So what should Obama have done?

[antagon]

actually, immie, i think the blame should fall on BP for the frailty of their response.

like katrina, i think catastrophe betrays american's lack of solidarity in the face of adversity. we havent managed to garner the respect we did following 9/11. we've instead been pussies about these disasters with respect to our choice to wield our suffering as political capital.

 

[ScienceRocks]

obama cares more about union goon bags than the environment.

Obama cares about destroying this once great nation period. He don't give a damn about the economy, environment. That is just the way it is.

 

[Immanuel]

actually, immie, i think the blame should fall on BP for the frailty of their response.

like katrina, i think catastrophe betrays american's lack of solidarity in the face of adversity. we havent managed to garner the respect we did following 9/11. we've instead been pussies about these disasters with respect to our choice to wield our suffering as political capital.

I agree the blame for the catastrophe lies with BP.

The point I was attempting to get across was that as far as American response to the catastrophe we should not be blaming President Obama alone, we should be blaming the entire system.

I don't think we should be waiting around for BP to get their shit together. We should be doing everything we can, right now, to stop the leak regardless of where the blame lies. For whatever reason, that has not happened. Maybe there is little we can do, but blaming the President for the lack of American action seems wrong in my opinion, just as blaming Bush for the governmental actions after Katrina seemed wrong to me.

Immie

 

[WillowTree]

actually, immie, i think the blame should fall on BP for the frailty of their response.

like katrina, i think catastrophe betrays american's lack of solidarity in the face of adversity. we havent managed to garner the respect we did following 9/11. we've instead been pussies about these disasters with respect to our choice to wield our suffering as political capital.

I agree the blame for the catastrophe lies with BP.

The point I was attempting to get across was that as far as American response to the catastrophe we should not be blaming President Obama alone, we should be blaming the entire system.

I don't think we should be waiting around for BP to get their shit together. We should be doing everything we can, right now, to stop the leak regardless of where the blame lies. For whatever reason, that has not happened. Maybe there is little we can do, but blaming the President for the lack of American action seems wrong in my opinion, just as blaming Bush for the governmental actions after Katrina seemed wrong to me.

Immie

course not.. he's only supposed to be pretending at leadership right? lol, the only thing he's offered so far is to forgive the Brits, blame boooooooosh, congress,,,,,, and the tea party.. he sucks..

 

[antagon]

actually, immie, i think the blame should fall on BP for the frailty of their response.

like katrina, i think catastrophe betrays american's lack of solidarity in the face of adversity. we havent managed to garner the respect we did following 9/11. we've instead been pussies about these disasters with respect to our choice to wield our suffering as political capital.

I agree the blame for the catastrophe lies with BP.

The point I was attempting to get across was that as far as American response to the catastrophe we should not be blaming President Obama alone, we should be blaming the entire system.

I don't think we should be waiting around for BP to get their shit together. We should be doing everything we can, right now, to stop the leak regardless of where the blame lies. For whatever reason, that has not happened. Maybe there is little we can do, but blaming the President for the lack of American action seems wrong in my opinion, just as blaming Bush for the governmental actions after Katrina seemed wrong to me.

Immie

i strongly agree with what you are saying. politics can profit from aligning blame to individuals, the higher up the ladder the better, but the reality is that systems need more careful consideration - from disaster response to disaster prevention and contingency. from katrina to BP to al-qaeda.

i feel the private sector has more experience and wherewithal to stop the leak; perhaps public management has slowed the process. i think the nagging pressure model alone would be better than intervening to approve courses of action, etc.

i think that the impact of the oil on the shore could be more effectively dealt with by the government. dramatically more. trusting BP to handle that is probably asking too much from them concurrent with their work at the source... someone should recognize that and act accordingly. some type of intervention.

