Serious?

[candycorn]

You're missing the point on purpose because you can't debate the larger point. Because you've already lost.

Read this. Do you know what this says? This says that union you are in protected you from taking major pay cuts or being fired. You should thank god for the union that you don't pay into but still defends your sorry ass.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, teachers were spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses in the Great Recession. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have. You can't have it both ways. You want a safe government job but you also want to make what we in the private sector make?

Granted, by many measures and in many places, teaching remains a solidly middle-class profession. Government data shows that the average teacher earns about $59,000 a year, with many school districts offering good benefits and generous retirement plans. Andrew Biggs, an economist at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, pushed against the notion that teachers are broadly underpaid. “It’s a good and a very family-friendly job,” citing its reasonable hours and long summer break. “Why should you pay them more?

You have a chip on your shoulder about teachers and also say really, deeply ignorant things about education. Stunningly ignorant things.

I don't belong to the NEA or, of course, my local union and I don't want to speak to you about education.

I don't say the things about teachers I just repeat

Why America's Teachers Haven't Been Getting Raises

The successful two-week-long strike of public-school workers in West Virginia—as well as the imminent strike of teachers in Oklahoma, led by grassroots activists, including Cagle—has thrown into relief the financial difficulties that thousands of education professionals face. Yet those difficulties are not unique to those two states. Despite the perception that educator jobs are unionized, pay decently well, and are guaranteed-tenure, hundreds of thousands of American teachers have seen their wages and benefits erode in recent years, more so than for many other types of workers.

It's true many of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession because you are unionized. But your pay also hasn't gone up because you are a government union employee.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, such employees were largely spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have, either, with public finances still squeezed, public workforces still smaller than their pre-recession peak, and local government officials still hesitant to make critical investments in their workforces and infrastructure.

These teachers should be fired for striking. And striking is the only way you'll ever get a raise lady so I hope they break the unions and cut out the old hags like you who are too old and burned out and ugly.

You're a wonderful liberal. Really, you're perfect.

"Old, burned out and ugly."

Yep, that's perfect. You make a great case for what qualifies a person to be a teacher. You're as ignorant as I suspected--more so, actually.

Do you think the same thing about Don Jr. yes or no?

Donald Trump, Jr. referred to teachers as "losers" at a campaign event.

And yet you voted for Trump after at his rallies his son called you teachers losers?

So lady, spare me your fake outrage. You are a political hack who only cares about banning abortion. You'd even sacrifice your own financial security unknowingly no doubt but still you ignore the obvious that Republicans would lower your pay if they could. And they'd take away all the protections you have. You would shit if you had to work the way we work. You government employees don't even know how good you got it. Lucky half of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession.

Let me guess you also don't believe in global warmring or evolution too right?

Notice a pattern? You'll go along with anything they say because you are a 1 issue voter.

Like all trump supporters…they believe what they are told to believe. Having zero self esteem, they can’t risk having their own opinion.

Teachers (and yes even Athletic Coaches) do a great service for the nation and get paid very little relative to the impact they have on the future. I just don’t think that it is fiscally responsible to ship kids on a 300 mile road trip to play a meaningless game when they could burn the same calories, learn the same techniques, and learn the same lessons on campus. If you don’t reach your potential as a wrestler or tennis player, I’m not sure it’s the job of Public Schools to address that.

 

[candycorn]

One can learn disciple and technique , with similar mentors in the arts Candy

Fact is, the field is every bit as competitive

~S~

I fully agree. It’s more important in the arts than athletics. In track for example, running the race as fast as you can is pretty much the goal. Seldom does playing the guitar or painting as fast as you can render favorable results.

I was simply pointing out that sports is important. Shipping kids on a 300 mile road trip to participate in a meaningless game is not fiscally responsible.

 

[Unkotare]

One can learn disciple and technique , with similar mentors in the arts Candy

Fact is, the field is every bit as competitive

~S~

I fully agree. It’s more important in the arts than athletics. In track for example, running the race as fast as you can is pretty much the goal. Seldom does playing the guitar or painting as fast as you can render favorable results.

I was simply pointing out that sports is important. Shipping kids on a 300 mile road trip to participate in a meaningless game is not fiscally responsible.

The United States disagrees with you, and always will.

