Self Defense with a firearm

[Jarlaxle]

Like I said, I am not seeing much difference (if any) between you and a gang banger that you hate so much.

You both have to carry so that after you instigate a confrontation (like the white guy did) you can pull a gun to show what bad asses you are.

And the guy wasn't trying to choke the other guy. And the white guy never tried to fight back. All he did was go for the gun. And the white guy instigated the fight.

But you call that self defense. Fuck that.

And if you can't tell what is happening from the video, you've never done much fighting. You can see the white guy decide to call the dude outside when he changes his body language, his demeanor and his hand gestures.

No wonder those bikers kicked your ass. You never saw it coming.

Dude...does it HURT to be THIS FUCKING STUPID?

 

[zeke]

A man throws a punch, the other man shoots him dead. What is wrong with this scenario?

More people are killed with fists and feet than they are with "assault" rifles every year.

If someone attacks you it is prudent to think he will kill you if given the chance.

Have you ever been the victim of a violent crime?

I have and the two guys had nothing but fists and feet (steel toed boots and one guy had a bike chain wrapped around his right hand)

Recently a Kansas City cop shot and killed an off-duty firefighter who was unarmed and was ruled justifiable.

The firefighter (on his honeymoon apparently) was drunk as a skunk and would not leave an area when ordered. He began to fight the cop and, quite frankly, was beating the hell out of the cop. He finally pulled his weapon and shot the guy twice. He suffered a broken jaw, busted nose and broken ribs.

Things like that are ALWAYS a bad situation - but if I were in the same situation - I would not have hesitated to shoot, either. Some of these guys, when they get into a fist-fight, aim to kill the guy. No doubt attributed to "MMA" or something of the sort.

I sincerely hope that none of you are ever in a situation where you have to use deadly force on anyone. It sticks with you for the rest of your life - whether you are right or wrong. Makes no difference.

Thanks for saying that. That is what I have always heard and believe. It is pretty easy to pull the trigger and kill someone. Not so easy to live with it.

But man there are a bunch of people seemingly just looking for the chance.

 

[zeke]

Like I said, I am not seeing much difference (if any) between you and a gang banger that you hate so much.

You both have to carry so that after you instigate a confrontation (like the white guy did) you can pull a gun to show what bad asses you are.

And the guy wasn't trying to choke the other guy. And the white guy never tried to fight back. All he did was go for the gun. And the white guy instigated the fight.

But you call that self defense. Fuck that.

And if you can't tell what is happening from the video, you've never done much fighting. You can see the white guy decide to call the dude outside when he changes his body language, his demeanor and his hand gestures.

No wonder those bikers kicked your ass. You never saw it coming.

Dude...does it HURT to be THIS FUCKING STUPID?

You watch the video asshole? Or are you one of them wanna be bad motherfuckers that have to carry? You know, to be da man with da gun. Bad muttafucker you.

Which is it? You watch the video? What did you see? You didn't see the white guy call him out? Then you're a blind, lying motherfucker. You didn't see the white guy, as they walked down the isle, make sure that his gun was free in his pocket. Or the white guy never take his hand from his right hand pocket?

Come on dude. What the fuck was the white guy doing if it wasn't setting this guy up to get shot? Why'd he call the black guy out side?

 

[Jarlaxle]

Dude...just stop. The wanna-be fake gangbanger lingo isn't at all amusing, just stupid. Go guzzle a 40 and calm down or something.

 

[MikeK]

To qualify as self defense, an attacker only needs the means to cause bodily harm or death; this does not necessitate the possession of any weapon at all, much less a gun.

I've had very few fights in my life but I've won them all. The reason for that is I enjoyed the sport of wrestling. I learned from experts at the YMCA and I was pretty good at it -- which is a supreme advantage in a fight with someone who is not a wrestler and cannot anticipate or avoid being taken down.

The point is even a moderately proficient wrestler is quite capable of getting behind an opponent, applying a choke hold -- and easily killing him within one minute. The notion that an unarmed attacker does not represent a lethal threat is mistaken. So one who is not proficient at wrestling or some related martial art should be very careful who he gets into a fight with -- or is attacked by.

No Mike, the point in this case is that the white guy instigated the fight BECAUSE he had a gun in his pocket. He knew he had to provoke the guy into an attack so that when he shot him he could claim self defense.

The guy (shooter) knew exactly what he was doing.

The police used to prosecute acts like this as murder or something a little less. The fear of being charged with murder kept supposedly normal, sane people from killing each other so callously.

Guess Bob Dylan was right. Them times, they are a changin'.

Evidently you have never met anyone that carried a gun because they thought they were a bad ass. Or wanted to be thought of as a bad ass. You are seeing one of those in that Walmart video. Because I guarantee you that if the white guy did not have a gun in his pocket, he would have never called the black guy out. Over something being said about who is next in line. Guarantee it.

Actually I wasn't referring to any specific incident but simply disputing the notion that one is never justified in shooting an unarmed attacker.

As regards the incident you are referring to; I didn't watch the video so I have no opinion. But I don't disagree with the general implication of your comments.

