The Myth of Sanders’ Socialism

[EvilCat Breath]

Bernie Sanders says he's a socialist. He's said that for years. Are you calling him a liar?

 

[Mac1958]

Start paying taxes and your mind begins to change.

Correct. Then we endlessly bitch at each other about where we think our tax dollars should be spent. As if we ever have any real control over this beyond a vote.

Where we disagree is that I think that political ideology and economic systems are now becoming more polarized and linked, so that each party is now making a clearer argument for its case.

I don't think this is a new concept.

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.
.

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

As I've said before, society evolves, for better or worse.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.

Republicans are supposed to be all about preserving traditions and the status quo. Should Bernie get elected, they will go kicking and screaming, just like everything else they've felt is spooky and 'progressive' throughout history.

 

[gipper]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

 

[gipper]

The Gipper & Mac wear the same glasses...

View attachment 310842

You don’t need glasses, since you’re blind.

 

[gipper]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

"Boogeyman" really is a good way to describe it. The problem is that most on the Right have been conditioned (by the usual suspects) to see virtually everything in a binary state. So, in their minds, there is only "capitalism" or "socialism", good or evil, black or white, one or the other. This has been drummed into them for the last 30+ years, so for many of them, it's all they've ever known.

At some level, they HAVE to know that this all exists along a continuum, that the task is not to magically "beat" the "other side", but to find the right place of equilibrium.

But the problem here is that the binary thought processes with which these people have been afflicted simply don't allow for anything deeper than binary viewpoints. As a result, it's virtually impossible for them to even RECOGNIZE that a point of equilibrium might even EXIST.
.

You are missing a critical part of this "conditioning" of the right, which is how the right has learned to recognize the profound effect of progressive changes over time. Give them an inch, and they take miles. Bernie is a commie who needs to be shut down immediately.

The whole purpose of this thread is to marginalize how people see Bernie's communism, in hopes that somehow nobody will notice a commie taking over our country. This thread is the work of cockroaches who work in the dark, trying to destroy America, but it won't work.

Yeah FDR was a fuckin commie too. We need to get rid of all social programs, after all we don’t want that commie shit. We need to make sure the wealthy oligarchy gets government protection, but the rest of us get rugged capitalism.

Is Canada a socialist nation? Is all of Western Europe socialist?

Rugged capitalism? Lol, I love rugged capitalism, and I would never trade it for the bread line.

If only it applied to all, including the 1%.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Start paying taxes and your mind begins to change.

Correct. Then we endlessly bitch at each other about where we think our tax dollars should be spent. As if we ever have any real control over this beyond a vote.

Where we disagree is that I think that political ideology and economic systems are now becoming more polarized and linked, so that each party is now making a clearer argument for its case.

I don't think this is a new concept.

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.
.

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

As I've said before, society evolves, for better or worse.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.

Republicans are supposed to be all about preserving traditions and the status quo. Should Bernie get elected, they will go kicking and screaming, just like everything else they've felt is spooky and 'progressive' throughout history.

Make no mistake about fellas...the Mexicrat Party has become emboldened by dark people, professional gamers and white guilt whackos....the more shameless dark people, Mexicans, Muslims and the like the greater the push to steal from Whitey. Spin this shit however you like but the writing is on the wall...Multiculturalism = shameless begging....just another way real Americans get super-fucked by oh so beautiful multiculturalism.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

But that healthcare would be worse than what I have now. How much of my hard earned money is a parasite like GeorgePhillipe for example entitled to?

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

Start paying taxes and your mind begins to change.

Correct. Then we endlessly bitch at each other about where we think our tax dollars should be spent. As if we ever have any real control over this beyond a vote.

Where we disagree is that I think that political ideology and economic systems are now becoming more polarized and linked, so that each party is now making a clearer argument for its case.

I don't think this is a new concept.

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.
.

Well, I think the difference now is that the Democrats, knowing that the word "socialism" doesn't scare people like it used to, are more likely to defend it (within its own definitions of the word) and toss the word out with less fear. And they're doing a very good job of it.

As I've said before, society evolves, for better or worse.

At the same time, the Republicans somehow don't yet realize that the term is scaring fewer people, and they still seem to think that all they have to do is scream SOCIALISM VENEZUELA AAAUUUGGGHHH and that will be enough. I don't think so. Not any more.

Republicans are supposed to be all about preserving traditions and the status quo. Should Bernie get elected, they will go kicking and screaming, just like everything else they've felt is spooky and 'progressive' throughout history.

Make no mistake about fellas...the Mexicrat Party has become emboldened by dark people, professional gamers and white guilt whackos....the more shameless dark people, Mexicans, Muslims and the like the greater the push to steal from Whitey. Spin this shit however you like but the writing is on the wall...Multiculturalism = shameless begging....just another way real Americans get super-fucked by oh so beautiful multiculturalism.

