The glaring evidence that Obamacare is a catastrophic FAILURE continues to mount

[Ringel05]

If only. I really believe that democrats are for America, Republicans are for Republicans.

And you would be fooling yourself because that's a clueless hack approach. Unless you never took civics you'd know why we don't have a one party system. Just because you don't agree with one side or the other doesn't make the opposite side "for themselves" or "un/anti American". One day, if you're not totally brain dead, hopefully you'll come to realize that the Dems and the Pubs are essentially the same lying, conniving, scheming, self promoting clueless pricks who happen to be on opposite sides of most issues.
Of course the one party system works great if you have no problem disenfranchising millions of fellow Americans.......... Just ask your far right adversaries, they want what you want, an America in their image......... fuck anyone who disagrees.......

I think that our two party system is essential. But right at the moment, it's been so long since Republicans have done anything positive for the country, that they are not viable here. And their response to that is only propaganda trying to drag the democrats and country down to their level of incompetence.

I see no possibility of their recovery until they disown the dixiecrats.

The good news is that they're closer than ever to doing that. The bad news is that they have no leaders.

You view your adversaries in the same way your adversaries view you. Speaks volumes, don't ya think?
Oh and given the fact the true Dixiecrats almost entirely disappeared a couple of decades ago your reference is nothing more than a far left boogyman to scare voters. You must live in a perpetual state of dizziness.........

 

[PMZ]

And you would be fooling yourself because that's a clueless hack approach. Unless you never took civics you'd know why we don't have a one party system. Just because you don't agree with one side or the other doesn't make the opposite side "for themselves" or "un/anti American". One day, if you're not totally brain dead, hopefully you'll come to realize that the Dems and the Pubs are essentially the same lying, conniving, scheming, self promoting clueless pricks who happen to be on opposite sides of most issues.
Of course the one party system works great if you have no problem disenfranchising millions of fellow Americans.......... Just ask your far right adversaries, they want what you want, an America in their image......... fuck anyone who disagrees.......

I think that our two party system is essential. But right at the moment, it's been so long since Republicans have done anything positive for the country, that they are not viable here. And their response to that is only propaganda trying to drag the democrats and country down to their level of incompetence.

I see no possibility of their recovery until they disown the dixiecrats.

The good news is that they're closer than ever to doing that. The bad news is that they have no leaders.

You view your adversaries in the same way your adversaries view you. Speaks volumes, don't ya think?
Oh and given the fact the true Dixiecrats almost entirely disappeared a couple of decades ago your reference is nothing more than a far left boogyman to scare voters. You must live in a perpetual state of dizziness.........

Your first sentence is what I want to hear. Extremists need to be shown how dysfunctional it is, but sort of fun.

If you think that dixiecrats are not running the GOP you are not paying much attention.

The Dixiecrat Party may be gone but dixiecrats have become the heart and soul of the demise of the Republican Party.

 

[Ringel05]

I think that our two party system is essential. But right at the moment, it's been so long since Republicans have done anything positive for the country, that they are not viable here. And their response to that is only propaganda trying to drag the democrats and country down to their level of incompetence.

I see no possibility of their recovery until they disown the dixiecrats.

The good news is that they're closer than ever to doing that. The bad news is that they have no leaders.

You view your adversaries in the same way your adversaries view you. Speaks volumes, don't ya think?
Oh and given the fact the true Dixiecrats almost entirely disappeared a couple of decades ago your reference is nothing more than a far left boogyman to scare voters. You must live in a perpetual state of dizziness.........

Your first sentence is what I want to hear. Extremists need to be shown how dysfunctional it is, but sort of fun.

If you think that dixiecrats are not running the GOP you are not paying much attention.

The Dixiecrat Party may be gone but dixiecrats have become the heart and soul of the demise of the Republican Party.

Again using the term Dixiecrat to define the GOP is nothing more than political stereotyping to create a boogyman among voters just like the far right uses the term Socialist to define the DNC.
Currently the GOP is partially controlled by the far right as the DNC is partially controlled by the far left. Hell, by today's liberal standards, Kennedy would be considered a Blue Dog at best. And people wonder why our government is so dysfunctional.
Personally I have no problem with it, for the most part (barring the ACA implementation and the shutdown) neither extreme has the upper hand and any real damage they can do is relatively minimized.
Until the mainsteam moderates retake control of both parties my hope is they keep canceling each other out.

