he added a lot of substance to the debate.

Yeah, I like Jindal.....maybe he can try again.....smart guy, competent guy and he fights.....

 

[Papageorgio]

Jindal and Walker both captured my attention. Trump I have increasingly changed my mind. He is a bull through a China shop.

Cruz is very sharp, Huckabee I don't think is a great choice but I don't dislike him, add Ben Carson and something about him resonates with me. Carly is very articulate.

There are so many GOP and it makes it tough for any to get a lot of traction. Bush is my last choice however if it came between him or a Democrat, he is a far better choice.

 

[2aguy]

Did you see when bush talked about his dad...and said he would kill for his dad, and go to jail for his dad....the way he sounded he reminded me of will farrel playing Ricky Bobby......now...I don't like will farrel and I don't think he is funny...but the way bush sounded was exactly like Ricky Bobby....Jeb just doesn't have it....

 

[Shrimpbox]

Have you all noticed how,the press is trying to put words in the candidates mouths? Someone asks Trump does he support a computer base of all Muslims, trump,responds by saying we have to look at everything, and the press makes it,sound like Trump is for putting all Muslims in a data base when he said no such thing. Does anyone remember when trump,said to bomb all the oil rigs,and cut off Isis funding. What are they doing now? Bombing oil rigs and convoys to cut off funding. This is a pattern the is oft repeated. Democrats and Obama screw up . Republicans tell them what will happen and what to do and democrats insult them. What the republicans say comes true, and they end up doing what pubs recommended in the first place. Obamacare, Isis, immigration have all turned into disasters just as was predicted. Keep,reminding the public who the adults in the room are.

 

[2aguy]

Have you all noticed how,the press is trying to put words in the candidates mouths? Someone asks Trump does he support a computer base of all Muslims, trump,responds by saying we have to look at everything, and the press makes it,sound like Trump is for putting all Muslims in a data base when he said no such thing. Does anyone remember when trump,said to bomb all the oil rigs,and cut off Isis funding. What are they doing now? Bombing oil rigs and convoys to cut off funding. This is a pattern the is oft repeated. Democrats and Obama screw up . Republicans tell them what will happen and what to do and democrats insult them. What the republicans say comes true, and they end up doing what pubs recommended in the first place. Obamacare, Isis, immigration have all turned into disasters just as was predicted. Keep,reminding the public who the adults in the room are.

That is why they hate the internet......back when it was just ABC, CBS, and NBC and all of the anchors were lefties...they could say all of this stuff and not be confronted...now..they lie about a candidate and it is exposed immediately....they have lost control of the news and they hate it.

 

[Foxfyre]

Jindal and Walker both captured my attention. Trump I have increasingly changed my mind. He is a bull through a China shop.

Cruz is very sharp, Huckabee I don't think is a great choice but I don't dislike him, add Ben Carson and something about him resonates with me. Carly is very articulate.

There are so many GOP and it makes it tough for any to get a lot of traction. Bush is my last choice however if it came between him or a Democrat, he is a far better choice.

That 'bull in a china shop' thing is part of Trump's appeal I think. He thinks out loud--I tend to do that too--and he doesn't give a flying fig about political correctness and people realize he is speaking from the heart and mind and not from some poll tested, carefully crafted and memorized script. And because he says things that others would like to say but don't dare in this politically correct environment, and he doesn't care if anybody doesn't like it, people seem to gravitate toward and embrace him in large numbers. He didn't build his empire by making rash, off the cuff decisions though and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't do that as President either.

And I think that is what bothers me about Rubio. When he talks, he always sounds like he is reciting a poll tested, carefully crafted and memorized script. And that always sends up red flags in my head. But there is no getting around it that he is a rising star in the GOP and he does have a really good track/voting record on most issues.

 

[Shrimpbox]

Ok fox, I hope you had a good thanksgiving but we can't get disconnected from the action. I know you have probably stopped going to the malls because of,the terror threat, not! Lol. Man the Donald has everybody against him. Ernst is telling repubs who they can have as candidates and all establishment republicans are ganging up on the Donald. How many times can he step in shit and come out smelling like a rose? Cruz and Rubio are ascending. Carson is waning. Trump may be losing to a better ground game in Iowa. They had Christie creeping up in New Hampshire. Bush is stuck. Carly, I want you to be the new presidents press secretary, probably not gonna happen.

