The Dirty Little Truth About the Minimum Wage

[Boss]

Which free society specifically did you have in mind?

Ours.

 

[dblack]

A free society doesn't redistribute wealth.

Which free society specifically did you have in mind?

How about we drop platitudes and come down back to earth...what do you say?

Are you suggesting "free society" is a platitude, rather than a laudable goal?

 

[JoeB131]

Again... thank you SO much for displaying your mockery and contempt for my racial heritage. Done like only a true bigoted racist can do. I can sit here all day long accusing you of being a bigoted racist but nothing I could ever say would prove that point any more than what you just did.

That would only be true if anyone actually believed you were a Native American, Chief Running Gag...

 

[danielpalos]

Most of you, like myself, have learned about the Great Depression through the prism of public education. We were taught that FDR came into office, implemented his New Deal policies and saved the day... Right? Or, at least that's the way it is portrayed. The actual reality is quite different. As we get older and go to college, we are able to read different accounts of what happened and we learn that many of his policies actually prolonged the Great Depression. In fact, many argue that it might not have ever been a "Great" depression if not for some of the things he did early on. Some have even speculated that if not for WWII, we may have never pulled ourselves out of the death spiral we were in. All of this stuff is highly debatable but I want to focus on just one policy that FDR enacted which is still with us today, and is still being paraded around by Progressives as something great and wonderful... The Federal Minimum Wage mandate.

It is interesting to note what FDR said on the day he signed this legislation into law. He said: "no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country." That was June 16, 1933. Some 83 years later, we have Progressive politicians out there screaming the same line. So, why has this policy not effectively worked to produce what was promised 83 years ago? The Progressives will say that we just haven't raised it enough. So we ask them, how much do you think we need to raise it? They tell us and we raise it. A few years go by and we're once again having the debate and the Progressives are again claiming we didn't raise it enough. For 83 years, we've chased the carrot on the stick in hopes of attaining this elusive "living wage" that will finally solve all our problems. It never does.

In her book, The Forgotten Man: A New History of the Great Depression, author Amity Shlaes makes a revealing and scathing discovery behind the idea of the minimum wage. This is the basis of what I want to talk about here today. While we have always been taught to believe the minimum wage was FDR's attempt to force companies to pay employees a decent wage, that's not the whole truth. Yes, there were some companies exploiting the conditions at the time to profit on the backs of desperate people. We've all watched Grapes of Wrath, we all know the horror stories... Progressives are good at emoting the worst case scenarios. But there were also people like Henry Ford who paid his employees well above the national average because he wanted them to be able to afford his product.

So what is the dirty little secret the Progressives fail to mention? Well, you have to remember, after the stock market crashed in 1929, millions and millions of people were laid off. Unemployment skyrocketed across the nation. This literally affected just about every family in the country. And if you weren't a laborer who earned a paycheck, you were probably a farmer and your plight was even worse. Because of the protectionist tariffs applied by Hoover, a tariff war had devastated agriculture and then came the droughts. So everyone was in bad shape across the board. Also keep in mind, we were not a very homogeneous society back then, there was a great deal of blatant racism and discrimination. Because of the lean financial situation, a lot of capitalists were looking for the cheapest way to provide labor and they found the black man was not afraid to work long hours for meager wages. They seemed to be much more productive for the low wages they demanded... more bang for the buck.

Now here is a trivia question for you... When was the last time black unemployment was lower than white unemployment in the US? Progressives are good at feeding you the propaganda that blacks have always had historically higher unemployment than whites, but that's not true. Shlaes points out, according to the 1930 census data, black unemployment was lower than white unemployment. The implementation of the Federal Minimum Wage was quite simply a measure to improve employment for whites at the expense of blacks. The year following the implementation of this law, we find black unemployment was double that of whites. Companies were not forced to hire black people, there were no laws protecting them from discrimination at the time. So when faced with the prospect of either hiring a black man or white man at the same mandated wage, they typically went with the white man. The Minimum Wage, so proudly promoted by Progressives to this day, was an abhorrently racist policy designed to improve employment opportunity for whites over blacks and minorities.

And just as in days past, the insistence on increasing the minimum wage is doing nothing for the unskilled worker, the low-education minorities, the working poor. When a capitalist is faced with having to hire people at a higher rate, they are going to naturally look at the more-skilled, higher-educated prospects first. And the first people to get the ax when they have to cut jobs are those who are lacking in those areas. So even though we now have all kinds of laws against discrimination based on race, the minimum wage continues to be a racist policy that ensures better job opportunity for skilled whites over lesser-skilled blacks and minorities. All the while, we are being pumped full of lies and propaganda from the Progressives.

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

 

[Boss]

That would only be true if anyone actually believed you were a Native American, Chief Running Gag...

Well unfortunately, we can't really prove things online like this, so people will have to take my word for it... or not... doesn't matter to me. But the fact that you continue to mock what you think is my heritage, is revealing of your personal bigotry and racism. Even after having it pointed out to you, we see you continue to do it more. Apparently, you think this bothers me? That is even more revealing of your true character. I thank you for this gift... I could have never indicted you better.

Now, if all you intend to do is continue showing us what a racist bigot you are and what a sleazy character you have, and you don't intend to comment further on the thread OP, then I am going just ignore you. But again, thanks for confirming my point.

 

[Boss]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

 

[JoeB131]

Well unfortunately, we can't really prove things online like this, so people will have to take my word for it... or not... doesn't matter to me. But the fact that you continue to mock what you think is my heritage, is revealing of your personal bigotry and racism. Even after having it pointed out to you, we see you continue to do it more. Apparently, you think this bothers me? That is even more revealing of your true character. I thank you for this gift... I could have never indicted you better.