 

[NoNukes]

Hmmmm Is it a coward who carries a gun because they know that they are physically unable to defend themselves against people half their age?

Is it a coward who carries a gun because they know that they, as a woman, are physically unable to defend themselves against most men?

Is it a coward who carries a gun because they know that most attacks are not by single individuals, but by at least two people and usually more?

Sounds like a lot of paranoid people. Guess the United States is a lot more violent than civilized countries.

Do you own a fire extinguisher? If so, does that make you Paranoid?

Do you own a First Aide Kit? If so, does that make you Paranoid?

Do you have a spare tire for your car? If so, does that make you Paranoid?

Do you have spare keys made for your house and car? If so does that make you Paranoid?

I do not carry them around on my person for protection, and none of them are deadly weapons.

 

[NoNukes]

A man throws a punch, the other man shoots him dead. What is wrong with this scenario?

For one thing, it bears no resemblance to the facts of the case.

But you knew that. Lying to revoke civil rights is virtue, right?

It has everything to do with this case.

 

[NoNukes]

I have been in fights in my life and never shot my opponent.

I have been in no fights in my adult life.

Hmmm, must be a left / right thing....

Come back when you can make sense.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I have been in fights in my life and never shot my opponent.

I have been in no fights in my adult life.

Hmmm, must be a left / right thing....

Come back when you can make sense.

He noted successfully that he has not been in a fight as an adult while you claimed to have been in a few. So based on that information one must assume you are a violent person.

 

[Spiderman]

Like I said, I am not seeing much difference (if any) between you and a gang banger that you hate so much.

You both have to carry so that after you instigate a confrontation (like the white guy did) you can pull a gun to show what bad asses you are.

And the guy wasn't trying to choke the other guy. And the white guy never tried to fight back. All he did was go for the gun. And the white guy instigated the fight.

But you call that self defense. Fuck that.

And if you can't tell what is happening from the video, you've never done much fighting. You can see the white guy decide to call the dude outside when he changes his body language, his demeanor and his hand gestures.

No wonder those bikers kicked your ass. You never saw it coming.

Your conjecture is meaningless

The fact is the Asian guy made the first move. You can try to spin it anyway you want but the guy who throws the first punch is the one who initiates.

 

[Geaux4it]

Like I said, I am not seeing much difference (if any) between you and a gang banger that you hate so much.

You both have to carry so that after you instigate a confrontation (like the white guy did) you can pull a gun to show what bad asses you are.

And the guy wasn't trying to choke the other guy. And the white guy never tried to fight back. All he did was go for the gun. And the white guy instigated the fight.

But you call that self defense. Fuck that.

And if you can't tell what is happening from the video, you've never done much fighting. You can see the white guy decide to call the dude outside when he changes his body language, his demeanor and his hand gestures.

No wonder those bikers kicked your ass. You never saw it coming.

Look- Let me break it down for you.. It's quite simple as I'm sure you'll understand..Expect to be shot dead if you attack someone. But hey, everyone has their own risk aversion meter

YMMV

-Geaux

 

[racewright]

Let me make this simple. I was raised by a pro boxer,(DAD) if there is one thing he instilled in me it is.
God,Goverment,fellow man,justice system,and any other entity can go jump in the lake I determine what I will do-- with anything in this world and will protect my self anyway I see fit "GET IT" so stick your constitution and religion were this sun don't shine I make the rules for me and decisions .
This is what Georgie and the boys were trying to put down on paper but you fools need something in writing so you have a way of understanding right from wrong--but you for the most part get it wrong.
Take your rules and laws and put them on the weak as you always do, but they will not work on me--I know right from wrong and will act accordingly.
Some simple examples for you who do not know right from wrong:
1. you do not hurt you fellow man unless he tries to hurt you and yours
2. mind your own business
3.be kind unless being kind is not being respected
4. give to those in need
5. do not be taken advantage of
6. charity begins at home.

These are just a few samples for those who need it in writing.

 

[TemplarKormac]

A innocent man has the right to preserve his life by any means necessary. If that means killing the aggressor(s) with my firearm, so be it. I will not be told to do otherwise by people hellbent on taking that right away from me.

 

[JoeB131]

A innocent man has the right to preserve his life by any means necessary. If that means killing the aggressor(s) with my firearm, so be it. I will not be told to do otherwise by people hellbent on taking that right away from me.

And when you go to prison, Tubby?

Yeah, that's what we really need, a guy who can't hold down a job due to his mental problems walking around with a gun.

 

[Theowl32]

Liberals, on the wrong side of another issue. Shocked.

 

[zeke]

I gotta make sure I understand this new world of shooting people without cause.

I can go up to a person and provoke them anyway necessary to get them to throw a punch.
Cut in line, trash talk them, insult their wife, tell the person to fuck off. Provoke any way I can to get to get the person to commit a physical, aggressive act toward me.

Then I can shoot and kill that person and call it "self defense".

That about cover it? Sounds like premeditated murder to me. When you start looking for a reason to shoot someone like the white guy was doing.

