The definitive guide to the 2nd Amendment

[2aguy]

Compared to the decrease in the past 30 years that increase is insignificant and cannot be proven to be directly caused by guns

Concealed carry is at its highest and violent crime went up. Clearly it does not decrease crime.

IDGAF if it decreases crime and I never claimed it did but you have not proven in any way shape or form that concealed carry is a direct cause of the increased crime rates have you?

Concealed carry is at its highest and violent crime went up. Clearly it does not decrease crime.

Crime has increased in WI every year since they got concealed carry.

Moron....

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.

Crime has increased every year since getting concealed carry.

The link shows you don't know what you are saying......23.7 per 100,000 is lower than 26.27 in 1991 dumb ass....

 

[2aguy]

Make up your feeble mind. Did they stop all criminals from getting guns? Did they stop straw buyers? Hell no. By your own reasoning, nothing short of stopping that 100% is worthwhile.

No.....that is your reasoning......my way is to lock up gun criminals for 30 years.....that stops gun crime...you guys keep letting them out over and over again......you reduce the population of actual criminals who actually use guns to commit crimes....this has the incredible benefit of leaving normal, law abiding gun owners alone...

Oh shut up.

Did you think that up that reply all by yourself?

It's what I, and most others should have told your dumb ass long ago. Just shut up. Your goofy crap isn't even funny any more.

The crap got old many school shootings ago. Countries with strong gun control don't have a school shooting problem.

No....countries that don't have our mental health issues have fewer school shootings......

 

[2aguy]

It is hilarious listening to progressives whine about constitutional rights. If the U.S. is too scary for you - leave. The Castros confiscated firearms after they used them to over throw the government and take control of the people. Cuba is waiting for you.

So you like school shootings? You like our police getting shot and killed regularly? Mass shootings are a good thing?

Everything you just cited is the result of failed progressive policy. Firearms are universally banned from schools, stupid. Banned. Just like you want. How is that working out?

School shootings are a result of too many guns. The UK has strong gun control. When was their last school shooting? We have them here regularly.

They almost had 2 last year.....and it wasn't their gun control laws that stopped them, it was dumb luck......and before they banned guns.....they didn't have school shootings either.......moron.

 

[2aguy]

No it has never plummeted anywhere.

Crime has plummeted everywhere conceal carry was approved. That is a fact.

No that isn't even close to a fact. Here are the stats again:
Wisconsin Crime Rates 1960 - 2016

WI got concealed carry in 2011. Violent crime rate went from 249.9 to 305.9. And you know IL and Chicago got concealed carry right? Show me were it ever plummeted.

I’m talking outside of Wisconsin, nitwit.

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Illinois has a gang problem that isn't the same gang problem as L.A. and New YOrk.....both cities that have the same gun control laws as Chicago, but lower gun murder rates.....while Balitmore has even more extreme gun control than New York, it has a smaller population...but more gun murders than New York or L.A....

Your argument is not based in reality...

 

[2aguy]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

 

[2aguy]

When was the last school shooting in the UK?

When was the last time people in England were able to defend themselves? Oops...

Homicide and knife crime rates 'rising'

Intentional homicide rate:
UK- .92
US- 4.88

They are doing a lot better job of defending themselves than us.
List of countries by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia

Gun crime has gone up in Britain 23% across the entire country, and 42% in London all by itself......gun crime going up on an island nation that banned and confiscated guns.....the only thing their criminals don't do with their easily acquired guns is murder people...which is why you morons have to bring that data up........violent crime is going up all across Britain, and their criminals are using guns....

As to why Milwaukee has gun murder......democrat leadership...

Homicides soar in Milwaukee, along with many theories on cause

Flynn has cited lack of cooperation from witnesses, intimidation of witnesses who do cooperate, high standards for prosecution and an overwhelming workload as factors in the 2015 rate. Regardless, detectives work relentlessly to try to bring justice to families, he said. He said he couldn't vouch for how clearances were calculated before he was chief.

