Should The Rich Be Required To Pay Higher Taxes In the US?

[Dad2three]

The Myths of Reaganomics

Tax Cuts. One of the few areas where Reaganomists claim success without embarrassment is taxation. Didn't the Reagan administration, after all, slash income taxes in 1981, and provide both tax cuts and "fairness" in its highly touted tax reform law of 1986? Hasn't Ronald Reagan, in the teeth of opposition, heroically held the line against all tax increases?

The answer, unfortunately, is no. In the first place, the famous "tax cut" of 1981 did not cut taxes at all. It's true that tax rates for higher-income brackets were cut; but for the average person, taxes rose, rather than declined. The reason is that, on the whole, the cut in income tax rates was more than offset by two forms of tax increase.

The Myths of Reaganomics

The answer, unfortunately, is no. In the first place, the famous "tax cut" of 1981 did not cut taxes at all. It's true that tax rates for higher-income brackets were cut; but for the average person, taxes rose, rather than declined. The reason is that, on the whole, the cut in income tax rates was more than offset by two forms of tax increase. One was "bracket creep," a term for inflation quietly but effectively raising one into higher tax brackets, so that you pay more and proportionately higher taxes even though the tax rate schedule has officially remained the same.

And then Reagan indexed taxes for inflation.

The second source of higher taxes was Social Security taxation, which kept increasing, and which helped taxes go up overall.

OMG! That's awful! So the Social Security tax rate went from what level to what higher level?

Yep, YET taxes increased under Reagan for the middle 40% WHILE he gutted it for the "job creators". Go figure

WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%! You know what revenues are right Bubs

YET taxes increased under Reagan for the middle 40%

You just can't prove it.
How did their income tax rates change?
How did their payroll tax rates change?

Show me some actual numbers, not just your fact free whining.

The Myths of Reaganomics

Tax Cuts. One of the few areas where Reaganomists claim success without embarrassment is taxation. Didn't the Reagan administration, after all, slash income taxes in 1981, and provide both tax cuts and "fairness" in its highly touted tax reform law of 1986? Hasn't Ronald Reagan, in the teeth of opposition, heroically held the line against all tax increases?

The answer, unfortunately, is no. In the first place, the famous "tax cut" of 1981 did not cut taxes at all. It's true that tax rates for higher-income brackets were cut; but for the average person, taxes rose, rather than declined.

....But a National Bureau study by Hausman and Poterba on the Tax Reform Act shows that over 40% of the nation's taxpayers suffered a marginal tax increase (or at best, the same rate as before) and, of the majority that did enjoy marginal tax cuts, only 11% got reductions of 10% or more. In short, most of the tax reductions were negligible.



LIBERTARIAN MISES

The Myths of Reaganomics

How did their income tax rates change?
How did their payroll tax rates change?

Show me some actual numbers, not just your fact free whining.

Fact free whining? Yes Bubba, that's about ALL you have. Thanks for playing

The man and his cronies (most of whom we saw in Dubya’s admin) should have been impeached for real crimes of high treason.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Thanks for the link.
What was the rate in 1980 and what was the rate when he left office?

Once more:



" WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%"

You know since I never mentioned RATES? But he doubled the self employment tax!

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

That's awful! Personally, I'd like SS to be privatized.
I'm not sure why a big gov lib like you is whining about higher taxes.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Thanks for the link.
What was the rate in 1980 and what was the rate when he left office?

Once more:



" WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%"

You know since I never mentioned RATES? But he doubled the self employment tax!

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%

Well, if 100 workers paid in 1981 and 160 workers paid in 1989, that would increase revenues by 60%.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The answer, unfortunately, is no. In the first place, the famous "tax cut" of 1981 did not cut taxes at all. It's true that tax rates for higher-income brackets were cut; but for the average person, taxes rose, rather than declined. The reason is that, on the whole, the cut in income tax rates was more than offset by two forms of tax increase. One was "bracket creep," a term for inflation quietly but effectively raising one into higher tax brackets, so that you pay more and proportionately higher taxes even though the tax rate schedule has officially remained the same.

And then Reagan indexed taxes for inflation.

The second source of higher taxes was Social Security taxation, which kept increasing, and which helped taxes go up overall.

OMG! That's awful! So the Social Security tax rate went from what level to what higher level?

Yep, YET taxes increased under Reagan for the middle 40% WHILE he gutted it for the "job creators". Go figure

WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%! You know what revenues are right Bubs

YET taxes increased under Reagan for the middle 40%

You just can't prove it.
How did their income tax rates change?
How did their payroll tax rates change?

Show me some actual numbers, not just your fact free whining.

The Myths of Reaganomics

Tax Cuts. One of the few areas where Reaganomists claim success without embarrassment is taxation. Didn't the Reagan administration, after all, slash income taxes in 1981, and provide both tax cuts and "fairness" in its highly touted tax reform law of 1986? Hasn't Ronald Reagan, in the teeth of opposition, heroically held the line against all tax increases?

The answer, unfortunately, is no. In the first place, the famous "tax cut" of 1981 did not cut taxes at all. It's true that tax rates for higher-income brackets were cut; but for the average person, taxes rose, rather than declined.

