Teacher Compensation

[Wry Catcher]

When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.

BULLSHIT

It's about the product, the education of the next generation.

There is no doubt public education needs to be reinvented, but not by being destroyed, something the right wing has tried hard to do. The elitists want their children subsidized, so they can attend a private school, charter school or religious school, where it is easy to kick out an unruly or slow student at their will.

Not so in the public school system, where once again the public sector is squeezed, and forced to do more with less. When the more is less than expected, the call to cut funding and create vouchers for private schools limits funding again.

With the most false of pathos they claim this will help minority students who suffer and are held back by poorly operating public schools.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

You apparently would not know a faculty lounge if someone locked you in it! Lounge? Folding chairs around a table to eat lunch. That's about it!

It is a fact that you cannot assess me because you are an ignorant troll. That is all. Have a nice day!

lol....ahhh...
It's ok little buddy. I know, as a former teacher it is tough for you to deal with people who don't agree with you and, in your mind, not see you as intellectually superior.
It's a big world outside of your little classroom, believe it or not...we have opinions of our own out here.

 

[initforme]

Imagine people getting upset about a person making 35 grand.....too funny. Tisk tisk. It's not a big issue to pay them a little more. Oklahoma should be ashamed.

 

[rightwinger]

Imagine people getting upset about a person making 35 grand.....too funny. Tisk tisk. It's not a big issue to pay them a little more. Oklahoma should be ashamed.

It is part of the Conservative playbook

Support unfettered accumulation of wealth for the one percent

Attack as excessive any wage earned by teachers, cops....even minimum wage jobs

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You apparently would not know a faculty lounge if someone locked you in it! Lounge? Folding chairs around a table to eat lunch. That's about it!

It is a fact that you cannot assess me because you are an ignorant troll. That is all. Have a nice day!

lol....ahhh...
It's ok little buddy. I know, as a former teacher it is tough for you to deal with people who don't agree with you and, in your mind, not see you as intellectually superior.
It's a big world outside of your little classroom, believe it or not...we have opinions of our own out here.

You have uninformed opinions based on lies that you have created to make yourself feel better. THAT is your problem.

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

No, just a little modicum of respect for all teachers would be sufficient.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

No, just a little modicum of respect for all teachers would be sufficient.

What part of "wonderful, I appreciate, great people"...do you not understand?
Do you need to go back to school yourself?
Again, you're the one carrying a chip around on his shoulder, not me.
You need to get over yourself and hopefully you can make a decent teacher also...because if these post are any indication of how you interact with students...you are a jerk.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

No, just a little modicum of respect for all teachers would be sufficient.

What part of "wonderful, I appreciate, great people"...do you not understand?
Do you need to go back to school yourself?
Again, you're the one carrying a chip around on his shoulder, not me.
You need to get over yourself and hopefully you can make a decent teacher also...because if these post are any indication of how you interact with students...you are a jerk.

My students are not idiots! You, on the other hand, ...

 

[iamwhatiseem]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

No, just a little modicum of respect for all teachers would be sufficient.

What part of "wonderful, I appreciate, great people"...do you not understand?
Do you need to go back to school yourself?
Again, you're the one carrying a chip around on his shoulder, not me.
You need to get over yourself and hopefully you can make a decent teacher also...because if these post are any indication of how you interact with students...you are a jerk.

My students are not idiots! You, on the other hand, ...

I can say one thing you are entertaining!....

 

[pismoe]

teachers are pretty much full of themselves , they think that they are Special . Course i think teachers do pretty poorly when it come to teaching . --- Oklahoma slips to 47th in nation on annual educational quality ranking ---

 

[Skull Pilot]

It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

The best of the best do not major in education

 

[initforme]

Since Oklahoma is too cheap to fund their schools it's not hard to figure why they are 47th.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

BTW, who said I was former? I am substituting right now because no one in the private sector will hire me because I am much more qualified that the people interviewing me. I am back in the classroom full time as of last week, but I don't get paid for any day we are off. When my paycheck comes in 2 weeks, it will have 4 days pay, at about 1/3 my normal rate per day.

You are just so awesome!!....we should all be groveling at your blessed feet!!

No, just a little modicum of respect for all teachers would be sufficient.

What part of "wonderful, I appreciate, great people"...do you not understand?
Do you need to go back to school yourself?
Again, you're the one carrying a chip around on his shoulder, not me.
You need to get over yourself and hopefully you can make a decent teacher also...because if these post are any indication of how you interact with students...you are a jerk.

My students are not idiots! You, on the other hand, ...

I can say one thing you are entertaining!....

That's what my students tell me! I make learning fun!

You, on the other hand, are boring as hell!

 

[pismoe]

Oklahoma mentioned by me because their teachers just got a raise i think . So , your reasoning is that the teachers get to feck with the kids until they can SQUEEZE more money from Taxpayers eh Init ??

 

[rightwinger]

It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

The best of the best do not major in education

Some do

We have some excellent teachers. Chasing them into other professions will not help our educational system

 

[pismoe]

yeah , you're the cool teachers eh Admiral !!

 

[rightwinger]

Since Oklahoma is too cheap to fund their schools it's not hard to figure why they are 47th.

You get what you pay for

 

[pismoe]

It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

The best of the best do not major in education

Some do

We have some excellent teachers. Chasing them into other professions will not help our educational system

-------------------------------- might not but it will stop them from whining and it would get them away from American kids RWinger .

 

[Skull Pilot]

It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

The best of the best do not major in education

Some do

We have some excellent teachers. Chasing them into other professions will not help our educational system

Matters not to me. I was smart enough not to have kids. And it's not teachers' salary that is the problem it's that we are asking schools to be something else these days.

And like most government run bureaucracies the schools are top heavy with administrators

These teachers should be calling for the culling of the administrative herd