 

[sealybobo]

Read this. Do you know what this says? This says that union you are in protected you from taking major pay cuts or being fired. You should thank god for the union that you don't pay into but still defends your sorry ass.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, teachers were spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses in the Great Recession. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have. You can't have it both ways. You want a safe government job but you also want to make what we in the private sector make?

Granted, by many measures and in many places, teaching remains a solidly middle-class profession. Government data shows that the average teacher earns about $59,000 a year, with many school districts offering good benefits and generous retirement plans. Andrew Biggs, an economist at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, pushed against the notion that teachers are broadly underpaid. “It’s a good and a very family-friendly job,” citing its reasonable hours and long summer break. “Why should you pay them more?

You have a chip on your shoulder about teachers and also say really, deeply ignorant things about education. Stunningly ignorant things.

I don't belong to the NEA or, of course, my local union and I don't want to speak to you about education.

I don't say the things about teachers I just repeat

Why America's Teachers Haven't Been Getting Raises

The successful two-week-long strike of public-school workers in West Virginia—as well as the imminent strike of teachers in Oklahoma, led by grassroots activists, including Cagle—has thrown into relief the financial difficulties that thousands of education professionals face. Yet those difficulties are not unique to those two states. Despite the perception that educator jobs are unionized, pay decently well, and are guaranteed-tenure, hundreds of thousands of American teachers have seen their wages and benefits erode in recent years, more so than for many other types of workers.

It's true many of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession because you are unionized. But your pay also hasn't gone up because you are a government union employee.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, such employees were largely spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have, either, with public finances still squeezed, public workforces still smaller than their pre-recession peak, and local government officials still hesitant to make critical investments in their workforces and infrastructure.

These teachers should be fired for striking. And striking is the only way you'll ever get a raise lady so I hope they break the unions and cut out the old hags like you who are too old and burned out and ugly.

You're a wonderful liberal. Really, you're perfect.

"Old, burned out and ugly."

Yep, that's perfect. You make a great case for what qualifies a person to be a teacher. You're as ignorant as I suspected--more so, actually.

Do you think the same thing about Don Jr. yes or no?

Donald Trump, Jr. referred to teachers as "losers" at a campaign event.

And yet you voted for Trump after at his rallies his son called you teachers losers?

So lady, spare me your fake outrage. You are a political hack who only cares about banning abortion. You'd even sacrifice your own financial security unknowingly no doubt but still you ignore the obvious that Republicans would lower your pay if they could. And they'd take away all the protections you have. You would shit if you had to work the way we work. You government employees don't even know how good you got it. Lucky half of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession.

Let me guess you also don't believe in global warmring or evolution too right?

Notice a pattern? You'll go along with anything they say because you are a 1 issue voter.

Like all trump supporters…they believe what they are told to believe. Having zero self esteem, they can’t risk having their own opinion.

Teachers (and yes even Athletic Coaches) do a great service for the nation and get paid very little relative to the impact they have on the future. I just don’t think that it is fiscally responsible to ship kids on a 300 mile road trip to play a meaningless game when they could burn the same calories, learn the same techniques, and learn the same lessons on campus. If you don’t reach your potential as a wrestler or tennis player, I’m not sure it’s the job of Public Schools to address that.

Like I said the other day, I'm fine with keeping it local to keep the costs down. We use to drive 62 miles every year to Holt MI for a tournament. I agree there is no reason for the schools to be driving the kids so far away. They could do it smarter and closer.

The only time you should have to travel outside your district is when you make it to regionals and states.

P.S. Without wrestling I would have never got into college. In fact I got in the same way those rich kids got into college on a sports waiver.

 

[sealybobo]

One can learn disciple and technique , with similar mentors in the arts Candy

Fact is, the field is every bit as competitive

~S~

I fully agree. It’s more important in the arts than athletics. In track for example, running the race as fast as you can is pretty much the goal. Seldom does playing the guitar or painting as fast as you can render favorable results.

I was simply pointing out that sports is important. Shipping kids on a 300 mile road trip to participate in a meaningless game is not fiscally responsible.

The United States disagrees with you, and always will.

I bet if gas would have stayed above $4 a gallon you'd be wrong. Schools would suddenly start rethinking their schedules. Instead of driving 60 miles to a tournament, the farthest you will drive is 15 miles to one of the other schools in your district.

 

[sealybobo]

Anyone interested in a serious discussion about education? Any non-educators have any questions about what really goes on in the classroom instead of stereotypes and assumptions? Any educators want to share stories from the front lines? Anything?