 

[ConHog]

actually, immie, i think the blame should fall on BP for the frailty of their response.

like katrina, i think catastrophe betrays american's lack of solidarity in the face of adversity. we havent managed to garner the respect we did following 9/11. we've instead been pussies about these disasters with respect to our choice to wield our suffering as political capital.

I agree the blame for the catastrophe lies with BP.

The point I was attempting to get across was that as far as American response to the catastrophe we should not be blaming President Obama alone, we should be blaming the entire system.

I don't think we should be waiting around for BP to get their shit together. We should be doing everything we can, right now, to stop the leak regardless of where the blame lies. For whatever reason, that has not happened. Maybe there is little we can do, but blaming the President for the lack of American action seems wrong in my opinion, just as blaming Bush for the governmental actions after Katrina seemed wrong to me.

Immie

i strongly agree with what you are saying. politics can profit from aligning blame to individuals, the higher up the ladder the better, but the reality is that systems need more careful consideration - from disaster response to disaster prevention and contingency. from katrina to BP to al-qaeda.

i feel the private sector has more experience and wherewithal to stop the leak; perhaps public management has slowed the process. i think the nagging pressure model alone would be better than intervening to approve courses of action, etc.

i think that the impact of the oil on the shore could be more effectively dealt with by the government. dramatically more. trusting BP to handle that is probably asking too much from them concurrent with their work at the source... someone should recognize that and act accordingly. some type of intervention.

It is a legitimate argument to suggest that government has hindered the private sector here. The Jones act being a prime example. Waive that sucker so some foreign aid can help out.

 

[Gremlin-USA]

BO should have canceled what was left of his vacation

Maybe he should have not gone a second vacation

Maybe BO should have called the CEO of BP sooner than 48 days into the spill

BO should have had more Booms sent, there are still hundreds in storage in CT, I believe

BO should have taken the Offer from Finland or was it the Dutch? any way they offered on day four to send Ships and Equipment.

BO should have allowed the Burn of the first wave of Oil as it was already approved by the MMS

BO should have allowed Bobby Jindal to build the Sand Berms to help keep the Oil from washing on shore.

BO should have had his team together the next day instead of waiting two weeks, BTW has BO" Team come up with anything yet or are they still in committee?

I am sure there are lot more thing he could have done, I am just tired of typing

 

[antagon]

I agree the blame for the catastrophe lies with BP.

The point I was attempting to get across was that as far as American response to the catastrophe we should not be blaming President Obama alone, we should be blaming the entire system.

I don't think we should be waiting around for BP to get their shit together. We should be doing everything we can, right now, to stop the leak regardless of where the blame lies. For whatever reason, that has not happened. Maybe there is little we can do, but blaming the President for the lack of American action seems wrong in my opinion, just as blaming Bush for the governmental actions after Katrina seemed wrong to me.

Immie

i strongly agree with what you are saying. politics can profit from aligning blame to individuals, the higher up the ladder the better, but the reality is that systems need more careful consideration - from disaster response to disaster prevention and contingency. from katrina to BP to al-qaeda.

i feel the private sector has more experience and wherewithal to stop the leak; perhaps public management has slowed the process. i think the nagging pressure model alone would be better than intervening to approve courses of action, etc.

i think that the impact of the oil on the shore could be more effectively dealt with by the government. dramatically more. trusting BP to handle that is probably asking too much from them concurrent with their work at the source... someone should recognize that and act accordingly. some type of intervention.

It is a legitimate argument to suggest that government has hindered the private sector here. The Jones act being a prime example. Waive that sucker so some foreign aid can help out.

the jones act hasn't been a factor; no waiver application/requests have been made, and foreign shipping is extensively employed.

i was talking about the oval office review of the game-plan which forced inferior courses of action to be pursued ahead of the current course. then again, i don't know all the considerations read into the decisions.

 

[Ravi]

Oil stains are now being left behind by each wave that reaches shore in Florida Keys ...

Link please.

