The Lazy Poor

[koshergrl]

He doesn't "make" $445 a month. He RECEIVES $445 a month. There's a difference.

And the youngest is in a place that costs thousands of dollars a month...that you don't pay for, and neither does he.

You can't find a job because you refuse to move where work is, compounded by the fact that your work history is sketchy and your skills are probably nil.

We see the same people. You just see them differently because you're one of them.

Yes, it costs the state thousands for the placement of my son. You know what? They also provide him with psychiatric care, physical therapy and behavioral therapy, none of which they would provide him at home. In fact, they wouldn't provide 24/7 care for my son at home, if they would, it would have saved them $thousands. My husband has Parkinson's and I have health problems, we are getting too old to handle him. He's ripped out walls in this house including the two in the bathroom we only just now got the money to fix. Do you know how old he was when we decided to look for a place for him? 20. Do you know how old he was when he was finally placed? 24, and then only after I had threatened suicide. I still don't know if I was serious or not. You deal with a child who is low functioning autistic, still in diapers, wets the bed every night and occasionally gets violent and see how well your health takes it. What the hell did you expect us to do? Wait until he killed one of us? Now he gets the help he needs and he even visits twice a week. He's much calmer and happier, as are we. I'm sorry your tax dollars are going to help take care of him.

As for $445 dollar a month, you try living off of that, I dare you! He's special needs, what do you expect him to do, die and stop costing the tax payers money?

My work history is sketchy because I have two special needs kids. You ever try to work while taking care of two special needs kids? We are not talking about kids who can take care of them selves, one of them still can't go to the bathroom by himself and he's 25.

I've pointed out that there were doctors that got medicaid and disability for their special needs children when I didn't for mine until they were over 18 because I don't lie and you have the nerve to say I'm one of the lazy poor? That I lie to get benefits? How dare you! Who the hell do you think you are? I hope they fire your lazy judgmental ass because you sure as hell need to be in another line of work.

You know what else? Yeah, you just succeeded in insulting me and my children for no good reason and you made me mad. Congrats, you've made MY ignore list and unlike Poet, when I put you on ignore I really ignore you. I know it doesn't mean anything to you but it sure as hell makes me feel better. I hope someone else lambastes you for your lack of empathy. You deserve to be taken down more than a notch or two. And you are in the wrong job. You've gotten burned out and the people who come to you for help, they deserve better. GOODBYE, Have a nice life.

I don't care. You are one of the "gimme" class that is responsible for the mess we're in. It's sad and hard that your family has issues. All families have issues. But your attitude that it's somebody ELSE'S responsibility is disgusting. I don't expect the state to provide my children with enough money to live on. I don't care what's going on with them. If they received it, I would be grateful, not resentful that it's not more. Because it would alleviate my own burden, that is rightfully mine, bestowed upon me the day I got pregnant, to provide for my own. It's a GIFT. You don't snarl and sneer at gifts, you ungrateful hag.

 

[High_Gravity]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

Do we have enough employment for everyone thats out of work? thats a big issue.You can't even just up and join the Military anymore because their down sizing.

 

[koshergrl]

PS...my work has been taking care of special needs kids, and I have worked and been the sole support for my own family while supporting a special needs kid. Without any child support or welfare. So shut the fuck up.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

Do we have enough employment for everyone thats out of work? thats a big issue.You can't even just up and join the Military anymore because their down sizing.

How about starting your own? Someone within these poor communities needs to do just that and hire more poor.

 

[Againsheila]

I wouldn't.......but then my job isn't to determine who would qualify for government assitance. If it WERE my job, their willingness to get an education, job training and work to support themselves when given the opportunity as opposed to those who want to be supported like their parents and grandparents before them for doing nothing but existing would be a fairly large clue of which is which though. Those who won't use assistance to better themselves and believe they deserve assisatance for life.......the lazy poor......should be cut off. It's called tough love.

They are a much smaller percentage of those on welfare than you think.

That's no excuse to not sort out and remove those who would waste valuable resources provided at other people's expense. For every penny provided in aid, it's a penny taken from someone else who earned it.

I'll agree with you, but I don't like that because a few abuse the privileged, everyone pays the price.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

There is no real poverty in America.

.

That would be proof that the LIBERAL war on poverty has been victorious.