I didn't invite trash into this thread. Did you, Mac?

 

[gipper]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

But that healthcare would be worse than what I have now. How much of my hard earned money is a parasite like GeorgePhillipe for example entitled to?

Oh brother. More dumb talking points as if they were true.

We have the most expensive HC in the world, and it isn’t very effective. Medicare for all will be cheaper and more effective.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

But that healthcare would be worse than what I have now. How much of my hard earned money is a parasite like GeorgePhillipe for example entitled to?

Oh brother. More dumb talking points as if they were true.

We have the most expensive HC in the world, and it isn’t very effective. Medicare for all will be cheaper and more effective.

You broad brush it. I, Azog, have great healthcare for me and my family. Many do not so You’re saying I should sacrifice for the greater good. OK, then answer my question.

 

[EvMetro]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

"Boogeyman" really is a good way to describe it. The problem is that most on the Right have been conditioned (by the usual suspects) to see virtually everything in a binary state. So, in their minds, there is only "capitalism" or "socialism", good or evil, black or white, one or the other. This has been drummed into them for the last 30+ years, so for many of them, it's all they've ever known.

At some level, they HAVE to know that this all exists along a continuum, that the task is not to magically "beat" the "other side", but to find the right place of equilibrium.

But the problem here is that the binary thought processes with which these people have been afflicted simply don't allow for anything deeper than binary viewpoints. As a result, it's virtually impossible for them to even RECOGNIZE that a point of equilibrium might even EXIST.
.

You are missing a critical part of this "conditioning" of the right, which is how the right has learned to recognize the profound effect of progressive changes over time. Give them an inch, and they take miles. Bernie is a commie who needs to be shut down immediately.

The whole purpose of this thread is to marginalize how people see Bernie's communism, in hopes that somehow nobody will notice a commie taking over our country. This thread is the work of cockroaches who work in the dark, trying to destroy America, but it won't work.

Yeah FDR was a fuckin commie too. We need to get rid of all social programs, after all we don’t want that commie shit. We need to make sure the wealthy oligarchy gets government protection, but the rest of us get rugged capitalism.

Is Canada a socialist nation? Is all of Western Europe socialist?

Rugged capitalism? Lol, I love rugged capitalism, and I would never trade it for the bread line.

If only it applied to all, including the 1%.

Why do you care about the 1%?

 

[Weatherman2020]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

Yeah, and I’ll get my $2,500 a year savings in healthcare any day now.

 

[BluesLegend]

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

^^^ delusional. Free healthcare and college for $100 okay...Bernie is that you?

 

[BluesLegend]

True ignorance is common in the land of the (not) free. The billionaire’s media sees to that. This is yet another perfect example. This myth is believed by many on the right and left. The 1% who run everything don’t much like Bernie, so their media makes sure to dupe millions into thinking as they do.

MARCH 5, 2020
The Myth of Sanders’ “Socialism”
by M. G. PIETY

Fox News has an all-out frontal assault on Bernie Sanders’ purported “socialism.” It is a sad statement on the level of ignorance in this country that anyone could take seriously the charge that Sanders is a socialist. What Sanders is advocating is something approaching the social-welfare systems of other economically developed countries and that’s a far cry from the socialism Fox News is using as a boogeyman to frighten conservatives. The “socialism” Fox is decrying is the old-fashioned Stalinist-Maoist kind where all important industries are nationalized, most of the private property of the wealthy is seized by the state, and there are no such things as individual rights and freedoms because the very idea of “individuals” is considered capitalist propaganda.

The Myth of Sanders' "Socialism" - CounterPunch.org

Bernie wants to raise taxes, he can go to hell.

Yeah...your income tax might increase of $100, but now all Americans have healthcare and access to a college education. We can’t have that. God forbid.

Yeah, and I’ll get my $2,500 a year savings in healthcare any day now.

The left are such liars.

 

[MisterBeale]

Dirigisme or dirigism (from French diriger, meaning ‘to direct’) is an economic system where the state exerts a strong directive influence over investment. It designates a capitalist economy in which the state plays a strong directive role, as opposed to a merely regulatory one.

Good one Mr B!

but now i wonder how 'where investors exert a strong influence over the state' would be defined?

~S~

Corruption is legal.

Interlocking directorate - Wikipedia

Revolving door (politics) - Wikipedia

Few examples;

This here, this is key;

"Passing a Constitutional Amendment that makes clear that money is not speech and corporations are not people."
Get Corporate Money Out of Politics


Nothing else matters in the system till this is done.