 

[Mini 14]

Well, no matter where the blame lies, Alabama's Gulf Coast is now trashed. Up to 38 feet of oil staining the beaches at low tide, and Perdido Pass will be closed to ALL recreational boating by permanent booms for an undetermined amount of time. Mobile Bay will likely be next.

Residents and visitors to Gulf Shores, Orange Beach, Fort Morgan, Ono Island, began yesterday to report that the effects are FAR worse than what is being reported, and that people should stay away, as the situation began to grow far more dangerous and widespread yesterday.

BP obviously has no clue or is not inclined to stop the leak. Could our government/military have done a better job? Why did they do nothing?

I was in Fort Morgan for Memorial Day. It didn't dawn on me then that at 48 years old, I was seeing the white sand beaches of Alabama for the last time in my lifetime.

 

[Capitalist]

The Federal Aviation Administration banned flights over the GULF OF MEXICO OIL SPILL AND AFFECTED COASTLINE this week.

After all, we don't need any embarrassing photos of the oil slicks.

 

[Capitalist]

Three days after the explosion of the Deepwater Horizon in the Gulf of Mexico, the Dutch government offered to help.
It was willing to provide ships outfitted with oil-skimming booms, and it proposed a plan for building sand barriers to protect sensitive marshlands.
The response from the Obama administration and BP, which are coordinating the cleanup: “The embassy got a nice letter from the administration that said, ‘Thanks, but no thanks,’” said Geert Visser, consul general for the Netherlands in Houston.
Now, almost seven weeks later, as the oil spewing from the battered well spreads across the Gulf and soils pristine beaches and coastline, BP and our government have reconsidered.
U.S. ships are being outfitted this week with four pairs of the skimming booms airlifted from the Netherlands and should be deployed within days. Each pair can process 5 million gallons of water a day, removing 20,000 tons of oil and sludge.
At that rate, how much more oil could have been removed from the Gulf during the past month?
The uncoordinated response to an offer of assistance has become characteristic of this disaster’s response. Too often, BP and the government don’t seem to know what the other is doing, and the response has seemed too slow and too confused.
Federal law has also hampered the assistance. The Jones Act, the maritime law that requires all goods be carried in U.S. waters by U.S.-flagged ships, has prevented Dutch ships with spill-fighting equipment from entering U.S. coastal areas.
“What’s wrong with accepting outside help?” Visser asked. “If there’s a country that’s experienced with building dikes and managing water, it’s the Netherlands.”
Even if, three days after the rig exploded, it seemed as if the Dutch equipment and expertise wasn’t needed, wouldn’t it have been better to accept it, to err on the side of having too many resources available rather than not enough?
. . .
While the skimmers should soon be in use, the plan for building sand barriers remains more uncertain. Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal supports the idea, and the Coast Guard has tentatively approved the pro-ject. One of the proposals being considered was developed by the Dutch marine contractor Van Oord and Deltares, a Dutch research institute that specializes in environmental issues in deltas, coastal areas and rivers. They have a strategy to begin building 60-mile-long sand dikes within three weeks.
That proposal, like the offer for skimmers, was rebuffed but later accepted by the government. BP has begun paying about $360 million to cover the costs. Once again, though, the Jones Act may be getting in the way. American dredging companies, which lack the dike-building expertise of the Dutch, want to do the work themselves, Visser said.
HC
​

 

[antagon]

Federal law has also hampered the assistance. The Jones Act, the maritime law that requires all goods be carried in U.S. waters by U.S.-flagged ships, has prevented Dutch ships with spill-fighting equipment from entering U.S. coastal areas.

the right-wing deception is getting exhausting with the jones act shtick. the jones act regulates the registration of ships and origin of crews engaged in port to port shipping among US ports. reading it here, it shows it doesn't even include barges. dutch ships haven't been involved because neither BP nor the government have contracted them. other foreign ships have been contracted. is there a mystery there?

 

[WillowTree]

The Federal Aviation Administration banned flights over the GULF OF MEXICO OIL SPILL AND AFFECTED COASTLINE this week.

