Texas Launches Gold-Backed Bank

[Toddsterpatriot]

article 1 section 10

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.​

Nope. It says they can't "coin money." In other words, they can't mint coins. It says nothing about paper notes. IN fact, prior to the creation of the federal reserve, private banks printed their own gold backed notes. If the Constitution doesn't bar a private bank from doing it, then how could it possible bar a state?

Also note that this section prohibits legal tender laws that mandate anything but gold or silver coins as a form of payment, so anytime the state issues or receives payments in anything but gold and silver coins, it's violating the Constitution.

No State shall...emit Bills of Credit

Bill of Credit
A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals. Money is a bill of credit, but a bill of credit need not be money. An interest-bearing certificate that was issued by Missouri, and usable in the payment of taxes, was thus ruled to be an unconstitutional bill of credit.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit. It doesn't pay interest. No money is loaned. Gold backed banknotes are a claim on a specific quantity of gold.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

 

[bripat9643]

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.​

Nope. It says they can't "coin money." In other words, they can't mint coins. It says nothing about paper notes. IN fact, prior to the creation of the federal reserve, private banks printed their own gold backed notes. If the Constitution doesn't bar a private bank from doing it, then how could it possible bar a state?

Also note that this section prohibits legal tender laws that mandate anything but gold or silver coins as a form of payment, so anytime the state issues or receives payments in anything but gold and silver coins, it's violating the Constitution.

No State shall...emit Bills of Credit

Bill of Credit
A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals. Money is a bill of credit, but a bill of credit need not be money. An interest-bearing certificate that was issued by Missouri, and usable in the payment of taxes, was thus ruled to be an unconstitutional bill of credit.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit. It doesn't pay interest. No money is loaned. Gold backed banknotes are a claim on a specific quantity of gold.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

 

[Skylar]

As long they do not conflict with Congress authority, there is nothing to keep Texas from "printing" a second currency honored by the government of Texas.

In fact, it could be a money making idea if they are prudent in its uses.

I guarantee you the feds will try to shut it down because it won't be long before all Americans are performing their transactions in the new Texas gold backed currency.

texas can't print a currency. a 'constitutional expert' like yourself should know that.

Really? What law says that? Private individuals can't print currency, but I'm not aware of any law that says a state owned bank can't.

Nope. But the Federal Government can apply a 10% tax to any such currency. And have.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

No State shall...emit Bills of Credit

Bill of Credit
A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals. Money is a bill of credit, but a bill of credit need not be money. An interest-bearing certificate that was issued by Missouri, and usable in the payment of taxes, was thus ruled to be an unconstitutional bill of credit.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit. It doesn't pay interest. No money is loaned. Gold backed banknotes are a claim on a specific quantity of gold.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

You shouldn't confuse credit with bill of credit.

Bill of credit is a phrase from Article One, Section 10, Clause One of the United States Constitution. It refers to a document similar to a banknote that is issued by a government and designed to circulate as money. Because the framers of the Constitution sought to limit the issuance of currency, it explicitly prohibits the states from issuing bills of credit. The restriction of emitting bills of credit was extended to Congress as well, because the power to "emit bills and borrow money on credit" during the previous Articles of Confederation was struck out and revised in the Constitution to only "borrow money on the credit (Article I, section 8).[1]

Bill of credit - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

 

[bripat9643]

As long they do not conflict with Congress authority, there is nothing to keep Texas from "printing" a second currency honored by the government of Texas.

In fact, it could be a money making idea if they are prudent in its uses.

I guarantee you the feds will try to shut it down because it won't be long before all Americans are performing their transactions in the new Texas gold backed currency.

texas can't print a currency. a 'constitutional expert' like yourself should know that.

Really? What law says that? Private individuals can't print currency, but I'm not aware of any law that says a state owned bank can't.

Nope. But the Federal Government can apply a 10% tax to any such currency. And have.

No, actually Andrew Jackson imposed a 10% tax on branches of the Bank of the United States to kill it.