A war that CONSERVATIVES would have kept us out of.

That would depend upon who is "sustaining" their lifestyle, the government or have they begun EARNING their own way of life OUT of poverty on their own? A victorious war on poverty is only achieved where there is less of a growing need for government dependency. Can any such case be found towards LESS government dependency among those of the poor?

 

[Claudette]

He doesn't "make" $445 a month. He RECEIVES $445 a month. There's a difference.

And the youngest is in a place that costs thousands of dollars a month...that you don't pay for, and neither does he.

You can't find a job because you refuse to move where work is, compounded by the fact that your work history is sketchy and your skills are probably nil.

We see the same people. You just see them differently because you're one of them.

Yes, it costs the state thousands for the placement of my son. You know what? They also provide him with psychiatric care, physical therapy and behavioral therapy, none of which they would provide him at home. In fact, they wouldn't provide 24/7 care for my son at home, if they would, it would have saved them $thousands. My husband has Parkinson's and I have health problems, we are getting too old to handle him. He's ripped out walls in this house including the two in the bathroom we only just now got the money to fix. Do you know how old he was when we decided to look for a place for him? 20. Do you know how old he was when he was finally placed? 24, and then only after I had threatened suicide. I still don't know if I was serious or not. You deal with a child who is low functioning autistic, still in diapers, wets the bed every night and occasionally gets violent and see how well your health takes it. What the hell did you expect us to do? Wait until he killed one of us? Now he gets the help he needs and he even visits twice a week. He's much calmer and happier, as are we. I'm sorry your tax dollars are going to help take care of him.

As for $445 dollar a month, you try living off of that, I dare you! He's special needs, what do you expect him to do, die and stop costing the tax payers money?

My work history is sketchy because I have two special needs kids. You ever try to work while taking care of two special needs kids? We are not talking about kids who can take care of them selves, one of them still can't go to the bathroom by himself and he's 25.

I've pointed out that there were doctors that got medicaid and disability for their special needs children when I didn't for mine until they were over 18 because I don't lie and you have the nerve to say I'm one of the lazy poor? That I lie to get benefits? How dare you! Who the hell do you think you are? I hope they fire your lazy judgmental ass because you sure as hell need to be in another line of work.

You know what else? Yeah, you just succeeded in insulting me and my children for no good reason and you made me mad. Congrats, you've made MY ignore list and unlike Poet, when I put you on ignore I really ignore you. I know it doesn't mean anything to you but it sure as hell makes me feel better. I hope someone else lambastes you for your lack of empathy. You deserve to be taken down more than a notch or two. And you are in the wrong job. You've gotten burned out and the people who come to you for help, they deserve better. GOODBYE, Have a nice life.

I don't care. You are one of the "gimme" class that is responsible for the mess we're in. It's sad and hard that your family has issues. All families have issues. But your attitude that it's somebody ELSE'S responsibility is disgusting. I don't expect the state to provide my children with enough money to live on. I don't care what's going on with them. If they received it, I would be grateful, not resentful that it's not more. Because it would alleviate my own burden, that is rightfully mine, bestowed upon me the day I got pregnant, to provide for my own. It's a GIFT. You don't snarl and sneer at gifts, you ungrateful hag.

Personally I have no problem helping those who are truly mentally or physically Handicapped. Thats a tough row to hoe for anyone. One would think there would be a little gratitude in there though. After all she's living on someone elses money.

I do agree K that she seems to bellyache that its not enough. It should be more. Never mind that its somebody elses money. She just wants more of it to make her life easier and I'm sure she could care who busts ass to make that money.

She sounds like the freeloaders who take our money, never worry about having to pay it back. After all its free.

 

[koshergrl]

The best way to cure dependency is to remove whatever it is that people are dependent upon.

People are resourceful, smart and tough. Remove the benefits, they will scramble and you will be amazed at how well they do.

 

[Claudette]

The best way to cure dependency is to remove whatever it is that people are dependent upon.

People are resourceful, smart and tough. Remove the benefits, they will scramble and you will be amazed at how well they do.

I agree.

Back in the 90's when they cut back on Welfare they all survived.

Let the free ride come to a screeching halt and sit back and see how long it takes people to take care of themselves.

Why? Because they will have not choice.

