The lefts ideas are soothing, but the policies are a disaster!

[danielpalos]

I don't support the drug war and have said it plenty of times. You seem to stupid to read that.

His liberal talking point script is very limited.

i am not whining about taxes or the cost of social services. only the fantastical, right wing, does that.

When you don't fund them because you don't pay those taxes, YOU can't say anything about them.

What you do is support others paying those taxes and take credit as if it your money because you support it being used for piece of shit freeloaders like yourself.

like i said; let's end our War on Drugs, and then talk.

Like I've said multiple times and you don't see to get you stupid motherfucker is OK as long as we end the war on poverty.

Do all the drugs the wants. However, when doing them puts you in a situation you don't like and can't get out of, fuck off.

let's end our drug war, first.

 

[danielpalos]

His liberal talking point script is very limited.

i am not whining about taxes or the cost of social services. only the fantastical, right wing, does that.

When you don't fund them because you don't pay those taxes, YOU can't say anything about them.

What you do is support others paying those taxes and take credit as if it your money because you support it being used for piece of shit freeloaders like yourself.

like i said; let's end our War on Drugs, and then talk.

Like I've said multiple times and you don't see to get you stupid motherfucker is OK as long as we end the war on poverty.

Do all the drugs the wants. However, when doing them puts you in a situation you don't like and can't get out of, fuck off.

See that! All day long this thread has been here, and not ONE leftist can show a social entitlement that is solvent. Not a one of them, nada, forget about it! They all need cash infusions, and the left still wants to create more, even as they have been unsuccessful at every social entitlement they have created.

But then, we conservatives already knew this, and since they run from trying to explain their positions, it just means we need to bring it up more often!

How solvent are our "wars on crime, drugs, poverty, and terror"?

 

[danielpalos]

instead of land; i got it.

It's always the other guys fault...

Still waiting fellas, got any of your social programs that do NOT need a big influx of cash? That is what this thread is about-) Or are you instead just surrendering to the point that your lefty ideas have not made one social program that is even close to self sustainable-)

let's abolish our War on Drugs.

Really, that is all you got, lol.

Wow, ok.............if that is all you got, then yes......I think drugs is a factor in our give and take, lol!

it is a start; unlike the right.

Those on the right expect you to earn what you get. You want it for doing nothing while you sit around and do drugs.

it takes social morals for free to have moral forms of indignation.

cronies have no standing.

 

[danielpalos]

i think it is funny that the right wing has nothing but diversions instead of valid arguments.

 

[rdean]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

 

[Conservative65]

I don't support the drug war and have said it plenty of times. You seem to stupid to read that.

His liberal talking point script is very limited.

Gimme, gimme, gimme isn't hard to learn.

neither is right wing fantasy instead having having a "hard work" ethic to come up with valid arguments, instead of nothing but fantastical fallacies.

So you think expecting people to earn what they have is a fantasy? Got it.

expecting Everyone to earn all the time with a natural rate of unemployment, is just, right wing fantasy.

Thinking that one group is owed something simply because they don't have it is fantasy. I don't you or anyone else a damn thing because you don't have it. Do without.

 

[Conservative65]

Plenty of handouts to those contributing nothing to society.

instead of land; i got it.

And requiring nothing in return. If you give me land and I use it to benefit society, I've contributed. If you give me money for nothing and I provide nothing in return, I've done nothing for society.

paying taxes is something. personal property taxes instead of real estate taxes is still, taxes.

Personal property taxes, if the poor even pay those, don't fund the federal social welfare programs they use.

they fund local and State government.

And they're not paying their fair share of those taxes either.

They damn aren't paying any federal taxes if they use social welfare programs.

 

[Conservative65]

Plenty of handouts to those contributing nothing to society.

instead of land; i got it.

Thank that lefties for that.

It's always the other guys fault...

Still waiting fellas, got any of your social programs that do NOT need a big influx of cash? That is what this thread is about-) Or are you instead just surrendering to the point that your lefty ideas have not made one social program that is even close to self sustainable-)

let's abolish our War on Drugs.

I've already said more than once that's OK. As long as we get rid of the war on poverty, too.

let's start with the drug war, first.

Looking out for yourself? How greedy and typical of a lefty.

 

[Conservative65]

i think it is funny that the right wing has nothing but diversions instead of valid arguments.