 

[bripat9643]

Nope, money is not a bill of credit. It doesn't pay interest. No money is loaned. Gold backed banknotes are a claim on a specific quantity of gold.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

You shouldn't confuse credit with bill of credit.

Bill of credit is a phrase from Article One, Section 10, Clause One of the United States Constitution. It refers to a document similar to a banknote that is issued by a government and designed to circulate as money. Because the framers of the Constitution sought to limit the issuance of currency, it explicitly prohibits the states from issuing bills of credit. The restriction of emitting bills of credit was extended to Congress as well, because the power to "emit bills and borrow money on credit" during the previous Articles of Confederation was struck out and revised in the Constitution to only "borrow money on the credit (Article I, section 8).[1]

Bill of credit - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Yep, that's a note that isn't backed by gold. Therefore it's effectively a loan to the bank. It's fiat money, on other words.

The bottom line is that before the civil war there were state banks that issued gold backed currency. That is simply an historical fact.

 

[Skylar]

No State shall...emit Bills of Credit

Bill of Credit
A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals. Money is a bill of credit, but a bill of credit need not be money. An interest-bearing certificate that was issued by Missouri, and usable in the payment of taxes, was thus ruled to be an unconstitutional bill of credit.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit. It doesn't pay interest. No money is loaned. Gold backed banknotes are a claim on a specific quantity of gold.

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

Historically and in the context of state banks, 'Bills of Credit' which were essentially proof of specie deposit a given bank. A $20 bill of credit could be exchanged for 20 dollars in say, gold or silver. They were used as a currency, representing the gold or silver without having to lug it around.

These are completely constitutional if issued from a State bank. The key case is Briscoe vs Bank of Kentucky .

A state cannot do that which the federal Constitution declares it shall not do. It cannot "coin money." Here is an act inhibited in terms so precise, that they cannot be mistaken. They are susceptible but of one construction. And it is certain that a state cannot incorporate any number of individuals, and authorize them to coin money. Such an act would be as much a violation of the Constitution as if money were coined by an officer of the state under its authority. The act being prohibited cannot be done by a state, directly or indirectly. The same rule applies to bills of credit issued by a state.

To constitute a bill of credit within the Constitution, it must be issued by a state on the faith of the state, and designed to circulate as money. It must be a paper which circulates on the credit of the state, and so received and used in the ordinary

Stater banks can't offer any legal tender backed by full faith and credit, nor coin money. But they can offer these Bills of Credit, as defined in Briscoe. They must be backed in specie and be redeemable for gold or silver upon demand.

Beyond that, they're good to go.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

You shouldn't confuse credit with bill of credit.

Bill of credit is a phrase from Article One, Section 10, Clause One of the United States Constitution. It refers to a document similar to a banknote that is issued by a government and designed to circulate as money. Because the framers of the Constitution sought to limit the issuance of currency, it explicitly prohibits the states from issuing bills of credit. The restriction of emitting bills of credit was extended to Congress as well, because the power to "emit bills and borrow money on credit" during the previous Articles of Confederation was struck out and revised in the Constitution to only "borrow money on the credit (Article I, section 8).[1]

Bill of credit - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Yep, that's a note that isn't backed by gold. Therefore it's effectively a loan to the bank. It's fiat money, on other words.

The bottom line is that before the civil war there were state banks that issued gold backed currency. That is simply an historical fact.

Do you see any difference between state issued and state-chartered bank issued?

 

[Skylar]

As long they do not conflict with Congress authority, there is nothing to keep Texas from "printing" a second currency honored by the government of Texas.

In fact, it could be a money making idea if they are prudent in its uses.

I guarantee you the feds will try to shut it down because it won't be long before all Americans are performing their transactions in the new Texas gold backed currency.

texas can't print a currency. a 'constitutional expert' like yourself should know that.

Really? What law says that? Private individuals can't print currency, but I'm not aware of any law that says a state owned bank can't.

Nope. But the Federal Government can apply a 10% tax to any such currency. And have.

No, actually Andrew Jackson imposed a 10% tax on branches of the Bank of the United States to kill it.