They need to get the focus back on Obama and Hilary. At some point, even though I like him, trump is going to take too much attention away from the real issues and I am going to have to cry uncle. The country is more important than the personality. If he is smart( like who am I to say) he will get more specific. But I didn't have him winning the nomination anyway. Keep an eye on Cruz. They say he is modeling his campaign on obamas and is in it for the long run.

" all the debutants in Houston, couldn't hold a candle to you"

 

[Foxfyre]

Ok fox, I hope you had a good thanksgiving but we can't get disconnected from the action. I know you have probably stopped going to the malls because of,the terror threat, not! Lol. Man the Donald has everybody against him. Ernst is telling repubs who they can have as candidates and all establishment republicans are ganging up on the Donald. How many times can he step in shit and come out smelling like a rose? Cruz and Rubio are ascending. Carson is waning. Trump may be losing to a better ground game in Iowa. They had Christie creeping up in New Hampshire. Bush is stuck. Carly, I want you to be the new presidents press secretary, probably not gonna happen.

They need to get the focus back on Obama and Hilary. At some point, even though I like him, trump is going to take too much attention away from the real issues and I am going to have to cry uncle. The country is more important than the personality. If he is smart( like who am I to say) he will get more specific. But I didn't have him winning the nomination anyway. Keep an eye on Cruz. They say he is modeling his campaign on obamas and is in it for the long run.

" all the debutants in Houston, couldn't hold a candle to you"

We're still some time out to the reality of the first primaries, but as the distance narrows between the campaign activity and the vote, there are some obvious trends. Trump is gaining support in New Hampshire for instance and though he has lost some ground in Iowa, he still leads the pack. All the same front runners are on the radar screen though Carson and Fiorina have lost some serious ground. I think most love Ben Carson but just can't wrap their heads around him being qualified for the position. I think he would enhance anybody's ticket as Veep though. Don't know why Fiorina is losing ground--it certainly is not due to gaffes or appearing clueless--but she is pretty low key and maybe just fails to excite people? I don't know. Each week that passes it looks more and more like Jeb isn't going to be the people's choice.

Personally, I hope the candidates stay on message and don't start slinging mud at each other or the Democrats. Obama and Hillary do a good enough job shooting themselves in the foot and there is nothing to be gained by attacking somebody the media is ignoring right now (Hillary). They can continue to focus on how things are that people don't like, why we don't want more of the same old same old, and point out how Obama/Clinton's proposed policies suck etc. and how they'll make it better.

The one candidate who has not endorsed or reinforced Trump but who hasn't really opposed him is Cruz which makes me wonder about a potential Cruz/Trump or Trump/Cruz ticket. It's hard to imagine either of them embracing the idea of being in the Veep slot but who knows?

 

[Shrimpbox]

Too many alpha males and females to talk about vp. Trump certainly ain't gonna be second banana. Someone on tv said ask trump to name his advisors and Muslim friends, cause he doesn't think trump can. He thinks trump,is a one man show and is wingin it, a wizard of oz. Carly got a bad wrap at hp for not caring about the little guy, but she still has a laser like focus. I like her. Rubio is starting to look tired, he needs to take a weekend off. Republican congress is starting to burn it up. This is your shot Ryan, show us what you got. I will,have to disagree with ya on pointing out obamas and Hilary's failures. Obamacare is imploding, Iran deal isn't even written down on paper and is falling apart. Economy is poised for free fall. At the very least don't let dems totally control the narrative.

 

[Shrimpbox]

I would love to have some feedback here. I did not,see the,debate the way the pundits saw it. I think Cruz was rude and overbearing, he was trying too hard and he hurt himself. I thought Fiorino, Carson, even bush, and especially Christie really did well. I thought Donald looked befuddled and wore out especially over the nuclear triad thing, he whiffed on that question. He also displayed some heretofore Unseen humility which may herald an acknowledgement that he is not invincible. I still feel the media is going for gotcha questions and that Carson missed an opportunity when asked about killing thousands of children, he should have piped back that you would never ask Hilary Clinton that question and that no one attack has killed thousands of children much less hundreds or even tens.

Th thing with Cruz and Rubio is the likability factor in the general. Cruz was not likable and he told a couple,of untruths and acted way too much like a politician. That is not his usual modis operandi. Rubio looked solid and presidential. I want someone who can beat Hilary, last night Cruz was not that man