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I was a teen in the 70's. Grown men "dating" 14 year old girls was NOT the norm nor considered acceptable. Moore defenders might trash these girls reputations but their accounts are confirmed by Moore's reputation by the people in that town and local police.And this is why many women are reluctant to speak up.I think there is a pattern here that needs to be acknowledged. I'm not being partisan either as I included several Democrats.
And out of all of these women, did a single one of them ever suffer any consequences for their actions? Not that I'm aware of. When it blows over, they just continue their lives and only the accused suffers the aftermath.
I'm all for the protection of our women, but this has really got to stop. It's just way too obvious that most-- if not all of it is pure bullshit. Money chasers and attention whores is all they are to me unless evidence is presented. The more credibility we give them, the more frequently we will be treated to stories like this.
Except in every case, it's the same MO. First one woman comes out against a wealthy or popular person, or both, and all of a sudden, many more come out of the woodwork.
If a crime has been committed, then you immediately report the crime. If you report the crime decades later, of course the claim loses a lot of credibility. I knew girls back in the 70's that were assaulted, they went straight to the police station and had the cops pick the guy up. In reality, they had to be more concerned about the family than the police, and I'm sure that was tenfold in Alabama years ago.
One of my late coworkers started dating his wife when she was 15. She was from the south somewhere, but not sure if Alabama or not. Anyway, his claim is they never had any sex until after they were married. Even though she was 15, he was ten years older than her serving our country. He fought in Vietnam and made a career in the military.
They stayed married until his death. He and his wife raised a great family with grandkids. The sexual revolution didn't effect every single young person at the time. There were still plenty of old fashioned youngsters back then who withheld their sexual desires until the absolute right one came along.
What I'm saying is that we can't use a situation back then and put it into our modern world today. Dating back then for many people was just that--dating and no further.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Franken was closer to rape than Moore ever was, and at least we have evidence of it.
Did you pull that out of your fat ass after a quick stint in the toilet bowl?'
is Franken accused of molesting a 14 year old? yes or No, scum bucket?
You mean the 14 year old who was molested in the "back" parking lot that never existed? As a true liberal, you believe that unproven accusations are more evidence than a photo of a man attacking a woman while she slept. Uninformed Voters..........
I think Franken is honest. Moore not so much. I think you are far more willing to believe the bad about a Dem then about a Pub.
Franken attacking? No. He was making a bad joke on her, and she ACCEPTED his apology,. Too bad Moore isn't as honest.
And by honest you mean by your judgement as a liberal?
Do you know why Franken had to apologize? He got busted.
Now when you have as much concrete evidence on Moore as we have with Franken, I would expect an apology out of him. In fact any evidence, even a smidgen, I would expect him to drop out of the race. And no, hearsay is not what any reasonable person could consider evidence.
I believe those women.
I believe the police detective.
I believe the people who knew Moore's reputation.
There are enough different people corroborating a pattern that I think he should step down. You aren't talking about just one woman. You aren't talking about a seat in an area that is even up for grabs - it's hard core red.
What I see in Moore is hypocrisy. A willingness to elect someone who's character is most definately stained...who has even broken the law he is sworn to uphold in his days as a judge....over ANYONE else.
That is sad.
And a clear double standard because I am sure you would not apply those distinctions to a Dem.
I believe those women.
I believe the police detective.
I believe the people who knew Moore's reputation.
There are enough different people corroborating a pattern that I think he should step down. You aren't talking about just one woman. You aren't talking about a seat in an area that is even up for grabs - it's hard core red.
What I see in Moore is hypocrisy. A willingness to elect someone who's character is most definately stained...who has even broken the law he is sworn to uphold in his days as a judge....over ANYONE else.
That is sad.
And a clear double standard because I am sure you would not apply those distinctions to a Dem.
Okay, so what you're saying is that from now on, anytime unproven accusations are made, a candidate should step down because we should just accept such accusations as fact. Forget about the country we left behind where a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. We are too liberal for those silly rules now.
And if we do that, then who would we get to run our country? After all, people can make unproven accusations against anybody.
No. I did not say that at all.
You didn't? Okay, then the only thing I can figure is that standard only applies to certain people.....Republicans I'm assuming.
Because if we should stop Moore from running for a seat in the Senate based on unproven accusations, wouldn't it be fair to stop anybody from running for anything based on the same thing????
Nope. Same standard to Dems and Pubs. I do not like sexual predators and there is enough DIVERSE evidence to at least put question to Moore's character...