The Milwaukee Police Association, which represents the department's rank-and-file, has long criticized Flynn's leadership. Union president Michael Crivello says the chief's reorganization of the department deserves much of the blame for higher levels of violence and lower clearance rates.

"(An) abandonment of the fundamentals of policing have caused the out-of-control spiral of criminal behavior," Crivello said.

When no one's held accountable for a homicide, the victim's family and friends suffer, said Tory Lowe, a Milwaukee activist and Common Council candidate.

"When it goes unsolved, that anger sits right there in the community and causes a form of hopelessness," he said.

 

[2aguy]

I never carrying and am far from helpless.

You are completely helpless. I always carry a firearm and never worry about a thing. Have never been mugged, assaulted, etc. and never will be.

Yes you are so scared you need to carry a gun everywhere you go. Meanwhile:
School Shooting in Kentucky Was Nation’s 11th of Year. It Was Jan. 23.

And that is a lie......once again they are using Everytown for gun safety and they use anything they can find and call it a school shooting, including gangs shooting it out near a school and people committting suicide in the school parking lot after hours......you are such a liar.

 

[2aguy]

While crime goes up in the US, crime goes down in New York where they have stuck to strong gun control.
https://nypost.com/2018/02/06/nyc-crime-continues-to-plummet-in-2018/

And you are lying by omission...

New York's crime dropped because Rugy Guiliani cleaned up the city by arresting criminals.......and they have followed his techniques until this latest socialist showed up as mayor....

Don’t Take the Wrong Lessons from NYC’s Murder Drop

New York City’s formerly high-crime neighborhoods have experienced a stunning degree of gentrification over the last 15 years, thanks to the proactive-policing-induced conquest of crime. It is that gentrification which is now helping fuel the ongoing crime drop. Urban hipsters are flocking to areas that once were the purview of drug dealers and pimps, trailing in their wake legitimate commerce and street life, which further attracts law-abiding activity and residents in a virtuous cycle of increasing public safety.

The degree of demographic change is startling.

In Brooklyn’s Bedford-Stuyvesant neighborhood, for example, the number of white residents rose 1,235 percent from 2000 to 2015, while the black population decreased by 17 percent, reports City Lab.

In Bushwick, Brooklyn, the number of whites rose 610 percent over that same decade and a half; the black population was down 22 percent. Central Harlem’s white population rose 846 percent; the black share dropped 10 percent. In 2000, whites were about three-quarters of the black population in Brownsville-Ocean Hill; by 2015, there were twice as many whites as blacks.

In 2000, whites were one-third of the black population in Crown Heights North and Prospect Heights; now they exceed the black population by 20,000. The Brooklyn Navy Yards has now been declared the next cool place to be by the tech industry. Business owners are moving their residences as well as their enterprises to the area.


This demographic transformation has enormous implications for crime.

A black New Yorker is 50 times more likely to commit a shooting than a white New Yorker, according to perpetrator identifications provided to the police by witnesses to, and victims of, those shootings.

Those victims are overwhelmingly minority themselves.

When the racial balance of a neighborhood changes radically, given those crime disparities, its violent-crime rate will as well. (This racial crime disparity reflects the breakdown of the black family and the high percentage of black males — upwards of 80 percent in some neighborhoods — being raised by single mothers.)

----

The high-crime areas of Baltimore and Chicago have not been gentrified. Baltimore is experiencing its highest per capita murder rate for the third year in a row. While Chicago’s homicide numbers are down somewhat this year, thanks to the aggressive use of shot-spotter technology, they remain at a level far higher than in the past decad

They have strong gun control and their crime is plummeting. WI got concealed carry and crime is increasing.

Chicago has "strong gun control" too
DC has "strong gun control" so does CA

UT does not have "strong gun control" and their crime rate is lower than all of the above.

Baltimore.......

New York....

Houston has gun stores on every corner and you can openly and concealed carry guns if you are a law abiding citizen...add to that the fact it is on the border with the drug cartel nation of Mexico......and yet it has fewer gun murders than New York, Baltimore and D.C....all cities with extreme gun control..