....But a National Bureau study by Hausman and Poterba on the Tax Reform Act shows that over 40% of the nation's taxpayers suffered a marginal tax increase (or at best, the same rate as before) and, of the majority that did enjoy marginal tax cuts, only 11% got reductions of 10% or more. In short, most of the tax reductions were negligible.



LIBERTARIAN MISES

The Myths of Reaganomics

How did their income tax rates change?
How did their payroll tax rates change?

Show me some actual numbers, not just your fact free whining.

Fact free whining? Yes Bubba, that's about ALL you have. Thanks for playing

The man and his cronies (most of whom we saw in Dubya’s admin) should have been impeached for real crimes of high treason.

Fact free whining?

Until you post the SS tax rate before he entered office and the SS rate when he left, your whining will continue to be fact free.

 

[danielpalos]

which administration holds the record for lowest unemployment in relatively modern times?

 

[bripat9643]

Yea right, having your money taken by force to be given away to welfare queens should make anybody beam with pride.

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

The force of law is quite different than violence. So, if you are not an anarchists, you understand that the force of law is legitimate, and violence is generally not.

By inference I have taken the Libertarian meme of force to mean violent force, if I'm mistaken let me know.

What makes our law "legitimate?" Nothing that I can discern.

There's no distinction between force and violence.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[Dad2three]

Once more:



" WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%"

You know since I never mentioned RATES? But he doubled the self employment tax!

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

That's awful! Personally, I'd like SS to be privatized.
I'm not sure why a big gov lib like you is whining about higher taxes.

You mean higher taxes on the working guys AS you gut the tax burden to the top job off shorrers? Nah, what's bad about that? lol

 

[Dad2three]

Once more:



" WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%"

You know since I never mentioned RATES? But he doubled the self employment tax!

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%

Well, if 100 workers paid in 1981 and 160 workers paid in 1989, that would increase revenues by 60%.

Wishful thinking. Or as I call it, the current state of right wing "reality"

 

[Dad2three]

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

The force of law is quite different than violence. So, if you are not an anarchists, you understand that the force of law is legitimate, and violence is generally not.

By inference I have taken the Libertarian meme of force to mean violent force, if I'm mistaken let me know.

What makes our law "legitimate?" Nothing that I can discern.

There's no distinction between force and violence.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

YOU IGNORING THE FACT I BACKED UP MY POSIT, THE BOTTOM 50% OF US WENT FROM NEARLY 18% OF GDP IN INCOME IN 1980 TO 11% BY 2012, IS NOTED BUBBA!


LOL

 

[Wry Catcher]

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

The force of law is quite different than violence. So, if you are not an anarchists, you understand that the force of law is legitimate, and violence is generally not.

By inference I have taken the Libertarian meme of force to mean violent force, if I'm mistaken let me know.

What makes our law "legitimate?" Nothing that I can discern.

There's no distinction between force and violence.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

The more you post, the more I roll my eyes. What decided you to become an anarchist?

 

[Flash]

[

What are the federal government's sources of revenue?

The thing that is hidden in that chart is the reality of the payroll tax, the income tax, and the corporate tax.

The payroll tax is really not a tax at all in the strictest sense of the word because the money theoretically goes into a retirement fund that an individual can recoup.

The income tax, on the other hand, is a trillion dollars honest to goodness tax that is paid out mostly by the top wage earners. 50% of the revenue comes from the top 1% of income earners. 80% of the revenue comes from the top 20%. About half the people in the country don't pay anything into the fund at all but yet they are the ones that gets the welfare payments, which makes that tax legalized stealing.

The corporate tax is actually a very cruel tax on all Americans. Corporations really don't pay the tax. They collect the revenue from the American people for the tax with their sale of goods and services and then pass it to the government as an expense of doing business. Those taxes are hidden in the cost of food, fuel, goods, services and most of the things that we buy. When you buy a box of cereal made by General Mills you are providing the revenue to pay General Mill's income tax. The money comes out of your pocket.

 

[Flash]

[


Yep, YET taxes increased under Reagan for the middle 40% WHILE he gutted it for the "job creators". Go figure

WHILE increasing SS taxes 60%! You know what revenues are right Bubs

That is a good reason not to vote for any big government Progressive, whether they be Democrat or Republican.

The Democrats promises to raise your taxes and they usually do it.

Republicans promises not to raise your taxes but they usually do it some way or another. Reagan is a great example.

Good reason not to vote for anybody in either one of those big government parties,

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

That's awful! Personally, I'd like SS to be privatized.
I'm not sure why a big gov lib like you is whining about higher taxes.

You mean higher taxes on the working guys AS you gut the tax burden to the top job off shorrers? Nah, what's bad about that? lol

You mean higher taxes on the working guys AS you gut the tax burden to the top job off shorrers?

Taxes were cut for everybody.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Increasing the number of employed workers is a good thing, you fucking moron.

Yet THAT wasn't what happened Bubba, what he did was, to hide the costs of tax cuts for the rich ("supply side") he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

he had ALL self employed pay both sides of the SS tax

Rich self-employed people had to pay more SS?
That's awful!
What about the rest of us? How much did the rate increase?