Fine. Let's hold that standard to politicians of either party. If enough people come out with unproven claims, that candidate should be thrown out of office or not allowed to run. Works for me, as long as it's equal.
I was a teen in the 70's. Grown men "dating" 14 year old girls was NOT the norm nor considered acceptable. Moore defenders might trash these girls reputations but their accounts are confirmed by Moore's reputation by the people in that town and local police.And this is why many women are reluctant to speak up.
Except in every case, it's the same MO. First one woman comes out against a wealthy or popular person, or both, and all of a sudden, many more come out of the woodwork.
If a crime has been committed, then you immediately report the crime. If you report the crime decades later, of course the claim loses a lot of credibility. I knew girls back in the 70's that were assaulted, they went straight to the police station and had the cops pick the guy up. In reality, they had to be more concerned about the family than the police, and I'm sure that was tenfold in Alabama years ago.
One of my late coworkers started dating his wife when she was 15. She was from the south somewhere, but not sure if Alabama or not. Anyway, his claim is they never had any sex until after they were married. Even though she was 15, he was ten years older than her serving our country. He fought in Vietnam and made a career in the military.
They stayed married until his death. He and his wife raised a great family with grandkids. The sexual revolution didn't effect every single young person at the time. There were still plenty of old fashioned youngsters back then who withheld their sexual desires until the absolute right one came along.
What I'm saying is that we can't use a situation back then and put it into our modern world today. Dating back then for many people was just that--dating and no further.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Mall Manager possessed the ban list. Moore’s name was never on it. Cops told?, but only one knew?
And again, in forty years, no opposition candidate used it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE? No press ever reported it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE.
Only the dumbest of the dumb can believe that all the groups that opposed Moore went silent on something of such
COMMON KNOWLEDGE!
This stinks of reverse engineering. You know it, and I know it.
Wake up.
Hell no. We have to hold to the standard of innocent until proven guilty or the political system will be bedlam with every whack job out there coming forth with accusation from 50 years ago.
We have to stop this shit right in its tracks that an accuser should be believed at all costs.
I was a teen in the 70's. Grown men "dating" 14 year old girls was NOT the norm nor considered acceptable. Moore defenders might trash these girls reputations but their accounts are confirmed by Moore's reputation by the people in that town and local police.And this is why many women are reluctant to speak up.
Except in every case, it's the same MO. First one woman comes out against a wealthy or popular person, or both, and all of a sudden, many more come out of the woodwork.
If a crime has been committed, then you immediately report the crime. If you report the crime decades later, of course the claim loses a lot of credibility. I knew girls back in the 70's that were assaulted, they went straight to the police station and had the cops pick the guy up. In reality, they had to be more concerned about the family than the police, and I'm sure that was tenfold in Alabama years ago.
One of my late coworkers started dating his wife when she was 15. She was from the south somewhere, but not sure if Alabama or not. Anyway, his claim is they never had any sex until after they were married. Even though she was 15, he was ten years older than her serving our country. He fought in Vietnam and made a career in the military.
They stayed married until his death. He and his wife raised a great family with grandkids. The sexual revolution didn't effect every single young person at the time. There were still plenty of old fashioned youngsters back then who withheld their sexual desires until the absolute right one came along.
What I'm saying is that we can't use a situation back then and put it into our modern world today. Dating back then for many people was just that--dating and no further.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Mall Manager possessed the ban list. Moore’s name was never on it. Cops told?, but only one knew?
And again, in forty years, no opposition candidate used it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE? No press ever reported it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE.
Only the dumbest of the dumb can believe that all the groups that opposed Moore went silent on something of such
COMMON KNOWLEDGE!
This stinks of reverse engineering. You know it, and I know it.
Wake up.
Hell no. We have to hold to the standard of innocent until proven guilty or the political system will be bedlam with every whack job out there coming forth with accusation from 50 years ago.
We have to stop this shit right in its tracks that an accuser should be believed at all costs.
I know that. I'm trying to get Coyote to understand it.
Did you pull that out of your fat ass after a quick stint in the toilet bowl?'
is Franken accused of molesting a 14 year old? yes or No, scum bucket?
You mean the 14 year old who was molested in the "back" parking lot that never existed? As a true liberal, you believe that unproven accusations are more evidence than a photo of a man attacking a woman while she slept. Uninformed Voters..........
I think Franken is honest. Moore not so much. I think you are far more willing to believe the bad about a Dem then about a Pub.