Notice the cities below that have extreme gun control vs. Houston......

Murder rate 2017
Baltimore......343

Population of cities 2016:

Chicago........2.7 million
L.A................3.9 million
N.Y................8.5 million
Houston........2.3 million
Baltimore......620,961
Detroit...........672,795
Milwaukee.....595,647

St. Louis.......311,404

Murder rate 2016:

Chicago........765
L.A.......... .....293
N.Y................335
Houston .......301
Baltimore......318
Detroit...........303
Milwaukee.... 142

St. Louis..........188

 

[Brain357]

When was the last school shooting in the UK?

When was the last time people in England were able to defend themselves? Oops...

Homicide and knife crime rates 'rising'

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

you don't even read the articles you post do you?

"Chicago accounted for more than 20% of the nationwide murder increase in 2016, despite being home to less than 1% of the U.S. population,"

So your "strong gun control" bastion of Chicago accounted for the single largest increase in the national murder rate

Chicago has concealed carry. Hardly strong gun control.

 

[Brain357]

Concealed carry is at its highest and violent crime went up. Clearly it does not decrease crime.

IDGAF if it decreases crime and I never claimed it did but you have not proven in any way shape or form that concealed carry is a direct cause of the increased crime rates have you?

Concealed carry is at its highest and violent crime went up. Clearly it does not decrease crime.

Crime has increased in WI every year since they got concealed carry.

Moron....

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.

Crime has increased every year since getting concealed carry.

The link shows you don't know what you are saying......23.7 per 100,000 is lower than 26.27 in 1991 dumb ass....

We were discussing WI.

 

[Brain357]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

 

[Rustic]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

More frivolous gun laws increase violent crime... fact

 

[2aguy]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

No....as you can see from the link, it is lower than it was in 1991.....and the homicide rate is being driven by bad policing from bad democrat leadership....moron....just like Chicago........

Baltimore has extreme gun control......everything you morons want...from magazine bans to assault weapon bans, finger printing law abiding gun owners to waiting periods.........and a higher murder number than Milwaukee.....moron....

Moron....Baltimore has f

Murder rate 2017
Baltimore......343
Population of cities 2016:


Baltimore......620,961

Milwaukee.....595,647



Murder rate 2016:


Baltimore......318

Milwaukee.... 142

 

[2aguy]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

Moron...please.....try to actually tell the truth once in a while.......

The Ferguson effect...again....notice the year...2015....

Sheriff shreds anti-gun mayor’s excuse for crime spree



Clarke, who still lives in the city, points out that while the number of homicides in Milwaukee has shot up this year over last, one must look at a larger sample of data, not just this year over last, to get an accurate picture.

That’s because last year was a particularly safe year in Milwaukee. Homicides were down 14 percent from the year before.

“The holes in that argument are obvious. First of all, there’s an ebb and flow to crime,” Clarke told WND. “You’ll see a high period followed by a low period, and a low period will often be followed by a high. But some things remain constant, and one is the availability of guns.”

How to explain a broader drop in homicides?

So the data would appear to support Clarke’s thesis that the cause of any recent blip in violent crime is more complex than the availability of guns.

“If you look at the data, over the years violent crime has fallen, and there are more guns on the street.

But nobody ever asks Chief Flynn why there has been an increase in guns while the number of homicides went down; why is that?” Clarke asked. “You won’t see that question asked, because the media here are willing accomplices in perpetrating that myth that guns cause violence.”

 

[Skull Pilot]

When was the last school shooting in the UK?

When was the last time people in England were able to defend themselves? Oops...

Homicide and knife crime rates 'rising'

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

you don't even read the articles you post do you?

"Chicago accounted for more than 20% of the nationwide murder increase in 2016, despite being home to less than 1% of the U.S. population,"

So your "strong gun control" bastion of Chicago accounted for the single largest increase in the national murder rate

Chicago has concealed carry. Hardly strong gun control.

Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the country as does CA and the crime rate in UT which has some of the least restrictive gun laws has far less crime than either so it seems your argument is proven wrong yet again

 

[Skull Pilot]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

so what?

