Scottish independence

[Vikrant]

It does not matter which way the vote goes, it is certain that Scots are not happy. Sooner or later this union will break. Scottish are very different sort of people than English.

 

[Samson]

"Not think England has a say?"





Have you read any English History?

Dude, you got to be kidding me. I doubt anybody on this forum knows more than me when it comes to what English elites are capable of.

We are talking about a referendum here. Yes, English have no say in it. And, it is also true that the elites whose interests are served by the union will resort to all sorts of antics to prevent the independence of Scotland. But if you think there will be military intervention from English and Wales to prevent the Scottish independence then you are wrong. But it will be very interesting to see if that happens.

Coming back to Scottish independence: Scottish people are a staunch supporters of Israel. If they are an independent nation, they will be free to offer more moral and diplomatic support to Israel or else their support for Israel will be moderated by the factions in the union which tend to be pro Arab.

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

 

[Phoenall]

In fairness, some of the claims on the other side are nonsense too.

Is Scotland economically viable? Of course it is. There will be no collapse of the Scottish economy. But it could certainly be disruptive, and Scotland will likely be relatively poorer over time.

What Scots economy, why do you think they want to still be in the British economy and use the British pound. Any currency they have will be new and unproven so not do very well on the market, unless they use the Euro

 

[Phoenall]

You might be able to read, but you don't understand what you are reading. A high standard of living comes at a cost, and in this case it means higher prices. So a chicken fillet costing $1 in the US will cost $10 in Norway.

Britain is a very propaganda centric society. The drawback of societies like that is people grow up believing those propaganda. However, when they come face to face with the truth, it irritates them because it just does not conform to their world view. The result is often name calling or obnoxious behavior such as what we are seeing reflected in your posts. If you act civilized, I will engage in discourse with you but if you act rude and obnoxious then you can talk to the hand.

Like the propaganda spoon fed by the neo Marxists all those years regarding the Pakistani muslim men raping children, when the truth was known it made it ten times worse and now muslims are hated for what they did.

 

[Phoenall]

The English arrived in India to trade as private concerns, not as a national body. They started the East India Company to trade in spice in 1600. The Dutch became the majority party after the English left in 1622. This was the case until William of Orange became King of England and the wars between England and the Dutch ended. The English trade in textiles overtook the trade in spice and became the most lucrative. It was not until 1757 when England went to war in India and it was from this point on they realised they could defeat India by taking it one small province at a time. So you see it was nothing to do with the Scots and they played no role in the matter until the start of the RAJ in 1858.

I gave you the entire timeline and then you come up with this. It does not seem like you are interested in an objective discussion. This is my last post on this subject. You can talk to the hand now.

What you gave was a fantasy world of your own making that has no bearing on reality. The Act of Union was signed before any wars in India, and the British saw how easy it was to take each small province one at a time. The Scots were not involved until 1858 after the Indian Rebellion of1857.
I may as well talk to the hand it has more brains than the rest

 

[Phoenall]

Nothing is static. Scotland would survive just fine..It would have friendly nations lining up to help them.

If they vote to peacefully withdraw, they should be allowed to do so.

...unlike what happened in the war of northern aggression in the u.s.

We can only hope the Scots leave the UK. That should help secessionist movements worldwide. Too bad the Frenchies in Quebec, did not secede. That might have triggered secessionist movements in the USA.

There was something going on in Spain a while back, too?...Catalonia wanted to secede, I think?

Our time is coming again...

Basque separatists is what you are looking for, and they have used terrorist bombings against innocents to force the issue. Like all terrorists they should be shot and we should never negotiate with them.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

In fairness, some of the claims on the other side are nonsense too.

Is Scotland economically viable? Of course it is. There will be no collapse of the Scottish economy. But it could certainly be disruptive, and Scotland will likely be relatively poorer over time.

What Scots economy, why do you think they want to still be in the British economy and use the British pound. Any currency they have will be new and unproven so not do very well on the market, unless they use the Euro

One of the SNP's main claims is that they'll still be able to use the Pound, but that's not clear, and if they join the EU without being allowed to use the Pound they'll be forced into the Euro. They may be forced into the Euro even if they are permitted to use the Pound, frankly. Which is why they should avoid the EU and maybe try to get into the EFTA instead.

 

[Rotagilla]

"Not think England has a say?"





Have you read any English History?

Dude, you got to be kidding me. I doubt anybody on this forum knows more than me when it comes to what English elites are capable of.