 

[PMZ]

When I first took up this hobby, deluded conservatives posted constantly things that their hobby, absorbing Republican propaganda, had them presuming were true, that simply were unsupported by evidence.

That conservatism is fiscally responsible.

That America is not a democracy.

That we are a failure and the cause is too much government.

That we do not follow the Constitution.

That we should hold Obama accountable for the impact of Bush's policies.

That there was a connection between Bush's holy wars and 9/11.

That Sarah Palin was a qualified public servant.

And many others.

I think that democrats just were being way too polite about calling those spades, spades.

So I did.

 

[Ringel05]

When I first took up this hobby, deluded conservatives posted constantly things that their hobby, absorbing Republican propaganda, had them presuming were true, that simply were unsupported by evidence.

That conservatism is fiscally responsible.

That America is not a democracy.

That we are a failure and the cause is too much government.

That we do not follow the Constitution.

That we should hold Obama accountable for the impact of Bush's policies.

That there was a connection between Bush's holy wars and 9/11.

That Sarah Palin was a qualified public servant.

And many others.

I think that democrats just were being way too polite about calling those spades, spades.

So I did.

You do realize that's non-objective, partisan opinion..... right?

 

[PMZ]

When I first took up this hobby, deluded conservatives posted constantly things that their hobby, absorbing Republican propaganda, had them presuming were true, that simply were unsupported by evidence.

That conservatism is fiscally responsible.

That America is not a democracy.

That we are a failure and the cause is too much government.

That we do not follow the Constitution.

That we should hold Obama accountable for the impact of Bush's policies.

That there was a connection between Bush's holy wars and 9/11.

That Sarah Palin was a qualified public servant.

And many others.

I think that democrats just were being way too polite about calling those spades, spades.

So I did.

You do realize that's non-objective, partisan opinion..... right?

Pick one. Let's debate it.

 

[PMZ]

You view your adversaries in the same way your adversaries view you. Speaks volumes, don't ya think?
Oh and given the fact the true Dixiecrats almost entirely disappeared a couple of decades ago your reference is nothing more than a far left boogyman to scare voters. You must live in a perpetual state of dizziness.........

Your first sentence is what I want to hear. Extremists need to be shown how dysfunctional it is, but sort of fun.

If you think that dixiecrats are not running the GOP you are not paying much attention.

The Dixiecrat Party may be gone but dixiecrats have become the heart and soul of the demise of the Republican Party.

Again using the term Dixiecrat to define the GOP is nothing more than political stereotyping to create a boogyman among voters just like the far right uses the term Socialist to define the DNC.
Currently the GOP is partially controlled by the far right as the DNC is partially controlled by the far left. Hell, by today's liberal standards, Kennedy would be considered a Blue Dog at best. And people wonder why our government is so dysfunctional.
Personally I have no problem with it, for the most part (barring the ACA implementation and the shutdown) neither extreme has the upper hand and any real damage they can do is relatively minimized.
Until the mainsteam moderates retake control of both parties my hope is they keep canceling each other out.

There is no evidence that the Democrats have moved even an inch to the left. There's overwhelming evidence that dixiecrats are right wing extremists and always have been.

What's changed is that somehow, I think from Fox Republican propaganda, the dixiecrats now run the GOP.

I've always been a registered Republican even though that party left me in the 60s. My parents were delegates at several Republican National Conventions. I knew the party of business well. The present devolution is not remotely as competent. In fact it's anti-American.

To call someone's beliefs prejudiced is an attempt to imply they are not objective. That implication has absolutely no impact on reality. Some opinions are, some aren't, and you don't get to make that call. You can offer evidence, you can debate the evidence, but not judge prejudice in the absence of evidence and debate.

 

[Antares]

Yep. ACA cements them in place via legal mandate. Resistance is futile.

If they were in force before ACA than they are unrelated to ACA.

Try to follow along. ACA makes it impossible for us to escape. It cruelly grabs all the people who were beginning to wake up, beginning to see just what a scam it all is, and forces them to the yoke. It sells us out to the insurance industry and makes it impossible for us to explore alternatives without permission from our government - government infested with the controlling influence of said corporations.

