Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

[Freewill]

Explain "right to work". This is where the big government gets involved and dictates contract agreements between employers and workers, right? Given the name "right to work" to dupe simple-minded red state yokels into thinking that it's going to guarantee everyone a job but what it really does is uses the government arm of the corporate oligarchy to stifle collective bargaining and workers' rights.

So explain what you think "right to work laws" do.

Right to work means a person has the right to work without joining a union. It is how the Post office is run and is how many states have laws. The example is that if you work at the Post Office you don't have to join the union but the union does have to represent you because, I believe, you are still covered under the contract. The quality of that representation might be suspect. It really has nothing to do with the government dictating what a person does it is entirely up to the person, freedom man.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Note; No argument is a bad argument. But if you just say, "You are stupid" you will be generalized as the bad and sadly typical argument.

Naw............guessing you follow Fox News.

Here we see a SHINING example of what party lines are. This small brain thinks that Unions are Only a Left wing thing. When in history it has been a human movement.

I'm so sad for this kid. Propaganda sheep aren't wrong because they believe propaganda. They are wrong because they haven't received true information.

AZMike, I think that you think you are advanced in political thinking. Sadly, I see you as a 2-5 year newbie in politics. I really doubt you have been in politics long. Sorry, as I said, Im me and I think for me.

And I think we can all see just what a deep thinker you are. I'm not very impressed with you but apparently you are.

And as a side as to why I thought your second post was bullshit and you were nothing more than a cut rate left wing candy ass that can't handle opposition to your weak minded and easily refuted positions?

1- Your user name combined with the topic of the post. Nothing screams antiparty like having to join a group. I mean nothing screams independence more than than joining clubs.

2- Your avatar, again nothing points out you are an independent thinker like a Guy Fawks avatar and joining the Guy Fawks fan club. You are so fucking individual you had to join a group to prove it.

You're a flake, a wanna be and a groupie. You can only venture outside your comfort zone as far as your welfare and food stamps will allow you. You're only as antiparty as the comfort zone of the party you belong to will allow lest you upset your support group.

You're a real gem.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Explain "right to work". This is where the big government gets involved and dictates contract agreements between employers and workers, right? Given the name "right to work" to dupe simple-minded red state yokels into thinking that it's going to guarantee everyone a job but what it really does is uses the government arm of the corporate oligarchy to stifle collective bargaining and workers' rights.

So explain what you think "right to work laws" do.

Quite simple: it prevents people from being forced at gunpoint to pay protection money to unions in order to stay employed. It really is that simple.

 

[Freewill]

What is the Republican final solution to the problem of Unions?

They are killing themselves, no solution is required. What you should be asking yourself is what is the Unions going to do to reverse the trend. And let me give you a hint, they need to quit suckling up to the same teat.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

What is the Republican final solution to the problem of Unions?

They are killing themselves, no solution is required. What you should be asking yourself is what is the Unions going to do to reverse the trend. And let me give you a hint, they need to quit suckling up to the same teat.

Unions have created their own death spiral, you offer people nothing while forcing them to pay you. I think unions are about to die, they can't even get Toyota to join up and people are bailing big time in Wisconsin.

The usefulness of unions has gone away. Anything they can offer you is already law in every state. They have nothing new to give.

 

[Zander]

Private sector unions are fine.

Public sector unions are an abomination. Even FDR knew they were wrong.

 

[Jughead]

Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

This is why...

NO Union should force anyone to join a Union pending employment.

Problem is that unions do indeed force prospective employees to join as a condition of employment. Paying union fees is something that many of us want no part of. Unions put companies at an unfair disadvantage as they lose qualified candidates to companies without unions. As a result, companies with unions may be required to hire less qualified individuals if they are the only ones who would be willing to join the union.

On a positive note, right to work states have been steadily increasing.

 

[jasonnfree]

Ultra wealthy people have a union. They call it our Congress. Or the International Brotherhood of Plutocrats.
But unionized they are. How the hell else did they get bailed out during the economic collapse? Any of you on here get any of those TARP funds? Big bonuses for shoddy work?