We are talking about a referendum here. Yes, English have no say in it. And, it is also true that the elites whose interests are served by the union will resort to all sorts of antics to prevent the independence of Scotland. But if you think there will be military intervention from English and Wales to prevent the Scottish independence then you are wrong. But it will be very interesting to see if that happens.

Coming back to Scottish independence: Scottish people are a staunch supporters of Israel. If they are an independent nation, they will be free to offer more moral and diplomatic support to Israel or else their support for Israel will be moderated by the factions in the union which tend to be pro Arab.

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

In fairness, some of the claims on the other side are nonsense too.

Is Scotland economically viable? Of course it is. There will be no collapse of the Scottish economy. But it could certainly be disruptive, and Scotland will likely be relatively poorer over time.

What Scots economy, why do you think they want to still be in the British economy and use the British pound. Any currency they have will be new and unproven so not do very well on the market, unless they use the Euro

One of the SNP's main claims is that they'll still be able to use the Pound, but that's not clear, and if they join the EU without being allowed to use the Pound they'll be forced into the Euro. They may be forced into the Euro even if they are permitted to use the Pound, frankly. Which is why they should avoid the EU and maybe try to get into the EFTA instead.

They should avoid nato and the EU..Otherwise they'll be flooded with 3rd world immigrants to "culturally enrich" them...not to mention gay "rights" and other moral and cultural poisons "progressives" like so much.

Hold fast to your culture and morals. Resist marxist social engineering, "diversity" and "multiculturalism".

 

[Vikrant]

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

You are one confused cat. If you had read the whole thread you would have known that I have already mentioned that UK elites will try any antics to prevent Scottish independence. This may be a big news for your little brain but I have known it for a while.

Only people in British isles who are staunch supporter of Israel are Scots. If they are independent, Israel will have one more vote in the UN. Last time there was no country but the US who voted in favor of Israel. Don't you think it will be better if there were one more country which would stand up for Israel?

 

[Rotagilla]

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

You are one confused cat. If you had read the whole thread you would have known that I have already mentioned that UK elites will try any antics to prevent Scottish independence. This may be a big news for your little brain but I have known it for a while.

Only people in British isles who are staunch supporter of Israel are Scots. If they are independent, Israel will have one more vote in the UN. Last time there was no country but the US who voted in favor of Israel. Don't you think it will be better if there were one more country which would stand up for Israel?

Israel can sink or swim on their own. We've wasted too much money and lives fighting for israel by proxy in the ME.
We don't need israel for anything and we don't need anything in the ME.

 

[Samson]

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

You are one confused cat. If you had read the whole thread you would have known that I have already mentioned that UK elites will try any antics to prevent Scottish independence. This may be a big news for your little brain but I have known it for a while.

Only people in British isles who are staunch supporter of Israel are Scots. If they are independent, Israel will have one more vote in the UN. Last time there was no country but the US who voted in favor of Israel. Don't you think it will be better if there were one more country which would stand up for Israel?

Linking the argument for Scottish independence to the survival of Israel is absurdly tangential and only adds doubt to the credibility of what might otherwise be reasonable arguments for independence.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

"Not think England has a say?"





Have you read any English History?

Dude, you got to be kidding me. I doubt anybody on this forum knows more than me when it comes to what English elites are capable of.

We are talking about a referendum here. Yes, English have no say in it. And, it is also true that the elites whose interests are served by the union will resort to all sorts of antics to prevent the independence of Scotland. But if you think there will be military intervention from English and Wales to prevent the Scottish independence then you are wrong. But it will be very interesting to see if that happens.

Coming back to Scottish independence: Scottish people are a staunch supporters of Israel. If they are an independent nation, they will be free to offer more moral and diplomatic support to Israel or else their support for Israel will be moderated by the factions in the union which tend to be pro Arab.

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

In fairness, some of the claims on the other side are nonsense too.

Is Scotland economically viable? Of course it is. There will be no collapse of the Scottish economy. But it could certainly be disruptive, and Scotland will likely be relatively poorer over time.

What Scots economy, why do you think they want to still be in the British economy and use the British pound. Any currency they have will be new and unproven so not do very well on the market, unless they use the Euro

One of the SNP's main claims is that they'll still be able to use the Pound, but that's not clear, and if they join the EU without being allowed to use the Pound they'll be forced into the Euro. They may be forced into the Euro even if they are permitted to use the Pound, frankly. Which is why they should avoid the EU and maybe try to get into the EFTA instead.