He doesn't care to follow along, he wants to ask a question and either deflect or dictate the answer....truth for PMZ can ONLY be true if HE believes it to be true.

Thats why he never gives a straight answer, only another question.

 

[PMZ]

If they were in force before ACA than they are unrelated to ACA.

Try to follow along. ACA makes it impossible for us to escape. It cruelly grabs all the people who were beginning to wake up, beginning to see just what a scam it all is, and forces them to the yoke. It sells us out to the insurance industry and makes it impossible for us to explore alternatives without permission from our government - government infested with the controlling influence of said corporations.

He doesn't care to follow along, he wants to ask a question and either deflect or dictate the answer....truth for PMZ can ONLY be true if HE believes it to be true.

Thats why he never gives a straight answer, only another question.

I'm a sucker for evidence, and you're a sucker for propaganda that tells you that what you want to be true, is.

You're being given every day what you want.

But you still spend all day whining.

Hard to understand.

 

[Ringel05]

When I first took up this hobby, deluded conservatives posted constantly things that their hobby, absorbing Republican propaganda, had them presuming were true, that simply were unsupported by evidence.

That conservatism is fiscally responsible.

That America is not a democracy.

That we are a failure and the cause is too much government.

That we do not follow the Constitution.

That we should hold Obama accountable for the impact of Bush's policies.

That there was a connection between Bush's holy wars and 9/11.

That Sarah Palin was a qualified public servant.

And many others.

I think that democrats just were being way too polite about calling those spades, spades.

So I did.

You do realize that's non-objective, partisan opinion..... right?

Pick one. Let's debate it.

I won't debate the first one because it's a mixed bag.
The second one will probably end up in a debate concerning semantics but, by definition, the US is a democratic, representative republic, an offshoot of democracy.
Number three is a matter of opinion where both sides use select statistics to make their points.
To the best of my knowledge when Obama became president he inherited (and continued) many of the Bush policies. That he was elected to "fix" the problems makes him now responsible as it would be if a Republican was elected president.
The term you used, "Bush's holy wars", speaks absolute volumes........ No, it was eventually discovered the intel was bad, we relied on allies without doing our own intel and Sadam didn't help by continuing to allude he had such weapons. A lot went on that your simplistic assessment completely discounts.
I know of no requirement in the constitution that says a public servant has to take specific courses or has to have specific experience to run for or hold office. If that were the case 99.9% of all politicians would be out of a job.
So you see, your opinion is a non-objective, hyper partisan viewpoint.

 

[Ringel05]

Your first sentence is what I want to hear. Extremists need to be shown how dysfunctional it is, but sort of fun.

If you think that dixiecrats are not running the GOP you are not paying much attention.

The Dixiecrat Party may be gone but dixiecrats have become the heart and soul of the demise of the Republican Party.

Again using the term Dixiecrat to define the GOP is nothing more than political stereotyping to create a boogyman among voters just like the far right uses the term Socialist to define the DNC.
Currently the GOP is partially controlled by the far right as the DNC is partially controlled by the far left. Hell, by today's liberal standards, Kennedy would be considered a Blue Dog at best. And people wonder why our government is so dysfunctional.
Personally I have no problem with it, for the most part (barring the ACA implementation and the shutdown) neither extreme has the upper hand and any real damage they can do is relatively minimized.
Until the mainsteam moderates retake control of both parties my hope is they keep canceling each other out.

There is no evidence that the Democrats have moved even an inch to the left. There's overwhelming evidence that dixiecrats are right wing extremists and always have been.

What's changed is that somehow, I think from Fox Republican propaganda, the dixiecrats now run the GOP.

I've always been a registered Republican even though that party left me in the 60s. My parents were delegates at several Republican National Conventions. I knew the party of business well. The present devolution is not remotely as competent. In fact it's anti-American.

To call someone's beliefs prejudiced is an attempt to imply they are not objective. That implication has absolutely no impact on reality. Some opinions are, some aren't, and you don't get to make that call. You can offer evidence, you can debate the evidence, but not judge prejudice in the absence of evidence and debate.