5 years of concealed carry: Law obscures impact

“It’s hard to create any kind of causal relationship between the law and what’s happening because we aren’t able to look specifically at the individuals who have been carrying concealed weapons,” said Jeri Bonavia, executive director of the Wisconsin Anti-Violence Effort. “When someone commits a murder, when a man shoots his wife and his kids, when shots are fired in road rage — is that person a concealed carry permit holder? We don’t know, because the law prevents us from having that information.”

so we have even more evidence that your correlation of concealed carry and crime is dubious at best

Here's a little more just for fun

“The story kind of is that there is no story,” Attorney General Brad Schimel said. “I’m not aware of evidence of statistical significance that there are people who gain a permit who are committing crime with guns … and there’s not a lot of evidence of people using guns to protect themselves or others.”

Crime stats show little change

About 320,000 Wisconsinites now have a concealed carry permit, and police outside of Milwaukee say they have seen little impact for better or worse.

“We only give permits to people who are law-abiding, who have no record of anything that disqualifies them from seeking that firearm, and those people don’t tend to commit crimes with the guns,” Schimel said.

Statewide, firearm injuries per capita rose slightly to an average of 513 after the passage of concealed carry, according to National Vital Statistics Reports from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

But that was consistent with growth in the national average, and Wisconsin’s ranking relative to the rest of the country actually dropped by one over that period.

Changes in violent crime (a category that includes murder, rape, robbery and aggravated assault) also tracked exactly with national trends, according to the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report.

Homicides in Wisconsin have been generally consistent as well. The 71 counties excluding Milwaukee County averaged a total of 37 homicides per year in the four years before 2011 and the four years after.

Milwaukee County has been a different story, seeing the number of homicides jump from an average of 68 in the four years before concealed carry to 94 in the four years after, according to death certificate tallies from the Wisconsin Department of Health Services. That spike continued this year.

James Palmer, executive director of the 10,000-member Wisconsin Professional Police Association, said he doesn’t see any connection between crime stats and the advent of concealed carry.

“Any fluctuations in crime, increase or otherwise, involve individuals utilizing guns who don’t have the lawful ability to do so,” he said.

 

[Brain357]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

No....as you can see from the link, it is lower than it was in 1991.....and the homicide rate is being driven by bad policing from bad democrat leadership....moron....just like Chicago........

Baltimore has extreme gun control......everything you morons want...from magazine bans to assault weapon bans, finger printing law abiding gun owners to waiting periods.........and a higher murder number than Milwaukee.....moron....

Moron....Baltimore has f

Murder rate 2017
Baltimore......343
Population of cities 2016:


Baltimore......620,961

Milwaukee.....595,647



Murder rate 2016:


Baltimore......318

Milwaukee.... 142

They didn't get concealed carry in 1991.

 

[Brain357]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

Moron...please.....try to actually tell the truth once in a while.......

The Ferguson effect...again....notice the year...2015....

Sheriff shreds anti-gun mayor’s excuse for crime spree



Clarke, who still lives in the city, points out that while the number of homicides in Milwaukee has shot up this year over last, one must look at a larger sample of data, not just this year over last, to get an accurate picture.

That’s because last year was a particularly safe year in Milwaukee. Homicides were down 14 percent from the year before.

“The holes in that argument are obvious. First of all, there’s an ebb and flow to crime,” Clarke told WND. “You’ll see a high period followed by a low period, and a low period will often be followed by a high. But some things remain constant, and one is the availability of guns.”

How to explain a broader drop in homicides?

So the data would appear to support Clarke’s thesis that the cause of any recent blip in violent crime is more complex than the availability of guns.

“If you look at the data, over the years violent crime has fallen, and there are more guns on the street.

But nobody ever asks Chief Flynn why there has been an increase in guns while the number of homicides went down; why is that?” Clarke asked. “You won’t see that question asked, because the media here are willing accomplices in perpetrating that myth that guns cause violence.”