Naw, dude I mock you because you are a phony...

(For the record, I'm 1/8 cherokee, but I don't make a big deal about it.)

The fact is, you make up all sorts of BS Stories about being a successful business guy and being native american and all your other Walter Mitty fantasies..

Now, if all you intend to do is continue showing us what a racist bigot you are and what a sleazy character you have, and you don't intend to comment further on the thread OP, then I am going just ignore you. But again, thanks for confirming my point.

Yes, your concession, as always, is noted.

 

[Wyatt earp]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

You don't pay directly to unemployment insurance, your employer does that's why they can make up something to deny you.

 

[danielpalos]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

Just clueless and Causeless while claiming to be for the "gospel Truth"? You must be on the (semi)Religious Right.

It is about correcting for the laziness of laissez fair capitalism regarding full employment of resources in any given market; but, especially the market for labor.

A fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage competes favorably with the cost of social services; and, unemployment compensation simply for being unemployed in an at-will employment State is merely asking for equal protection of the law. However, it does correct for simple poverty and the capital effects of capitalism's, natural rate of unemployment.

You need more than propaganda.

 

[AntonToo]

A free society doesn't redistribute wealth.

Which free society specifically did you have in mind?

How about we drop platitudes and come down back to earth...what do you say?

Are you suggesting "free society" is a platitude, rather than a laudable goal?

No I'm suggesting that what you call "free society" has no grounding in reality.

 

[AntonToo]

Which free society specifically did you have in mind?

Ours.

Ours has plenty redistribution last I checked...

 

[danielpalos]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

You don't pay directly to unemployment insurance, your employer does that's why they can make up something to deny you.

Legislative incompetence is not the fault of the People. It is about equal protection of the law. Employment is at the will either party, not just the employer, in any at-will employment State.

 

[Boss]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

You don't pay directly to unemployment insurance, your employer does that's why they can make up something to deny you.

Both pay.

 

[Wyatt earp]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

You don't pay directly to unemployment insurance, your employer does that's why they can make up something to deny you.

Both pay.

No they don't, how old are you?

 

[dblack]

A free society doesn't redistribute wealth.

Which free society specifically did you have in mind?

How about we drop platitudes and come down back to earth...what do you say?

Are you suggesting "free society" is a platitude, rather than a laudable goal?

No I'm suggesting that what you call "free society" has no grounding in reality.

Well, it's an ideal. A goal. Are you saying it isn't worth pursuing?

 

[Conservative65]

So now you want some little corner where you can keep being bigots.

Says the the guy who supports racist policies and says we should hire and fire based on skin color.

I fully understand what you're saying and think JoeB is an idiot. However, JoeB is one of those that thinks it's wrong to use race to not hire/fire someone yet perfectly OK to use race as a factor to hire someone.

 

[Boss]

No they don't, how old are you?

I'm 56... yes they do... it's part of your payroll taxes. It's called SUI and it's listed on your pay stub. Now, I suppose you could SAY your employer pays it just like they pay ALL your taxes and your salary. Where else does the money come from?

 

[danielpalos]

It is why I am also advocating fourteen dollars an hour for unemployment compensation, simply for being unemployed in our at-will employment States.

Advocate for whatever... you won't ever get it. People like you are just morons. You don't seem to understand that things aren't free... money doesn't fall from the heavens... it has to be produced by someone. All things have to be paid for by someone producing and expending a portion of their life to do so. You are like a child who simply doesn't understand how things work.

Unemployment is an insurance program we created in order to help people bridge the gap between jobs, in order to make things easier for them. We collectively decided to take a small portion of our paychecks each week and set it aside for in case we ever need it. Some people may work 40-50 years and never use it. The notion that we can just write checks for whatever amount you dream up because you think that's cool.. is just plain ignorant and childlike. That would necessitate having to dramatically increase the amount taken from your check each week to cover your unemployment insurance. I'm not willing to do that and I don't think most of collective society would be willing to do that. We already have more than enough coming out of our paychecks.

So go smoke your bong and dream up some other nonsense.

You don't pay directly to unemployment insurance, your employer does that's why they can make up something to deny you.

Both pay.

depends on the State.

to be more cost effective; unemployment compensation taxes should be general taxes on Firms. thus, if they want a lower tax rate they can simply hire more people and stop whining about taxes.

 

[AntonToo]

Well, it's an ideal. A goal. Are you saying it isn't worth pursuing?

I'm saying you fellas need to come on down to planet earth and start talking about issues in a realistic way that doesn't make you look like martians.

 

[Boss]

I fully understand what you're saying and think JoeB is an idiot. However, JoeB is one of those that thinks it's wrong to use race to not hire/fire someone yet perfectly OK to use race as a factor to hire someone.

He actually admitted in another thread that he wants employers to be forced to hire based on community makeup and to be monitored by government to ensure compliance. So in order to do this, they would necessarily have to hire AND fire solely on the basis of skin color.

Under his system... if I look out there and find my community is 20% more white, I have to fire 20% of my black workers and replace them with whites. Next month, if my community is 20% more Hispanic, I have to fire the whites and hire Hispanics. Otherwise, I can't be in compliance when the government man comes around.

After this was pointed out, he tried to tapdance around with some bullshit about letting "natural attrition" take care of it... but that poses a problem with any way of enforcing compliance.

And the underlying racism of his plan is the systemic segregation it would create. As companies attempted to hire based on community makeup, the minority in the community would find it impossible to get jobs and they would be forced into communities where they were in the majority. Over time, you'd have predominately white communities... which is what JoeB is probably wanting.