Nope, the self employed stop paying taxes at the cap, currently about $115,000. Back then it was MUCH less. The rich didn't pay more SS, But the avg working guy did as well as small Biz owners!

RATE? No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%. You know ON SS TAX INCREASES that hit the middle class/poor? AS he gutted tax rates for the rich and did away with things like credit card interest rate deductions that ALSO hurt the middle class (as he upped the deducibility of home interest rate deductions, that benefited the rich more!)

No Bubs, Ronnie increased REVENUES 60%

Well, if 100 workers paid in 1981 and 160 workers paid in 1989, that would increase revenues by 60%.

Wishful thinking. Or as I call it, the current state of right wing "reality"

Wishful thinking is your claim that Reagan screwed workers with a huge hike in the payroll tax rate.
I've noticed you still haven't posted the numbers.
Why is that?

 

[SAYIT]

Paying for the finest tax rates in the world should be a source of capital pride (of ownership) for Persons of wealth.

Yea right, having your money taken by force to be given away to welfare queens should make anybody beam with pride.

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

It astounding just how weak the leftist mind can be. The fact that you disagree with one means you don't want the gov't to provide necessary services and tax us to fund them. Pathetic.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Yea right, having your money taken by force to be given away to welfare queens should make anybody beam with pride.

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

It astounding just how weak the leftist mind can be. The fact that you disagree with one means you don't want the gov't to provide necessary services and tax us to fund them. Pathetic.

You needed too many words to simply post an ad hominem, please try to be concise if not substantive.

Keep in mind taxes pay for more than sending our troops all over the world to protect the oil cartel, and other sources of material (an now labor) for corporate America.

Tax cuts need to targeted, and benefit those who need tax relief; the very wealthy have lawyers and lobbyists looking out for them, they don't need hoi polloi conservatives in their corner.

 

[bripat9643]

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

The force of law is quite different than violence. So, if you are not an anarchists, you understand that the force of law is legitimate, and violence is generally not.

By inference I have taken the Libertarian meme of force to mean violent force, if I'm mistaken let me know.

What makes our law "legitimate?" Nothing that I can discern.

There's no distinction between force and violence.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

YOU IGNORING THE FACT I BACKED UP MY POSIT, THE BOTTOM 50% OF US WENT FROM NEARLY 18% OF GDP IN INCOME IN 1980 TO 11% BY 2012, IS NOTED BUBBA!


LOL

What does that have to do with whether our laws are "legitimate?"

 

[SAYIT]

There is no force, people pay taxes and people die - two basic truths.

Welfare Queens is a term from the past, when AFDC was replaced by TANF the rules changed. Try to keep up, and if you have, stop lying.

Tell you what stop paying all your taxes and tell us what happens.

Why would I do that? I want the government to provide provide services consistent with the vision statement, aka, the Preamble to the COTUS.

I want local police and fire, special districts to make sure water and air are clean, vector control and sewage removal, flood controls and the dozens of other things done by local and state workers.

You don't and I find that insane.

Who said I didn't? You said that taxes aren't force, and nothing you said makes it otherwise. If you don't pay taxes you will find out that they are forced.

It astounding just how weak the leftist mind can be. The fact that you disagree with one means you don't want the gov't to provide necessary services and tax us to fund them. Pathetic.

You needed too many words to simply post an ad hominem, please try to be concise if not substantive.

Keep in mind taxes pay for more than sending our troops all over the world to protect the oil cartel, and other sources of material (an now labor) for corporate America.

Tax cuts need to targeted, and benefit those who need tax relief; the very wealthy have lawyers and lobbyists looking out for them, they don't need hoi polloi conservatives in their corner.

It's all good, Comrade W, and we do tax the big earners enough that the top 25% carry 86% of the total federal personal income tax load while the bottom 49% of American earners contribute NOTHING to help pay for our interstate highways, our federal courts, our federal gov't and yes, our military which protects America, Americans and our interests (evidently much to your chagrin).

 

[dcraelin]

It depends on how it is structured. Now the wealthy get their tax breaks with the 70k page tax code set up purposely to enrich them and the pols.

The typical federal flat tax planned is 10%. The vast majority of the middle class and poor PAY less than 10% in federal taxes.

If you like Trumps tax plan, you need to keep in mind it doesn't effect/affect 'The Donald.' or me, or Bill Gates, because were all corporations.

just saw that Greece now has something like a 23% sales tax....... That is a realistic type rate for flat taxes, or national sales taxes.

Trump has actually said the rich can pay a little more, percentage wise.

 

[eagle1462010]

IRAQ WAR

hundreds of dems cast literally thousands of votes to continue funding it for a decade

Once you have boots on the ground it is hard to pull their funding. Republicans thrive on that

it's especially hard for you to end when you're voting FOR something idiot

I know

Especially with republicans playing the you don't support our troops card

CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN.........

Army lays out plan to cut 40,000 soldiers

Liberals love to cut the military and nothing else.........now break out your pom poms and say TAX THE SHIT OUT OF THE RICH RAH.

They need a new line...............sniff sniff..............perhaps rehab.