Yes Ferguson happened because we have too many guns. People aren't regularly shot by police in countries with strong gun control.

 

[Brain357]

When was the last school shooting in the UK?

When was the last time people in England were able to defend themselves? Oops...

Homicide and knife crime rates 'rising'

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

you don't even read the articles you post do you?

"Chicago accounted for more than 20% of the nationwide murder increase in 2016, despite being home to less than 1% of the U.S. population,"

So your "strong gun control" bastion of Chicago accounted for the single largest increase in the national murder rate

Chicago has concealed carry. Hardly strong gun control.

Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the country as does CA and the crime rate in UT which has some of the least restrictive gun laws has far less crime than either so it seems your argument is proven wrong yet again

They have concealed carry, that is hardly very strict. You need to think again.

 

[Brain357]

How is IL and Chicago doing?

Awful...thanks to failed progressive policy. They banned firearms. How is that working out?

They have concealed carry moron. And crime is going up.

Wrong...dipstick....law abiding people carrying their legal guns is not driving the crime rate anywhere in the country, not even in Wisconsin...

Milwaukee drives the gun crime rate in Wisconsin...because their democrat mayor is mishandling the police..but even so.....it is lower than it was before they had concealed carry.....moron..

Wisconsin 2016.......

As another violent year ends, memories of homicide victims live on

Milwaukee's per capita homicide rate was 23.7 per 100,000 residents — a lower rate than the 26.27 per 100,000 residents in 1991.


“You’re seeing a rebirth:” Crime rates in Milwaukee’s Amani neighborhood down significantly

The data shows crime in 2016 compared with 2015 was down in the Amani neighborhood by 10.42%. For the city as a whole, the decline was 4.66%.

---

Over the past four years: crime in the Amani neighborhood declined 26.36% -- for the city: 10.86%.

Crime in Milwaukee has increased since getting concealed carry.

so what?

5 years of concealed carry: Law obscures impact

“It’s hard to create any kind of causal relationship between the law and what’s happening because we aren’t able to look specifically at the individuals who have been carrying concealed weapons,” said Jeri Bonavia, executive director of the Wisconsin Anti-Violence Effort. “When someone commits a murder, when a man shoots his wife and his kids, when shots are fired in road rage — is that person a concealed carry permit holder? We don’t know, because the law prevents us from having that information.”

so we have even more evidence that your correlation of concealed carry and crime is dubious at best

Here's a little more just for fun

“The story kind of is that there is no story,” Attorney General Brad Schimel said. “I’m not aware of evidence of statistical significance that there are people who gain a permit who are committing crime with guns … and there’s not a lot of evidence of people using guns to protect themselves or others.”

Crime stats show little change

About 320,000 Wisconsinites now have a concealed carry permit, and police outside of Milwaukee say they have seen little impact for better or worse.

“We only give permits to people who are law-abiding, who have no record of anything that disqualifies them from seeking that firearm, and those people don’t tend to commit crimes with the guns,” Schimel said.

Statewide, firearm injuries per capita rose slightly to an average of 513 after the passage of concealed carry, according to National Vital Statistics Reports from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

But that was consistent with growth in the national average, and Wisconsin’s ranking relative to the rest of the country actually dropped by one over that period.

Changes in violent crime (a category that includes murder, rape, robbery and aggravated assault) also tracked exactly with national trends, according to the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report.

Homicides in Wisconsin have been generally consistent as well. The 71 counties excluding Milwaukee County averaged a total of 37 homicides per year in the four years before 2011 and the four years after.

Milwaukee County has been a different story, seeing the number of homicides jump from an average of 68 in the four years before concealed carry to 94 in the four years after, according to death certificate tallies from the Wisconsin Department of Health Services. That spike continued this year.

James Palmer, executive director of the 10,000-member Wisconsin Professional Police Association, said he doesn’t see any connection between crime stats and the advent of concealed carry.

“Any fluctuations in crime, increase or otherwise, involve individuals utilizing guns who don’t have the lawful ability to do so,” he said.

Crime has increased every year since they got concealed carry. Fact.