Yes. Why not start teaching a foreign language in pre-k? Why not start teaching Excel in 9th grade? Why don’t you teach skills like networking, public speaking, and negotiation?

Thank you

Schools are doing it the same way they did it 200 years ago. Do you think their methods are outdated? Of course they are. But good luck telling a teacher who's stuck in their ways that they aren't doing it right or could do it better. We need to train the new teachers to do better. They should get better results than unkotare and sweetsue92 are getting.

Hillary was wrong they aren't deplorable. They're losers

Before Trump Jr. Calls Me a 'Loser Teacher,' How About He Steps Inside My Classroom?

 

[sealybobo]

One can learn disciple and technique , with similar mentors in the arts Candy

Fact is, the field is every bit as competitive

~S~

I fully agree. It’s more important in the arts than athletics. In track for example, running the race as fast as you can is pretty much the goal. Seldom does playing the guitar or painting as fast as you can render favorable results.

I was simply pointing out that sports is important. Shipping kids on a 300 mile road trip to participate in a meaningless game is not fiscally responsible.

The United States disagrees with you, and always will.

What a dumb comeback. That's like if I said the government spends too much money and you came back and said, "the United States disagrees with you, and always will"

So just because schools waste a lot of money that does not mean the USA agrees with you nor does it mean this will always be the way we do things unkotare.

In fact if Republicans had their way you wouldn't have a wrestling program at all.

Personal attack edited out.

 

[Unkotare]

Athletics and education are inextricably connected and always - ALWAYS will be.

As they should be.

 

[sealybobo]

Athletics and education are inextricably connected and always - ALWAYS will be.

As they should be.

Are you sure or are you just talking out of your ass?

Then the question becomes, which sports are important. My nephews go to the best private school in the state. That school doesn't have a wrestling program.

My buddy went to a big college in Colorado that didn't have a wrestling program. Either Colorado U or Univerity of Colorado Bolder?

Some sports that are money makers will stay but some sports like wrestling they will do away with.

I almost went to Northern Michigan University. The year I graduated high school they dropped their wrestling program.

Have you heard that for the big schools like University of Michigan sports are a money maker but for smaller schools like Eastern Michigan University they actually cost the students more to have those programs? Schools like Eastern might one day drop their athletics.

So UofM and MSU might always have mens football and basketball because they make money but all the other sports may one day be taken out.

Athletics cost colleges, students millions

College Student Fees: Unnecessary or Essential?

The cost of college has reached shockingly, appallingly, disturbingly high levels, and there are no new adverbs left to describe the staggering amount of money needed to pursue a four-year degree. A recent report by Robert Kelchen, an assistant professor at Seton Hall University, reveals that student fees are 20% of the total cost of tuition at the average four-year public college or university.

Many schools charge student fees to cover the costs associated with having an athletic program.

I never once watched an Eastern Michigan University basketball game and only went to one football game. It was horrible.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Anyone interested in a serious discussion about education? Any non-educators have any questions about what really goes on in the classroom instead of stereotypes and assumptions? Any educators want to share stories from the front lines? Anything?

Yes. Why not start teaching a foreign language in pre-k? Why not start teaching Excel in 9th grade? Why don’t you teach skills like networking, public speaking, and negotiation?

Thank you

Schools are doing it the same way they did it 200 years ago. Do you think their methods are outdated? Of course they are. But good luck telling a teacher who's stuck in their ways that they aren't doing it right or could do it better. We need to train the new teachers to do better. They should get better results than unkotare and sweetsue92 are getting.

Hillary was wrong they aren't deplorable. They're losers

Before Trump Jr. Calls Me a 'Loser Teacher,' How About He Steps Inside My Classroom?

I teach Part Time but in college and my methodology is different than most but the feedback has been positive.

 

[SweetSue92]

You're missing the point on purpose because you can't debate the larger point. Because you've already lost.

Read this. Do you know what this says? This says that union you are in protected you from taking major pay cuts or being fired. You should thank god for the union that you don't pay into but still defends your sorry ass.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, teachers were spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses in the Great Recession. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have. You can't have it both ways. You want a safe government job but you also want to make what we in the private sector make?

Granted, by many measures and in many places, teaching remains a solidly middle-class profession. Government data shows that the average teacher earns about $59,000 a year, with many school districts offering good benefits and generous retirement plans. Andrew Biggs, an economist at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, pushed against the notion that teachers are broadly underpaid. “It’s a good and a very family-friendly job,” citing its reasonable hours and long summer break. “Why should you pay them more?