After all, we don't need any embarrassing photos of the oil slicks.

They banned flights? Really?

 

[Immanuel]

The Federal Aviation Administration banned flights over the GULF OF MEXICO OIL SPILL AND AFFECTED COASTLINE this week.

After all, we don't need any embarrassing photos of the oil slicks.

They banned flights? Really?

Evidently they did, but then there may be very good reasons why they did:

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_0_5100.html#areas

All aircraft operations are prohibited except those flights authorized by ATC, routine flights supporting offshore oil operations; federal, state, local and military flight operations supporting oil spill recovery and reconstitution efforts; and air medical and law enforcement operations.

1. All pilots operating within and near this area including the shoreline should exercise extreme caution due to the numerous low level operations associated with the deepwater horizon/mc-252 incident 3000 feet and below.

2. Aircraft involved in these operations may make sudden changes in direction, speed, and altitude. For additional information, participating aircraft altitude assignments and awareness, all pilots are recommended to review the following web site dedicated to the aviation cleanup efforts at: https://1afnorth.Region1.Ang.Af.Mil/deepwater_spill/default.Aspx

Its easy to think that this is simply to keep the press and the rest of us from pointing out that the government is hiding something, but then if you think about the massive clean up effort that should be going on, and may or may not be going on at the moment, then safety issues might play a very strong reason in regards to why this airspace is currently restricted.

Immie

 

[American Horse]

Oil stains are now being left behind by each wave that reaches shore in Florida Keys ...

Link please.

I saw a reporter standing on at least one beach in the florida keys (FNC) remarking on how each time the surf came onshore a shadowy stain was left behind; not a lot but still detectable. Perhaps what would be deposited from an "oil sheen"

CLICK HERE FOR A LINK: "Oil sheen, tar balls reported in south Florida Keys" (reported in the Palm Beach Palm News)

 

[American Horse]

I was in Fort Morgan for Memorial Day. It didn't dawn on me then that at 48 years old, I was seeing the white sand beaches of Alabama for the last time in my lifetime.

Same here; the beaches of the Florida Space Coast. I'm pretty sure a Christmas vacation there like we've enjoyed the past three years would be disappointing.

On FNC yesterday there was a reporter who said that many people were taking their vacations earlier than usual to get to Florida before the oil messes up the beaches for who knows how long.

 

[rightwinger]

So what should Obama have done?

If it was the previous president he would have attacked the perpetrators for this unwarranted attack on our shores

 

[Immanuel]

Oil stains are now being left behind by each wave that reaches shore in Florida Keys ...

Link please.

I saw a reporter standing on at least one beach in the florida keys (FNC) remarking on how each time the surf came onshore a shadowy stain was left behind; not a lot but still detectable. Perhaps what would be deposited from an "oil sheen"

CLICK HERE FOR A LINK: "Oil sheen, tar balls reported in south Florida Keys" (reported in the Palm Beach Palm News)

Looking this up, I just found this:

Tar balls that washed up in Keys not related to Gulf oil spill, Coast Guard says - Sun Sentinel

KEY WEST — The Coast Guard announced Wednesday morning that the blobs of tar that washed up in the Florida Keys earlier this week are not related to the Gulf oil spill.

The Coast Guard analyzed the tar balls while evidence mounted that at least some oil from the spill soon would arrive in South Florida.

Nothing else on the first couple of pages of the Goggle Search indicate the arrival of the oil from the spill and here in Tampa they tell us it may get to us but so far we are free and clear. I suspect we would get it long before Key West, but then maybe currents will carry it around the Tampa Bay Area.

Immie

 

[American Horse]

Immie, your link was to an article dated May 19, 25 days old. The link I found was to an article 3 days old, and the report I saw in FNC, which as I said was a video showing the barest outline in the sand as each wave broke on the beach, probably from the "sheen" was one day old.