frigidweirdo
Diamond Member
- Mar 7, 2014
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Life expectancy has absolutely nothing.... NOTHING to do with health care. I don't understand why people don't grasp this.
That's because, clearly, we're not talking healthcare. We're talking STATISTICS. Listen.
You have a country where the average life expectancy is 40. Chances of surviving cancer when you are young is higher than when you are old.
file:///C:/Users/hp/Downloads/Surv_by_cancer_age15-39.pdf
Lung and stomach cancer in 15-39 year olds is around 1/3 chance of surviving.
Bowel, Brain, Leukemia about 2/3 and others go to around 90 something percent.
file:///C:/Users/hp/Downloads/Surv_by_cancer_age50-59.pdf
For 50-59 year olds.
Lung and stomach cancer 12% and 26%
Bowel, Brain Leukemia 61%, 11% and 65%
So, some are down a little bit, by about 2 percent one is down by 50%, lung and stomach are massively down.
So, if someone who in one country would be healthy, then die of cancer at the age of say 80, but died of some complication with obesity at the age of 60, is clearly not going to appear on one set of statistics, but will appear on the other.
A healthier society is more liable to diagnose cancer in older patients. Older patients are more likely to die from that cancer.
So, while it doesn't have an impact on the quality of care, it does have an impact on the statistics which people use to show quality of care.
If I pull out a gun and shoot you dead....... that directly impacts life expectancy.
Now explain to me how that is health care's fault? Were the doctors supposed to magically fly to my location, and prevent me from shooting? Were they supposed to jump to you, and toss a bullet proof vest over you just before you were hit?
Of course not.
If you lose control and hit a tree in your car and die, or if I plow into you with my Grand Marquis and kill you.... that directly impacts life expectancy.
Now explain to me how that reflects on the quality of health care? Were the doctors supposed to pull along side with lug nuts, and zip them into your wheels while you were driving, to prevent you from losing control? Where they supposed to jump through the window of my car, grab the wheel to prevent me from hitting you?
Of course not.
If you are hooked on Heroin, and OD in your home and die.... that directly impacts life expectancy.
Now explain to me how higher quality health care would prevent that? Are doctors and nurses supposed to be going door to door, to find you, and rip the needles out of your hands, to prevent you from ODing?
There are millions of factors that all effect life expectancy. Very very few of which are related to health care.
The only statistic that directly relates to the ability of the health care system to diagnose, treat, and heal patients, is survival rates. You show me the 5-Year Survival rates, between the US and Switzerland, and I'll show you higher quality US care.
And not death rates either. If you and I are on islands with 20 people each. And you have only one person get sick, and you simply let them die. And I have 5 people get sick, and we heal and cure 3 of them, and two die. Would you conclude your health care was better? Of course not. My health care system is better, even though twice as many died.
Death rates are also meaningless. Again, only survival rates make any difference. Only survival rates actually show the quality of the care.
Switzerland's quality health system helps push up cancer rate - swissinfo.ch
"Cases of melanoma, prostate and breast cancer are higher in Switzerland than the European average - a side-effect of the top-notch Swiss health care system."
Again, I'm not sure what the point of that was. I don't care at all, how many are dected, if they die after being detected.
What matters isn't just "did we find cancer!". What matters is "did we find the cancer, and treat the cancer, and heal the patient".
The reality is, it isn't that easy to compare two systems. Higher cancer death rate could be down to higher life expectancy, or due to less people being obese and therefore less likely to die of obesity, or lower traffic accidents etc.
They have a high level of people getting cancer, especially old people, because they live a long time.
You explain to me then, why it's so hard to compare. To me, it's pretty easy. When you find someone who is ill.... are they alive in 5-years?
Britain, the sick man of Europe: Heart and cancer survival rates among worst in developed world | Mail Online
Who is at the top of the list, on 5 year survival rates for Breast and Bowel cancer? The US.
Who is so low, they are not even ranked? Switzerland among many others.
If you get either of those illnesses, and you shockingly, want to live... which country do you have the absolute best possible chance of being alive in 5 years or longer? The US.
Now if you want to save money, and have a higher risk of dying for the sake of your dollars, then by all means take your chances elsewhere. Most people would rather live, and get a bill in the mail, than die without a bill.
But don't tell me that they have higher quality of care. They simply do not. Not even close. Period.
So, you want to know about survival rates, I told you how lower life expectancy impacts survival rate statistics.