Franken attacking? No. He was making a bad joke on her, and she ACCEPTED his apology,. Too bad Moore isn't as honest.
And by honest you mean by your judgement as a liberal?
Do you know why Franken had to apologize? He got busted.
Now when you have as much concrete evidence on Moore as we have with Franken, I would expect an apology out of him. In fact any evidence, even a smidgen, I would expect him to drop out of the race. And no, hearsay is not what any reasonable person could consider evidence.
I believe those women.
I believe the police detective.
I believe the people who knew Moore's reputation.
There are enough different people corroborating a pattern that I think he should step down. You aren't talking about just one woman. You aren't talking about a seat in an area that is even up for grabs - it's hard core red.
What I see in Moore is hypocrisy. A willingness to elect someone who's character is most definately stained...who has even broken the law he is sworn to uphold in his days as a judge....over ANYONE else.
That is sad.
And a clear double standard because I am sure you would not apply those distinctions to a Dem.
Third accuser has just been destroyed by court records proving that this situation she claimed happened when Moore supposedly groped her ass never occurred and she came forward out of revenge.
Moore awarded custody of her son to her mother who was terrified of her daughter at the time. She was violent, committed fraud, and a criminal.
Two accusers left and Allred refuses to release the yearbook for independent analysis. The credibility of the two remaining women accusers is quickly getting shredded.
The police detective? Are you kidding me? She was yakking away based on rumors. All you believe are rumors that are unsubstantiated.
Unfreaking real. Seriously. Try innocent until proven guilty. You have no evidence. You have jack shit with the so called witnesses because everything is based on rumor and innuendo.
No one should go down over accusations brought forth 40 years later weeks before an election. Moore will not and should not step down.
I was a teen in the 70's. Grown men "dating" 14 year old girls was NOT the norm nor considered acceptable. Moore defenders might trash these girls reputations but their accounts are confirmed by Moore's reputation by the people in that town and local police.Except in every case, it's the same MO. First one woman comes out against a wealthy or popular person, or both, and all of a sudden, many more come out of the woodwork.
If a crime has been committed, then you immediately report the crime. If you report the crime decades later, of course the claim loses a lot of credibility. I knew girls back in the 70's that were assaulted, they went straight to the police station and had the cops pick the guy up. In reality, they had to be more concerned about the family than the police, and I'm sure that was tenfold in Alabama years ago.
One of my late coworkers started dating his wife when she was 15. She was from the south somewhere, but not sure if Alabama or not. Anyway, his claim is they never had any sex until after they were married. Even though she was 15, he was ten years older than her serving our country. He fought in Vietnam and made a career in the military.
They stayed married until his death. He and his wife raised a great family with grandkids. The sexual revolution didn't effect every single young person at the time. There were still plenty of old fashioned youngsters back then who withheld their sexual desires until the absolute right one came along.
What I'm saying is that we can't use a situation back then and put it into our modern world today. Dating back then for many people was just that--dating and no further.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Mall Manager possessed the ban list. Moore’s name was never on it. Cops told?, but only one knew?
And again, in forty years, no opposition candidate used it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE? No press ever reported it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE.
Only the dumbest of the dumb can believe that all the groups that opposed Moore went silent on something of such
COMMON KNOWLEDGE!
This stinks of reverse engineering. You know it, and I know it.
Wake up.
There is and was no "ban list" - just common knowledge.
What motivation did these girls have?
I was a teen in the 70's. Grown men "dating" 14 year old girls was NOT the norm nor considered acceptable. Moore defenders might trash these girls reputations but their accounts are confirmed by Moore's reputation by the people in that town and local police.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Mall Manager possessed the ban list. Moore’s name was never on it. Cops told?, but only one knew?
And again, in forty years, no opposition candidate used it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE? No press ever reported it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE.
Only the dumbest of the dumb can believe that all the groups that opposed Moore went silent on something of such
COMMON KNOWLEDGE!
This stinks of reverse engineering. You know it, and I know it.
Wake up.
There is and was no "ban list" - just common knowledge.
What motivation did these girls have?
Common knowledge? Rumor? Wreck a man's life over 40 year old rumors from a handful of mall rats? Motivation for one was revenge so she's gone. Two women left. Who the hell knows the motivation at this point in time.
Cripes the maniac bitch that went wild with her accusations against a Fraternity with "A Rape on Campus" that destroyed lives lied about the rape to get attention from a boy she liked.