 

[MisterBeale]

"Boogeyman" really is a good way to describe it. The problem is that most on the Right have been conditioned (by the usual suspects) to see virtually everything in a binary state. So, in their minds, there is only "capitalism" or "socialism", good or evil, black or white, one or the other. This has been drummed into them for the last 30+ years, so for many of them, it's all they've ever known.

At some level, they HAVE to know that this all exists along a continuum, that the task is not to magically "beat" the "other side", but to find the right place of equilibrium.

But the problem here is that the binary thought processes with which these people have been afflicted simply don't allow for anything deeper than binary viewpoints. As a result, it's virtually impossible for them to even RECOGNIZE that a point of equilibrium might even EXIST.
.

Unfortunately, it’s not just the right. The left is just as guilty and many on the left believe just as those on the right, that Bernie is a crazy commie. Proof the billionaire media still has the power to brainwash.

There's definitely a lot of it on the Left, this simplistic and shallow behavior. I look at the Right screaming SOCIALISM at everything that moves in essentially the same way as the Left screaming RACISM at everything that moves.

As I always say, these two ends can be so similar. And worse, destructive.
.

What is missing in this debate is honesty, as always.

I would guess when FDR pushed for social security, many called him a socialist. I don’t believe most Americans consider Canada and Western Europe socialist nations, yet Bernie is advocating for policies much like those nations.

The extreme wealthy seem to really like socialism and our government does all it can to give it to them. Bernie is demanding the government help the poor and working class, like they do for the 1%. For this, he’s labeled a god damned commie. LOL.

The problem I have with Sanders, is that he, and those like him, think the solution is MORE government.

I think how we got into the mess we are in, is government in the first place. I'm not convinced more will make things any better.

I do not, really. . . understand, how we can radically improve things, and get rid of all the privatized secret intel agencies and the Deep State, w/o something serious, but you are correct, there is a fundamental misunderstanding of what Sanders and his ideas represent.

If you took away the nationalist trappings of fascism, Sanders and his cohorts are really, much closer to the type of governing that the fascists of WWII used economically.

Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez are Not Socialists, So What are They?
Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez are Not Socialists, So What are They?
". . .If the socialist wing of the Democratic Party are not socialists, what are they? First and foremost, they are unshackled welfare statists, directed by a morality that values, above all, a form of outcome-based egalitarianism. As a result, they favor all-encompassing government programs that they believe will minimize income inequality and the outcomes that flow from such inequalities. As we have seen, this includes a steeply progressive income tax system, government control of payments for health care services, tuition-free higher education, guaranteed employment, etc. Note that none of their proposed programs seeks to nationalize these industries. What they do seek to do is equalize the benefits that these industries provide through one or another kind of government payment scheme.

In the area of economic policy these self-proclaimed socialists embrace, not socialism, but what is called “dirigisme”, which the Merriam-Webster dictionary simply defines as a system that embraces “economic planning and control by the state” and the Collins English Dictionary describes as “control by the state of economic and social matters.”

But both Wikipedia and the Encyclopedia Britannica have more refined definitions that I think captures the essence of what is advocated by Sanders, et. al. Wikipedia states:

Dirigisme or dirigism (from French diriger, meaning ‘to direct’) is an economic system where the state exerts a strong directive influence over investment. It designates a capitalist economy in which the state plays a strong directive role, as opposed to a merely regulatory one.

According to The Encyclopedia Britannica:

dirigiste [adjective form] policies often include centralized economic planning, directing investment, controlling wages and prices, and supervising labour markets.

Dirigisme is considered to have been “an inherent aspect” of the fascist economies of post-WWI Italy, Spain, and Germany, which have been described as being “based on private individuals being allowed property and private initiative, but these were contingent upon service to the state.”

Dirigisme - Wikipedia

Let’s not have more government. Let’s have better government.

Clearly our government today is by for and of the 1%. Why not change that? Bernie is the only one advocating this. Will he act do it should he win, is anyone’s guess.

We can't have better government until the fundamental foundation upon which our present one is based.

That means some Supreme Court interpretations which were made in favor of the ruling Oligarchy have screwed the place up for the poor and the middle class.

Now, the only way to solve this, is for the masses to put into place an Amendment to the Constitution. This way the Oligarchic Judges which are patrons of the duopoly, won't be able to malignantly interpret the will of the free citizens.

Sort of like the words, "Shall not be infringed," is pretty damn unambiguous to even the most uneducated slob. It is part of our culture.

Even now, there are freedom loving folks on the left and right that agree, these elite judges giving corporations "person-hood status," IOW, the same legal rights that any citizen enjoys? That is dangerous to liberty of all.

