Republican legislator slams Muhammad Ali

[Esmeralda]

Someone who didn't have the balls to say no, someone who was stupid enough to fight for a cause not worth dying for.

Why should Ali have gone to serve masters who had kept his people enslaved, segregated his people within his life time, still treated his people like shit, and yet you think he should then have forgotten all of this and gone to die for those very same people. Er......

It takes 'balls' to do your duty, not to shirk it and stay home. You can't lose your life saying no.

Furthermore, you're assuming he's fighting for specific people, no, he's fighting to protect loved ones. People her knows. If the war came over here, when they were done there, they'd be in danger.

You keep using the term "your duty", is it your duty to go put your life on the line for rich people to make more money? Or in the case of Vietnam to go tell other countries how to run their country because the people in power have decided they don't like it?

You know, the US went to war in WW2 to fight Nazism, and yet had segregation at home and in the armed forces. Imagine how black people felt, when they kept getting white people tell them that their duty was to die for the people who oppressed them.

My response would have been "you can fuck right off".

Which was, essentially, what Ali's was.

 

[ABikerSailor]

I don't really get the point of this thread. Ali DID dodge the draft. Sometimes the truth hurts, but it doesn't mean we should not speak it.

He didn't dodge the draft. He flat out told them he wasn't going.

how is that not dodging the draft.......

Let me get this straight, we now have an on going war against the very people Trump has vilified to know end. He wants to wipe these bastards off the map, correct? Why is his son's not in uniform? Why do we rally for bitch when he hasn't asked his own to fight for this country. ESPECIALLY WHITE MF'S...YOUR THE ONE'S WHO OWE THIS COUNTRY, NOT US BLACK FOLK. AMERICA HAS BEEN MORE THAN ACCOMIDATING TO WHITE PEOPLE, SO YES YOU SHOULD FIGHT!!

Trump has 3 sons, ages 10, 32 and 38. Ask the draft board why they aren't in uniform.

There is no draft in the US now. Our current military is an all volunteer force. I see you are on top of things.

You're right.................our current military is an all volunteer force, too bad that it is only one percent of the population, and that most of the volunteers are those who are from families of those who earn 50,000/year or less.

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

 

[Esmeralda]

He didn't dodge the draft. He flat out told them he wasn't going.

how is that not dodging the draft.......

Let me get this straight, we now have an on going war against the very people Trump has vilified to know end. He wants to wipe these bastards off the map, correct? Why is his son's not in uniform? Why do we rally for bitch when he hasn't asked his own to fight for this country. ESPECIALLY WHITE MF'S...YOUR THE ONE'S WHO OWE THIS COUNTRY, NOT US BLACK FOLK. AMERICA HAS BEEN MORE THAN ACCOMIDATING TO WHITE PEOPLE, SO YES YOU SHOULD FIGHT!!

Trump has 3 sons, ages 10, 32 and 38. Ask the draft board why they aren't in uniform.

There is no draft in the US now. Our current military is an all volunteer force. I see you are on top of things.

You're right.................our current military is an all volunteer force, too bad that it is only one percent of the population, and that most of the volunteers are those who are from families of those who earn 50,000/year or less.

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

The majority of the military is always from the lower economic level. They finish high school and don't want to go to college. They can't get a decent job and are told they will be trained in the military, etc. In fact, that can be true. My father was lower economic, raised by a single (widowed) mother. He learned electronics in the military and worked at that after the military. But rich kids, middle class kids, are far less likely to join the military.

Or they don't have money for college and can get their college paid for by the GI Bill. I know someone who joined the military for just that reason.

 

[Kat]

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

Oh BS! Why even say that?

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

Yep, beat that dead horse.

I only wish I could be as perfect as you guys. Woe is me. Sigh.

 

[Esmeralda]

I believe in the will of the people working together to make something that is as satisfactory for as many as possible. You don't get this with knuckleheads with guns. You get this with debate, discussion, and acting sensibly.

I believe that those who are not willing to back their voices up with their fists don't deserve a voice at all. I have no use for debate and never have.

Therefore, as women who join the military are not allowed in combat, or only in tiny numbers, they have no right to have an opinion? LOL You are laughable.

That would mean men have no right to an opinion about abortion, as they are not the ones putting their bodies and futures on the line with an unwanted pregnancy.

 

[Esmeralda]

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

Oh BS! Why even say that?

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

Yep, beat that dead horse.

I only wish I could be as perfect as you guys. Woe is me. Sigh.

It's a dead horse, seriously? 5000 Americans died in Iraq. I don't think their parents would consider the fact we were tricked into going there a 'dead horse.' How sad for you to think the way you do.

 

[Kat]

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

Oh BS! Why even say that?

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

Yep, beat that dead horse.