They should avoid nato and the EU..Otherwise they'll be flooded with 3rd world immigrants to "culturally enrich" them...not to mention gay "rights" and other moral and cultural poisons "progressives" like so much.

Hold fast to your culture and morals. Resist marxist social engineering, "diversity" and "multiculturalism".

They should avoid the EU because the idea of an independent Scotland is so that Scots can govern themselves, which would be impossible if they throw off the national government of the UK only to replace it for the international government of the EU. Additionally, the Euro is a nightmare they should want to stay away from.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Did I say I thought England would use a military option?

No.

If you knew a fraction about the English elites' capabilities, then you would know they have many other options and have always been able to exercise them.

Scotland and Israel? WTF?

Try to focus. Get back on your prescription.

You are one confused cat. If you had read the whole thread you would have known that I have already mentioned that UK elites will try any antics to prevent Scottish independence. This may be a big news for your little brain but I have known it for a while.

Only people in British isles who are staunch supporter of Israel are Scots. If they are independent, Israel will have one more vote in the UN. Last time there was no country but the US who voted in favor of Israel. Don't you think it will be better if there were one more country which would stand up for Israel?

An independent Scotland will have little leverage in the UN, so it really won't much matter.

 

[bendog]

If they leave, I think that Billy Connolly would say "they foked themselves in their bullocks." (-:

 

[Vikrant]

Linking the argument for Scottish independence to the survival of Israel is absurdly tangential and only adds doubt to the credibility of what might otherwise be reasonable arguments for independence.

I agree.

The best incentive for Scots to break away from the union would be the Scottish interests themselves.

And, it is not just oil which makes Scotland wealthier than England and Wales; there are a host of other things. Scotland's per capital income is $40K which is much higher than England's. Scotland is pretty much subsidizing England and Wales at the moment. That is why there will be all attempts to prevent the Scottish independence.

The Scottish economy in ten essential charts - Telegraph

 

[Vikrant]

They should avoid the EU because the idea of an independent Scotland is so that Scots can govern themselves, which would be impossible if they throw off the national government of the UK only to replace it for the international government of the EU. Additionally, the Euro is a nightmare they should want to stay away from.

European union is not a sustainable entity. There is irreconcilable disparity among member states.

 

[Samson]

Linking the argument for Scottish independence to the survival of Israel is absurdly tangential and only adds doubt to the credibility of what might otherwise be reasonable arguments for independence.

I agree.

The best incentive for Scots to break away from the union would be the Scottish interests themselves.

And, it is not just oil which makes Scotland wealthier than England and Wales; there are a host of other things. Scotland's per capital income is $40K which is much higher than England's. Scotland is pretty much subsidizing England and Wales at the moment. That is why there will be all attempts to prevent the Scottish independence.

The Scottish economy in ten essential charts - Telegraph

Indeed.

And from your link I found this extremely interesting:

But with the likes of the Royal Bank of Scotland and Lloyds already saying they would re-domicile to England in the event of a Yes vote, this would substantially reducing the new economy's exposure to bank failure, while causing the ratio of banking assets to GDP in the rest of the UK to shoot up.
​

I'm not certain the reduction in exposure would necessarily be a good thing, considering that there doesn't seem to be anything to take the place of this much business unless world wide demand for Scotch and Plaid Wool Clothing skyrockets.

 

[Vikrant]

^ Banks can move or re-register themselves in England. The important thing is they cannot take Scottish share of money. I do not think anyone is saying that Scotland's income will go up. What the yes campaign is saying that they will get to keep the money they make.

 

[Phoenall]

In fairness, some of the claims on the other side are nonsense too.

Is Scotland economically viable? Of course it is. There will be no collapse of the Scottish economy. But it could certainly be disruptive, and Scotland will likely be relatively poorer over time.

What Scots economy, why do you think they want to still be in the British economy and use the British pound. Any currency they have will be new and unproven so not do very well on the market, unless they use the Euro

One of the SNP's main claims is that they'll still be able to use the Pound, but that's not clear, and if they join the EU without being allowed to use the Pound they'll be forced into the Euro. They may be forced into the Euro even if they are permitted to use the Pound, frankly. Which is why they should avoid the EU and maybe try to get into the EFTA instead.

Have you seen their economy and cost of living, they even ration alcohol and charge extremely high prices for it.

 

[Indofred]

One of the SNP's main claims is that they'll still be able to use the Pound,.

They can, but without any guarantees.