Scottish independence

[Phoenall]

Will the Duchess of Cambridge's pregnancy help save the Union?

It's ignited round two of royal baby-mania, but the No camp shouldn't get too excited.

Scottish Independence Will the Duchess of Cambridge s pregnancy help save the union - Comment - Voices - The Independent

Highly unlikely as the rabid rabble rousers of pro independence also happen to be anti monarchists and hate the Royals. But without them Scotland would be just another sad place to live.

 

[Vikrant]

I personally wish Scottish people good luck. At least nobody is going to start a war against them because of their referendum. Unlikely in Ukraine, which started exterminating its SE just because they had had their referendum and with huge majority said "NO!" to Kiev and their Nazi regime. You would think that all the progressive mankind should stop that genocide and blame Kiev for its aggression towards its own citizens? Surprise: the world is doing completely opposite...

That is an interesting point. This brings us back to the issue of unequal treatment that Scots have been subjected to. Even European Union discriminates against Scotland. Look at how EU is rolling the red carpet for Ukraine but it is the same EU which is threatening Scots against their quest for freedom. That tells you that EU was created for the benefit of select few European countries not all European countries.

 

[Vikrant]

What a load of crap the union was formed when Scotland went bankrupt and came to England for help. A deal was struck for Scotland to become part of the UK while keeping its own identity and laws. This was acceptable and so Scotland joined the union as an equal partner after England had bailed them out. It was only with the rise of Scots nationalism and the inherent racism produced that certain hot headed Scots decided they wanted to be free of England while still keeping the money flowing in. What should have happened when Scotland devolved from the rest of Britain is the £2500 subsidy granted to every Scot should have ceased and they should have received a proportional amount of the money raised from Scots taxes and the ability to raise their own taxes on top. This would have shown just how much Scotland is indebted to Great Britain and how much the racist SNP is lying to the Scots people.

Both Scotland and England were dirt poor before they started looting other countries. English used the gold and money they looted from their colonies to bribe the Scottish elites who in turn colluded with English in destroying the social fabric of Scotland. That is why Scotland is in a state of confusion today.

It is really 'generous' of England to take away Scotland's resources and in return throw some crumb at them like the subsidy you are talking about.

 

[Phoenall]

The scots have nothing to offer the EU that they cant get elsewhere. They have no strategic importance like the Ukraine, no arable farm lands to grow grain. The scots treatment was so unequal that they received £2,500 per person per year more than the English. So they will lose all that subsidy when they declare independence

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

The Scots would be wise to reject the EU even harder than they do the UK.

 

[Phoenall]

What a load of crap the union was formed when Scotland went bankrupt and came to England for help. A deal was struck for Scotland to become part of the UK while keeping its own identity and laws. This was acceptable and so Scotland joined the union as an equal partner after England had bailed them out. It was only with the rise of Scots nationalism and the inherent racism produced that certain hot headed Scots decided they wanted to be free of England while still keeping the money flowing in. What should have happened when Scotland devolved from the rest of Britain is the £2500 subsidy granted to every Scot should have ceased and they should have received a proportional amount of the money raised from Scots taxes and the ability to raise their own taxes on top. This would have shown just how much Scotland is indebted to Great Britain and how much the racist SNP is lying to the Scots people.

Both Scotland and England were dirt poor before they started looting other countries. English used the gold and money they looted from their colonies to bribe the Scottish elites who in turn colluded with English in destroying the social fabric of Scotland. That is why Scotland is in a state of confusion today.

It is really 'generous' of England to take away Scotland's resources and in return throw some crumb at them like the subsidy you are talking about.

Scotland was bankrupt in 1700 when it ploughed over half of its capital into the failed Darien scheme, so they had to go cap in hand to the English to bail them out. England never took anything it paid for the oil exploration out of the Unions coffers for the benefit of all British subjects, it was a Scot that gave it away to Europe. But the British government gave the Scots a £2,500 subsidy that they did not give to the English, on top of the oil wealth that went to Aberdeen. They stand to lose all that in their racist greed and good luck to them

 

[Phoenall]

The Scots would be wise to reject the EU even harder than they do the UK.

Then they would be screwed as they would have no support for any future currency they might create, so would face bankruptcy as a nation all over again. They are putting all their eggs in one basket and forget that they don't have sole ownership of the oil.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

The Scots would be wise to reject the EU even harder than they do the UK.

Then they would be screwed as they would have no support for any future currency they might create, so would face bankruptcy as a nation all over again. They are putting all their eggs in one basket and forget that they don't have sole ownership of the oil.