You have a chip on your shoulder about teachers and also say really, deeply ignorant things about education. Stunningly ignorant things.

I don't belong to the NEA or, of course, my local union and I don't want to speak to you about education.

I don't say the things about teachers I just repeat

Why America's Teachers Haven't Been Getting Raises

The successful two-week-long strike of public-school workers in West Virginia—as well as the imminent strike of teachers in Oklahoma, led by grassroots activists, including Cagle—has thrown into relief the financial difficulties that thousands of education professionals face. Yet those difficulties are not unique to those two states. Despite the perception that educator jobs are unionized, pay decently well, and are guaranteed-tenure, hundreds of thousands of American teachers have seen their wages and benefits erode in recent years, more so than for many other types of workers.

It's true many of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession because you are unionized. But your pay also hasn't gone up because you are a government union employee.

Because of the stable nature of government employment, such employees were largely spared the worst of the layoffs and wage cuts that afflicted private businesses. That said, these jobs have not rebounded in the same way that many private-sector ones have, either, with public finances still squeezed, public workforces still smaller than their pre-recession peak, and local government officials still hesitant to make critical investments in their workforces and infrastructure.

These teachers should be fired for striking. And striking is the only way you'll ever get a raise lady so I hope they break the unions and cut out the old hags like you who are too old and burned out and ugly.

You're a wonderful liberal. Really, you're perfect.

"Old, burned out and ugly."

Yep, that's perfect. You make a great case for what qualifies a person to be a teacher. You're as ignorant as I suspected--more so, actually.

Do you think the same thing about Don Jr. yes or no?

Donald Trump, Jr. referred to teachers as "losers" at a campaign event.

And yet you voted for Trump after at his rallies his son called you teachers losers?

So lady, spare me your fake outrage. You are a political hack who only cares about banning abortion. You'd even sacrifice your own financial security unknowingly no doubt but still you ignore the obvious that Republicans would lower your pay if they could. And they'd take away all the protections you have. You would shit if you had to work the way we work. You government employees don't even know how good you got it. Lucky half of you didn't lose your jobs during the recession.

Let me guess you also don't believe in global warmring or evolution too right?

Notice a pattern? You'll go along with anything they say because you are a 1 issue voter.

Wait. Are you trying to get me MORE pay or are we paid too much for too little work?

You're really not too bright, are you?

 

[SweetSue92]

Anyone interested in a serious discussion about education? Any non-educators have any questions about what really goes on in the classroom instead of stereotypes and assumptions? Any educators want to share stories from the front lines? Anything?

Yes. Why not start teaching a foreign language in pre-k? Why not start teaching Excel in 9th grade? Why don’t you teach skills like networking, public speaking, and negotiation?

Thank you

Schools are doing it the same way they did it 200 years ago. Do you think their methods are outdated? Of course they are. But good luck telling a teacher who's stuck in their ways that they aren't doing it right or could do it better. We need to train the new teachers to do better. They should get better results than unkotare and sweetsue92 are getting.

Hillary was wrong they aren't deplorable. They're losers

Before Trump Jr. Calls Me a 'Loser Teacher,' How About He Steps Inside My Classroom?

The chip on your shoulder is REALLY REALLY big, and it's sad. It makes you mean and ignorant

 

[sparky]

Athletics and education are inextricably connected and always - ALWAYS will be.

As they should be.

That's not the point Unkotare, the inclusion of one doctrine does not exclude or devalue or take precedence another

IE~ Chess club is on par with Football

A well rounded education is appropos

~S~

 

[Unkotare]

Athletics and education are inextricably connected and always - ALWAYS will be.

As they should be.

That's not the point Unkotare, the inclusion of one doctrine does not exclude or devalue or take precedence another

IE~ Chess club is on par with Football



~S~

Tell that to what’s her face.

 

[sparky]

methinks she has me on ignore , or should have.....~S~

 

[sealybobo]

Anyone interested in a serious discussion about education? Any non-educators have any questions about what really goes on in the classroom instead of stereotypes and assumptions? Any educators want to share stories from the front lines? Anything?

Yes. Why not start teaching a foreign language in pre-k? Why not start teaching Excel in 9th grade? Why don’t you teach skills like networking, public speaking, and negotiation?