The most powerful, cash rich organization in the work force is the union of the ultra wealthy. They have it going on for the rich. Any of you notice the income gains for the ultra rich? Percentage of the nations wealth held by the ultra rich? Bail outs of the ultra rich?

That is one powerful union they belong to. The union of the ultra wealthy.

Don't forget the U.S. Supreme court. A union for corporations. Most if not all members, democrat and republican, corporate lawyers. Not too many countries consider corporations as people.

 

[jasonnfree]

Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

This is why...

NO Union should force anyone to join a Union pending employment.

Problem is that unions do indeed force prospective employees to join as a condition of employment. Paying union fees is something that many of us want no part of. Unions put companies at an unfair disadvantage as they lose qualified candidates to companies without unions. As a result, companies with unions may be required to hire less qualified individuals if they are the only ones who would be willing to join the union.

On a positive note, right to work states have been steadily increasing.

Union dues aren't that much considering that the extra pay and benefits more than make up for the dues. Why would a highly qualified person go to a company that paid less wage and benefits
just to not pay union dues?

 

[jasonnfree]

Explain "right to work". This is where the big government gets involved and dictates contract agreements between employers and workers, right? Given the name "right to work" to dupe simple-minded red state yokels into thinking that it's going to guarantee everyone a job but what it really does is uses the government arm of the corporate oligarchy to stifle collective bargaining and workers' rights.

So explain what you think "right to work laws" do.

Quite simple: it prevents people from being forced at gunpoint to pay protection money to unions in order to stay employed. It really is that simple.

You know, if a union thug pointed a gun at you to pay protection money, you could go to the police? No, really, not joking.

 

[Jughead]

Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

This is why...

NO Union should force anyone to join a Union pending employment.

Problem is that unions do indeed force prospective employees to join as a condition of employment. Paying union fees is something that many of us want no part of. Unions put companies at an unfair disadvantage as they lose qualified candidates to companies without unions. As a result, companies with unions may be required to hire less qualified individuals if they are the only ones who would be willing to join the union.

On a positive note, right to work states have been steadily increasing.

Union dues aren't that much considering that the extra pay and benefits more than make up for the dues. Why would a highly qualified person go to a company that paid less wage and benefits
just to not pay union dues?

It depends on the nature of the job. Nowadays, most companies provide benefits like insurance. For skilled work, the unionless company would be smart to match the salary of the equivalent union job. This way the unionless company acquires all of the top talent.

Also, unions offer no rewards for top performance. They tend to protect those who are unproductive to the detriment of those who are. They also tend to pay the unproductive employees the same salaries as the productive ones. Overall company performance suffers. In a unionless company, the unproductive employees would be given the door.

Many of us are also aware that unions are the reason a lot of our jobs were sent overseas to places like China. That is a strong deterrent to not join a union.

When adding the union fees to all this, I figure that I need a union like I need a hole in the head.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

This is why...

NO Union should force anyone to join a Union pending employment.

Problem is that unions do indeed force prospective employees to join as a condition of employment. Paying union fees is something that many of us want no part of. Unions put companies at an unfair disadvantage as they lose qualified candidates to companies without unions. As a result, companies with unions may be required to hire less qualified individuals if they are the only ones who would be willing to join the union.

On a positive note, right to work states have been steadily increasing.

Union dues aren't that much considering that the extra pay and benefits more than make up for the dues. Why would a highly qualified person go to a company that paid less wage and benefits
just to not pay union dues?

I'm thinking the unions in Wisconsin are proving you wrong. The members that aren't forced to pay are now not paying for the nothing they gain. And by not paying they get the same pay scale and benefits less the actual paying for the union. Most are choosing that option.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Tell Me Why Unions Are Bad

This is why...

NO Union should force anyone to join a Union pending employment.

Problem is that unions do indeed force prospective employees to join as a condition of employment. Paying union fees is something that many of us want no part of. Unions put companies at an unfair disadvantage as they lose qualified candidates to companies without unions. As a result, companies with unions may be required to hire less qualified individuals if they are the only ones who would be willing to join the union.

On a positive note, right to work states have been steadily increasing.

Union dues aren't that much considering that the extra pay and benefits more than make up for the dues. Why would a highly qualified person go to a company that paid less wage and benefits
just to not pay union dues?