It's hilarious that freeloaders like you think someone owes you something so you can sit around doing drugs. Hope they leave you in the gutter.

 

[Conservative65]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

2. Far less on food stamps and more in the work force.

 

[RASTAMEN]

some on the left believe in merely simplifying Government to lower our Tax burden.

Really, name them, lol!

moi, for one.

The left believes in expanding government and that means more taxes.

But the point is---->they can NOT point to any social program that is sustainable......meaning they have zero successes. They need to fix what they created before we allow them to talk about creating anything else.

The social programs that began in the 1960s were supposed to eradicate poverty. The poverty rate just before they were put in place was 15%. Today, after trillions spent on them, the poverty rate is 15%.

Well...........the election of Ronald Alzheimer Reagan sure changed all that!!!

 

[RASTAMEN]

i think it is funny that the right wing has nothing but diversions instead of valid arguments.

It's hilarious that freeloaders like you think someone owes you something so you can sit around doing drugs. Hope they leave you in the gutter.

Its hilarious how knuckle draging white conservatives who earn between minimum wage to $60,000 per married couple believe the GOP has their best interest in mind!!!!

 

[RASTAMEN]

His liberal talking point script is very limited.

Gimme, gimme, gimme isn't hard to learn.

neither is right wing fantasy instead having having a "hard work" ethic to come up with valid arguments, instead of nothing but fantastical fallacies.

So you think expecting people to earn what they have is a fantasy? Got it.

expecting Everyone to earn all the time with a natural rate of unemployment, is just, right wing fantasy.

Thinking that one group is owed something simply because they don't have it is fantasy. I don't you or anyone else a damn thing because you don't have it. Do without.

So why does the richest one percent in this country think they are owed something?????? There are about 4 million of the richest people in America who arrogantly believe the other 320 million Americans are here to serve THEM!!!!

Meanwhile, there are around 100 million white conservatives who LOVE to grovel down to the richest Americans as slaves. Go Figure.

 

[imawhosure]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

Makes no difference R, these social programs have been failing for DECADES now, it is just becoming acute. Tell everyone when SS was supposed to run out of money under Bill Clinton! How much has it changed? What about Medicare?

You people created these financial weights around Americas neck. OK, fine, can you try and fix them? But no, oh no. You fleece one of them (medicare) of 700 billion dollars to fund a NEW social program. (Ocare) Your new program is already near out of money after 6 or 7 years, and then you want Trump to fix it for you people!

Do, when you people going to fix anything you created? We are waiting!

 

[imawhosure]

Gimme, gimme, gimme isn't hard to learn.

neither is right wing fantasy instead having having a "hard work" ethic to come up with valid arguments, instead of nothing but fantastical fallacies.

So you think expecting people to earn what they have is a fantasy? Got it.

expecting Everyone to earn all the time with a natural rate of unemployment, is just, right wing fantasy.

Thinking that one group is owed something simply because they don't have it is fantasy. I don't you or anyone else a damn thing because you don't have it. Do without.

So why does the richest one percent in this country think they are owed something?????? There are about 4 million of the richest people in America who arrogantly believe the other 320 million Americans are here to serve THEM!!!!

Meanwhile, there are around 100 million white conservatives who LOVE to grovel down to the richest Americans as slaves. Go Figure.

And here we go, back to identity politics, lol. The same narrative, over, and over, that has nothing to do with anything I asked or said.

You guys really are in trouble, since most of your narratives are just recycled Marxism from the good ole USSR.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Really, name them, lol!

moi, for one.

The left believes in expanding government and that means more taxes.

But the point is---->they can NOT point to any social program that is sustainable......meaning they have zero successes. They need to fix what they created before we allow them to talk about creating anything else.

The social programs that began in the 1960s were supposed to eradicate poverty. The poverty rate just before they were put in place was 15%. Today, after trillions spent on them, the poverty rate is 15%.

Agreed! The left was never about eliminating poverty, it was about buying votes.

All I am saying is----->we need to concentrate on their failures, along with their ZERO victory's to show there way is always fail!

The real poverty rate is about 3% when aid to the poor is taken into consideration when the poverty rate is calculated.
That's a success of liberalism.