I only wish I could be as perfect as you guys. Woe is me. Sigh.

It's a dead horse, seriously? 5000 Americans died in Iraq. I don't think their parents would consider the fact we were tricked into going there a 'dead horse.' How sad for you to think the way you do.

Esmeralda....Shut Up. Do you know how? Also stop putting words in my mouth. You have no clue what you are talking about. How sad for you to be such a nasty person.

 

[ABikerSailor]

how is that not dodging the draft.......

Let me get this straight, we now have an on going war against the very people Trump has vilified to know end. He wants to wipe these bastards off the map, correct? Why is his son's not in uniform? Why do we rally for bitch when he hasn't asked his own to fight for this country. ESPECIALLY WHITE MF'S...YOUR THE ONE'S WHO OWE THIS COUNTRY, NOT US BLACK FOLK. AMERICA HAS BEEN MORE THAN ACCOMIDATING TO WHITE PEOPLE, SO YES YOU SHOULD FIGHT!!

Trump has 3 sons, ages 10, 32 and 38. Ask the draft board why they aren't in uniform.

There is no draft in the US now. Our current military is an all volunteer force. I see you are on top of things.

You're right.................our current military is an all volunteer force, too bad that it is only one percent of the population, and that most of the volunteers are those who are from families of those who earn 50,000/year or less.

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

The majority of the military is always from the lower economic level. They finish high school and don't want to go to college. They can't get a decent job and are told they will be trained in the military, etc. In fact, that can be true. My father was lower economic, raised by a single (widowed) mother. He learned electronics in the military and worked at that after the military. But rich kids, middle class kids, are far less likely to join the military.

Or they don't have money for college and can get their college paid for by the GI Bill. I know someone who joined the military for just that reason.

You're right................the majority of the military comes from lower economic families. I know I did. But, I didn't join because I couldn't or didn't want to go to college, I really did, but the problem is that my family didn't have enough money to send me, and they told me to find another way.

I spent 20 years in the military and was trained to be able to respond to quite a few situations.

Rich people don't join the military (generally) unless they have some reason.

 

[Esmeralda]

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

Oh BS! Why even say that?

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

Yep, beat that dead horse.

I only wish I could be as perfect as you guys. Woe is me. Sigh.

It's a dead horse, seriously? 5000 Americans died in Iraq. I don't think their parents would consider the fact we were tricked into going there a 'dead horse.' How sad for you to think the way you do.

Esmeralda....Shut Up. Do you know how? Also stop putting words in my mouth. You have no clue what you are talking about. How sad for you to be such a nasty person.

Shut up? That's a quality comeback. Nasty people are people who think killing innocent people is a good thing because the government tells you it's okay...in our 'national interests.' You say I'm a nasty person, but you say that simply because I disagree with not only your opinions but the way you reach them--for example, "My husband said so." Really? When are you going to start thinking for yourself?

 

[Pumpkin Row]

I keep saying it was a war for white people because it was. You're in 1960s America. The president is white, always has been. Only 6 representatives are black out of 500 or so, that's just over 1% representation. Black people had just come out of segregation in a large part of the country and many white people were using laws and the government to keep black people down.

It wasn't a 'War for white people', it was a war for America, America isn't represented by white people, it's not entirely populated by white people, it's not lead by white people. Everyone who lives here as a legal citizen is an American, and as such, it's their war, too. You don't have to be black to represent black people, you represent all of America by being part of the Federal Government.

So America is involved, it doesn't make it right to go fight in that war. If the US started a war against the Jews, and started calling people up in order to put Jews in concentration camps before executing them, do you think all Americans who were called up should go and "do their duty" to the country? Do you?

The US wouldn't get away with starting a physical war against a culture as benign as Jews. Even if they did, they don't represent a threat to America. Stop trying to strawman, this isn't even close to the same thing.

If you are free, doesn't that mean you are free to disagree with the war, disagree with the way the country is run, disagree with going to war? Or are you only free to go die for someone else's cause? That's not freedom.

Yes, you're free to shirk your duty, that doesn't mean you're free from criticism when you do. He was free to stay home, instead of serving his country, and he did, he should be ashamed, but he was free to do so. Many people don't vote in elections, it's their duty, they're free not to do so, and should be ashamed for not doing so, but they still can.

I didn't say the entire USA was the KKK. I'm not even suggesting that all black people should have refused to go fight, I'm suggesting that those in the South should absolutely have refused to fight for the oppressors that put the title of "the nation" onto their jackets.

I was only pointing out that he'd have still been fighting for everyone that wasn't oppressing 'his people'.

 

[Kat]

And..................if you let the GOP run things, you might end up with another draft for a war a la Viet Nam.

Oh BS! Why even say that?

I mean..................we've already been lied into a war in Iraq.