 

[Againsheila]

Another thing about my special needs son who is in a living situation, it's a non-profit organization. When he first moved in, they would send me a statement every month as to how much he cost them, how much money was spent on him, etc. I would pay the difference. The program manager told me we weren't responsible for any of that money and not to worry about it. That they just kept the debts and added them up for their own bookkeeping purposes. I still kept paying them, then they stopped coming. I think the program manager stepped in and decided that we shouldn't be paying that. Probably thought I did enough for them anyway as I go through my network whenever they need something and I've come up with furniture and housing supplies for them when they've needed it. I also arranged for some of them to attend the play at our local theatre last Christmas. It was tough but I got the theatre manager to donate the tickets. I work at the theatre as the house manager and volunteer program coordinator along with my friend. We put in a lot of unpaid hours there. Last Christmas we were working 5 days a week, sometimes 13 hours a day and all for no pay. I guess donating those 15 tickets to a non profit organization was the least the theatre manager could do for me. I, in turn got the whole thing published in the local paper, free publicity for the theatre, and I took the picture that was published,and wrote the article. Newspaper writer and photographer can be added to the number of jobs for which I'm not paid, but of course, I'm the lazy, lying poor so that's probably not worth mentioning.

You have my complete admiration Sheila for I can't imagine having as much on your plate as you do or coping with what you have had to cope with for a very long time now. And as I recall, your own health isn't the best either. And despite it all you do spend a good deal of time helping out others less fortunate and volunteering elsewhere in your community. Am I going to fault you or accuse you for ANYTHING or ANY choices you have made in your life? No way.

But your circumstances are pretty unique in the world of those who need help. And because of the infrequency and rareness of your situation, it simply does not accommodate a one-size-fits-all remedy.

There is a world of difference in your situation that is not caused in any way by any choice you conciously made, and in that of those who chose not to stay in school, who chose not to acquire marketable skills and knowledge, who chose to have kids without benefit of marriage, who squandered their resources and future with illegal substances and illegal activities, etc. etc. etc.

A compassionate society takes care of the truly helpless.

A compassionate society does not reward poor choices, bad behavior, and intentional failure and thereby encourage more of it.

Actually, there are a lot of people in a bad situation today through no fault of their own. Our economy is not strong and our jobs have been shipped overseas. Some people have managed to create the own business to make up for it in these hard times but not everyone is capable of that. My brother in law who has a PhD and was laid of from his job as Vice President in a company has only recently been making money from the new business he started and he was laid off years ago. My sister meanwhile has had to take a minimum wage job just to get health insurance for them. These are people who were in the top 10% of our economy just 10 years ago. If they hadn't been investing wisely, they would have lost everything, a lot of people did.

Like I said, two women at the church, both with Bachelors degrees and they don't make enough to live on without help. One of them helps out at the theatre with us. She does a good job and she's always looking for more work. She has her food handler's permit and her alcohol license and she still can't find enough work. My friend has hired to her teach a group of students from Japan this summer. She even has her ESL certificate and though she does teach ESL, it's on a volunteer basis also. NO JOBS people. We are in a desperate situation here than none of you seem to understand because you haven't been out there looking.

 

[Againsheila]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

I'm beginning to think that's what the majority wants.

 

[koshergrl]

Yes, it costs the state thousands for the placement of my son. You know what? They also provide him with psychiatric care, physical therapy and behavioral therapy, none of which they would provide him at home. In fact, they wouldn't provide 24/7 care for my son at home, if they would, it would have saved them $thousands. My husband has Parkinson's and I have health problems, we are getting too old to handle him. He's ripped out walls in this house including the two in the bathroom we only just now got the money to fix. Do you know how old he was when we decided to look for a place for him? 20. Do you know how old he was when he was finally placed? 24, and then only after I had threatened suicide. I still don't know if I was serious or not. You deal with a child who is low functioning autistic, still in diapers, wets the bed every night and occasionally gets violent and see how well your health takes it. What the hell did you expect us to do? Wait until he killed one of us? Now he gets the help he needs and he even visits twice a week. He's much calmer and happier, as are we. I'm sorry your tax dollars are going to help take care of him.

As for $445 dollar a month, you try living off of that, I dare you! He's special needs, what do you expect him to do, die and stop costing the tax payers money?