Why would a highly qualified individual want a union to convince his employer that he is part of a large group of interchangeable pieces?

 

[Harry Dresden]

Needless to say, most on this board would benefit from a union. It's the fat cats who want cheap labor that are against them.

I'm in a union (not by choice). I get NOTHING from it. The union is utterly worthless and totally useless.

i was in one too.....and any pay and benefits received was because of that Union....my fucking Employer sure as hell was against just about everything we got....and they proved that at Contract time....but when it came to the assholes that ran the place .....money was no object....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Explain "right to work". This is where the big government gets involved and dictates contract agreements between employers and workers, right? Given the name "right to work" to dupe simple-minded red state yokels into thinking that it's going to guarantee everyone a job but what it really does is uses the government arm of the corporate oligarchy to stifle collective bargaining and workers' rights.

So explain what you think "right to work laws" do.

Right to work means a person has the right to work without joining a union. It is how the Post office is run and is how many states have laws. The example is that if you work at the Post Office you don't have to join the union but the union does have to represent you because, I believe, you are still covered under the contract. The quality of that representation might be suspect. It really has nothing to do with the government dictating what a person does it is entirely up to the person, freedom man.

yea and those guys enjoyed all the pay and benefits too.....and in my office the 2 assholes who filed the most grievances were non union....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Private sector unions are fine.

Public sector unions are an abomination. Even FDR knew they were wrong.

why?.....do Govt Employees get so taken care of by their Employers that they dont need representation?......come work in the Post Office....the management there will violate contracts and safety issues as much as they can ......seen it for 33 years.....and the only ones standing up for the employees is that Union....my Union had their flaws just like other Unions.....but they were the only ones who got on management for violating Safety rules and the Contract that they signed off on....there was a reason there was so many shootings in the past.....Management,especially Middle Management....many of them are pure fucking assholes....

 

[Grandma]

Unions are fine, they still work for employee rights.

Do you want to know the real reason wingnuts hate unions?

It's because 3 of the top 10 donors to the democratic party are unions.

In other words, the right has no problem with the Kochs throwing millions of dollars into elections, but they don't want anyone else to do the same thing.

Because they're incapable of fair play.

 

[Zander]

Unions are fine, they still work for employee rights.

Do you want to know the real reason wingnuts hate unions?

It's because 3 of the top 10 donors to the democratic party are unions.

In other words, the right has no problem with the Kochs throwing millions of dollars into elections, but they don't want anyone else to do the same thing.

Because they're incapable of fair play.

You are wrong. The mass majority of conservatives do not oppose all UNIONS. They oppose PUBLIC SECTOR UNIONS. Private sector unions have a place in our economy. Public sector unions are a scourge and a conflict of interest so obvious that even FDR opposed them.

Franklin D. Roosevelt: Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service
All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Private sector unions are fine.

Public sector unions are an abomination. Even FDR knew they were wrong.

why?.....do Govt Employees get so taken care of by their Employers that they dont need representation?......come work in the Post Office....the management there will violate contracts and safety issues as much as they can ......seen it for 33 years.....and the only ones standing up for the employees is that Union....my Union had their flaws just like other Unions.....but they were the only ones who got on management for violating Safety rules and the Contract that they signed off on....there was a reason there was so many shootings in the past.....Management,especially Middle Management....many of them are pure fucking assholes....

It's a question of good and bad. What do the general public see? That someone gets help with a contract or a union makes unreasonable demands over something or other? Bad is newsworthy, good is boring.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Unions are fine, they still work for employee rights.

Do you want to know the real reason wingnuts hate unions?

It's because 3 of the top 10 donors to the democratic party are unions.

In other words, the right has no problem with the Kochs throwing millions of dollars into elections, but they don't want anyone else to do the same thing.

Because they're incapable of fair play.

You are wrong. The mass majority of conservatives do not oppose all UNIONS. They oppose PUBLIC SECTOR UNIONS. Private sector unions have a place in our economy. Public sector unions are a scourge and a conflict of interest so obvious that even FDR opposed them.

Franklin D. Roosevelt: Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service
All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters.

we were not allowed to strike.....get fired if you do....had to sign a paper at hiring....