True, hyper-partisan hacks would obviously discount the evidence right before their eyes. A simple look at the last 40 years will prove my point if one is willing to look objectively.

 

[P@triot]

There is no evidence that the Democrats have moved even an inch to the left.

You're right - there is no evidence that Dumbocrats have moved an inch to the left. The evidence shows they've moved 300,000 miles to the left. Barack Obama is a radical marxist and you know it. He knows it.

Here is the golden boy of your party - JFK himself - saying the exact same thing that causes assholes like you to label the Tea Party as "radical" for saying:

[ame=http://youtu.be/aEdXrfIMdiU]Income Tax Cut, JFK Hopes To Spur Economy 1962/8/13 - YouTube[/ame]

 

[RKMBrown]

ACA has no impact on the total cost of health care in the country. Right?

Same people except for the poor going to the Dr's instead of the emergency room.

I think a lot of what's going on are companies lowering compensation more by backing away from employer researched and subsidized health care insurance.

Semantics.
God this is weak.

The ACA is responsible for the DRAMATIC rise in "INSURANCE" costs...get the fuck over yourself moron.

Where is that dramatic rise going to? And for what?

I think that the dramatic rise has been in Republican propaganda because they've alienated everyone but the cult.

You are a pos lying prick. I was just told my insurance premiums are going up 75% under this dumb ass bill you retarded democrats are shoving up our asses.

 

[P@triot]

Someday Obamacare will be a widely regarded improvement to our past inept, expensive health care insurance non-system.

Fact: We have the #1 healthcare system in the world. The wealthiest from around the world fly to the United States for their healthcare.

Fact: Even the Dumbocrats own most overblown statics claim that 30 million Americans didn't have health insurance. That means over 100,000,000 Americans had coverage. Or, for Dumbocrats not capable of dealing with large numbers, over 91% of America. So in essence, while the overwhelming majority of Americans had exactly what they needed, Dumbocrats in true communist fashion fucked up the entire system for the fringe 9% of asshats who would rather shoot up heroin than hold a job.

Fact: PMZ was challenged 30 pages and two weeks ago why Obamacare explicitly outlaws and penalizes "cadillac plans" when the Dumbocrats claim the entire point of Obamacare is to create quality, affordable healthcare (which is exactly what a cadillac plan is).

The fact that PMZ would claim our system was "inept" in light of these indisputable facts shows how profoundly ignorant he is - and thus unqualified to discuss healthcare. He's a partisan hack looking to be a parasite who mooches off of his fellow citizen.

 

[P@triot]

Semantics.
God this is weak.

The ACA is responsible for the DRAMATIC rise in "INSURANCE" costs...get the fuck over yourself moron.

Where is that dramatic rise going to? And for what?

I think that the dramatic rise has been in Republican propaganda because they've alienated everyone but the cult.

You are a pos lying prick. I was just told my insurance premiums are going up 75% under this dumb ass bill you retarded democrats are shoving up our asses.

Of course he's a lying piece of shit prick - he's a Dumbocrat. If he were to tell the truth, the "debate" would be over in 3 seconds. We all know the healthcare is not one of the 18 enumerated powers of the federal government. Therefore if he were to be honest once in his miserable life, all we would have to say is "Constitution" and the discussion would be over.

When you're on the wrong side of the facts, lies are all you have...

 

[RKMBrown]

Where is that dramatic rise going to? And for what?

I think that the dramatic rise has been in Republican propaganda because they've alienated everyone but the cult.

You are a pos lying prick. I was just told my insurance premiums are going up 75% under this dumb ass bill you retarded democrats are shoving up our asses.

Of course he's a lying piece of shit prick - he's a Dumbocrat. If he were to tell the truth, the "debate" would be over in 3 seconds. We all know the healthcare is not one of the 18 enumerated powers of the federal government. Therefore if he were to be honest once in his miserable life, all we would have to say is "Constitution" and the discussion would be over.

When you're on the wrong side of the facts, lies are all you have...

Screw Obama. I'm dropping my insurance. Screw you democrats that foisted this nightmare on us. I'll pay cash from here on.

