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Should we NO longer trust our intelligence-gathering systems?

I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?
There is no way to "prove" that Russia's Wikileaks shenanigans got Trump elected. We can be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs without jumping to the conclusion that it actually altered the election.
This isn't about "letting bygones be bygones." But imo, it is going too far to bring the outcome of the election into it.
 
If you notice, there is no evidence Russia was involved at all.

There may NEVER be any hard evidence that Russia was involved in sabotaging the DNC....good hackers with lots of money can hide their deeds rather well......What there may be is spies, turncoats and informants that make allegations....that is the world of espionage....HOWEVER, according to right wingers (like you) when outfits such as the CIA or FBI or DEA, et al state something that does NOT fit your right wing agenda, then you want the intelligence to be written on tablets like the 10 commandments.

Live with your hypocrisy.....

Grow up, Fraud. You are about as right wing as they come. You peddle conspiracy theory bullshit in a blatant attempt to hide the filth you are.

You aren't liberal. You're a paid to post troll.

You have no evidence.
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.
 
How can 'intelligence sources' be 'trusted'? What does trusting an organization based upon achieving a goal no matter what the cost really mean? It is an oxymoron.
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

We can trust our intelligence...just so long as it doesn't contradict Trump, if it does, we need to trust Trump's word instead.
 
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I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?
There is no way to "prove" that Russia's Wikileaks shenanigans got Trump elected. We can be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs without jumping to the conclusion that it actually altered the election.
This isn't about "letting bygones be bygones." But imo, it is going too far to bring the outcome of the election into it.


There is no way to prove it was Russia hackers.
Hackers are hard to track down from it's location.

This is about the FBI, Military and IRS agencies being politicalized under this adminatration.
It also has happened under other adminstrations and usually gets corrected by the peoples votes.
 
I know that there are other threads tangential on this topic and that many of us on the left have also criticized the CIA and FBI (especially) for their political subjectivity.

Nonetheless, how should we feel if indeed it is strongly proven that Russia helped Trump win the election by sabotaging the DNC???

Should we let bygones be bygones? Or should we be outraged that a foreign government interfered in our domestic affairs?

Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.
 
Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.

No not really, many voted for Hilary because they did not want to vote for Trump!

Hilary moved far left in order to compete with Sanders..

Remember now the far left pushed Hilary aside in 2008 to push a half white man for president!

The far left rules the party, no matter how anyone wants to spin it!
 
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.

No not really, many voted for Hilary because they did not want to vote for Trump!

Hilary moved far left in order to compete with Sanders..

Remember now the far left pushed Hilary aside in 2008 to push a half white man for president!

The far left rules the party, no matter how anyone wants to spin it!

She didn't move that far to the left. She is right wing.
 
The OP seems very naive. Why on earth would you ever trust the C.I.A. and NSA? They've declared war on you the American Citizen. They fear & hate you far more than they do foreign terrorists.
 
No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.

No not really, many voted for Hilary because they did not want to vote for Trump!

Hilary moved far left in order to compete with Sanders..

Remember now the far left pushed Hilary aside in 2008 to push a half white man for president!

The far left rules the party, no matter how anyone wants to spin it!

She didn't move that far to the left. She is right wing.

Maybe she is right wing to a far left drone!

And she did move very far to the left!

She supported Obama policies and Obama's fascism..

She would have been more fascist than Obama and Trump combined, yet still being far left!

However if she did get elected she would be first woman president impeached..
 
Yes you far left drones were defeated big time, now it is time for you to grow and admit your own religious beliefs have been false and you followed your false prophets into the destruction of your party!
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.
Except foreign policy and economics...
 
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.
Except foreign policy and economics...

Oh look a dupe hater far left drone thinks it is a moderate..
 
I think you are confused. Those on the far left absolutely hate Hillary Clinton. Probably even more than you do.

No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.

No not really, many voted for Hilary because they did not want to vote for Trump!

Hilary moved far left in order to compete with Sanders..

Remember now the far left pushed Hilary aside in 2008 to push a half white man for president!

The far left rules the party, no matter how anyone wants to spin it!
It is a false narrative that the far left rules the Democratic Party. It is establishment Democrats that rule the Democratic Party, and the large majority of them are neoliberals and neoliberals (Both Republican neoliberals and Democratic neoliberals) are despised by the far left.

CorpWatch : What is Neoliberalism?
 
No they still voted for her and they do not hate her as much as you would think!

If they truly hated her she would have only got 35% of the votes!
I disagree but it depends on what your definition of far left is. I consider Clinton to be slightly right of center. I really see no difference between her and say, Jeb Bush, aside from a few social issues. And if you look at Clinton's record, she is pro big-business, anti-union and quite the war hawk. Those traits, of which I abhor, are traditionally Republican.

Yes tell that to FDR and all those FDR Democrats!

The far left voted mostly for Hilary! As the far left only sees two choices vote for their nominee or not at all!
Sure, some of the far left voted for Hillary, but the numbers are small. Hillary supporters, from what I can tell, are extremely moderate and tend to focus mainly on social issues and identity politics while ignoring foreign policy and economics.

No not really, many voted for Hilary because they did not want to vote for Trump!

Hilary moved far left in order to compete with Sanders..

Remember now the far left pushed Hilary aside in 2008 to push a half white man for president!

The far left rules the party, no matter how anyone wants to spin it!
It is a false narrative that the far left rules the Democratic Party. It is establishment Democrats that rule the Democratic Party, and the large majority of them are neoliberals and neoliberals (Both Republican neoliberals and Democratic neoliberals) are despised by the far left.

CorpWatch : What is Neoliberalism?

Wrong!

The far left does rule the Democratic party as they openly hijacked in the late seventies, only a far left drone would not see that!

If there was any moderates left in the Democratic party then Clinton would have been the nominee in 2008..

If Clinton were a true moderate she would have separated herself from Obama and his policies which were far left policies and even further left policies of Sanders!

Far left drones often see themselves as moderates, but they are not!

And Obama was a war monger and started illegal wars!
 

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