My work history is sketchy because I have two special needs kids. You ever try to work while taking care of two special needs kids? We are not talking about kids who can take care of them selves, one of them still can't go to the bathroom by himself and he's 25.

I've pointed out that there were doctors that got medicaid and disability for their special needs children when I didn't for mine until they were over 18 because I don't lie and you have the nerve to say I'm one of the lazy poor? That I lie to get benefits? How dare you! Who the hell do you think you are? I hope they fire your lazy judgmental ass because you sure as hell need to be in another line of work.

You know what else? Yeah, you just succeeded in insulting me and my children for no good reason and you made me mad. Congrats, you've made MY ignore list and unlike Poet, when I put you on ignore I really ignore you. I know it doesn't mean anything to you but it sure as hell makes me feel better. I hope someone else lambastes you for your lack of empathy. You deserve to be taken down more than a notch or two. And you are in the wrong job. You've gotten burned out and the people who come to you for help, they deserve better. GOODBYE, Have a nice life.

I don't care. You are one of the "gimme" class that is responsible for the mess we're in. It's sad and hard that your family has issues. All families have issues. But your attitude that it's somebody ELSE'S responsibility is disgusting. I don't expect the state to provide my children with enough money to live on. I don't care what's going on with them. If they received it, I would be grateful, not resentful that it's not more. Because it would alleviate my own burden, that is rightfully mine, bestowed upon me the day I got pregnant, to provide for my own. It's a GIFT. You don't snarl and sneer at gifts, you ungrateful hag.

Personally I have no problem helping those who are truly mentally or physically Handicapped. Thats a tough row to hoe for anyone. One would think there was a little gratitude in there thoughfor the fact that she is living on someone elses money.

I do agree K that she seems to bellyache that its not enough. It should be more. Never mind that its somebody elses money. She just wants more of it to make her life easier and I'm sure she could care who busts ass to make that money.

She sounds like the freeloaders who take our money, never worry about having to pay it back. After all its free.

I can't tell you how many whackos I've had sitting across the desk from me telling me all the reasons they can't work, and explaining all the reasons why their kids are *different*. They actually cripple their own kids in order to excuse their own laziness. They groom them from infancy to be moronic, imbecilic, they run after every diagnosis that they can find or make up and dope the shit out of them...so that they can draw ssi and ultimately sponge off the system entirely.

I also can't tell you how many women I've had sit across t he table from me and whine "I'm a stay at home mom". Well, maybe you were a stay-at-home mom in ANOTHER life, but in THIS life, you had kids with a loser, so guess what? Now you're a WORKING mom. Or should be. Yes, your children will suffer for your lack of discrimination in the past. That's life, get over it and move on, and work harder than you ever dreamed you would have to, or watch your children falter and fail.

I have nothing but sympathy and empathy for mothers who have disabled children, who work tirelessly for their children. But I have nothing for disdain for idiots who create sponges so that they can be sponges themselves. If I was constantly *fighting* to get money for my kids and nobody was forthcoming with it, guess what? I'd GET A FUCKING JOB. If I couldn't find one where I lived, I'd pick up and move where I could work. If I had a house that I owned then I'd sell it or rent it out, and take my happy ass to a place where I could work.

See how that works? It's a completely alien concept to most of the women who have spent their entire lives finding ways to get more out of the system.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Will making robot help feed the poor? Meaning doing our farming can allow us to give them the food. This and improving education is the solution.

 

[koshergrl]

We have enough food. It's not scarcity of food that is the problem.

It's over regulation that means that everything is priced out of range.

 

[Foxfyre]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

Do we have enough employment for everyone thats out of work? thats a big issue.You can't even just up and join the Military anymore because their down sizing.

The government seems to be doing its damndest to downgrade the dollar, increase unemployment, and step up the misery index for whatever reason. The reason is probably best addressed on a different thread focusing on that though.

But it isn't that difficult to start your own service business if you have the expertise and access to the customers for whatever service you offer. My hubby and I did it with a minimal amount of initial investment capital needed. But we brought the expertise to our business and business savvy in how to manage the mountain of government paperwork, rules, and regs nvolved. Without that, we would not have had any chance to be successful.