Yep, beat that dead horse.

I only wish I could be as perfect as you guys. Woe is me. Sigh.

It's a dead horse, seriously? 5000 Americans died in Iraq. I don't think their parents would consider the fact we were tricked into going there a 'dead horse.' How sad for you to think the way you do.

Esmeralda....Shut Up. Do you know how? Also stop putting words in my mouth. You have no clue what you are talking about. How sad for you to be such a nasty person.

Shut up? That's a quality comeback. Nasty people are people who think killing innocent people is a good thing because the government tells you it's okay...in our 'national interests.' You say I'm a nasty person, but you say that simply because I disagree with not only your opinions but the way you reach them--for example, "My husband said so." Really? When are you going to start thinking for yourself?

LOL That is super funny....IF you just knew me. I am quite opinionated myself. I know what I believe or do not believe. I even learn from SOME people here. Not you. You come across as a super unhappy person. I am sorry for that.
I happen to have a strong, good relationship with my husband. Since I did not serve, and he did, yeah, I listen. Why wouldn't I?
Sometimes it is better to shut up and just listen rather than mouth off constantly. I really have nothing to say to you.
I used to think you were nice. Now I know differently.
There are ways to have differences of opinion and not be nasty. And if you see nasty from me...you can betcha you came at me first.
I am not quite the pushover I used to be.
My post was NOT to you, it was to ABS. I will be happy to discuss with him. He does know how to be decent.
Now.
Leave me alone.

 

[Pumpkin Row]

Shut up? That's a quality comeback. Nasty people are people who think killing innocent people is a good thing because the government tells you it's okay...in our 'national interests.'

You're right, she should have quality comebacks like:

So profound. So in depth. Truly a remarkable reply, quality everywhere.

Also a high quality reply. Calling someone names is always a remarkable way to debate, I must say.

Calling people racist, also an amazing way to debate. I applaud the quality in your posts, keep up the good work. I also value your incredible ability to avoid hypocrisy. I mean, clearly your posts absolutely ooze quality from every pore. You know, I'd suggest that, if someone disagrees, you call them racist, an idiot, or type a 'crazy' emote, but I don't need to suggest that, you're already on top of it.

 

[frigidweirdo]

I keep saying it was a war for white people because it was. You're in 1960s America. The president is white, always has been. Only 6 representatives are black out of 500 or so, that's just over 1% representation. Black people had just come out of segregation in a large part of the country and many white people were using laws and the government to keep black people down.

It wasn't a 'War for white people', it was a war for America, America isn't represented by white people, it's not entirely populated by white people, it's not lead by white people. Everyone who lives here as a legal citizen is an American, and as such, it's their war, too. You don't have to be black to represent black people, you represent all of America by being part of the Federal Government.

So America is involved, it doesn't make it right to go fight in that war. If the US started a war against the Jews, and started calling people up in order to put Jews in concentration camps before executing them, do you think all Americans who were called up should go and "do their duty" to the country? Do you?

The US wouldn't get away with starting a physical war against a culture as benign as Jews. Even if they did, they don't represent a threat to America. Stop trying to strawman, this isn't even close to the same thing.

If you are free, doesn't that mean you are free to disagree with the war, disagree with the way the country is run, disagree with going to war? Or are you only free to go die for someone else's cause? That's not freedom.

Yes, you're free to shirk your duty, that doesn't mean you're free from criticism when you do. He was free to stay home, instead of serving his country, and he did, he should be ashamed, but he was free to do so. Many people don't vote in elections, it's their duty, they're free not to do so, and should be ashamed for not doing so, but they still can.

I didn't say the entire USA was the KKK. I'm not even suggesting that all black people should have refused to go fight, I'm suggesting that those in the South should absolutely have refused to fight for the oppressors that put the title of "the nation" onto their jackets.

I was only pointing out that he'd have still been fighting for everyone that wasn't oppressing 'his people'.

Again, you seem to be unable to see the difference in who controlled society and what society was.

In 1960s USA, the govt was white run for the most part. The executive was all white, the Legislature had 6 black men and the Judiciary was all white

Let's play "spot the black guy"

I didn't ask you about whether the US would get away with it or not. You're making the claim that you should do what you're told by the government without thinking. Now you're saying the people wouldn't do this...... I mean, you're saying most people would not do their duty if asked to exterminate the Jews?
Well, the Germans did it in the 1930s and 1940s, why not the USA?

You're essentially being contradictory here, saying you should do you duty, oh, unless I introduce something you think won't happen.

We're not talking about whether people get criticized here. We're talking about whether people should do their duty or not. You're saying they should. I'm saying they should if they agree with what that duty involves.

 

[Anathema]

There's a difference between willing to do so in extreme circumstances, and those willing to do so when the itch calls.

