Sodom and Gomorrah

[koshergrl]

Yes, yes, you've already carped on that plenty.

Not judging people doesn't mean you give them free rein to commit murder. Can we go onto the next topic now, please?

 

[Dr.Drock]

Yes, yes, you've already carped on that plenty.

Not judging people doesn't mean you give them free rein to commit murder. Can we go onto the next topic now, please?

Well I'm glad you didn't touch my point about Jesus's Golden Rule, even you the queen of lying on this board, couldn't lie your way out of that.




What's the topic you want to pic? How boogers and grass are the same bc they're both green? How jumping on a trampoline is the same as jumping off a building? What psychotic stretch would you like to make now?

 

[koshergrl]

What the hell are you yammering about?

 

[Dr.Drock]

What the hell are you yammering about?

2 things, the fact that you didn't question the point I made about how you couldn't give a shit less about Jesus's golden rule, and the fact that you make crazy connections like how people who disagree with you are Nazis and how America is so similar to Nazi Germany.

 

[koshergrl]

You know, when you guys are so lame that you can't come up with your own argument and have to steal material from me, I wish you would at least make a tiny attempt to hide it.

 

[Foxfyre]

Spoken like a true Nazi.

They wanted abortion to protect life. That's the way they phrased it.

Very similar to "Protecting those babies is interference in the womb!"

Well..yeah, I guess, if babies have to be protected from the women who create them, then I guess it IS interference, of a sort, to make them meet their obligation once they've chosen that path...likewise pregnant women who test positive for drugs are often incarcerated or placed in treatment until their baby is born. Because the mother has an obligation to protect, or at least not harm, that life.

But I digress. How funny that you will continue to cling faithfully to your eugenics-based beliefs despite the obvious connection to the Holocaust. I suppose in this instance you are protecting the life of the planet, or protecting the ability of the woman to work without hindrance, or to improve the health of the population...all good Nazi sentiments! Bravo! I wish I had a badge to give you..check with Ravi. Being anti-Nazi, I don't, but I'm sure she has some cool prizes to give.

If there's 2 things I'm certain of in life, it's the following.

1.) You don't judge people

2.) You take Jesus's Golden Rule VERY seriously

It is true that Jesus commanded us not to judge what is in the heart of others. But we were strongly commanded to judge the actions of others and condemn evil. And he strongly suggested that there would be dire consequences for anybody who harmed any of the most innocent, i.e. the children, or led them astray.

We do not have to judge the character or motives of the mother in order to be justified in believing that it is wrong to abort a healthy baby for no other reason than the baby is inconvenient.

And if you apply the golden rule, would you want somebody to have aborted you? Then don't condone that for others.

 

[koshergrl]

Abiding by the Golden Rule doesn't mean you turn your back on human rights violations, murder, atrocities, depravity.

But I opt for the most part not to speak to inutterably stupid whimsy spouted by retards, which is why I don't really jump up and defend myself when they make such ridiculous comments.

 

[JoeB131]

Conceding the point on the rareness of bibles before printing presses (which came about in 1444, and the Protestant Reformation happened within a century, imagine that.)

However, explain if you would, how it could be I could get through 12 years of Catholic Education and never have heard of Jephthah? In fact, the only character in the Book of Judges (which is one of the most fun books in the Bible, really) that we got a bowlderized version of was Samson and how he brought down a temple after his hair grew back.

As for Genesis 19, there was a solid discussion of that book in my Freshman year, not in religion class, but in literature class. This Christian Brother (who wasn't just gay, he was FLAMING) had a textbook that ends with Mrs. Lot getting turned into Salt. (They leave out the drunken Hillbilly Sex.) Teenage boys being what we were, needled him on whether it was the gay stuff that made God kill them all. We really didn't have a in depth discussion about how Lot could be a "righteous" man offering his daughters up for gang rape.

There you go Dr. Drock, disrespect. If you want to discuss the matter in a mature and relevent way, then you don't say things to disrespect those who hold the text sacred. It's really that simple, there's no need for that unless your goal is to harass and belittle those who take it seriously.

I would say that anyone who holds that story as sacred, with a petty evil God saving a petty evil man, then they really deserve a bit of disrespect.

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how a guy who offeres his daughters up for gang rape following having drunken sex with them himself, is going to be considered "righteous", yet other books in the bible call him exactly that.

 

[JoeB131]

"
When the Nazis came to power in 1933 one of the first acts Hitler did was to legalize abortion. By 1935 Germany with 65 million people was the place where over 500,000 abortions were being performed each year. Although Hitler and his government encourged Aryan women to produce a lot of children, he left the matter of abortion and all its facets in the hands of a decidely pro- abortion medical establishment. Even in the midst of Nazi propaganda aimed at increasing the Aryan population, scores of Aryan women still chose to abort their unborn children. The medical publication Deutsches Aerzleblatt reported the abortions in Germany each year reached a half-million.
Further, a Nazi decree of October 19, 1941 established abortion on demand as the official policy of Poland. Hitler, however, expressed dissatisfaction with this policy. Abortion, he believed, should NOT be limited to Poland. He therefore ordered that abortion be expanded to all populations under the control of the "Ministry of the Occupied Territories of the East."