That woman should be in jail for crying out loud for the damage she did. Motivation was just to get a boy to like her.
You mean the 14 year old who was molested in the "back" parking lot that never existed? As a true liberal, you believe that unproven accusations are more evidence than a photo of a man attacking a woman while she slept. Uninformed Voters..........
I think Franken is honest. Moore not so much. I think you are far more willing to believe the bad about a Dem then about a Pub.
Franken attacking? No. He was making a bad joke on her, and she ACCEPTED his apology,. Too bad Moore isn't as honest.
And by honest you mean by your judgement as a liberal?
Do you know why Franken had to apologize? He got busted.
Now when you have as much concrete evidence on Moore as we have with Franken, I would expect an apology out of him. In fact any evidence, even a smidgen, I would expect him to drop out of the race. And no, hearsay is not what any reasonable person could consider evidence.
I believe those women.
I believe the police detective.
I believe the people who knew Moore's reputation.
There are enough different people corroborating a pattern that I think he should step down. You aren't talking about just one woman. You aren't talking about a seat in an area that is even up for grabs - it's hard core red.
What I see in Moore is hypocrisy. A willingness to elect someone who's character is most definately stained...who has even broken the law he is sworn to uphold in his days as a judge....over ANYONE else.
That is sad.
And a clear double standard because I am sure you would not apply those distinctions to a Dem.
Third accuser has just been destroyed by court records proving that this situation she claimed happened when Moore supposedly groped her ass never occurred and she came forward out of revenge.
Moore awarded custody of her son to her mother who was terrified of her daughter at the time. She was violent, committed fraud, and a criminal.
Two accusers left and Allred refuses to release the yearbook for independent analysis. The credibility of the two remaining women accusers is quickly getting shredded.
The police detective? Are you kidding me? She was yakking away based on rumors. All you believe are rumors that are unsubstantiated.
Unfreaking real. Seriously. Try innocent until proven guilty. You have no evidence. You have jack shit with the so called witnesses because everything is based on rumor and innuendo.
No one should go down over accusations brought forth 40 years later weeks before an election. Moore will not and should not step down.
None of that disproves anything. And no one can come up with a reason why these women, the Police and other townspeople would decide to to do this. The only one defending Moore is Trump - another sexual harraser.
Even the governor said she believed the women but would still support Moore.
Ohhhhhhh, your the one with the police report that nobody else can seem to find!
Oh, you don’t? Know why? It never happened.
Ever wonder how something that everybody knew about never made a single news report or was ever used against him in almost FOURTY YEARS? Until just weeks before this election
Hell, Hustler magazine was paying millions of dollars to nab conservatives, and no one in Gadsden needed a big pay day WHEN EVERYONE IN THAT TOWN SUPPOSSEDLY KNEW ABOUT THIS?
You can’t make this shit up know matter how hard you try.
We went from 9 accusers to 2
Mall ban - nope, never happened
Cops told to watch him around teen girls, but no report exists?
This thing is dieing a quick merciful death.
As I said Pops....Ailes, O'Reilly, Weinstein provided the tipping point for women to come out with less fear of retaliation. What did they have to gain? Seriously? These are dyed in the wool Republican women in a red red state.
Let me ask you this. Billy Boy Clinton's accusers came out at a politically convenient time. Were they all liars? At least they got a court hearing. How about Frankens? How about the others? Is Franken to be dammed because he was honest enough to fess up?
The allegations against Moore seem to be well corroborated. The only DEFENSE seems to be shredding the women's reputations. No wonder so few women step forward.
Roy Moore changes his story about accusers, compares claims to Trump-Russia investigation
Moore accuser fires back in letter: 'I demand that you stop calling me a liar'
Why don't women step forward? The 1970's....
Why Roy Moore's accusers stayed silent for so long
"I didn't even tell my mom about it. She had told me one time that it was common for men to 'mess around' with the teenage girls...her mother had told her that was just the way it was, and that they should never talk about it. Then it happened to me and I didn't tell my mom because I knew it would upset her."
At the outset of the #MeToo movement an extended family member privately shared her experience of sexual assault with me. She was a young woman when she was raped - just like the eight women who have accused Roy Moore of sexual misconduct. But there is another reason why my relative, and Moore's accusers have been silent until now - Southern culture.