 

[MisterBeale]

Unfortunately, it’s not just the right. The left is just as guilty and many on the left believe just as those on the right, that Bernie is a crazy commie. Proof the billionaire media still has the power to brainwash.

There's definitely a lot of it on the Left, this simplistic and shallow behavior. I look at the Right screaming SOCIALISM at everything that moves in essentially the same way as the Left screaming RACISM at everything that moves.

As I always say, these two ends can be so similar. And worse, destructive.
.

What is missing in this debate is honesty, as always.

I would guess when FDR pushed for social security, many called him a socialist. I don’t believe most Americans consider Canada and Western Europe socialist nations, yet Bernie is advocating for policies much like those nations.

The extreme wealthy seem to really like socialism and our government does all it can to give it to them. Bernie is demanding the government help the poor and working class, like they do for the 1%. For this, he’s labeled a god damned commie. LOL.

The problem I have with Sanders, is that he, and those like him, think the solution is MORE government.

I think how we got into the mess we are in, is government in the first place. I'm not convinced more will make things any better.

I do not, really. . . understand, how we can radically improve things, and get rid of all the privatized secret intel agencies and the Deep State, w/o something serious, but you are correct, there is a fundamental misunderstanding of what Sanders and his ideas represent.

If you took away the nationalist trappings of fascism, Sanders and his cohorts are really, much closer to the type of governing that the fascists of WWII used economically.

Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez are Not Socialists, So What are They?
Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez are Not Socialists, So What are They?
". . .If the socialist wing of the Democratic Party are not socialists, what are they? First and foremost, they are unshackled welfare statists, directed by a morality that values, above all, a form of outcome-based egalitarianism. As a result, they favor all-encompassing government programs that they believe will minimize income inequality and the outcomes that flow from such inequalities. As we have seen, this includes a steeply progressive income tax system, government control of payments for health care services, tuition-free higher education, guaranteed employment, etc. Note that none of their proposed programs seeks to nationalize these industries. What they do seek to do is equalize the benefits that these industries provide through one or another kind of government payment scheme.

In the area of economic policy these self-proclaimed socialists embrace, not socialism, but what is called “dirigisme”, which the Merriam-Webster dictionary simply defines as a system that embraces “economic planning and control by the state” and the Collins English Dictionary describes as “control by the state of economic and social matters.”

But both Wikipedia and the Encyclopedia Britannica have more refined definitions that I think captures the essence of what is advocated by Sanders, et. al. Wikipedia states:

Dirigisme or dirigism (from French diriger, meaning ‘to direct’) is an economic system where the state exerts a strong directive influence over investment. It designates a capitalist economy in which the state plays a strong directive role, as opposed to a merely regulatory one.

According to The Encyclopedia Britannica:

dirigiste [adjective form] policies often include centralized economic planning, directing investment, controlling wages and prices, and supervising labour markets.

Dirigisme is considered to have been “an inherent aspect” of the fascist economies of post-WWI Italy, Spain, and Germany, which have been described as being “based on private individuals being allowed property and private initiative, but these were contingent upon service to the state.”

Dirigisme - Wikipedia

A other problem with Sanders is that he endorsed Hillary Clinton.

Agreed. That is a problem. She exemplified everything he rails against. He tries to appease the D party and for this, they kick him in the balls. Hopefully he’s learned something.

I'm of the opinion that there is nothing to learn.

. . but then, I am cynical. I believe he is aware of what is going on, and he does it on purpose.


I don't think he was ever really that obtuse about what was going on in Nicaragua, or Cuba, or the Soviet Union, therefor, he is not obtuse about the corporate control of the duopoly of both parties, the illusion of choice, or his place in sheep-dogging for the DNC.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

The extreme wealthy seem to really like socialism and our government does all it can to give it to them. Bernie is demanding the government help the poor and working class, like they do for the 1%. For this, he’s labeled a god damned commie. LOL.

LefTard Logic:
“Allowing wealthy folks to keep more of what they earn” = SOCIALISM
“Stealing from wealthy folks and giving the stolen loot to beggars.” = NOT SOCIALISM

Well, he is not wrong. His solution is wrong.

Limiting the power of government is the solution. Not socialism.

.

 

[gipper]

The extreme wealthy seem to really like socialism and our government does all it can to give it to them. Bernie is demanding the government help the poor and working class, like they do for the 1%. For this, he’s labeled a god damned commie. LOL.

LefTard Logic:
“Allowing wealthy folks to keep more of what they earn” = SOCIALISM
“Stealing from wealthy folks and giving the stolen loot to beggars.” = NOT SOCIALISM

Well, he is not wrong. His solution is wrong.

Limiting the power of government is the solution. Not socialism.

.

Yes agreed, but we all know limiting government isn’t going to happen.