For those of you that liked this shooting. Why didn't the white guy put his form on the counter where there was no people in line? Why did the white guy call the black guy outside? Why would a guy 30 pounds lighter and 6 inches shorter pick a fight over something said about cutting in line? What did the white guy plan to do when he got outside? Knowing he had that gun. So what was the bad ass white guy doing calling the guy out?

Were they heading for lunch? To get a drink? To just shoot the shit? Or fight?

They were heading out to fight. The black guy sees that the white guy has his hand in his pocket and asks what the guy has. A gun? SO the black guy, not having his own gun does what I would have done. Attack the guy BEFORE he gets his gun out of his pocket. The white guy was asking for the fight.

Unfortunately the black guy didn't hit the white guy hard enough. All he did was try and grab him. The black guy should have kicked him in the nuts then beat the hell out of him.

We live in a fucked up world today. All you bad muttafuckers carrying a piece looking for a reason to shoot someone. For no good reason.

 

[Spiderman]

I gotta make sure I understand this new world of shooting people without cause.

I can go up to a person and provoke them anyway necessary to get them to throw a punch.
Cut in line, trash talk them, insult their wife, tell the person to fuck off. Provoke any way I can to get to get the person to commit a physical, aggressive act toward me.

He didn't cut in line he stopped to sign something. And how do you know the asian guy didn't start the trash talking and "calling out"? You don't.

The white guy was walking away. The asian guy was following do you know if he was the one taunting or not? You don't.

The asian guy initiated physical contact THAT is when the law was broken. THAT is the aggressive act

Then I can shoot and kill that person and call it "self defense".

AFter being attacked yes you can. You seem to think that a guy calling you a a name is reason to physically attack them. What's wrong with you? Are you that violent and unhinged that some punk calling you a name will make you snap?

That about cover it? Sounds like premeditated murder to me. When you start looking for a reason to shoot someone like the white guy was doing.

Yeah the guy walking away with his back turned to the guy who attacked him was trying to start something .

For those of you that liked this shooting. Why didn't the white guy put his form on the counter where there was no people in line? Why did the white guy call the black guy outside? Why would a guy 30 pounds lighter and 6 inches shorter pick a fight over something said about cutting in line? What did the white guy plan to do when he got outside? Knowing he had that gun. So what was the bad ass white guy doing calling the guy out?

Why did the asian guy get all pissy about a guy using the counter to sign something? Why did he follow the white guy and then lay hands on him? He must have been mentally unstable if these events made him so angry that he attacked someone.

Were they heading for lunch? To get a drink? To just shoot the shit? Or fight?

Tell me if the asian guy didn't follow the white kid out and try to attack him what would have happened?
.[/QUOTE]

 

[DiamondDave]

Yeah.. unfortunately you assume a lot.. and unfortunately you call for an attack as the way out instead of walking away.. and unfortunately you side with the person who starts an assault...

Unfortunately, you are a citizen of this country

 

[Geaux4it]

I gotta make sure I understand this new world of shooting people without cause.

I can go up to a person and provoke them anyway necessary to get them to throw a punch.
Cut in line, trash talk them, insult their wife, tell the person to fuck off. Provoke any way I can to get to get the person to commit a physical, aggressive act toward me.

Then I can shoot and kill that person and call it "self defense".

That about cover it? Sounds like premeditated murder to me. When you start looking for a reason to shoot someone like the white guy was doing.

For those of you that liked this shooting. Why didn't the white guy put his form on the counter where there was no people in line? Why did the white guy call the black guy outside? Why would a guy 30 pounds lighter and 6 inches shorter pick a fight over something said about cutting in line? What did the white guy plan to do when he got outside? Knowing he had that gun. So what was the bad ass white guy doing calling the guy out?

Were they heading for lunch? To get a drink? To just shoot the shit? Or fight?

They were heading out to fight. The black guy sees that the white guy has his hand in his pocket and asks what the guy has. A gun? SO the black guy, not having his own gun does what I would have done. Attack the guy BEFORE he gets his gun out of his pocket. The white guy was asking for the fight.

Unfortunately the black guy didn't hit the white guy hard enough. All he did was try and grab him. The black guy should have kicked him in the nuts then beat the hell out of him.

We live in a fucked up world today. All you bad muttafuckers carrying a piece looking for a reason to shoot someone. For no good reason.

Dont attack anyone and no worries.. Oh, and it helps to MYOB

-Geaux

 

[Geaux4it]

Couldn't address the legit question in what I wrote eh?

Why am I not surprised. It is because you are one of the most dishonest, punk ass fuckers on this board.

And what is cool is that I can talk to you like a fucking dog. Smear you name all over the board. And as long as I don't physically attack you, its all good. Cool.

To bad we will never meet in person. Would be fun trying to provoke you into an attack so I could shoot your lying ass. And it would all be all right.

As long as my provocation wasn't physical and your retribution was physical, I can shoot and kill you.
Even if you just push me and say get the fuck out of here. When you touched me, I could kill you.

And call it self defense. LMAO. You are one stupid mother fucker.

Wow.. you got anger issues dude..maybe mental

-Geaux

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