 

[Barbarap]

[/QUOTE]
Screw Obama. I'm dropping my insurance. Screw you democrats that foisted this nightmare on us. I'll pay cash from here on.[/QUOTE]

Good luck. Hope you know where the nearest soup kitchen is.

 

[Antares]

Try to follow along. ACA makes it impossible for us to escape. It cruelly grabs all the people who were beginning to wake up, beginning to see just what a scam it all is, and forces them to the yoke. It sells us out to the insurance industry and makes it impossible for us to explore alternatives without permission from our government - government infested with the controlling influence of said corporations.

He doesn't care to follow along, he wants to ask a question and either deflect or dictate the answer....truth for PMZ can ONLY be true if HE believes it to be true.

Thats why he never gives a straight answer, only another question.

I'm a sucker for evidence, and you're a sucker for propaganda that tells you that what you want to be true, is.

You're being given every day what you want.

But you still spend all day whining.

Hard to understand.

LOL, you don't give a shit aboutany evidence, you either ignore it when given or simply say "nuh-uh".

You have no idea as to what you speak of...you have one goal...and that is to try and make everyone believe that you are as smart as you think you are.

You look stupid, plain and simply.

 

[PMZ]

You do realize that's non-objective, partisan opinion..... right?

Pick one. Let's debate it.

I won't debate the first one because it's a mixed bag.
The second one will probably end up in a debate concerning semantics but, by definition, the US is a democratic, representative republic, an offshoot of democracy.
Number three is a matter of opinion where both sides use select statistics to make their points.
To the best of my knowledge when Obama became president he inherited (and continued) many of the Bush policies. That he was elected to "fix" the problems makes him now responsible as it would be if a Republican was elected president.
The term you used, "Bush's holy wars", speaks absolute volumes........ No, it was eventually discovered the intel was bad, we relied on allies without doing our own intel and Sadam didn't help by continuing to allude he had such weapons. A lot went on that your simplistic assessment completely discounts.
I know of no requirement in the constitution that says a public servant has to take specific courses or has to have specific experience to run for or hold office. If that were the case 99.9% of all politicians would be out of a job.
So you see, your opinion is a non-objective, hyper partisan viewpoint.

I thought that you were going to pick one to debate. Instead I got a partisan rant with zero facts and evidence. You made my point better than I did.

 

[beagle9]

Someday Obamacare will be a widely regarded improvement to our past inept, expensive health care insurance non-system.

Fact: We have the #1 healthcare system in the world. The wealthiest from around the world fly to the United States for their healthcare.

Fact: Even the Dumbocrats own most overblown statics claim that 30 million Americans didn't have health insurance. That means over 100,000,000 Americans had coverage. Or, for Dumbocrats not capable of dealing with large numbers, over 91% of America. So in essence, while the overwhelming majority of Americans had exactly what they needed, Dumbocrats in true communist fashion fucked up the entire system for the fringe 9% of asshats who would rather shoot up heroin than hold a job.

Fact: PMZ was challenged 30 pages and two weeks ago why Obamacare explicitly outlaws and penalizes "cadillac plans" when the Dumbocrats claim the entire point of Obamacare is to create quality, affordable healthcare (which is exactly what a cadillac plan is).

The fact that PMZ would claim our system was "inept" in light of these indisputable facts shows how profoundly ignorant he is - and thus unqualified to discuss healthcare. He's a partisan hack looking to be a parasite who mooches off of his fellow citizen.

Hmm, so if I can only afford the basic plan instead of the Cadillac plan, then what does this mean for me ?
Does it mean that if someone walks into the door of a health treatment facility with something ailing them, and they have the Cadillac plan but I have the basic plan, then will they get life saving treatment immediately and without delay, but rather I will have to sit in the waiting room for hours with the possibility of becoming sicker as I sit there, and maybe even becoming critical due the access being based on one plan verses another plan in which is interpreted by the health care provider as such when they are processing me in with the other person in this way ?

Shouldn't it be that everyone who is an American, should have equal access to health care as Americans together, where as we are all treated alike as human beings when we get sick, otherwise instead of having this class system operating in the health care industry as it had been over time ?

How can we get beyond the one person is better treated than another is, and all because of the differences being found now in affordable and/or not so affordable health care plans along with the care one receives due to those plans ?