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The polls have been showing for decades that most Catholic women use birth control.
Whether individual Catholics use it or not is not the issue. They will not see the issue as that. The issue is that the Church does not. Catholics can and do differentiate between the individual and the official policy of the Church. They will - if pushed (like they are being with Obama) - support the Church's official policy, regardless of their individual choices. They will see it for what it is... an attack on our faith. And so will other faiths... because they already are seeing it that way.
You are looking at it from a very simplistic attitude. It is not a simple issue. It is not about the individuals - it is about the Church.
You never answered my question as to whether or not you use birth control. Was that too personal?
The issue is business regulation, not religious freedom. A Catholic university is not a house of worship, it is a business enterprise. It hires non-Catholics and Catholics alike under the business and labor laws of the United States, which has the right to regulate business.
It is discrimination against the employees to exempt a Church business from an otherwise applicable law.
If the principle you want applied were legitimate, then it would entitle the Church's businesses to hire ONLY Catholics, or, even, only women who swore to never use birth control.
The government needs to get out of the business of supporting faith based charities..post haste.
Can't stand the competition huh? Charities make it tougher on entitlements I guess.
Religion and Government don't mix.
Never have..never will.
The government needs to get out of the business of supporting faith based charities..post haste.
those faith based charities do for the people with no strings attached.
Government does for the people with strings attached.
Given a choice, I want my tax money going to faith based charities.
No they don't. Hence this situation.
They're are plenty of strings that come along with faith based help.
And there is the constitionality of it.
Can't stand the competition huh? Charities make it tougher on entitlements I guess.
It always makes me laugh when idiots pronounce that the government should 'get out' of supporting faith based charities or that faith based charities should not receive government funding. They clearly have no concept of the 'law of unintended consequences'. Much like their bullshit about 'tax the churches'.... never actually research that before they form their halfwitted opinions. They just regurgitate crap.
When the charity gets my tax money, it becomes a dispenser of government 'entitlements'.
those faith based charities do for the people with no strings attached.
Government does for the people with strings attached.
Given a choice, I want my tax money going to faith based charities.
No they don't. Hence this situation.
They're are plenty of strings that come along with faith based help.
And there is the constitionality of it.
when the church opens its doors to the hungry of ANY faith, what strings are attached?
The government doesn't give you a choice. They want Catholics forced to pay for the abortions and birth control of all.
those faith based charities do for the people with no strings attached.
Government does for the people with strings attached.
Given a choice, I want my tax money going to faith based charities.
No they don't. Hence this situation.
They're are plenty of strings that come along with faith based help.
And there is the constitionality of it.
when the church opens its doors to the hungry of ANY faith, what strings are attached?
The issue is business regulation, not religious freedom. A Catholic university is not a house of worship, it is a business enterprise. It hires non-Catholics and Catholics alike under the business and labor laws of the United States, which has the right to regulate business.
Can't stand the competition huh? Charities make it tougher on entitlements I guess.
Religion and Government don't mix.
Never have..never will.
The government sure looks to be trying hard though....
It always makes me laugh when idiots pronounce that the government should 'get out' of supporting faith based charities or that faith based charities should not receive government funding. They clearly have no concept of the 'law of unintended consequences'. Much like their bullshit about 'tax the churches'.... never actually research that before they form their halfwitted opinions. They just regurgitate crap.
When the charity gets my tax money, it becomes a dispenser of government 'entitlements'.
Without that 'dispenser', you'd be paying a lot more.
When the charity gets my tax money, it becomes a dispenser of government 'entitlements'.
Without that 'dispenser', you'd be paying a lot more.
That's just made-up nonsense.
If churches want to become arms of the government then they can check their churchie beliefs at the door and comply with the secular laws.
Whether individual Catholics use it or not is not the issue. They will not see the issue as that. The issue is that the Church does not. Catholics can and do differentiate between the individual and the official policy of the Church. They will - if pushed (like they are being with Obama) - support the Church's official policy, regardless of their individual choices. They will see it for what it is... an attack on our faith. And so will other faiths... because they already are seeing it that way.
You are looking at it from a very simplistic attitude. It is not a simple issue. It is not about the individuals - it is about the Church.
You never answered my question as to whether or not you use birth control. Was that too personal?
The issue is business regulation, not religious freedom. A Catholic university is not a house of worship, it is a business enterprise. It hires non-Catholics and Catholics alike under the business and labor laws of the United States, which has the right to regulate business.
It is discrimination against the employees to exempt a Church business from an otherwise applicable law.
If the principle you want applied were legitimate, then it would entitle the Church's businesses to hire ONLY Catholics, or, even, only women who swore to never use birth control.
Curious...
I assume you supported the bailouts of Chrysler and GM.....and I assume you supported the stiumulus plan..
Now....using those assumptions...
What right does the government have to pick and choose what companies should get stimulus money or bailout money....
and if they have the right to pick and choose...