McVeigh was not right for backing up his voices with "fists" (or bombs as they call them).

You have no use for debate? Yeah, figures. But then why the fuck are you on here? Go feel excited by shooting your load.

McVeigh was a coward and an imbecile who put uninvolved parties at risk due to his cowardice.

There is a difference between discussion and debate. The former I have no problem with, the latter I have no time for.

 

[Anathema]

Therefore, as women who join the military are not allowed in combat, or only in tiny numbers, they have no right to have an opinion? LOL You are laughable.

That would mean men have no right to an opinion about abortion, as they are not the ones putting their bodies and futures on the line with an unwanted pregnancy.

Apparently you totally misunderstood my comment. I'm not talking about the military. I'm talking about people willing to take up arms for their cause.... whatever it might be.

 

[tigerred59]

He didn't dodge the draft. He flat out told them he wasn't going.

how is that not dodging the draft.......

Let me get this straight, we now have an on going war against the very people Trump has vilified to know end. He wants to wipe these bastards off the map, correct? Why is his son's not in uniform? Why do we rally for bitch when he hasn't asked his own to fight for this country. ESPECIALLY WHITE MF'S...YOUR THE ONE'S WHO OWE THIS COUNTRY, NOT US BLACK FOLK. AMERICA HAS BEEN MORE THAN ACCOMIDATING TO WHITE PEOPLE, SO YES YOU SHOULD FIGHT!!

Trump has 3 sons, ages 10, 32 and 38. Ask the draft board why they aren't in uniform.

Maybe Ali should ask that question....why aren't you in uniform?

Son, I retired 38 years ago. Plus my uniform won't fit anymore.

first off, I'm a girl.

 

[tigerred59]

Since when does anyone with a working brain cell give a rats fuck about republicans and how they think or feel about minorities in this country? If you morons do anything going forward in life, understand, the only people in this country that listens to you fuck heads, give a fuck about you fuck heads are hillbilly racist white fuck heads with lice balls dancing in their rugs, weaves and brains!!! Thanks to Trump, your credit rating is now at 0, your the laughing stock of the planet, all of you

I could name more than one Democrat that has made your credibility 0, and I could do it without invalidating my entire post with pointless cursing, too.

Big gotdamned difference beyatch.....the world is laughing at you white motherfuckers, you Trump dogs, the world. Just as they were laughing when Bush won a second term and got a shoe thrown at his ass. I challenge you to step outside the box and show one sentence where outsiders outside of white fucks in America has laughed at this country while Obama was in office, just a sentence you stupid troll. Because anything coming out of America's mouth .....IS A NON MOTHERFUCKIN FACTOR, DIG?

 

[frigidweirdo]

There's a difference between willing to do so in extreme circumstances, and those willing to do so when the itch calls.

McVeigh was not right for backing up his voices with "fists" (or bombs as they call them).

You have no use for debate? Yeah, figures. But then why the fuck are you on here? Go feel excited by shooting your load.

McVeigh was a coward and an imbecile who put uninvolved parties at risk due to his cowardice.

There is a difference between discussion and debate. The former I have no problem with, the latter I have no time for.

Well, you seem to want to debate the difference between discussion and debate.

 

[Anathema]

Well, you seem to want to debate the difference between discussion and debate.

Not at all. Discussions involve the exchange of information (facts, opinions, etc....) purely for informational/communicative purposes. Debate adds the step of attempting to change the other person's mind or prove one side correct.

I don't debate. My views don't change. I'm not here to change anyone else's views either.

 

[Hossfly]

I don't really get the point of this thread. Ali DID dodge the draft. Sometimes the truth hurts, but it doesn't mean we should not speak it.

He didn't dodge the draft. He flat out told them he wasn't going.

how is that not dodging the draft.......

Let me get this straight, we now have an on going war against the very people Trump has vilified to know end. He wants to wipe these bastards off the map, correct? Why is his son's not in uniform? Why do we rally for bitch when he hasn't asked his own to fight for this country. ESPECIALLY WHITE MF'S...YOUR THE ONE'S WHO OWE THIS COUNTRY, NOT US BLACK FOLK. AMERICA HAS BEEN MORE THAN ACCOMIDATING TO WHITE PEOPLE, SO YES YOU SHOULD FIGHT!!

Trump has 3 sons, ages 10, 32 and 38. Ask the draft board why they aren't in uniform.

There is no draft in the US now. Our current military is an all volunteer force. I see you are on top of things.

Oh, but there is a draft. Since 18 year olds have to register for the draft they are given a number. When POTUS declares a national emergency, and activates the draft, those people as well as eligible retirees and veterans are going to get deployment orders. As I have reached age 75 I am no longer eligible but I am going to lie about my age and tell the Army I am now a 25 year old female.