Thank you

Schools are doing it the same way they did it 200 years ago. Do you think their methods are outdated? Of course they are. But good luck telling a teacher who's stuck in their ways that they aren't doing it right or could do it better. We need to train the new teachers to do better. They should get better results than unkotare and sweetsue92 are getting.

Hillary was wrong they aren't deplorable. They're losers

Before Trump Jr. Calls Me a 'Loser Teacher,' How About He Steps Inside My Classroom?

I teach Part Time but in college and my methodology is different than most but the feedback has been positive.

I’m not dogging teachers so much as the entire process. When we graduate high school or even college are we ready to interview? Do we know what we want to do? What exactly did we learn in those electives, social sciences, even math and English. Was it geared towards modern day life? Work? I remember pottery class. What was that all about? Or I remember a class on the Greek gods. An entire class on that. It’s crazy.

Anyways, I don’t feel like the 120 credits I got were very meaningful. A big waste of time if you ask me. Now sure you can make the argument each of those classes taught me something but let’s be honest, what a scam.

The business school was no joke but I was a horrible student yet a brilliant salesperson. You’d never know it in college.

I remember psychology of sex. That was a 3 credit hour course. What a joke.

 

[sparky]

So.....wuts wrong with keeping it all to the 3 R's Sealy?

~S~

 

[Weatherman2020]

Anyone interested in a serious discussion about education? Any non-educators have any questions about what really goes on in the classroom instead of stereotypes and assumptions? Any educators want to share stories from the front lines? Anything?

Hayti HS in Hayti Missouri had a great season last season; 15-0. Being the district powerhouse, they played mainly home games (6 road games out of 15). Still, they racked up about 1,500 miles of travel on district school buses.

08/24/18 260 miles.
09/07/18 151 miles.
10/05/18 141 miles.
10/19/18 34 miles.
11/17/18 260 miles.
12/01/18 605 miles.

This doesn't count the travel of the band, the housing (if any), meals, etc...

All for nothing.

And keep in mind that this is just one team out of literally dozens playing one sport (11 man football).
That 1,500 miles traveled could be easily duplicated for teams playing:

Sports

• Baseball
• Basketball
• Cross Country
• Field Hockey
• Football
• Golf
• Lacrosse
• Soccer
• Softball
• Swimming and Diving
• Tennis
• Track and Field
• Volleyball
• Water Polo
• Wrestling

Factor in a few dozen teams for every sport, give them 1,000 miles of traveling and you can see the incredible expense at stake.

This doesn't count the utilities to run the stadiums, paying the coaches, officials, groundskeepers, etc...
This doesn't count the time taken away from what school is supposed to be about (education exploits), etc...
This doesn't count the costs of purchasing equipment, uniforms, insurance, etc....

Somehow the word "waste" doesn't begin to address the wrongheaded expenditures that are being made in high school athletics.

You asked for a question...mine would be this: How can this remotely be justified?

What exactly is it you feel needs to be justified? Education?

The justification of spending money to transport about 200-300 teams (the number of high schools) 1,000 miles (about the amount of travel each team makes in a season--the example above showed the travel to be substantially more but not every team makes the playoffs I guess) each in between 5-15 different sports (15 sports are listed in the MSHSAA website Missouri State High School Activities Association but I'm assuming not every school has a lacrosse team for example so I gave it a range of 5-15 sports) . for absolutely no good reason other than to have them play a meaningless game against someone from a different school. This is exclusive of the costs of coaches, trainers, facilities, equipment, insurance, housing, etc... It also doesn't count the other pointless activities that are done in the name of education from the MSHSAA website:

Activities

• Bass Fishing
• Bowling
• Chess
• Music Activities
• Scholar Bowl
• Speech, Debate and Theatre
• Spirit Activities
• Target Shooting

Money is never the issue with education. California spends more each year than other nations total GDP and those nations have better educated kids coming out.

 

[sparky]

ah!...brains for the buck


well one could see THAT commin'....

~S~

 

[sealybobo]

So.....wuts wrong with keeping it all to the 3 R's Sealy?

~S~

I think we should end public schools and anyone who has a kid can either send them to private school or have them sign up for online classes and kill the brick and mortar schools.

We can pay one unkotare to teach hundreds of kids around the state online for much cheaper than outdated teachers cost. Kids do everything online so go to school online.

Rich kids can go to private schools. Free school will be online in th3 future