Irrelevant to what I'm discussing. I'm speaking of the Federal Government's ability to place a tax on state currency. See the National Banking Act of 1865-66 where a 10% tax was placed on state banks. And Veazie Bank v. Fenno that followed it where such a tax was found to be constitutional.

What Jackson did to the 2nd Bank of the United States has no relevance to what the Federal Government can do the State banks in terms of levying taxes. The Federal government can place any tax it wants on those state currencies. Reducing the practical value of any state currency at will.

 

[Skylar]

Nope, money is not a bill of credit.

The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

The above source disagrees.

It doesn't pay interest.

So what?

No money is loaned.

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

Again, so what?
It's right there in the Constitution. States can't print money.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

You shouldn't confuse credit with bill of credit.

Bill of credit is a phrase from Article One, Section 10, Clause One of the United States Constitution. It refers to a document similar to a banknote that is issued by a government and designed to circulate as money. Because the framers of the Constitution sought to limit the issuance of currency, it explicitly prohibits the states from issuing bills of credit. The restriction of emitting bills of credit was extended to Congress as well, because the power to "emit bills and borrow money on credit" during the previous Articles of Confederation was struck out and revised in the Constitution to only "borrow money on the credit (Article I, section 8).[1]

Bill of credit - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Yep, that's a note that isn't backed by gold. Therefore it's effectively a loan to the bank. It's fiat money, on other words.

The bottom line is that before the civil war there were state banks that issued gold backed currency. That is simply an historical fact.

Gold backed currencies are fine. What the state can't do is issue currency based on full faith and credit. Or mint coins. But a bill of credit fully redeemable in gold or silver?

No problem. That issue was settled in 1837. The States can totally do that. As long as they're demand bills.

 

[my2¢]

This ought to make millions for the contractors that will build the depository and leave enough for those authorizing it to profit in the form of political contributions. Everyone else will be screwed but that's how the game is played everywhere you go.

 

[bripat9643]

A bill of credit is a loan that pays interest. That's not what money is.

It says they can't mint coins. It doesn't say a thing about printing money. In fact, before the Civil War, there were numerous state banks that all printed bank notes, so your claim is obvious horseshit.

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

That is so beautifully liberal.

A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals.

Whether it pays interest or not.

Wrong. Credit is a loan. A bill of credit is a loan..

cred·it
ˈkredət/
noun
noun: credit

1. 1. the ability of a customer to obtain goods or services before payment, based on the trust that payment will be made in the future. "I've got unlimited credit"
2. the money lent or made available under a credit arrangement.

plural noun: credits
"the bank refused to extend their credit"
synonyms: loan, advance, financing;More​

You obviously don't give a damn about what words mean or what the Constitution actually says.

We usually agree, but in this case you're wrong.

That is so beautifully liberal.

Sorry, I'm the conservative guy who doesn't want the states to print money.

I'd rather have state banks issuing gold backed currency than being stuck with the funny money the federal government forces on us.

You shouldn't confuse credit with bill of credit.

Bill of credit is a phrase from Article One, Section 10, Clause One of the United States Constitution. It refers to a document similar to a banknote that is issued by a government and designed to circulate as money. Because the framers of the Constitution sought to limit the issuance of currency, it explicitly prohibits the states from issuing bills of credit. The restriction of emitting bills of credit was extended to Congress as well, because the power to "emit bills and borrow money on credit" during the previous Articles of Confederation was struck out and revised in the Constitution to only "borrow money on the credit (Article I, section 8).[1]

Bill of credit - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Yep, that's a note that isn't backed by gold. Therefore it's effectively a loan to the bank. It's fiat money, on other words.

The bottom line is that before the civil war there were state banks that issued gold backed currency. That is simply an historical fact.

Do you see any difference between state issued and state-chartered bank issued?

It's irrelevant because both issued gold backed notes.

 

[bripat9643]

This ought to make millions for the contractors that will build the depository and leave enough for those authorizing it to profit in the form of political contributions. Everyone else will be screwed but that's how the game is played everywhere you go.

How will anyone get screwed?