 

[NYcarbineer]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

Makes no difference R, these social programs have been failing for DECADES now, it is just becoming acute. Tell everyone when SS was supposed to run out of money under Bill Clinton! How much has it changed? What about Medicare?

You people created these financial weights around Americas neck. OK, fine, can you try and fix them? But no, oh no. You fleece one of them (medicare) of 700 billion dollars to fund a NEW social program. (Ocare) Your new program is already near out of money after 6 or 7 years, and then you want Trump to fix it for you people!

Do, when you people going to fix anything you created? We are waiting!

Reagan fixed Social Security for 50 years. How about you elect another Reagan if you're going to elect Republicans?

 

[imawhosure]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

Makes no difference R, these social programs have been failing for DECADES now, it is just becoming acute. Tell everyone when SS was supposed to run out of money under Bill Clinton! How much has it changed? What about Medicare?

You people created these financial weights around Americas neck. OK, fine, can you try and fix them? But no, oh no. You fleece one of them (medicare) of 700 billion dollars to fund a NEW social program. (Ocare) Your new program is already near out of money after 6 or 7 years, and then you want Trump to fix it for you people!

Do, when you people going to fix anything you created? We are waiting!

Reagan fixed Social Security for 50 years. How about you elect another Reagan if you're going to elect Republicans?

Because you people created this mess, and keep pushing it off on Repubs. You have not created one social program that is self sustaining, and just draws money out of the private economy. Once more, after you get your precious plans, you expand them, which is another reason they go broke.

Not one of your plans sustains itself, so we do not want to hear about how caring all of are, you are killing the country, and have no solutions, just more programs!

 

[NYcarbineer]

When a leftist starts debating with you about which party has done more for the people, we should all as conservatives ask them----->which people do you mean? The people who will be alive after 2040, or those who will have died between the late 1930s and 2040? Certainly, the left by constantly kicking the can down the road, (and some repubs also) have made the life of those in that period far better economically, then those who will come further down the road. Now their schemes have come home to roost, and the problems that their ideas have caused are NOT far off in the future, but will have to faced by some in this generation, and many generations after.

REALITY--------> Who would not like to be promised free healthcare,(medicare/Ocare) insured against poverty in old age, protected if you have a child that you can't afford, an all provided to you by YOUR Federal/STATE government!

These, and many others, are the promises of the left. And if you do not agree to these ideas, you are evil, mean, racist, etc. But nobody wants to actually delve into (especially the left) if these ideas/programs are sustainable! They quickly gloss all of that over, because to concentrate on the sustainability of their ideas, is to prove they are just pie-in-the-sky nonsense being fed to people for votes.

Originally, I was going to go through all the programs that have been created at the behest of liberals, and show how virtually all of them are going broke and need cash infusions. As far as I know, none of the big social programs from Social security on down to Obamacare is anywhere CLOSE to self sustainment. And when you consider that Ocare took 700 BILLION dollars from Medicare which was itself in the red, and then Ocare is now in its death spiral 6 years later, and you have to wonder as Americans who plan to live for awhile WTF the Democrats were thinking!

The arrogance of Democrats is unbridled, even as you look across this message board. Knowing that Social Security and Medicare are the 3rd rail of politics in this country; instead of attempting to FIX these entitlements that were created from liberals past, they FLEECED one of them to create a NEW entitlement that probably won't make it 7 years. Obama would not TOUCH attempting to talk about how to make these solvent for the future, he stole part of the future for his legacy that is failing far faster that the other 2 ever did, which tells you about the business acumen of the modern leftist!

Again--------> The ideas of leftists are WONDERFUL, its just nobody can figure out how to pay for them, thus making them unworkable! They can NOT point to one social program that has been self sustaining, as far as I know, not a one.....but in their arrogance they keep promising the moon, and delivering debt, upon debt, upon debt, to anyone who intends to live past 2040 or so, and that is many of you, your children, and your grandchildren!

Does anyone think that these plans of the past were created and explained to the American public as "they won't go broke until here?" Of course NOT! The left ALWAYS promises their brilliant ideas will work to get them passed for votes as self sustaining, and then expects the American public to deal with their absolute failure later. How any leftist can talk about any social program when they haven't been able to devise one that is self sustaining should be a question a shrink has to answer, along with why America even listens to their bull anymore in the 1st place!