Hitler Pro-Abortion

Godwin Alert!!!!

 

[koshergrl]

Sorry, that won't fly.

 

[Iridescence]

Ahhh, nothing like throwing a grenade into the room.

Okay, fundementalists and others like to cite this story about how God hates gay people, and he thinks that Sodomy is wrong. (Never explain what the Gomorrah People were doing so they got it, too.) But then you look at the actual text, and the story becomes a bit more confusing.

God and two Angels visit Abraham in Genesis 18. God announces he's going to wipe out the City. And then Abarham asks God to spare the city if there are 10 righteous men in it. So God says he is going to send the two Angels to see if they are really wicked.

Well, next chapter, Genesis 19, the two Angels meet up with Lot, Abraham's no-account nephew. They go to Lot's house because the streets are too dangerous, and here's where the stuff gets tricky.

19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

Now, while "to know" is often used in other parts of the bible to indicate sex, it's not really clear that these guys actually wanted to gang rape the angels. But then Lot says the following.

19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

Ooooookay. Don't rape my guest. Instead rape my two virgin daughters. Keep in mind, this is the "Good guy" that God had to go and save from this den of inequity. Keep that in mind the next time you pray for Aunt Millie's cancer to get better and it doesn't, where God's priorities are.

Well, I guess these guys didn't want any of the poonany, because they next threaten, 19:9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

Okay... Hmmmm. Well, the Angels blind everyone, Lot gets out of town. They tell him not to look back, but Mrs. Lot does and she gets turned into a condiment.

Then we get to the part they don't tell you in Sunday School. Lot and his two daughters are hiding in a cave. And then it occurs to the daughters that the only way they could have babies is to have drunken sex with their father.

Once again... this is the good guy that God had to save. Not those damned Sodomites, who were no doubt planning a killer Oscar Party.

You, dear JoeB... Are a vile, repugnant, little minded man who ought not post to provoke others in such an obvious fashion.

There is *just enough* written to explain the basic aire of the people and their time... Lot's wife may have been one of the supposed few women the bible refers to as being worthy 'salt'.

These cities were far removed from reproach, from medical discipline, from God's alignment. You think it merely be about behaviour? About bedside manner and sexual preferences? *cringe*

I, personally, don't know enough to debate this or even to correct you, but I know you are sorely mistaken in your approach.

 

[JoeB131]

You, dear JoeB... Are a vile, repugnant, little minded man who ought not post to provoke others in such an obvious fashion.

There is *just enough* written to explain the basic aire of the people and their time... Lot's wife may have been one of the supposed few women the bible refers to as being worthy 'salt'.

These cities were far removed from reproach, from medical discipline, from God's alignment. You think it merely be about behaviour? About bedside manner and sexual preferences? *cringe*

I, personally, don't know enough to debate this or even to correct you, but I know you are sorely mistaken in your approach.

Why not provoke them. When I've seen obnoxious bible thumpers mistreat my friends who happen to be gay (one person I knew got fired because her bible thumping moron co-worker bitched about her after she brought her girlfriend to a company event.) I enjoy nothing more than pointing out their ignorance of their own holy book.

A God who murders babies but saves child rapists is not worthy of anyone's worship, only contempt and riducule, and I have plenty of that to spare.

 

[JoeB131]

Sorry, that won't fly.

But you think repeating crazy anti-abortion lies about Nazis does?

Abortion in Germany - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So let's see now. Making unsubstatiated claims about the other person's personal life?

Check.

Invoking the Nazis?

Check.

Any other LOSER arguments you want to try, because, hey, we've got all night, really.

 

[Iridescence]

OMGorsh. You seem to have been the one who has stopped thinking, though, really.

 

[koshergrl]

Sorry, that won't fly.

But you think repeating crazy anti-abortion lies about Nazis does?

Abortion in Germany - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So let's see now. Making unsubstatiated claims about the other person's personal life?

Check.

Invoking the Nazis?

Check.

Any other LOSER arguments you want to try, because, hey, we've got all night, really.

I didn't invoke the Nazis, you retard. I pointed out the similarities between those who go to bat for mass-killing babies, and the nazis.

And you aren't a biblical scholar, so I really doubt you'll be winning any arguments here.

And what's the wiki link for? Is that your big store of knowledge on the subject?

 

[JoeB131]

OMGorsh. You seem to have been the one who has stopped thinking, though, really.

No, I've been thinking the whole time.

It started when I was 11, and a nasty old nun said that God drowned all the babies in the world because they were "WIIIIIIIIICKED!!!"

It ended when my mom had cancer, and everyone in the parish prayed for her, and she still died in complete agony with a rosary in her hand.

That's when I decided that I had no time for santimonious bullshit or the idiots who try to claim to be "bible scholars" and can't defend their own bible.

So one more time, straight answer-

How can a guy who offers his daughters up for gang rape and then has drunken sex with them himself not be worse than a baby or child who happened to be in that city?