Silencing is a common tactic use by perpetrators of childhood sexual violence; many survivors of sexual trauma remain silent out of shame and fear. They are justified in doing so. For children, the threat of further harm is very real and perpetrators depend on secrecy. Even for adults, victim-blaming, stigma and re-traumatization may accompany disclosure. In Southern culture, the norm of the 'good girl' combined with the adage of 'speak when you are spoken to' closes the door on information sharing. It also affirms the lie that perpetrators often tell their victims: they will not be believed.
Other elements of the traditional Southern Belle archetype also play a role. Southern women, and especially girls, are expected to be as "sweet as pie" and genteel to boot. There is, after all, an entire magazine dedicated to Southern Living and hospitality. It simply wouldn't be polite by Southern standards to out sexual assailants. Instead Moore's behavior has been an open secret and the fodder for small town rumor mills. While some have attempted to discredit Moore's victims, they would not have come forth without prompting from members of the media.
As of this point...there are multiple women, who have accused Moore of impropriaties:
Roy Moore sexual abuse allegations - Wikipedia
And:
A former colleague who worked with Moore at the Etowah County District Attorney's office from 1982 to 1985 stated, "It was common knowledge that Roy dated high school girls, everyone we knew thought it was weird [...] We wondered why someone his age would hang out at high school football games and the mall".[32][33] At least four current and former residents of Etowah County have corroborated the colleague's story. One said, "These stories have been going around this town for 30 years ... Nobody could believe they hadn't come out yet". Another said, "Him liking and dating young girls was never a secret in Gadsden when we were all in high school ... In our neighborhoods up by Noccalula Falls we heard it all the time. Even people at the courthouse know it was a well-known secret ... It's just sad how these girls [who accused Moore] are getting hammered and called liars, especially Leigh [Corfman]."[34]
On November 13, The New Yorker quoted multiple local former police officers and mall employees who had heard that Roy Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall in the early 1980s for attempting to pick up teenage girls.[35][36] An Alabama woman said that Moore was banned from the mall in the late 1970s after she reported to her manager that he was sexually harassing her.[37] Local news channel WBRC interviewed Barnes Boyle, a manager of the mall from 1981 to 1998, who said that, to his knowledge, Moore was not banned.[38] The Moore campaign has now produced two other witnesses, a longtime mall employee and the Operations Manager overseeing mall security, both of whom state that he was never banned from the mall.[39]
Faye Gray[40], a retired detective, who is a 37 year veteran of the Gadsden police force, stated that in the 1980s she was told to look out for Roy Moore due to his known harassment of cheerleaders at local school athletic events. The detective said that she also had heard that Moore had been banned from the Gadsden Mall and also said that both in the police department and at the Gadsden courthouse there were frequent mentions of Moore liking young girls. She said "I didn’t realize until sometime later that when they said he liked young girls, I just thought he liked young ladies, you know, maybe in their 20s. I had no idea, or we had no idea, that we were talking about 14-year-olds." [41]
This is more then just unfounded allegations. If Moore were a Dem you'd be over him like white on rice.
Mall Manager possessed the ban list. Moore’s name was never on it. Cops told?, but only one knew?
And again, in forty years, no opposition candidate used it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE? No press ever reported it? Supposedly COMMON KNOWLEDGE.
Only the dumbest of the dumb can believe that all the groups that opposed Moore went silent on something of such
COMMON KNOWLEDGE!
This stinks of reverse engineering. You know it, and I know it.
Wake up.
There is and was no "ban list" - just common knowledge.
What motivation did these girls have?
Common knowledge? Rumor? Wreck a man's life over 40 year old rumors from a handful of mall rats? Motivation for one was revenge so she's gone. Two women left. Who the hell knows the motivation at this point in time.
Cripes the maniac bitch that went wild with her accusations against a Fraternity with "A Rape on Campus" that destroyed lives lied about the rape to get attention from a boy she liked.
That woman should be in jail for crying out loud for the damage she did. Motivation was just to get a boy to like her.
So...all these accusers are just lying? They are "mall rats"? All liars? Same with the mall personnel...the police...etc?
What was their motivation?
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
There's two. And they appear to be staying out of the limelight.
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
There's two. And they appear to be staying out of the limelight.
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
There's two. And they appear to be staying out of the limelight.
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
nope.
theres no evidence he did, which means theres no evidence he didnt.
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
There's two. And they appear to be staying out of the limelight.
Have any of the accusers retracted their statements?
nope.
theres no evidence he did, which means theres no evidence he didnt.
In other words the claim that it's down to two is a lie?
What facts?