Well it's not a guarantee they're going to get to use the Pound, and if they join the EU they won't be able to create their own currency. They'll be forced into the Euro.

 

[Mindful]

I watched George Galloway put his case to keep the Union.

 

[Samson]

Union between Scotland and England was a union of convenience. The union was formed to exploit the colonies. It was Scotland which provided foot soldiers for most of the British colonial conquests. The wealth that both English and Scottish acquired from their joint colonial efforts convinced Scots about the merit of the union. But thing is colonies are long gone now. Money is tight.

Norway had about the same amount of oil Scotland has but unlike Scotland, Norway being a free nation was able to invest profit from oil sale into Norwegian economy. Look at results today. Norway has extremely high standard of living. On the contrary, Scotland is in bad shape. Why? Because, Scottish oil went to London. In about ten days, we will know the fate of Scotland. I personally do not care what the outcome would be. It is up to Scottish people whether they want to become free and take control of their destiny or they want to stick with the union and complaint about how unhappy they are.

Look at Ireland. There was a time when British people used to make fun of Irish people. But Ireland stuck to its character and spirit. They are doing pretty well today. And to make a point, Ireland did not have to engage in grand military conquest of any nation. They did it on their own. They could have easily joined Britain and provided foot soldiers just like Scots did but they did not.

At the end, truth always triumphs.

What a load of crap the union was formed when Scotland went bankrupt and came to England for help. A deal was struck for Scotland to become part of the UK while keeping its own identity and laws. This was acceptable and so Scotland joined the union as an equal partner after England had bailed them out. It was only with the rise of Scots nationalism and the inherent racism produced that certain hot headed Scots decided they wanted to be free of England while still keeping the money flowing in. What should have happened when Scotland devolved from the rest of Britain is the £2500 subsidy granted to every Scot should have ceased and they should have received a proportional amount of the money raised from Scots taxes and the ability to raise their own taxes on top. This would have shown just how much Scotland is indebted to Great Britain and how much the racist SNP is lying to the Scots people.

By "Scotland went Bankrupt" I assume you mean that Scottish nobles lost money in their ill fated colonial adventures?

 

[1776]

Uh Ireland isn't leaving the UK while Russia is looking west....

No different that Ireland, eh?

 

[Toro]

Scotland = Oil

Black Gold under the North Sea.

England is not going to let it go anywhere.

That oil is rapidly diminishing, but the Yes side is whitewashing this.

Generally in the polls, the more educated are against this and the less educated are for it.

 

[Toro]

When the scots get a subsidy of £2000 a year each no one can claim that Britain is richer, isn't Scotlamd part of Britain along with Wales and N.I.

Apparently, great number of Scots do not feel like they are a part of UK. Economically speaking, it makes sense for Scotland to go independent. This way they do not have to subsidize ailing English economy.

lol

Not.

 

[Toro]

The Scots would be wise to reject the EU even harder than they do the UK.

Scotland would likely join the EU, whereas Scottish independence would make the probability of the UK leaving greater.

As for all this oil in the North Sea

How much North Sea oil revenue can an independent Scotland extract Politics theguardian.com

 

[Vikrant]

By "Scotland went Bankrupt" I assume you mean that Scottish nobles lost money in their ill fated colonial adventures?

I am not sure what he/she means by Scotland went bankrupt. The reality is both England and Scotland were dirt poor at the time their union began. England in its attempt to rectify its poverty, started venturing out looking for new ways to generate revenue. They started arriving in India around the time India as a strong country was in its last leg. The central authority in India was disappearing fast. It lead to various warring factions in India. English started to exploit the situation by trying to establish control over territories in India. The problem was that even though India was in a chaos, it still offered stiff resistance to English. English realized that they needed much larger troop than what they had. Naturally, they approached Scots and offered them a share of the loot if Scots agreed to help English. Scots accepted the deal and the rest is history. The kind of money they were taking from India to Scotland and England totally changed their life style. They went dirt poor to rich overnight. It was this money that kept Scots in the union. Now as you can see, colonies are gone. England has only Scotland to exploit. This creates a not so very savory situation for Scots.

What English think of Scots can be judged from this old English saying:
England is for beauty
Ireland is for wit
Welsh is for deceit
Scotland is for shit

 

[Vikrant]

That oil is rapidly diminishing, but the Yes side is whitewashing this.

Generally in the polls, the more educated are against this and the less educated are for it.