 

[JoeB131]

I didn't invoke the Nazis, you retard. I pointed out the similarities between those who go to bat for mass-killing babies, and the nazis.

And you aren't a biblical scholar, so I really doubt you'll be winning any arguments here.

And what's the wiki link for? Is that your big store of knowledge on the subject?

Nobody is "mass killing" babies.

they are individually killing fetuses, which aren't considered babies by law, science or even the Bible.

 

[Newby]

You, dear JoeB... Are a vile, repugnant, little minded man who ought not post to provoke others in such an obvious fashion.

There is *just enough* written to explain the basic aire of the people and their time... Lot's wife may have been one of the supposed few women the bible refers to as being worthy 'salt'.

These cities were far removed from reproach, from medical discipline, from God's alignment. You think it merely be about behaviour? About bedside manner and sexual preferences? *cringe*

I, personally, don't know enough to debate this or even to correct you, but I know you are sorely mistaken in your approach.

Why not provoke them. When I've seen obnoxious bible thumpers mistreat my friends who happen to be gay (one person I knew got fired because her bible thumping moron co-worker bitched about her after she brought her girlfriend to a company event.) I enjoy nothing more than pointing out their ignorance of their own holy book.

A God who murders babies but saves child rapists is not worthy of anyone's worship, only contempt and riducule, and I have plenty of that to spare.

There's the agenda... finally... If your 'friend' got fired for that, then they should have sued since it would have been against the law... but, personally, I don't believe a word of it. The only ignorance you're very clearly pointing out here, is your own.

 

[JoeB131]

You, dear JoeB... Are a vile, repugnant, little minded man who ought not post to provoke others in such an obvious fashion.

There is *just enough* written to explain the basic aire of the people and their time... Lot's wife may have been one of the supposed few women the bible refers to as being worthy 'salt'.

These cities were far removed from reproach, from medical discipline, from God's alignment. You think it merely be about behaviour? About bedside manner and sexual preferences? *cringe*

I, personally, don't know enough to debate this or even to correct you, but I know you are sorely mistaken in your approach.

Why not provoke them. When I've seen obnoxious bible thumpers mistreat my friends who happen to be gay (one person I knew got fired because her bible thumping moron co-worker bitched about her after she brought her girlfriend to a company event.) I enjoy nothing more than pointing out their ignorance of their own holy book.

A God who murders babies but saves child rapists is not worthy of anyone's worship, only contempt and riducule, and I have plenty of that to spare.

There's the agenda... finally... If your 'friend' got fired for that, then they should have sued since it would have been against the law... but, personally, I don't believe a word of it. The only ignorance you're very clearly pointing out here, is your own.

Come to think of it, that picture you use as an avi looks pretty gay, so I thought you'd be more sympathetic.

Anyway, yeah, she could have sued. But this was a relatively small company we worked for, so it wasn't like she could have gotten a lot. Not to mention this was in 2000, when we had 3% unemployment. She was able to get a job at their biggest competitor within two weeks for more pay.

Incidently, lots of companies do things that are against the law in personnel handling all the time. Sometimes because they don't know any better and sometimes because they are just arrogant enough to think they can get away with it. I was illegally fired from my last job because I ran up too many medical bills. The thing is, most people don't sue because suing is actually an expensive, uncertain enterprise that usually isn't worth it for the small stuff.

But my main point, which you avoid.

How is a god who kills gays and babies but saves a daughter rapist "righteous". YOu keep avoiding that question for some reason.

 

[Newby]

Why not provoke them. When I've seen obnoxious bible thumpers mistreat my friends who happen to be gay (one person I knew got fired because her bible thumping moron co-worker bitched about her after she brought her girlfriend to a company event.) I enjoy nothing more than pointing out their ignorance of their own holy book.

A God who murders babies but saves child rapists is not worthy of anyone's worship, only contempt and riducule, and I have plenty of that to spare.

There's the agenda... finally... If your 'friend' got fired for that, then they should have sued since it would have been against the law... but, personally, I don't believe a word of it. The only ignorance you're very clearly pointing out here, is your own.

Come to think of it, that picture you use as an avi looks pretty gay, so I thought you'd be more sympathetic.

Anyway, yeah, she could have sued. But this was a relatively small company we worked for, so it wasn't like she could have gotten a lot. Not to mention this was in 2000, when we had 3% unemployment. She was able to get a job at their biggest competitor within two weeks for more pay.

Incidently, lots of companies do things that are against the law in personnel handling all the time. Sometimes because they don't know any better and sometimes because they are just arrogant enough to think they can get away with it. I was illegally fired from my last job because I ran up too many medical bills. The thing is, most people don't sue because suing is actually an expensive, uncertain enterprise that usually isn't worth it for the small stuff.

But my main point, which you avoid.

How is a god who kills gays and babies but saves a daughter rapist "righteous". YOu keep avoiding that question for some reason.

I haven't avoided it, it's already been explained and discussed ad nauseum by many on here, you're never going to agree with it or see it any differently, so why would anyone continue to waste their time on you?

And why would my avi be gay exactly? Can't wait to hear that explanation?