Why cant they pick and choose who should be exempt from a law that would infringe on the religious convictions of an employer?
You never answered my question as to whether or not you use birth control. Was that too personal?
The issue is business regulation, not religious freedom. A Catholic university is not a house of worship, it is a business enterprise. It hires non-Catholics and Catholics alike under the business and labor laws of the United States, which has the right to regulate business.
It is discrimination against the employees to exempt a Church business from an otherwise applicable law.
If the principle you want applied were legitimate, then it would entitle the Church's businesses to hire ONLY Catholics, or, even, only women who swore to never use birth control.
Curious...
I assume you supported the bailouts of Chrysler and GM.....and I assume you supported the stiumulus plan..
Now....using those assumptions...
What right does the government have to pick and choose what companies should get stimulus money or bailout money....
and if they have the right to pick and choose...
Why cant they pick and choose who should be exempt from a law that would infringe on the religious convictions of an employer?
This is not about what the government can or can't do by changing the law, or passing a law.
It's about what is right. Allowing one set of businesses to avoid providing their employees a benefit that is the law for every other business in the country is discrimination.
When the charity gets my tax money, it becomes a dispenser of government 'entitlements'.
Without that 'dispenser', you'd be paying a lot more.
That's just made-up nonsense.
If churches want to become arms of the government then they can check their churchie beliefs at the door and comply with the secular laws.
You never answered my question as to whether or not you use birth control. Was that too personal?
The issue is business regulation, not religious freedom. A Catholic university is not a house of worship, it is a business enterprise. It hires non-Catholics and Catholics alike under the business and labor laws of the United States, which has the right to regulate business.
It is discrimination against the employees to exempt a Church business from an otherwise applicable law.
If the principle you want applied were legitimate, then it would entitle the Church's businesses to hire ONLY Catholics, or, even, only women who swore to never use birth control.
Curious...
I assume you supported the bailouts of Chrysler and GM.....and I assume you supported the stiumulus plan..
Now....using those assumptions...
What right does the government have to pick and choose what companies should get stimulus money or bailout money....
and if they have the right to pick and choose...
Why cant they pick and choose who should be exempt from a law that would infringe on the religious convictions of an employer?
This is not about what the government can or can't do by changing the law, or passing a law.
It's about what is right. Allowing one set of businesses to avoid providing their employees a benefit that is the law for every other business in the country is discrimination.
Without that 'dispenser', you'd be paying a lot more.
That's just made-up nonsense.
If churches want to become arms of the government then they can check their churchie beliefs at the door and comply with the secular laws.
It's not 'made up'. It's fact. Without the services provided on top of those funded by government, someone would have to pay for those services. Many churches believe they have a Christian duty to perform those services - they are the services talked about by Christ. The Government uses Churches to provide those services because it is good value for money - it doesn't cost the government as much as it would if those services were not provided by the church. Do the damned math. It is not hard.
Your problem is you allow your bias to influence your opinion. Do the fucking math. Look at the actual issue, and stop getting your group think points from bullshit media.
...on their non Catholic employees?
Churches are exempt from the ruling.
However, religious institutions that employ and serve people outside their faith -- hospitals, elementary schools, universities -- have to comply with the requirement to cover birth control if they offer health insurance coverage for employees. That means such Catholic institutions, which employ and serve wide swaths of non-Catholics across the country, will not be exempt, despite church teachings against use of contraception.
Obama Administration's New Contraception Rule Puts Key Catholic Vote at Risk
What gives the Catholic church (or any church, for that matter) the right to force their religious convictions on employees who aren't even catholic?
Better question...
What gives an employee the right to force their lack of belief in the convictions of the Catholic Church on the Catholic Church?
This is a free country. If you dont agree with your empoloyer, you have the right to quit your job. It happens everyday.
That's just made-up nonsense.
If churches want to become arms of the government then they can check their churchie beliefs at the door and comply with the secular laws.
It's not 'made up'. It's fact. Without the services provided on top of those funded by government, someone would have to pay for those services. Many churches believe they have a Christian duty to perform those services - they are the services talked about by Christ. The Government uses Churches to provide those services because it is good value for money - it doesn't cost the government as much as it would if those services were not provided by the church. Do the damned math. It is not hard.
Your problem is you allow your bias to influence your opinion. Do the fucking math. Look at the actual issue, and stop getting your group think points from bullshit media.
And you conveniently ignored the last line of my post.
...on their non Catholic employees?
Churches are exempt from the ruling.
What gives the Catholic church (or any church, for that matter) the right to force their religious convictions on employees who aren't even catholic?
Better question...
What gives an employee the right to force their lack of belief in the convictions of the Catholic Church on the Catholic Church?
This is a free country. If you dont agree with your empoloyer, you have the right to quit your job. It happens everyday.
We are a secular nation, where the secular laws of the nation are supreme, including in the regulation of business.
A church running a business has no right to substitute Church Law for US Law. Even you should be able to understand that.