And then....we have their insistence that it is better and MORE FAIR for government to do it, instead of the private sector! Sure it is, as long as you don't want the program to self sustain, like all the lefty programs ever created! Governments job is to get BIGGER, to hire more CRONIES, to keep the government LEFTIST or FAR RIGHT, not to sustain for the American people anything! The government is NOT about sustaining profit or program, but sustaining their POWER!

Every year a senator who just recently retired, produced a list...every year, about the waste in government, and was specific where it was. I believe that the last list, or next to last list in 2014 created by him showed something slightly over 25 billion. Nobody disagreed, but nobody tried to fix it either! You tell a company they are wasting 25 million, and watch how fast it is fixed!

So, when we as conservatives debate the left, all we need do is demand they show us their successes from the past! They have none, all they have is failure unless you decide that bringing the country to its knees financially for their vision is a success. They have no leg to stand on, period! Everything they devised is crashing down around them, and us.

But the other key to this conversation is the lefts insistence on paying YOUR fairshare to support their supposed Shang-Ri- La! How much do Americans actually already pay, and is that enough? Well, for that answer, you need to realize that between the feds, the state, property taxes, excise tax on virtually EVERYTHING up to and including toilet paper, gas taxes, double taxes, sales tax, and every kind of tax you can think of, most tax paying people are on the verge of.....if not past, 40% heading towards 50%.

How much money does the left need? Think about that for a second! They NEVER will tell you what YOUR fairshare is, because their needs are bottomless pits! They have pushed you so far in taxation, and every time someone comes along and tells you they want to lower your taxes, if you want to keep a little more of your money, you are a racist! They have never explained why that is, and why you paying an over all tax load in the mid to high 40% range is not fair because they need more, and yet they demand it, and YOU let them get away with it!

We can't let the left create the narrative we debate on any longer. They purposely create false narratives to keep everyone defending their position, instead of attacking theirs! They have no government legislative wins on what they claim to stand for, they just do not! All they have is FAILURE of every program because they, or their lefty fore fathers lied to America, and now she may end up financially on her knees, just as our children, or grandchildren, come to the front.

I believe conservatives should discuss what I have said, and look towards using it as the sledgehammer against leftists, instead of defending against the LEFTS phony talking points. In all of their NEW ideas, they can put down all the links they want from here forward on how to pay for anything, and just the question----->"show your success elsewhere causes" their whole argument to collapse.

Conservatives, please discuss!

Four things.

1. How the country was when it was turned over to Bush from Clinton.

2. How the country was when it was turned over to Obama from Bush.

3. How the country is going from Obama to Trump.

4. Guess we'll have to wait.

Makes no difference R, these social programs have been failing for DECADES now, it is just becoming acute. Tell everyone when SS was supposed to run out of money under Bill Clinton! How much has it changed? What about Medicare?

You people created these financial weights around Americas neck. OK, fine, can you try and fix them? But no, oh no. You fleece one of them (medicare) of 700 billion dollars to fund a NEW social program. (Ocare) Your new program is already near out of money after 6 or 7 years, and then you want Trump to fix it for you people!

Do, when you people going to fix anything you created? We are waiting!

Reagan fixed Social Security for 50 years. How about you elect another Reagan if you're going to elect Republicans?

Because you people created this mess, and keep pushing it off on Repubs. You have not created one social program that is self sustaining, and just draws money out of the private economy. Once more, after you get your precious plans, you expand them, which is another reason they go broke.

Not one of your plans sustains itself, so we do not want to hear about how caring all of are, you are killing the country, and have no solutions, just more programs!

So Reagan was an asshole for saving Social Security?

 

[danielpalos]

His liberal talking point script is very limited.

Gimme, gimme, gimme isn't hard to learn.

neither is right wing fantasy instead having having a "hard work" ethic to come up with valid arguments, instead of nothing but fantastical fallacies.

So you think expecting people to earn what they have is a fantasy? Got it.

expecting Everyone to earn all the time with a natural rate of unemployment, is just, right wing fantasy.

Thinking that one group is owed something simply because they don't have it is fantasy. I don't you or anyone else a damn thing because you don't have it. Do without.

owed, or, not being able to purchase privileges and immunities, large enough to drive a yacht through?

promoting the general welfare is in our social Contract.