We have a lot of folks going door to door here, leaving cards stuck on gates or into the door, advertising various services from tree trimming to yard cleanup to repainting the house number on the curb, etc. A few hundred business cards can be had for very little and there are lots of folks who need basic chores around their places done. We don't hire such people for inside jobs--I want references and sometimes bonding for those we allow into our home to work--but we have often hired them to do basic yard clean up, wash exterior windows, scrub down the walks and driveway, etc. Helps them out and helps us out.

My sister and her husband once were part owners of and manager of a Super 8 Motel. After they sold out their interest, my sister hired one of their former, and then unemployed, maids to clean her house. This gal was a go getter, very pleasant to have around, and honest as the day is long. So I started using her too. And recommended her to others. So she hired another gal to work with her so they together could work more quickly and handle more houses. As her business, through word of mouth grew, she hired others. And now she has a full fledged professional cleaning service with several superbly trained crews and she doesn't have to clean houses any more. She just manages the business. I can't afford her any more, but she remains a good friend.

When we have the character and work ethic and the ability to provide a service or product that others need, and aren't too proud to do what we have to do to support ourselves, very few people have to be completely destitute.

 

[Againsheila]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

I can go with that. I have no problem in requiring those who can work to actually work, I think it's better for them and for us. Like I said, unemployment for those who are looking for work and disability for those who can't work. If you can't find a job after a certain amount of time, we retrain you and if you still can't find a job, we put you to work until you do find a job, or until you are old enough that retirement is your only option.

 

[kwc57]

They are a much smaller percentage of those on welfare than you think.

That's no excuse to not sort out and remove those who would waste valuable resources provided at other people's expense. For every penny provided in aid, it's a penny taken from someone else who earned it.

I'll agree with you, but I don't like that because a few abuse the privileged, everyone pays the price.

It's more than a few. Don't buy into the liberal hype. Their intent is to keep people dependent on them and buy votes thru entitlements to stay in power.

Case Worker: Illegal Aliens Got Food Stamps by the ?Vanload? | Judicial Watch

 

[koshergrl]

Lets just hang all the poor people, problem solved.

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

I can go with that. I have no problem in requiring those who can work to actually work, I think it's better for them and for us. Like I said, unemployment for those who are looking for work and disability for those who can't work. If you can't find a job after a certain amount of time, we retrain you and if you still can't find a job, we put you to work until you do find a job, or until you are old enough that retirement is your only option.

Who is *we*, and you can't put people to work for no money.

Thank Obama for gutting the JOBS program nationwide, the only welfare reform that has ever successfully moved people from welfare to self sufficiency.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

PoliticalChic's belief we have no poor is the single most ignorant statement out of an ocean of ignorant statements I have heard on this board.

.

She stepped right in it with that claim, because the government assistance that she would end is what has lifted the very poor out of poverty.

She believes there are no poor, but wishes to recreate the poor by taking away what keeps them from being poor.

... such as free cell phones, free lap tops, free computers, free Internet.


Obama Gives Poor Free Internet After U.N. Says It’s A Basic Human Right.
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2...ternet-after-u-n-says-it-s-basic-human-right/

 

[Foxfyre]

No, I'm rather fond of some of them. Especially me.

But I sure would like to see a government, economy, policy, attitudes that encouraged people to get out of poverty rather than the one we have had that encourages more and more of it.

I can go with that. I have no problem in requiring those who can work to actually work, I think it's better for them and for us. Like I said, unemployment for those who are looking for work and disability for those who can't work. If you can't find a job after a certain amount of time, we retrain you and if you still can't find a job, we put you to work until you do find a job, or until you are old enough that retirement is your only option.

Who is *we*, and you can't put people to work for no money.

Thank Obama for gutting the JOBS program nationwide, the only welfare reform that has ever successfully moved people from welfare to self sufficiency.

I have long said that we do people no favors by paying them not to work. Kids should grow up seeing Mom and Dad haul themselves out of bed every morning, get themselves cleaned up and made presentable, and go out to do productive work, even if it is community service scrubbing graffiti off walls, cleaning up parks, or hiring out to the Salvation Army or thrift shops or whatever needs to be done in return for that government assistance check.

If folks have to put in an honest days work for a small government assistance check, they at least have a chance to develop a work ethic and acquire some positive references; possibly learn some marketable skills if they don't have those. And if they have to work hard for a government provided minimum wage job, they are likely to think if I gotta get up, get cleaned up, get dressed anyway, I might as well look for something that pays better in the private sector.