That was the whole point of me bringing in oil: Scots squandered their oil wealth while Norwegians used their oil revenue to boost their economy.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

The Scots would be wise to reject the EU even harder than they do the UK.

Scotland would likely join the EU, whereas Scottish independence would make the probability of the UK leaving greater.

As for all this oil in the North Sea

How much North Sea oil revenue can an independent Scotland extract Politics theguardian.com

I know, and that's why this whole independence scheme is essentially pointless.

 

[Phoenall]

Union between Scotland and England was a union of convenience. The union was formed to exploit the colonies. It was Scotland which provided foot soldiers for most of the British colonial conquests. The wealth that both English and Scottish acquired from their joint colonial efforts convinced Scots about the merit of the union. But thing is colonies are long gone now. Money is tight.

Norway had about the same amount of oil Scotland has but unlike Scotland, Norway being a free nation was able to invest profit from oil sale into Norwegian economy. Look at results today. Norway has extremely high standard of living. On the contrary, Scotland is in bad shape. Why? Because, Scottish oil went to London. In about ten days, we will know the fate of Scotland. I personally do not care what the outcome would be. It is up to Scottish people whether they want to become free and take control of their destiny or they want to stick with the union and complaint about how unhappy they are.

Look at Ireland. There was a time when British people used to make fun of Irish people. But Ireland stuck to its character and spirit. They are doing pretty well today. And to make a point, Ireland did not have to engage in grand military conquest of any nation. They did it on their own. They could have easily joined Britain and provided foot soldiers just like Scots did but they did not.

At the end, truth always triumphs.

What a load of crap the union was formed when Scotland went bankrupt and came to England for help. A deal was struck for Scotland to become part of the UK while keeping its own identity and laws. This was acceptable and so Scotland joined the union as an equal partner after England had bailed them out. It was only with the rise of Scots nationalism and the inherent racism produced that certain hot headed Scots decided they wanted to be free of England while still keeping the money flowing in. What should have happened when Scotland devolved from the rest of Britain is the £2500 subsidy granted to every Scot should have ceased and they should have received a proportional amount of the money raised from Scots taxes and the ability to raise their own taxes on top. This would have shown just how much Scotland is indebted to Great Britain and how much the racist SNP is lying to the Scots people.

By "Scotland went Bankrupt" I assume you mean that Scottish nobles lost money in their ill fated colonial adventures?

Not just the nobles but the rest of Scotland was to suffer. The failed harvests 3 years running were biting hard at the time so the thought of a fertile haven was just the thing needed by the Scots. But that is how the act of union came about. Can you see England doing it again after the Scots declare independence and then go bankrupt.

 

[Phoenall]

By "Scotland went Bankrupt" I assume you mean that Scottish nobles lost money in their ill fated colonial adventures?

I am not sure what he/she means by Scotland went bankrupt. The reality is both England and Scotland were dirt poor at the time their union began. England in its attempt to rectify its poverty, started venturing out looking for new ways to generate revenue. They started arriving in India around the time India as a strong country was in its last leg. The central authority in India was disappearing fast. It lead to various warring factions in India. English started to exploit the situation by trying to establish control over territories in India. The problem was that even though India was in a chaos, it still offered stiff resistance to English. English realized that they needed much larger troop than what they had. Naturally, they approached Scots and offered them a share of the loot if Scots agreed to help English. Scots accepted the deal and the rest is history. The kind of money they were taking from India to Scotland and England totally changed their life style. They went dirt poor to rich overnight. It was this money that kept Scots in the union. Now as you can see, colonies are gone. England has only Scotland to exploit. This creates a not so very savory situation for Scots.

What English think of Scots can be judged from this old English saying:
England is for beauty
Ireland is for wit
Welsh is for deceit
Scotland is for shit

You don't have a clue on what you are talking about. Trying looking up the Darien Scheme for starters and see that in the 1690's Scotland tried to emulate all the other nations and create colonies in the new world. They failed and lost most of Scotlands money. So in return for the Act of Union England bailed Scotland out.

 

[Vikrant]

You don't have a clue on what you are talking about. Trying looking up the Darien Scheme for starters and see that in the 1690's Scotland tried to emulate all the other nations and create colonies in the new world. They failed and lost most of Scotlands money. So in return for the Act of Union England bailed Scotland out.

It is you who is clueless. You have absolutely no clue what solidified English hold on Scotland; it was the gold (aka money) looted from India which was used by English to coerce Scottish elites. You are just mouthing off the propaganda you have heard in your racist circle.